Conditioning specifically for the jump?

[mvp]

I'm visiting from Hunter World with a question in hand:

After you get the base of fitness on your horses, do you Conditioning Gurus do specific things to strengthen your horse's hind end for the jumping effort? A timely question now that Spring has sprung, no?

Bounces?

Gymnastics?

Jumping the size fences you will in competition or lower ones with the same effect?

Cantering up hill?

Just more canter work in general?

The back story: I have a middle-aged, slacker of a WB with some jewelry in front. He's fairly strong behind but runs out of a$$ a bit quickly during our jumping schools. I'd like to help him develop his glutes and lower back without putting undue milage on his landing gear.

I'm in this forum because I think Eventers think harder about conditioning the whole horse than does your average hunter fiend. Insofar as his tendons and ligaments need to adapt to landing, too, am I out of line to think about building muscle behind without jumping? Do I need to just jump him (judiciously) in order to simultaneously strengthen his suspensories and flexors in front?

Thanks so much!

[subk]

IBounces?

Gymnastics?

Jumping the size fences you will in competition or lower ones with the same effect?

Cantering up hill?

Just more canter work in general?

My priority is none of the above. Number one thing for me is walking. Not ambling (although some of that too) but a walk with connection, forwardness and swing. Do it up slopes, down slopes and across uneven ground. Conditioning work for upper level 3-days is not just about doing gallop sets but also adding anywhere to 45 minutes to 1 1/2 of hacking (walking) before or after your normal school everyday!

[CookiePony]

Yes, slow hillwork will build your horse's stifles. :yes:

[yellowbritches]

Gymnastics (because they really ARE a great way to build some butt), but yes, more importantly, long, slow hacks with as many hills as you can get. Also, just in general, make sure your flatwork is very, very good. Event riders have to have good dressage so we do really ride on the flat, schooling transitions, doing lateral work, switching between various frames (long and low, deep, show ring frame, etc), bending and suppling. Trying desperately hard not to stereotype here because I know a lot of hunter people who do kickass flatwork, but I also know a lot of hunter people who consider riding around and around the rail flatwork. Make sure you are spending a good amount of time on good, quality flatwork with your horse traveling back to front and really using himself. Dressage is a little bit like weight building. It gives them a lot of strength and really develops the back and butt.

[Kairoshorses]

I live in an area w/ no hills, and I asked a similar question....and in addition to the conditioning hacks, I was told to do lateral work: shoulder in, haunches in, leg yields, turns on the forehand, etc.

[yellowbritches]

If no hills (or in addition to hills), cavalletti.

[mvp]

I do ride this puppy like a dressage horse and he is pretty correct, or so I have been told by some local pros. I think the flatwork part of the conditioning is there, but I feel like I'm missing something.

My gelding is also at a new barn that includes unprecedented access to trails, fields and hills, so maybe my long-term problem will be solved this year.

But I am grateful for the reminder about walking as a form of conditioning. I'll put that into the mix. My horse will dig it since walking even in a frame is (he thinks) almost like sitting on the couch, his preferred activity.

I also think we don't spend enough time at the canter. Additional cardiovascular fitness will help this quiet horse in several ways, but he might also need some time using his hiney at this gait.

In any case, I'm happy to hear from more of you guys about how you school over fences for the physical part of the job, not just the educational part.

[EventMore]

I am pushing myself to do more canterwork than I might normally...seems like we do 2/3 of our sport cantering, so this should be my best gait. I do a ot of lengthening and shortening of the horse's stride, and I work on my own position, both sitting and in half seat as a tool to influence his stride. I also work on helping him build strength and confidence to become more collected and uphill.

As for jumping for fitness, no I don't do that specifically. I don't want to waste his soundness on it. I figure there are a limited number of jumps in a sound horse's career and I want all of mine to be important. I do canter over lots of poles on the ground - singe poles, related distances, and canter step poles.

For strength building I use dressage and slow hills.

[yellowbritches]

OK. So the flatwork's there. Excellent.

The hacking will help, a lot. If you can swing it, try and get him out for a good, brisk walk, 20 minutes or more, for every ride. You can use it as a good warm up or cool down. Try and designate a day or two to go for a loooooong hack (hour or more). You can incooperate trots and canters, but long and slow, especially up the hills, is very, very good.

In the ring, try and always have some trot poles set up, raised is better. Make sure to use them in every ride. Just throw them in every now and then as you do your flatwork or jump school warm up.

Adding in some good canter work will be a help, but you'll be walking a fine line with him being a hunter. Hopefully, since he seems to be sooo mellow, it won't make him too "fit" in the ring. You can add in more good canter work in your flatwork (transitions, circles, counter bend, and just a good up in two point get up and go around the ring). You can also do some honest to God canter sets out in your new fields. A good, basic program is to warm up with 3 5 minute trot sets with 2 to 3 minute intervals of walk between them (time of the interval depends on how fit or unfit the horse is. Early on in the season or for a big powder puff of a horse, a little extra time is a little better). Then do 3 canter sets with 2 to 3 minute walk intervals. 3 minutes is a good place to start. Most horses with a general base of fitness can do that without feeling like they just ran a marathon, and since we're talking about a hunter, you don't need to build up too much past that.

And do some gymnastics. They are very good for getting them stronger, and it is great for their form and technique.

[CookiePony]

I forgot to add before-- trotting in straight lines also helps stifles (quads, hamstrings, adductors). So you can make good use of those fields at the new barn. :cool:

[mvp]

Eventmore-- "A horse has only so many jumps in him." Isn't that in the Bible somewhere?

I also think the long, slow conditioning that builds ligaments may bump up that number, but what would the rushed, ring-bound world know about that?

Poles are part of our flat work. They help keep this 'been there, done that" horse interested. He could use more trot sets of those. Cantering over poles is great for the eye and for the steering this horse needs for the eq side of his job. I haven't set up cavaletti in a long time, but I think I might be surprised by how hard it would be for him to canter, say, four poles in a row. This might be a good test of his actual a$$ strength and a place to start.

This horse is so mellow and broke that I don't think he can get too fit for the hunter ring. Along these lines, do any of you guys break your rides into two shorter workouts per day? On the mental side of things, I think this horse could use more than one ride on a weekend day, even if they are both pretty slow. If he thinks I'm asking for too much, he speed dials his attorney. This makes it tough (for someone!) to go to a horse show in Hunter World.

After that, it's just plain old work. I could definitely be fitter myself, so two point work at the trot or canter, inside or out, would be good for both of us. Thanks for the specific ideas about sets, yellowbritches. Same goes for walking. It's just necessary to put the time in. There's no reason to not find an extra 20 minutes somewhere. I don't know if I could handle 45 minutes of walking. Hats off to those of you dedicated enough for that!

A bit more backstory: I evented and conditioned foxhunters back when I was a kid jockey. I helped one woman condition her husband's horse for the Tevis Cup. I hope I am never asked to trot 35 miles in a row again. But I learned the most from boarding with a Competitive Distance rider for a couple of years. No one can condition a horse for career longevity like those purists!

As you can imagine, I'm a little odd among hunter peeps. But I want my horse to last forever.

[asterix]

Another exercise to add to the mix -- if you have access now to serious hills, try doing a day where you zig zag up and down a good grade hill, connected and marching, really turning at the end of each zig zag between both reins and both legs...up...and down...up...and down. Walk 2 or 3 times up and down, then trot 2 or 3 times up or down. It's PLENTY of work when they do it right!

[mvp]

We do have a hill that will work for zig zags of sorts, though it's a narrow space.

I have exploited the hill already. One night-- late after work-- RanchBroke and I went out there bareback and marched up and down. He had to put his head down and push on the way up, and collect on the way down. Great for stifle spot training.

I was taught a couple of things that might be of value. From a DQ-- Big trot uphill, but be very careful coming down. Weak or tired horses need to walk in a frame, stronger ones can trot down if they are collected.

Also from Keuring juries: Those guys think the walk and canter are related, so I was hoping that walking up hills would at least require a hind leg to push off by itself for a fraction of a stride. In the trot, of course, the horse has the diagonal forelimb to help.

Finally, I think our short but toughest-yet jumping school today loosened up my horse's sacral joint. It's not obviously stiff.... he just doesn't see any reason to use his couch-sitting buns and get any more swing in his back than is absolutely necessary.

So I turned him out for a roll in the arena after untacking and then asked him to trot. I wanted to see if he was a) crippled and right to call the SPCA or b) not that tired at all and just messing with me. That's when I noticed he was unusually loose up there and had a pretty big trot to offer.

With your help, this horse is in deep, deep trouble!