Four Reasons to Jump Your Dressage Horse

[gladys]

Four Reasons to Jump your Dressage Horse (http://www.barnmice.com/profiles/blogs/4-great-reasons-to-jump-your)

I jump my PSG horse (over tiny jumps) and we both love it. Does anyone else jump their dressage horse?

[STF]

All of our are cross trained, even if its just small 2'6" fences.

[Pommederue]

LOL, I think it should be the opposite; jumpers should do some dressage training on their horses. But seriously, I think some combined training would be good in both disciplines. We have mostly hunters at our stables and I can honestly say that some of their 'best' hunter/jumpers horses couldn't do a first level test. That's because the majority don't do much flat work and jump off of what they call the horse's 'athletic ability' alone. Plus, the hunter/jumper trainers never encourage a dressage lesson for their students. If fact, they are usually discouraged from it and if they practice any sort of 'dressage' they are sort of looked at as an outcast. On the other hand, if we dressage riders want to 'jump' our horses, we have to pay for a lesson from one of the hunter trainers because we are not allowed to jump a fence without one present.

[fordtraktor]

Pommerdue, every reputable jumper trainer I have ever worked with schools their horses in dressage. Most upper-level jumpers are trained to around second level. A good jumper must be responsive, adjustable, and well-balanced.

[Ajierene]

Pommerdue, every reputable jumper trainer I have ever worked with schools their horses in dressage. Most upper-level jumpers are trained to around second level. A good jumper must be responsive, adjustable, and well-balanced.

I get the impression that jumpers cross train into dressage more than dressage cross trains into jumping.

There is a fifth reason for jumping your dressage horse - variety....lack of boredom through variety. mental stretching.

[saultgirl]

Does anyone do smalls jumps in their dressage saddle or does everyone switch saddles for this type of cross training?

[SillyHorse]

Does anyone do smalls jumps in their dressage saddle or does everyone switch saddles for this type of cross training?
I always switch to my jumping saddle when I know I'll be jumping (we go up to 3'), but I'll do small jumps in the dressage saddle if I'm forced to, lol. I'm just much more comfortable jumping in the saddle that was made for it.

[GreekDressageQueen]

I use a jumping saddle when I jump my dressage horse but I have noticed his style has dramatically changed as he becomes much more advanced in collection. It is now quite uncomfortable to jump him even over small stuff as he comes to the jump super collected and POPS over it like he is actually doing a levade or something. The other option is to let him come in at quite a strong medium canter which defeats the purpose of the exercise IMO and puts him in more danger of hurting himself. My horse was bred to be an event horse and started out as an event horse until a bad accident left me hesitant to continue pursuing eventing and we are much better together at dressage anyway.

However, I think jumping dressage horses is a great cross training activity and would recommend it. But, I wonder how many truly upper level horses are still able to jump comfortably with their riders after achieving such a sensitivity to the aids and collection. There was an interesting thread about this in the eventing forum because of a statement Jimmy Wofford said about "dressage ruining event horses" - not a straight quote but I'm paraphrasing. I think in some sense, he may be right because upper level dressage horses do move differently and use their bodies differently, which may prove to be incompatible with jumping. I don't know, horses are so individualistic maybe I'm the only one that has this problem.

[pintopiaffe]

Does anyone do smalls jumps in their dressage saddle or does everyone switch saddles for this type of cross training?Since the jumps are soooo weeeeny, we do them in the stressaghe saddle. I have a couple of XC style obstacles (really, a big stride, not a jump) on the hill of the pasture where I ride at the bottom. If I'm going for a hillwork/hack/galloping day I do hike my stirrups as much as the saddle allows. But if we're just stuck mid-ride, I often will turn for a canter up the hill, and sometimes will pop over some of the logs or tires or such.

Himself ADORES running & leaping. A bit too much. I'm too big for him to really jump him, but he is quite good at it. At his RPSI inspection, they kept raising and raising the chute. He was jumping the same as the BIG guys, in very good form. Otto kept chuckling at him. Actually, he'd stop or knock the pole the first time it went up (he'd never gone CLOSE to those heights!) and then the second time at the same height would've figured it out and went beautifully.

We did a baby-baby HT a few years ago. It was one of the most perfect days of my life. He was SUCH a star. Here's a jump that's a weeeee bit too enthusiastic... :uhoh: (I've lost 30 more lbs since then, no flames, please) http://www.angelfire.com/me/innisfailte/images/BIGjump.jpg He was thinking HARD about refusing, then at the last minute, LAUNCHED. We don't have real painted jumps or standards at home, so the bright, pretty jumps here were a big deal. I got WAY left--but didn't hit his mouth! (I'm pretty sure if there was audio, that would've been a huge "ooooofff." :lol: )

And here you can tell how much both of us HATE it... http://www.angelfire.com/me/innisfailte/images/purpletrot.jpg :winkgrin:

When I am to my goal weight, if it is before he is a senior citizen, we will do another HT. He really likes it, and is good at it.

[TrotTrotPumpkn]

Pommerdue, every reputable jumper trainer I have ever worked with schools their horses in dressage. Most upper-level jumpers are trained to around second level. A good jumper must be responsive, adjustable, and well-balanced.

Even in jumping clinics we usually do just as much flatwork as over fences...

[Carnelian]

Let's get this thead back to the OP's "do dressage riders jump their horses" and AWAY from flaming hunters and jumpers for needing to do more dressage.

If you search previous threads of mine, you'll see me state I gave up jumping as a condition of a purchase of a dressage horse (condition of my husband's :(). As a re-rider, I evented at the lower levels up until a year ago while competing at 2nd level dressage.

Well, I still put on my skull helmet and vest and jump no larger than 2'6" since the newly purchased horse is fabulous over fences. Many years ago, I used to event up to Prelim and show lower level jumpers. Yes, I think jumping freshens up a horse. Before my dressage trainer retired her mare, she would have me jump her horse as I was/am better trained over fences.

You can easily defeat the purpose of freshening up the dressage horse by jumping if you aren't very well schooled over fences yourself. Getting left behind and banging the horse in the mouth and back will completely negate the "change of pace" exercise. If you don't jump often, I'd recommend grids as they will place you and the horse at the right take-off for the jump.

Or, aghast :eek:, find a jumper or event trainer with a respectable body position (i.e. NOT perched up on the neck before the fence), and take a lesson.

[purplnurpl]

Does anyone do smalls jumps in their dressage saddle or does everyone switch saddles for this type of cross training?

I can jump around 2'6'' pretty well in my dressage saddle. Whatever you have. go for it. : )

[purplnurpl]

Four Reasons to Jump your Dressage Horse (http://www.barnmice.com/profiles/blogs/4-great-reasons-to-jump-your)

I jump my PSG horse (over tiny jumps) and we both love it. Does anyone else jump their dressage horse?

Along with the back, I think it opens the shoulder and rib cage.

[millerra]

And if you don't feel comfortable jumping yourself - your horse might love free jumping. Mine do - they quickly figure out that you want them to go into the chute and will do some funny manuevers to get back in. the chute to do it again.

Honestly, I think they think it's really fun to free jump.

Caveat - you need to know how to set distances and be able to 'read' a horse to some degree, and adjust the fences to keep them confident and jumping well.

[LeopardBay]

I jump one of my dressage horses.
She can get quite enthusiastic when she is in the mood to jump. It gives us a change of place, and clears out the cobwebs.
I jump her in my dressage saddle, but we only go about as high at 80cm with the occassional 1m high jump. We don't do shows, as she is sometimes put off by the fillers under the jumps.

My other horse doesnt like to jump. We think he is slightly sight impaired in one eye which must make it difficult for him to judge the distance and height. He even struggles with trot poles. But he has done a little jump work... preferring to trot in and plop over rather than canter in.

We are stabled in a jumper yard.... always have been as we are about teh only dressage riders in the whole town. But I must say - there are very few of the jumpers around here that would make a decent attempt at a first level test...... which is sad really.

[Linda]

I would think this would be a great idea! I am primarily a jumper rider. My trainer spends twice as much time with us on the flat as she does over fences. She says jumping is flat work with fences in the way. That is because it is the riders job to place the horse in front of the fence that is the right place for him to jump. Dressage gives him balance so the rider can adjust the distance to the fence as they approach it.

I have a friend who bought a 2nd level dressage horse and introduced him to jumping. She had a terrific time. He very much enjoyed it toobut the great part of it for her was that he was so well balanced from the dressage, that she could easily, lengthen and shorten his stride, move him laterally, land and turn smoothly after the fence - all because of his great dressage training!

And the horse loved it. Instead of just schooling in the ring, he would really engage and move forward in a lovely frame. I think its a terrific way to keep your horse having fun when you ride!

[not again]

Reason number 5: Here is one we loose jump regularly. It has the extra benefit of keeping his stifles toned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZwPPBWFUmk&feature=channel_page

[fatorangehorse]

I have only 1 horse now about to go PSG - we jump 3-3'6" pretty regularly (1 or 2x / month). He loves it! I do it to entertain him (and me - long ago I used to be an eventer) but I can feel the benefit in him in our next ride. In addition to the benefitis outlined in the article and here, I feel immediate relaxation in his shoulders and his ability to be light in front. It's almost like it makes him remember up is an option after jumping.

I showjump and free jump (which everyone should do a little - great to see your horses natural movement and reaction to things). I also take him to XC school - nothing difficult. It is great to get him galloping. Maybe others don't have this problem - but I sometimes find myself allowing his engine to get a little quiet when always riding in a small space. The galloping is fun for him, but it really helps me to remember forward first!

thanks for starting this thread!! Many of my dressage friends -even (maybe especially) @ the FEI levels rarely vary their flatwork program. I encourage them otherwise - but they I'm just think I'm unrefined. (which is probably true by the way)

[fatorangehorse]

I don't think I could hold much of a position in my dressage tack. Have to say, I have never tried. I guess I should.

[saultgirl]

I've been putting off starting to do some little jumps with my horse... because I never seem to feel like hauling out my close contact saddle... my dressage saddle is sooooo much nicer!

[Barbara_F]

I jump in my dressage saddle because it's all I have. I only jump about a foot and a half though and I'm quite comfortable. I just shorten my stirrups a few holes and away I go!

[mvp]

I think dressage horses of all levels benefit in a number of ways.

It helps them think "forward."

It also about taking responsibility for self-carriage as well as paying attention to the world around them, not just the rider. Some dressage riders might not want this, but I think it does pay off to have horse learn to look at the outside world and listen at the same time when they get to busy shows.

I think it helps even specialized upper-level horses tone parts of the body we would like (seem Mecklem's idea about strengthening stifles in the original link).

It also helps them use other parts well, if in ways we don't always think about in dressage. Watch the video that not again posted. Her nice horse uses his front end better and better each time, and rocks back on his hocks in the last trip through the jumping shoot. He's clearly thinking and using his body well, too!

Finally, I have found that stopping over poles on the ground are the best technique EVER for teaching half halts. Ask if you want to know and I'll give you the step by step and philosophy. As a cross-training rider, I can also make suggestions about setting up jumps and poles that will help you get the right distance every time.

-mvp

[Equa]

No! don't do it! Your horse will be so fabulous at jumping that someone will find out and take him eventing, and you'll never get him back as your own wonderful dressage pony (speaking from bitter-sweet experience...).

[Beasmom]

I wish I COULD jump my gelding for cross training. Unfortunately, he suffered an injury that ended his jumping career and was intentionally sold to a "non-jumping" home. As part of his rehabilitation, I did walk and trot him over ground poles, but he draws the line at anything that requires a jump. Even a teensy jump. So the best I can do for cross-training is trail riding and occasional rail grids. Even those seem to worry him. He enjoys moving the BO's cows around the pasture, so we do that now and then.

My mare, on the other hand, thrives on grids and jumps. She'd really be better as a hunter, Pony Club or low eventer than a dressage horse, but the economy's so bad, I'm afraid I couldn't sell her. Gymnastic grids are the best way to get her to loosen up, relax, and go forward. Too bad my best jumping days are long gone!

[prudence]

If you go back and read your "Notes on Dressage and Combined Training," published by the AHSA, amended to 1966, you will see there was a separate scored jumping movement for levels 3 and lower. Specifically,


Jump fence 75 cm (2'6"). (Two efforts allowed). To be scored solely on proper use of aids, management of horse, willingness and obedience.{asterisk}

{asterisk} Jumping is not required when test is part of combined event.

[meupatdoes]

I find, when bringing along a young horse, that a couple of small jumps can really help the canter along. They often canter much better trotting up to and cantering away from a small jump.

I agree with the article that the "hunter" ride encourages a more giving hand.
It is amazing how nicely a well trained hunter will stay "under your seat" and carry himself. Coming into a slightly snug line, a horse will learn to rebalance himself without the hand having to get it done so much.

However, it takes a confident and skilled jumping ride to really reap the benefits of fences, imo. If the rider is going "Omg, ACK!" and doesn't know how to set up a logical progression of skills for the horse to try, they'll just end up using up his legs for the day to no real benefit.

And for all those who claim that hunter riders never seek out dressage lessons, I had one on one horse over the weekend, and will have one on my baby hunter prospect tomorrow morning, and my third horse who already knows his 3' hunter job (which is as high as he will go) is coming to a dressage barn after his winter off. Though of course he will still tag along to the hunter shows with the others to make sure everyone knows he's still got it. :)

[FleetwoodStarr]

I would like to jump my boy, but me+him over fences= :no:
I started jumping and switched to dressage when I realised that I am TERRIBLE at riding over any kind of fence. In addition to having no ability to actually ride over a fence, I have yet to be able to get a horse to take off at the right spot (even in well set-up grids), and as a result have become completely nervous about jumping.
My horse, despite his wonderful jumping pedigree isn't much better than me. When I got him he had trouble trotting over ground poles lol. I tried free jumping him once and it wasn't much better (worse actually).
Soo I don't think jumping is for us, for now I'm sticking to trail rides and bareback rides for fun. I do think jumping can be a great thing for dressage horses in general though.

[Sabine]

NEVER...

I let my horses have amazing turnouts- free jumping, trail rides but me jumping??? No way!
why would I subject them to such sub-standard conditions...hehe....

I think a young horse might like it- but I think smart dressage horses take pride in their job and love their work ...

[columbus]

Having Irish Draughts you would think jumping must be a natural but I had a gelding who loved dressage but thought jumping was a great way to ruin an fun dressage lesson and I believe that the major problem was jumping in a dressage saddle and I recommend jumping green horses in a jumping saddle or all purpose saddle. It is important to get off their backs and to be able to encourage a free canter, the saddle is designed for jumping and it is every bit as helpful for jumping as dressage saddles are for dressage. The fit of jumping saddles is less complicated than fitting dressage saddles and you can get by with borrowed or less expensive jump saddles. I want to add that it is important that the jump saddle be ridden as a jump saddle and not to take the dressage seat and plant it in the jump saddle.

Jumping has been wonderful for this gelding. It has encouraged more jump in his canter and better use of his hind end and they are right it has freed his shoulder as well. He is more forward and quicker footed. As much as he loves dressage he now also loves the challenge of jumping. Today he did cavalettis in trot then canter. He was so pleased that he figured out how to do it. This was a horse who mostly scattered poles a couple of months ago...now he knows to jump UP! Now he know he doesn't want to touch the poles. One of the goals of his work has been to encourage him to solve the problems the jumps and little courses present...for an Irish Draught this is like a big crate of carrots...they love to think and puzzle.

We have another Irish Draught who nickers at his stall door as we set the jumps up and he is so obviously delighted about his jumping lesson that you would be cruel to keep him from jumping and he is working third/fourth but he likes to stop listening...kind of a yada yada yada in dressage lessons...in jumping he has LEARNED to listen so the rider can help him with problems he doesn't get while jumping and that translates over to dressage.

We use a young eventing trainer to start our horses over fences...Saturday morning jumping. PatO

[not again]

Back in the early days of US dressage competition there was always a jump at the end of the test---2'6" to 3' for all levels. You came out of the ring and went around the outside perimeter and had to trot or gently canter over, then walk after the landing. To show obedience. :yes: (And the rider's ability to jump in a dressage saddle too!);)

[fatorangehorse]

i see prix caprilli making a comeback in local schooling shows. Think we'll ever see it in rated competition again?

[Gracie]

I jump my mare occasionally using my dressage saddle. She blasts out a loud fart over each jump.

[sid]

In lieu of jumping, for those who are not comfortable doing so ...cavaletti. Freejumping is great too, but putting up a chute is a PIA, unless you have a really wide arena and can just leave it up.

[GreekDressageQueen]

Back in the early days of US dressage competition there was always a jump at the end of the test---2'6" to 3' for all levels. You came out of the ring and went around the outside perimeter and had to trot or gently canter over, then walk after the landing. To show obedience. :yes: (And the rider's ability to jump in a dressage saddle too!);)

This sounds like a HORRIBLE idea! I don't really care about the jumping over the fence part - I'm fine with that - but doing 3' in a dressage saddle? I really don't know how y'all can do that. I've tried a few times to jump in my dressage saddle and it sucks me back over the fence and then slams me in the ass on the way down. I have jumped for too many years in a proper jumping saddle that there is no way I could keep my form over a fence in a dressage saddle.

[Mozart]

I once asked Gina Smith if the dressage horses at her farm were jumped and she said yes they were jumped. She said a local hunter rider comes and jumps the horses.

I think it is beneficial for a lot of reasons.

[thatmoody]

I would like to see the resurgence of prix caprilli as an option, at least (a separate class, so that you could choose whether or not to jump) at recognized shows. I have a horse who is a brilliant jumper and I'm always torn with him - he's also brilliant at dressage, but sometimes...

[equusaround]

My dressage stallion ended up at an eventing barn in late 2007 and by Fall 2008 he was a strong contender at Open Preliminary, coming in 2nd place at Galway Down International 3-day Event. According to my dressage trainer, the jumping and galloping x-country will improve his "jump and expression" in his changes and his canter pirouettes. Running and jumping certainly makes him happy and he ended up with year end awards as an eventer!

Dressage (at Rebecca Farms, Montana):

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff171/teamgauguin/IMG_0870.jpg

Stadium jumping (at Galway):

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff171/teamgauguin/IMG_2509.jpg

Cross Country (at Copper Meadows):

http://i237.photobucket.com/albums/ff171/teamgauguin/IMG_1338.jpg