Nolvasan on the foal's navel?

[Philliab]

For those of you that use Nolvasan solution on the foal's navel, are you using the solution straight out of the bottle? If not, what is your dilution rate? And what do you suggest as the best dipping container?

I'm putting the finishing touches on my foaling kit and drew a blank when it came to the treating the navel. :lol:

Thanks!

[VirginiaBred]

Best remedy is iodine or half-percent solution of chlorhexidin.
One product that contains chlorhexidine as an active ingredient is one-percent Novasan® Antiseptic solution. In order to prepare the proper concentration, it should be diluted with an equal volume of water to create a half-percent solution.
Another product, Novasan® Teat Dip, with four-percent chlorhexidine plus glycerin, must also be diluted. Place one pint of the teat dip in a clean gallon container and fill with water, thus creating a gallon of half-percent solution.

[siegi b.]

Virginia Bred - as much as I hate to disagree with you, but iodine has been proven to be way too harsh and resulting in "burn" type cracking of the skin of the navel. Betadine or the chlorhexidin you mentioned are much better alternatives.

[Daydream Believer]

I use Nolvasan/chlorhexidine and water (warm) in a 1:1 ratio. I usually use a small disposable plastic drinking cup. I dunk the whole umbilicus in the cup. I use warm water to make it a bit more pleasant for the little guy.

[Las Olas]

Virginia Bred - as much as I hate to disagree with you, but iodine has been proven to be way too harsh and resulting in "burn" type cracking of the skin of the navel. Betadine or the chlorhexidin you mentioned are much better alternatives.


Only if you spill it all over the foal. My SO is an equine vet here in Ocala and we dip using iodine on our breeding farm and so do all of the major TB farms in Lexington where I have worked. If you use a Clorhexidine solution you must dip the navel for several days as it does not have the same drying effect as the iodine (which is what you are looking for and why it burns and cracks the skin if you spill it).

[Philliab]

Thanks for your quick responses! :)

Is there any reason I can't use the Nolvasan-S Antiseptic Solution (scented) if I cut it at the correct ratio?

Las Olas what iodine product are you using?

[Equine Reproduction]

◊ The navel should be treated with 0.5% chlorhexidine (“Hibitane” ICI Pharmaceuticals; “Nolvasan”, Ft. Dodge);
• Closure of the navel is important to prevent pathogen access that may result in navel- or joint-ill;
• The 7% iodine solutions formerly popular have been determined as too astringent on the neonate tissue;
• 1% iodine solutions do not offer sufficient protection;
• Chlorhexidine treatment will require repetition several times daily for 2-3 days.

The problem with iodine solutions is that they "do" cause drying of the umbillicus and ultimately, cracking of the skin and tissue around which allows for pathogenic access. When using chlorhexidine, it does require multiple treatments but research has shown that there are less problems and a lower incidence of navel and joint ill.

Hope that helps!

Kathy St.Martin
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[Las Olas]

◊

The problem with iodine solutions is that they "do" cause drying of the umbillicus and ultimately, cracking of the skin and tissue around which allows for pathogenic access. When using chlorhexidine, it does require multiple treatments but research has shown that there are less problems and a lower incidence of navel and joint ill.

Hope that helps!

Kathy St.Martin
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Where did you find the research and who conducted it? I'd be interested in seeing it and passing it along, as all of the Board Certified Repro Vets I know still recommend iodine as they feel that the Chlorhexidine doesn't offer adequate protection.

[Equine Reproduction]

Where did you find the research and who conducted it?

I'd have to go dig through our periodicals, but the original research was done by UC Davis. the research results showed that a 0.5% solution of chlorexidine was the most effective against the common bacteria identifed as the most common cause for infections and did not cause teh complications normally associated with the use of iodine solutions.

According to the study, the stronger concentrations of iodine (seven to ten percent) should not be used because in addition to the damage they can do to the surrounding skin, they tend to cauterize and dry the umbilical cord too rapidly. The rapid drying can trap bacteria in the tissues, resulting in abscesses, and also cause a potential risk for a higher incidence of patent urachus developing which allows urine to drip from the drying cord (the urachus is the opening from the bladder to the umbilicus in the fetus).

I'm pulling information from what's in my research files on my computer. I just don't have the exact citings for the information and I'm brain dead this time of the night. I believe the use of chlorhexidine as opposed to iodine was also part of a retrospective study on neonatal fatalities before 10 days along with failure to do an IgG on foals, etc. I'd have to go dig that up, as well, but I believe that was one of the common denominators in that study.

Hope that helps!

Kathy St.Martin
To subscribe to our newsletters go to:
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[Las Olas]

I'd have to go dig through our periodicals, but the original research was done by UC Davis. the research results showed that a 0.5% solution of chlorexidine was the most effective against the common bacteria identifed as the most common cause for infections and did not cause teh complications normally associated with the use of iodine solutions.

According to the study, the stronger concentrations of iodine (seven to ten percent) should not be used because in addition to the damage they can do to the surrounding skin, they tend to cauterize and dry the umbilical cord too rapidly. The rapid drying can trap bacteria in the tissues, resulting in abscesses, and also cause a potential risk for a higher incidence of patent urachus developing which allows urine to drip from the drying cord (the urachus is the opening from the bladder to the umbilicus in the fetus).

I'm pulling information from what's in my research files on my computer. I just don't have the exact citings for the information and I'm brain dead this time of the night. I believe the use of chlorhexidine as opposed to iodine was also part of a retrospective study on neonatal fatalities before 10 days along with failure to do an IgG on foals, etc. I'd have to go dig that up, as well, but I believe that was one of the common denominators in that study.

Hope that helps!

Kathy St.Martin
To subscribe to our newsletters go to:
http://visitor.constantcontact.com/email.jsp?p=oi&m=1102379037302


It does, thank you. I'll see what I can Google up. I guess I should clarify that I believe we are using Triadine (which is a triple source iodine tincture), not 7% iodine. For some reason, I'm thinking you can't buy iodine with a concentration greater than 2.2% anymore because of it's use in Meth production. We have never had any problems with it (knock wood) and we foaled 400 foals/year on one farm and 200/year on another. If you do find the research, I would appreciate seeing it.

[Fairview Horse Center]

I use 2% iodine, but sometimes it is hard to find. I have only had to treat once, and the navel is dried up by the next morning. I use a 12cc syringe case, and up-end it over the navel. I hold it on for about 60 seconds.

[patch work farm]

My vet always insisted on having us use a 50/50 Betadine to distilled water solution and did not encourage the use of chlorexidine as it didn't allow for drying???

Kathy, do you agree the best use with chlorexidine is a 50/50 split and do you suggest distilled water over "regular" water? I would MUCH prefer to use this as it does seem less "caustic".

[VirginiaBred]

I use 2% iodine, but sometimes it is hard to find. I have only had to treat once, and the navel is dried up by the next morning. I use a 12cc syringe case, and up-end it over the navel. I hold it on for about 60 seconds.

That is what we use as well.

[Equine Reproduction]

My vet always insisted on having us use a 50/50 Betadine to distilled water solution and did not encourage the use of chlorexidine as it didn't allow for drying???

That's the idea! By encouraging the umbilicus to heal and NOT dry out and crack! We use chlorhexidine and are diligent at dipping navels. Never had a problem yet - knock on wood <smile>.

Kathy, do you agree the best use with chlorexidine is a 50/50 split and do you suggest distilled water over "regular" water? I would MUCH prefer to use this as it does seem less "caustic".

You want a 0.5% solution, so we typically dilute with 3 parts sterile water with 1 part Nolvasan (Nolvasan is a 2% solution). If you are using something besides Nolvasan, check to see what the concentration of chlorhexidine is and dilute it accordingly.

Hope that helps.

Kathy St.Martin
To subscribe to our newsletters go here:
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[sixpoundfarm]

I switched to using the nolvasan a couple years ago. I keep it in a small spray bottle, and after the first dunk, usually will spray the navel several times a day. Its lots easier than trying to hold baby down and dunk again and again.

[sniplover]

This is from a randomized human study but very interesting (L.C. Mullany, G.L. Darmstadt and J.M. Tielsch, Role of antimicrobial applications to the umbilical cord in neonates to prevent bacterial colonization and infection: a review of the evidence, Pediatr Infect Dis J 22 (2003), pp. 996–1002.)

" Although there is sufficient evidence to establish that the application of antiseptic to the cord reduces bacterial colonization, specific antiseptics vary in effectiveness depending on their antibacterial properties, the mode or frequency of application, the concentration of the antiseptic used and the degree of contamination in the environment. Chlorhexidine appears to be a favorable choice of antiseptic because of its wide-ranging activity against Gram-positive and Gram-negative bacteria, its residual effect on the skin and its low toxicity. Furthermore a number of nonrandomized trials have provided consistent evidence that 4.0% chlorhexidine can reduce the risk of both umbilical cord and periumbilical infections. Firm conclusions regarding the effect of topical antiseptic applications in reducing infection await large, well designed and sufficiently powered investigations. "

There is also this old study (O. Samales, A comparison of umbilical cord treatment in the control of superficial infection. N Z Med J. 1988 Jul 13;101(849):453-5.) again in humans but the principal applies;

"Owing to a high incidence of superficial infection in the newborn period the existing cord care treatment of Iodosan 10% in surgical spirit was compared with 4% chlorhexidine detergent solution. A prospective crossover study was performed between two comparable maternity units. Cord bacteriology was assessed at the time of discharge from hospital and the day of cord separation recorded. The number of infections involving skin, eyes and umbilical cord occurring in hospital and at home were recorded. Chlorhexidine treatment of the cord was associated with an overall reduction in bacterial colonisation of the cord. This was most marked for coagulase positive staphylococci and was not associated with an increase in gram negative organisms. Cord separation occurred at a mean of 10 days with Iodosan and 20 days with chlorhexidine. Chlorhexidine treatment was associated with fewer infections overall; 21% of babies v 38% of babies treated with Iodosan. Conjunctival infection was most commonly recorded; 48 babies being affected in the Iodosan group and 20 in the chlorhexidine group. The use of 4% chlorhexidine detergent solution is supported, but the length of treatment may have to be limited in order to encourage cord separation."

[Philliab]

And I thought my question would have a simple answer! :winkgrin:

I'm going to try to hunt up some Nolvasan locally since I can only seem to find it by the gallon online. I'm also going to pick up a spray bottle and an extra 12cc syringe. Thanks for all the information and suggestions!

Intermission over. Please keep the discussion coming!

[CathyKb]

I have always used iodine and the one foal that I used Nolvasan on ended up with an infection, and yes I dipped several times.

[clint]

Philliab, I had a conversation with my vet this year about the concentration level. UC Davis recommends diluting Nolvasan solution 1:4, but he gave me a bottle undiluted. According to my vet, it won't be harmful to treat the naval with it full strength, but to dilute it, you can measure, but you can also get it to the color of the sky, which is about 1:4. ;) I have always found it very surprising that Nolvasan solution isn't available from vet supply stores like betadine is, but it isn't. Can't you buy a bottle from your vet? That way you will be sure to get the right thing.

[Philliab]

Thanks, clint! Your comment made me feel better about the dilution; I was starting to get paranoid about making positive the ratio is precise. And at this moment, I really don't need something else to be paranoid about. :lol:

It's quite annoying that I can't just purchase a small container of Nolvasan online, but I think I saw a small bottle at my local feed store when I was there this past weekend. I'll call them and check before I give in an order a gallon online. Is there some other reason it would be helpful to have Nolvasan in my first aid kit in the barn? If so, I'll just buy a gallon.

I should have asked my vet when we was out last Thursdaytaking my mare's caslicks out, but out of all the questions I asked him, Nolvasan was not a topic. Due to my geographic location, it's not a quick trip to the vet to pick something us, but I'm sure I can get a bottle from them if I run out of other options.

Thanks!

[Equibrit]

Novalsan Solution http://www.kvvet.com/KVVet/family/345/Nolvasan%20%7C%20Nolvasan-S.asp gallon and 16oz

http://www.allivet.com/ProductDetails.asp?ProductCode=AAP311 Gallon

[Fairview Horse Center]

With well over 100 foalings, single treatments with iodine and no infections, I won't be changing anytime soon! ;)

[FriesianX]

We go back and forth, using a diluted Betadine solution the first time, then a diluted Novalsen (chlorahexidine), then diluted Betadine, and so on for the first few days. This was a recent suggestion from UCD. The Betadine helps dry things out faster than straight Nolvasan.

By the way, Nolvasan is available at vet supply catalogs, even at many feed stores. The only place I HAVEN'T been able to find it is at a human drug store (such as Rite Aid or Longs Drugs).

And I use whatever small, shallow dish I can find - lids to bottles, film cannisters, small plastic tupperware containers, seems every year, I end up with a new collection of little plastic containers. I pop them in the dishwasher to make sure they are clean.

I also try to dip (or splash) when baby is down napping. Easier on all of us :D

[CrossWinds81]

At the large equine hospital in Lexington, KY where I used to work, we used the nolvasan (chlorhexidine) straight from the bottle and dipped the umbilicus 3x/day. We just took a salad dressing container and cut an "X" in the middle of the lid and used a 5 cc syringe to douse the navel with.

[JoZ]

I use Nolvasan. A dunk when the foal is just born (not yet standing) and another dunk when the vet comes out to do the IgG, because she lies the foal down at that time. I have splashed more solution "up there" on a standing foal if the vet says it needs it.

Pay attention to the concentration (%) of whatever you get. We have the Nolvasan SCRUB which is a higher concentration (2%) than their other product available locally. I think the other one is called "Solution" or "Rinse", not sure. We do the 4-to-1 ratio and it does make the solution a nice sky blue. I want to get a gallon jug of Chlorhexidine though -- it is MUCH MUCH cheaper than the Nolvasan brand name.

[sniplover]

I've seen Nolvasan/chlorohexidine at CVS pharmacies in smaller volumes

[Waterwitch]

Another benefit of using 0.5% Chlorhexidine is the fact that it offers residual protection due to the fact that chlorhexidine binds to the stratum corneum.

[Altamont Sport Horses]

Buy Chlorhexidine at Jeffers, 1 gallon for 12.95 or 1 pint for 4.19. It is also great for treating scratches and rainrot (2 applications does the trick for me). I buy at by the gallon. I've never diluted it for dunking the umbilicus and haven't had problems but I guess I'll dilute in the future after reading this. http://www.jeffersequine.com/ssc/product.asp?CID=1&mscssid=CAH30VSVAM1L8KSMNW2NGKRR3SAP7VA5

[Edgewood]

Buy Chlorhexidine at Jeffers, 1 gallon for 12.95 or 1 pint for 4.19. It is also great for treating scratches and rainrot (2 applications does the trick for me). I buy at by the gallon. I've never diluted it for dunking the umbilicus and haven't had problems but I guess I'll dilute in the future after reading this. http://www.jeffersequine.com/ssc/product.asp?CID=1&mscssid=CAH30VSVAM1L8KSMNW2NGKRR3SAP7VA5

ASH, I agree with you, it is great for scratches and clears it right up (I use full strength too). I also use full strength on the navel and hadn't had a problem.

But your link didn't work...what did you find on Jeffers to change your mind about full strength?

[Altamont Sport Horses]

ASH, I agree with you, it is great for scratches and clears it right up (I use full strength too). I also use full strength on the navel and hadn't had a problem.

But your link didn't work...what did you find on Jeffers to change your mind about full strength?

Sorry the link didn't work. Go to www.jeffersequine.com and type Chlorhexidine in the search bar.

I didn't find anything to make me think I'll dilute. I'll ask my vets about diluting and see what they say. I don't think they dilute but can't say for sure. I saw them treat newborns at the clinic but didn't see them prepare the chlorhexidine.

[Edgewood]

Sorry the link didn't work. Go to www.jeffersequine.com (http://www.jeffersequine.com) and type Chlorhexidine in the search bar.

I didn't find anything to make me think I'll dilute. I'll ask my vets about diluting and see what they say. I don't think they dilute but can't say for sure. I saw them treat newborns at the clinic but didn't see them prepare the chlorhexidine.

Ah, I misunderstood! I thought that you found something (ie, bad) on the Jeffers site that said that you definitely should dilute vs use it undiluted. But you were actually referring to this thread (ie, "what I read here").

[2Horse]

[QUOTE=Equine Reproduction;3950609]◊

The problem with iodine solutions is that they "do" cause drying of the umbillicus and ultimately, cracking of the skin and tissue around which allows for pathogenic access. When using chlorhexidine, it does require multiple treatments but research has shown that there are less problems and a lower incidence of navel and joint ill. QUOTE]




YES! Unfortunately I learned that the hard way last spring.
I lost a very beautiful, big, strong colt to Navel Ill due to the use of Iodine.:cry:
I was unaware that iodine could do that. All the books I read said to use iodine. I had used it for years.
It broke my heart knowing it was my fault the colt died.
You can sure bet I won't be using it again.:no:

[SonnysMom]

I had to use Chlorahexine per my dr instructions on my knee for a few days prior to my ACL surgery.
We picked it up at the local pharmacy. It was under the name Hibiclens. (Spelling may not be right but should be close enough that if you ask the pharmacist they should know what you mean)

[sfstable]

I had to use Chlorahexine per my dr instructions on my knee for a few days prior to my ACL surgery.
We picked it up at the local pharmacy. It was under the name Hibiclens. (Spelling may not be right but should be close enough that if you ask the pharmacist they should know what you mean)

You can usually pick up Hibiclens (you spelled it correctly) at any durable medical supply store (where they sell Oxygen, wheelchairs, etc. if your local pharmacy does not carry it. I order it with our supply orders at the office and keep a good bit of it around the barn. Comes in handy when I really want to clean something.

[MaresNest]

I use a 12cc syringe case, and up-end it over the navel. I hold it on for about 60 seconds.

Agreed. A syringe case is the perfect size/shape, can be closed up when you are done, and won't shatter if you drop it.

[seramisu]

My mare is due next month and I am starting to get my foaling kit paraphanelia together now. I was going to order some Nolvasan but I notice Kathy stressed that it does require multiple treatments... I board, so I will not be able to treat the navel multiple times daily. Would iodine be a better option for me, as I'll only be able to treat 2x/day? I have betadine on hand; will that do? and should I dilute it?

TIA

[Indy-lou]

Somebody mentioned the Nolvasan Teat Dip Solution. It is a slightly different formula, one is acetate and the other Diacetate, (I think) ? Also the Teat Dip Sol'n contains glycerin. So, my question is, can the Nolvasan Teat Dip soln be used on a foal's navel? I ask because this product is readily available at my feed store, whereas the regular Nolvasan is obtained via catalog order in one gallon quantity. I have always wondered if I could use the Teat Dip SAFELY if I ran out of the regular stuff.