Possibly helpful tough foaling tip

[selah]

Our first of 3 foals arrived this past Saturday. The dam is a maiden, gorgeous-moving, broad-hipped, bay tobiano draft. She was purpose-bred to a 16H, 3/4warmblood, 1/4 Polish Arabian.

She had a normally progressing first stage labor. Her water broke at 2:22 p.m. There she was with this biiig foot sticking out of her, and she sort of shut down...contractions seemed to get few & far between, and were not being particularly effective. I checked for position...presentation was correct, but the foal was big. We were pulling with the infrequent contractions.The mare ended up laying on her left side...not progressing, vet out of town for the weekend. Fortunately, I had the phone number of a woman who used to work for him, who also had experience foaling out draft mares. She suggested getting the mare up into sternal position, and she would flop herself rather forcefully back on the ground, and as soon as she did, it would stimulate a contraction. It worked...but by the time we got the foal delivered, it was after 4p.m. He was alive and active initially...and a beautiful, big leggy bay tobiano paint. But soon the brain swelling from hypoxia & dystocia caught up with him.:cry:
I don't know how often maidens sort of "zone out" when the going gets tough, but that tip of getting the mare into sternal position and holding her there 'til she flopped herself back on the ground was key to stimulate a contraction, and coordinate the pulling with it. As rough as it was, it could have been a lot worse...

[SuperEventer]

Wow, I'm getting ready for my mare to foal in a month or so...she's maiden as well...and I'm new to all of this. Thanks for the tip!!!

[Tornado Run Farm]

He was alive and active initially... But soon the brain swelling from hypoxia & dystocia caught up with him.:cry:



I'm soooo sorry. :(

[tuckawayfarm]

Thank you for taking the time to share that info. I'm so sorry about your colt. :cry:

[MagicRoseFarm]

sorry about your foal, ty for the foaling tip

[ahf]

I'm very,very sorry - I can only imagine your pain.

THere is another method to stimulate contractions in a mare that isn't coping - I'm slightly uncomfortable describing it - so I will leave the dosage out.

I had a mare quit in the middle of delivering a large foal last spring. Can't blame her though - she'd been split open stem to stern to correct a uterine torsion just a couple of months before.

She was at the vets to foal out because she was high-risk with the recent surgery (this was this mare's fourth foal for me - and her pain and her progression was not normal). My vet did not screw around. The moment it looked like she was quitting, my vet lept up, grabbed a bottle of Oxytocin and jugged her with a big shot. She delivered a huge, but healthy foal very shortly afterwards. She also spit out the placenta in VERY short order - something like 12 minutes after delivery - which was helpful - as she was in a LOT of pain after foaling, and I was able to give her Banamine to help with the pain very quickly.

Oxtocin will forever be in my foaling kit now, drawn up in the syringe, ready to go. But I doubt I'd use it unless I had a vet on the phone telling me to go there after timing a contraction - and describing the presentation. Also in my foaling kit is a rented bottle of oxygen.

[Hillside H Ranch]

I'm sorry for your loss.
AHF is right; oxytocin can be a huge help in these types of situations. She is also right, though, in that it is critical to make sure the foal is presented normally AND has room to come through the pelvic canal. If you give oxytocin without being certain of these things, you can rupture the uterus.

[selah]

I can see that oxytocin may have been helpful...unfortunately, I did not have any, and did not find out that my vet was going to be out of town until a couple of days before he left. I also did not see this problem coming...presentation was perfect...the stallion is about half the size of the mare...but the mare just sort of checked out. We finally started gaining ground when told to get her in sternal position, and pull the foal when she flopped back on the ground 'cause that would stimulate a contraction, which it did.
The thing I really needed in my foaling kit, is a magic wand..cause all the oxygen in the world doesn't help that foal when he's jammed tight with one foot in the world...

[winsmorefarm]

Not quite the same thing, but Raspberry Leaves (start giving around 2-3 months prior to due date and about 3 months after foaling out) work great for uterine contractions and colostrum/milk quality and production.

Last year, my huge mare (who hadn't had a foal for several years) foaled out and my colt was stuck at the shoulders. Her contractions stayed strong, but I could tell that she was becoming exhausted. Baby's position was good. I was literally ready to call vet when she got another contraction and out he came. Everything else was great afterwards and his IgG was almost 3000.

I get the Raspberry Leaves at www.herbalcom.com.

Has helped with maiden mares too.

[selah]

Not quite the same thing, but Raspberry Leaves (start giving around 2-3 months prior to due date and about 3 months after foaling out) work great for uterine contractions and colostrum/milk quality and production.

Last year, my huge mare (who hadn't had a foal for several years) foaled out and my colt was stuck at the shoulders. Her contractions stayed strong, but I could tell that she was becoming exhausted. Baby's position was good. I was literally ready to call vet when she got another contraction and out he came. Everything else was great afterwards and his IgG was almost 3000.

I get the Raspberry Leaves at www.herbalcom.com.

Has helped with maiden mares too.

How much do you give? I must say, I have 2 more to foal out (not maidens, however!) and I am a bit tense about it! And if anyone hears a report about a missing vet & his mobile clinic...they may be locked in my barn!!!

[Centuree]

Thanks for sharing, although I am sure that was difficult to share - that is valuable advice that I will be sure to remember. So sorry for the loss of your beautiful colt :(

[Donella]

Sorry for your loss, gosh, that is so sad to have him born alive and then lose him:no:
Thanks for sharing this info as well, all these experiences that are posted are soooo helpful. I am finding myself always learning new things in regards to foaling on this board , things that you don't seen to from a book (the interactive nature of this board is great for these sorts of issues).

[pintopiaffe]

Thank you so much for posting what you learned... poor little guy's life was not in vain if it helps just one of us out. That will be locked in my memory cells now 'just in case.'

I'm so sorry. :cry:

I too feed red raspberry leaf now after having almost miraculous results with my old girl who retained with her first two. She'd been a 16yo maiden when first bred, 17yo first foal etc. Long story, I retired her after 2nd.. but she chose otherwise. I credit the RRL with amazing results--she went on to have two more for me, healthy, wonderful foals, and placenta came out (all in one piece) within a half hour of foaling each time. Now I use it for everyone. Just cuz. ;)

I use 1/2-1 cup loosely 'packed.' I get the actual dried leaves, which are rather fluffy. If you're getting the more fine/dense/heavy leaf, (chopped fine) the dosage would be different. Meadowsweet Herbs is a great website for information on it, and Patti will answer questions. I admit to ordering elsewhere this last time, but really recommend Patti for first-time users as she's horse specific and really knowledgeable. She also has a fabulous fennellseed and fenugreek mix for late term mares. I put the goodies in the girl's beep, and it smells SOOOOOOOOO good when I add the hot water and soak it. ;)

[winsmorefarm]

I get the ground up leaves, instead of the chopped up ones (mares weren't very fond of the fuzziness) and give one tablespoon daily for an average size mare and up to two tablespoons for xtra-large mare. It mixes great with any grain/supplements.

I generally get several pounds (especially when "on sale"), so I don't have to worry about running out.

My repro vet was a little skeptical a few years ago (when I first started using it - after it being recommended to me by a fellow breeder) - she was shaking her head AND rolling her eyes. We used it on two mares (one who foaled out at my place and the other went to hospital to foal out). One mare was a maiden TB, the other a QH surrogate (15 hands) that was carrying a WB cross baby (from 16.2 & 17.0 hand parents). Both IgG results were over 2000 and the labor and delivery went well for both. Placenta looked good and no fluid retention afterwards for re-breeding at 30 day heat.

Afterwards, my vet AND hospital staff were very impressed. They both noted IgG levels - they had never seen so high. My vet still shakes her head and rolls her eyes about many things (BUT not at Raspberry Leaves) and the hospital staff has noticed significant differences (for the better), with regards to mares that have been on Raspberry Leaves.

I meant to add that Oxytocin is great to have on hand (for emergency use, under vet supervision).

Thank you Selah for sharing your incredibly difficult experience and I am very sorry for your loss. I can only imagine how you must be feeling with your other two mares due. Please keep us posted and I am sending jingles. When are your other mares due?

[selah]

OK, I'm putting in my order for bulk red raspberry leaves, and getting some from my local health food store to start immediately! My vet prrroooomises he's not going anywhere 'til we have foaled them both out, and he's helping me fill the "holes" in my foaling kit!!!!

My other two (both experienced TBs) are due on the March 15 ("Beware the Ides of March"!?:eek:) and March 20th. The one due on the 15th seems to like the full moon (March 10th)....we also have Friday the 13th coming up...aaaiiieee!

Thank you all for your jingles, wisdom, & encouragement!