2 ring elevator legal in dressage phase?

[butlerfamilyzoo]

Just a quick question. Is a 2 ring happy mouth elevator allowed in the dressage phase?

[QHEventr]

I don't believe so.

[Janet]

Absolutely not.
Not a gray area at all.

[butlerfamilyzoo]

Yep, didnt think so, but wanted to make sure! Thanks!

[Bobthehorse]

Eeek no way. And on that note, if thats what you are doing dressage in, you need a big change in training.

[joharavhf]

I was going to say the same thing as Bobthehorse...but refrained ;)

BUT.....The boucher is legal. Don't understand WHY, but maybe it's similar enough to the 2-ring elevator?????

[butlerfamilyzoo]

The 2 ring elevator happy mouth was recomended by a trainer recently for my horse that needs just a little more whoa. Which might work fine for jumping work, but then i've got to tackle that canter in the dressage ring, so i'm not sure what to do there yet. It presently takes me 3 circles to get him from a canter to a trot... Granted, i'm coming back from having a baby and my muscles are gone, so its hard to be as strong as i need to be, but this is getting ridiculous. He KNOWS better! And he also knows that right now, i cant make him do otherwise... Its getting old.

[butlerfamilyzoo]

For more info, he's presently dragging me around in a loose ring french link "revolver" happy mouth...

[Threeday33]

Don't quote me on this, but I had a student a few years ago who had the bottom ring sawed off of a 2 ring. So, the rein went on the big ring and it still had a slight amount of leverage. This was legal for dressage...at least at the time it was. You would have to ask the TD at each show I am guessing. Boucher bits are very similar, so you might want to try one of those-they are definitely legal :)

[carrie_girl]

Try a boucher. I think it might really help. Also, I believe Dr. Bristols are still legal for dressage. That definitely is a stronger bit than a french link. French links are about as mild as you can get.

[piaffeprincess98]

I would say push through it at home with the bit you're comfortable with. He might just need a reminder for awhile. Then when you're getting ready to show, switch to something legal. My OTTB is similar in canter. On days when he doesn't want to listen, it takes me many circles to get him to trot. I just spiral my circle down to 12 meters or so. Last week, my trainer and I tried a strategy which was to just let him keep cantering for awhile on a 20m circle until he "let it go", meaning the pulling and quickening. It only took a few extra circles than usual and he gave it up.

[quietann]

My mare -- whose issues can be similar, although not nearly so bad -- has been quite happy in the entirely legal Stubben EZ-Control loose ring snaffle. It's not a good bit for horses who lean on the bit though...

[retreadeventer]

Oh dear. He's blowing thru your aids.
You CAN change bits and all, but it sounds to me that he's needing a "sensitivity" course....a bit of a Come To Jesus introduction...reinforced with consistency and parameters. Three circles to canter is three too many! A couple of strides or he "gets it"! (But there are effective ways to teach this without being mean or rude). You cannot let a horse dictate the schooling, babe; he has 23.5 hours of the day to do what HE wants. That .5 hour you ask him to do what you want...well, that's where the Come To Jesus meeting comes in!
Hey there is a very good article on this in the last issue of Practical Horsemean, written by a dressage trainer, Shawna Harding, about sensitivity and how to know when enough is enough. Not sure if it's online but take a look if you can find it, good reading and right to your problem.

Oh and I'd get the happy mouth gone -- try a regular snaffle with thinner mouth and fit it high in the corners.
Good luck!