WWYD Breed Snobbery and Teen Angst?-Updated Post 96

[alterdstate]

I've changed my usual name to protect the guilty... :D

I haven't run into this before and need feedback. Recently a teenage pampered eventing princess (let's call her Pep!) who has a high dollar horse competing at the lower levels made some rather disparaging comments about my son's horse. The comments had to do with the horse's ancestry, which is of mixed heritage :eek: and the fact that he is never going to be talented enough to go above Prelim. Keep in mind that my son has been eventing longer than Pep and has a horse that is extremely bold and safe but it doesn't have a European pedigree and we sure the heck didn't mortgage the house to buy it. More than good enough for us.

While I could care less about Pep's opinion of said horse, it has impacted my teen in a negative fashion. Let me add that comments have also been made about son's personal grooming habits and clothing. Never does Pep make these comments in front of the trainer or any other adult. The trainer seems to be clueless.

My question is, as a parent, wwyd? I have told my son that he is a better person for not buying in to this sort of behavior, that it is acceptable to tell Pep that the comments are hurtful (she didn't care-"I NOTICE things" she says) and that it's best to try and let it roll off his back. I've tried seperating them as much as possible but it doesn't seem to help. I've also explained that physical violence is out of the question. :lol: So what next? I hesitate to get involved as I think this is a pretty good life lesson but how far should it go before something is said to Pep, the trainer or Pep's parents or should I just stay out of it? I'm getting pretty darn frustrated.

[magnolia73]

Horses have a nice way of setting PEPS on their asses. Preferably in some mud or water. ;)

[seeuatx]

Apparently "Pep" has never heard of a cute little grey grade mare named Sportscar... or any of the other countless other successful grades and "knacker" saves throughout the history of eventing (He was a TB, but what about Red, Nick Larkin's $900 meat market save that he won Rolex on). Or Marcus Aurelius, the 15 hand Connemara/TB cross that won Pan Am Games with Mary Ann Tauskey back in the 70's.

That's my advice... let him know that some of eventing's best horses have come from questionable backgrounds or lineage.

[Bobthehorse]

Some of the best event horses in the world have been of mixed heritage. Definitely more mixed breeds than there have been European warmbloods.

[tikidoc]

Seeuatx, you beat me to it, I was also going to mention Red. What a wonderful horse from humble beginnings.

[galwaybay]

Age of teenage son and PEP? Young teens maybe...could this be somewhat of a role reversal - used to be around that age (or younger) when boy liked a girl - he made fun of her - goodness knows he couldn't say he liked her - not in front of his friends... so I'm wondering if maybe PEP might have secret crush on teen son but can't confess her crush because a) his horse doesn't have right pedigree and b) his clothes and grooming habits (I'm a bit concerned about this - is son more into fashion and grooming than PEP? or not into grooming and clothes at all? Or is PEP just a bully?

I would venture to say that based on my experience at most equine competitions son would be fairly popular among the female set - I would not worry about this PEP - nature has a funny way of taking care of these situations... and when it comes to anything equine it's taken care of in the most interesting and often amusing ways...

[Little Valkyrie]

See, I was going to suggest tossing her in the water complex. But, as a "young person" I understand where what your son is feeling...I am seeing a lot more people with attitudes like Pep's in the eventing world, which is rather discouraging IMO. It's hard to say, and a PITA to hear from other people, but I guess ignoring it is the best way. Until you snap and say "I don't care if your horse was owned by the F***ing Queen of England, leave me and my wonderful mutt horse alone!"

[Ajierene]

You could tell your son he's being more 'patriotic' by not having a horse with European pedigree...

Overall, it is just tough and it is a life lesson. This is one of those life lessons that is learned is years, not hours or days or weeks. You can remind him that Bruce Davidson had non-horsey parents and started out on the backyard mutt types. Not all the greats started with a silver spoon and just because she has some fancy horse does not mean she knows how to ride or she's going anywhere. There was a thread on here about the Developing Rider's program. It mentions some members with money who stopped riding in college - lost interest, whatever.

Usually those that have to work for it appreciate it more, work harder at it and end up being better at it.

[Beam Me Up]

My opinion--your advice to your son is good. There are jerks out there, and he should try not to let it get to him. Wealthy does not mean classy.

Since you say he's a teen, I think that you becoming directly involved by talking to Pep or her parents (who might be as classless as she is . . . ) would undermine your son.

He is free to call her out (and might be able to make a real impression by doing so and not being intimidated), but by the time I was a teenager the last thing I wanted was my parents intervening in any of my social interactions.

It might be worth mentioning to him, though, that she's putting a lot of energy into deriding him, and if neither he nor his riding abilities were at all threatening to her, she wouldn't bother.

[EqTrainer]

I guess you have to decide if the line between her ignorance running her mouth and her being a bully has been crossed. If she makes him feel uncomfortable enough to stop wanting to do things he normally would want to, or has affected his riding negatively, I would speak to her parents about it if she is a minor. If she's not a minor, I'd speak to her directly.

I also have to say, that both of my children know that they are allowed to tell anyone to shut up and leave them alone if they have asked nicely once. There is no reason for anyone to be a doormat to someone else's mouth and the sooner kids learn that they are allowed to NOT allow someone else to give them a hard time, the better.

[scpezold]

I say trip her and pray she falls face first in the fresh pile of horse manure that mysteriously fell in her path. Whoops. But that is just me :D

Edit: Oh I see you said no violence.....

[Eventer13]

You could have a private talk with Pep. Keep it civil, of course, but it should embarrass her enough to shut her up. All you really need to tell her is that she it being incredibly rude and immature, and that she needs to keep her opinions to herself.

My mother did this to a guy who was saying some mean things to my brother. This is the only time she ever really got "mother hen-ish" (actually I'm still a bit amazed that the whole event occurred), but I will say that kid NEVER crossed the line again.

And you only need to look at our past Olympic team to see horses that weren't bred for eventing succeeding at the highest level.

[Eventer13]

Or... you can give your son permission to do what I might do in that situation, assuming the girl is old enough: just casually and calmly tell her to F*** off and mind her own business.

I guess that's a harsher version of EqTrainer's "shut up," but it generally produces good results with the rude, bratty ones.

[BritNativePony]

I don't chime in often, but I couldn't help myself on this thread :) What an opportunity to impart some of the best advice I've ever received - and I it was from my Mother, of course!

When I was younger, going through the same transition from adolescent to not-quite-adult (ugh, those irritating teen years!) my Mom had the best saying: "That's just one person's way of trying to dim your light, to make theirs look brighter". How simple, yet truthful is that? She's always been the classiest of classy women, and this was her way of helping me to form a starting point from which I could understand this behavior in others, and it gave me the confidence to stand up for myself when I needed to because I understood 'the game'.

I'd continue to support your son, and use a similar teaching to help him to a) understand this part of life and b) learn how to handle it.

[Kementari]

I guess you have to decide if the line between her ignorance running her mouth and her being a bully has been crossed. If she makes him feel uncomfortable enough to stop wanting to do things he normally would want to, or has affected his riding negatively, I would speak to her parents about it if she is a minor. If she's not a minor, I'd speak to her directly.

I also have to say, that both of my children know that they are allowed to tell anyone to shut up and leave them alone if they have asked nicely once. There is no reason for anyone to be a doormat to someone else's mouth and the sooner kids learn that they are allowed to NOT allow someone else to give them a hard time, the better.

Right on. :yes:

[twofatponies]

Good advice here, though I will vote on the side of not intervening (by talking to the girl or to her parents or trainer). It will just add an extra layer of embarrassment to the situation, at least from my own experience (my mom was an over-enthusiastic intervener!). He won't die from being insulted, and he'll learn to either ignore it or think of something witty to say in return. Life lessons!

[MelantheLLC]

I agree with BNP, this is really a common thing that will come up in life, and it's better for a kid to learn to handle it emotionally himself than to have "mom" step in and speak to the girl.

The girl--she's some other parent's problem. Her comments are annoying but that's ALL they are, for both OP and son. At least that's all it should be.

Perhaps there's more than meets the eye, in a romantic sense, from one side or the other or both. But otherwise...

Stick and stones, eh?

[LAZ]

I'd say let your kid fight his own battles. If it bugs him, let him resolve it and you MYOB as much as possible.

It's a good lesson in life to learn to how to do that, no need to fuel issues that are best ignored.

[Mary in Area 1]

I may be the lone dissenter here, but this point worried me:

"Let me add that comments have also been made about son's personal grooming habits and clothing."

Just make sure there is no truth behind these comments. I think many young boys would be better off if they were told that showering and shampooing daily, especially after being in the barn all day, was ABSOLUTLEY necessary. And, there are barn clothes and school clothes, and they are NOT the same, esp. sneakers!

[Bobthehorse]

Just make sure there is no truth behind these comments. I think many young boys would be better off if they were told that showering and shampooing daily, especially after being in the barn all day, was ABSOLUTLEY necessary. And, there are barn clothes and school clothes, and they are NOT the same, esp. sneakers!

Hahah Im a dirty little boy. I cross every one of those lines. Especially sneakers!

[deltawave]

Be on your son's side. It's never too early for him to know that peer pressure is something potentially brutal, but that a negative reaction to it is VOLUNTARY. Kids are mean when they're not taught to be otherwise, and sometimes even when they are. You can only influence the development and behavior of your OWN offspring. :)

[FlightCheck]

There is nothing in life more viscious than a teenage girl, unless it is teenage girls in groups.

I'm in the "life's lessons" group - this is part of growing up, and at that age Everything and Everyone is a target of ridicule.

[Hilary]

The best way to put a bully in his or her place is to stand up to them.

The more he cows and reacts to her comments the more she's likely to make them.

If he ignores her or says "I really don't need your feedback, thanks. I like my horse, and I'll take a shower when I get home" what can she say to that? Not much.

My brother rode and there were more than enough girls who didn't care what breed his horse was or what his clothes looked like (ratty & tie-dyed mostly) that if one hadn't? Her loss.

[mkevent]

I agree with the above posters. This is a great time to help him learn "life lessons" and your best bet as a parent is to help him see all the options(and the possible repercussions from these options) and let him decide.
My daughters have dealt with bullies and it's really tough not to get involved-I let them vent to me and listen while they try to solve the problems on their own-I do give feedback if I think a particular option may not have been fully thought out.
The one time I intervened was an accidental one-my older daughter had 2 "friends" in high school that had been bullying her on the phone all weekend. She went into the other room when the phone rang and my younger daughter picked up and put it on speakerphone-I overheard the snarkiness and rudeness of these 2 girls and I lost it! I gave them a rather abrupt verbal "manners lesson". My older daughter then had to deal with the repercussions- she did lose those 2 as "friends" and ended up making new friends but I felt horrible that I forced the issue by snapping out at those girls-it should have been my daughter's decision to end the friendship.
I really think high schools and colleges should offer a "how to deal with a$$holes" course-it would be very useful!!

[subk]

I have teenage daughters and pretty much live this problem on a regular basis. While I generally would love to have a go at the little snots myself I realize that 1)my child would be better off if they learn to fight their own battles, 2) if I fight their battles then it's a pretty sound message to them that I think they can't do it for themselves 3) my involvement is the ultimate recognition that the insults are doing exactly what the little snot wanted in the first place.

The girl is a bully, treat her like one. That means that when she throws some insult don't acknowledge the insult, instead throw the focus back on her and her behavior, make HER feel uncomfortable about opening her mouth in the first place. It's kind of like training horses, if they don't get the response they want and they response they do get makes them uncomfortable then the eventually stop the behavior. I would certainly let your son know that he has to "train" her. :wink:

I role play responses with my girls. Here's some examples to, "Your horse is such a mutt. I'll bet his daddy was featured on "Fugly."
1) "What did you say?" It is very good to make them repeat the insult. Sometimes after a little "training" that's all it takes to get them to mumble and walk away.
2) "I can't believe you just said that." If she responses with "why not?" then: "Because it is rude and crass thing for you to say."
3) "Gee Pep, did you get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning? Someone pee in you Wheaties?" Humor especially at her expense is good.
4) "Should you really say such bitchy things out loud? Someone might hear you and I wouldn't want them to think you actually are a bitch." I like this with a tone of real earnestness and concern.
5) "And why is it that I'm suppose to care about your opinion?"

And if anybody ever justified their comments with "I NOTICE things." then the response is: "And I notice all kinds of things about you, but that doesn't mean I should be so rude as to speak them out loud."

Don't "own" the insult. The great thing about not owning it is that since the responses are about her behavior and not the insult he just needs to remember a handful of them then apply as needed. The role playing is great at getting just the right inflection. Even if the never use any of the comebacks it gives them a little more confidence, more of a feeling of being armed in battle. Maybe most importantly the activity of role playing enforces the whole concept that the issue here has absolutely nothing to do with any shortcomings and flaws of your child or his horse and it places her behavior squarely in the wrong.

[alterdstate]

Thanks for the great suggestions. It sounds like we're headed down the right path on this one. It's just hard to know sometimes where to land on things like this. Intervene, leave it alone, etc. I'll continue to provide a sounding board and encourage him to speak up and tell Pep to F-off! It's hard for him to do that as he tends to be pretty courteous to a fault.

As far as the hygiene issue goes, he's not a stinky boy. :lol: The comments had more to do with the way his hair is styled, the quality of his clothing, things of that ilk. I think the comments are totally out of line. And there is NO chance there is any teenage unrequited love thing going on. Pep is just being an insufferable cow in my opinion.

I'm not generally a helicopter parent and let him figure out how to handle things on his own and chalk it up to life experience. This is harder because it's so "ino your face" and random.

I can only hope the eventing gods see fit to have her take a non-injurious-to-anything-but-her-ego fall into the water or mud. :yes:

[mkevent]

I'll make an offering to the eventing gods, too. Sounds like she needs it!! Can we have her breeches soak through and reveal some ripped underwear or something? That would be especially funny! Good luck to your son-if he learns how to deal with b#$%& now hopefully he won't be dating any in the future!!

[Ajierene]

As a point of reference - I was harassed almost nonstop by a particular girl during almost all of high school. In my senior year, I was talking to some of the 'popular girls' and found out that they had no clue why she harassed me so much and they did not like her at all. The nearest we could figure is that she was trying to be 'popular' by harassing little outsider me, but she just looked like a mean girl that the 'popular girls' (very nice people) did not want to deal with. They had no animosity towards me, I just didn't travel in their circles - to busy riding, I guess.

So, keep that in mind - she's probably insecure/doesn't feel popular enough and is trying to pick on someone just to get that back.

[Thomas_1]

My question is, as a parent, wwyd? Generally I'd be ensuring my child was equipped with an abudance of self confidence and social skills sufficient to brush off silly comments.

What I wouldn't do is make a big song and dance about it or go wading in...... EVER! It's just another teenager making a silly comment that's all. It's what teenagers do in preparation for being obnoxious adults. Heck next week they could be best buddies and you'll be a stupid parent...... that is also part of the metaphorphosis through teenage years.

I've also explained that physical violence is out of the question. :lol: So what next? After you've equipped yours to manage life, suggest that he knuckle down and prove the other one wrong by doing well with said mutt with no pedigree.

[cloudyandcallie]

Unfortunately the world, not just the horse world, is full of people who buy expensive horses, cars, clothes and then act snobby to those who don't have something that costs that much. It is as if the price tag makes the thing, whether a horse or something else, better than something less expensive. Adults are worse than teens about this, but it hurts more when you are a teenager. I saw this happen a lot when I was a teen, and was fortunate to avoid all of it because I had the crossbred horse that everyone wanted.
The best revenge, of course, is to beat the pants off of the little creep in competition.

However, if you do decide to complain to the trainer or to the creep's parents, be prepared for her to deny all. So, before doing so, give your son a small tape recorder from radio shack, and let him keep it on his person and turn it on the next time the creep maligns him or his horse. Then go to the trainer and the creep's parents. Wait till the creep denies all, then whip out the recorder and prove her a liar. But don't be surprized if the parents are as bad as the creep.

[AnotherRound]

Its really hard not to empathize so very much with your child's pain that you also have trouble getting past the other teens' comments. This sort of thing will come to him (as it does to all of us) many times in our lives, and teen years often. The best way to handle it is to talk to him and give him the other way to look at these things. Remind him that the Pep girl is talking out of her own insecurieites. Remind him of his strengths. Talk with him frankly about his habits. I know with our very beautiful, talented teen daughter (my step daughter) she can get into a stubborn place and you have to sometimes stop all of life until she gets into the shower. She is required to shower after swim practice to get the chlorine off, and none of us can go anywhere until she does and its a struggle to get her in there, and if she's feeling stubborn she won't shower for several days unless we keep an eye out, then she'll shower twice a day. She started sorting it out for herself when she got into high school and nonly rarely starts being strangely stubborn about showers now and again (now, then once she's in there, that shower can go on for two hours, and dad has to start turning down the hot water! "I'll be out in a minute!" then another half hour goes by...)

Mom will just have to help him be on top of his personal habits. Tell him frankly, we just can't let that slide, everyone around us takes note, and he may just not be noticing but he will if you talk about it constantly. For example, he comes in the house, go to the kitchen sink, wash your hands, call him over, make him wash his hands. It has to be a constant attention on your part to get him to make it a contstant atteion on his part.

Our natural responses are "hope she trips in the mud" but you don't want to teach him that response. Point out the different horses doing high level work, the truth combats that kind of pettiness, as you tell him facts about horses and breeds and what top rider is riding what, he will sort out for himself the confidence to see her for what she is.

Good luck, keep talking to him, don't stop talking, make him give you his clothes as he comes in the house to wash, purloin his socks and have many others ready clean for him, that sort of thing. It will bring to his attention how constantly wehave to think about cleaning up during the day when we are outside and with horses. Help him pack a bag to go to the barn with. We change into barn clothes at the barn and out of them before we get in the car to go home. We don't wear barn boots into the house, you decide the level of grooming he needs, and don't leave it up to him until he actually does keep himself clean on his own. He'll get it. Also, don't underestimate the power of peer pressure. if he offends his friends andpeers enough he will want to change his habits, just be right there to show him how, sometimes we don't realize that they aren't getting it. We've all had to learn something socially like that. He'll sort it out with your help.

[subk]

Mom will just have to help him be on top of his personal habits. Tell him frankly, we just can't let that slide, everyone around us takes note, and he may just not be noticing but he will if you talk about it constantly. For example, he comes in the house, go to the kitchen sink, wash your hands, call him over, make him wash his hands. It has to be a constant attention on your part to get him to make it a contstant atteion on his part.
If his personal grooming habits have not been an issue in the past I think it would be a great mistake to make them one now because of this little snot. It gives her control and influence over a portion of his life and that is the wrong message. He's old enough to change them on his own if that is what he wants.

[imapepper]

I role play responses with my girls. Here's some examples to, "Your horse is such a mutt. I'll bet his daddy was featured on "Fugly."
1) "What did you say?" It is very good to make them repeat the insult. Sometimes after a little "training" that's all it takes to get them to mumble and walk away.
2) "I can't believe you just said that." If she responses with "why not?" then: "Because it is rude and crass thing for you to say."
3) "Gee Pep, did you get up on the wrong side of the bed this morning? Someone pee in you Wheaties?" Humor especially at her expense is good.
4) "Should you really say such bitchy things out loud? Someone might hear you and I wouldn't want them to think you actually are a bitch." I like this with a tone of real earnestness and concern.
5) "And why is it that I'm suppose to care about your opinion?"

And if anybody ever justified their comments with "I NOTICE things." then the response is: "And I notice all kinds of things about you, but that doesn't mean I should be so rude as to speak them out loud."

#4 is fabulous :lol: I might just use that myself someday :)

[mkevent]

More thoughts came to mind...
1) A fancy horse does not make you a better rider. You could place higher and possibly be "more competitive"-but it does not make you a better rider
2) Some people get more pleasure out of the "process" than the "results"-if your son enjoys his partnership with his horse and what he's learning and he's safe, there is a lot less pressure on him than on Pep, who has to prove her merits because she has the big fancy expensive horse. Even if Pep succeeds, it will be seen that she suceeded because she has a big fancy expensive horse.
3) While it would be nice to be wealthy and not have to worry about finances, it does not necessarily make you a happy person
4) If nothing else, your son can practice perfecting the eyeroll-because these type of people can be really unbearable to deal with...

Ok, I'll shut up now

[crittertwitter]

http://www.speakupdesigns.com/cgi-bin/store/shop.cgi/humor/speakupdesigns.65400687

[bamboozled]

I find it interesting that "Pep" is actually insulting a guy. Usually this snottiness is targeted to the other girls.

However, don't get involved. That reduces your son's ranking. Have him vent to you, and I do like the snappy comebacks offered, espec. #4 and #5.

I can tell you from past experience, watching the teen drama unfold, that these type of girls WILL get it in the end. The horse will go lame, colic, start refusing, get injured...you name it. Then it doesn't matter how much of a pedigree she's got going....she's not able to compete.

I will also place odds that her parents will run into financial difficulties....so the horse may have to go, or the competitions will be few and far between.


Or Pep will find a boyfriend that will take up too much of her time, drop the riding altogether and Mom and Dad are stuck with a horse they can't sell to cover the investment they put in.

So just keep on doing the right thing. Ribbons are ribbons, and a horse with a wonderful pedigree can meltdown just as much as one from the auction.

Oh - I've seen such a "princess" get her dues by ripping her breeches at the first fence, so the pink thong was exposed for the rest of the course. She quietly left the sport after that.

[SmallHerd]

Usually a teenage boy in horse sports is to die for and all the girls swoon over him. I wonder if she is making her comments because she actually LIKES your son but he is not interested. Sounds like PEP is used to getting what she wants, but is not getting your son in the way she wants, so she is going to Plan B. A woman scorned . . .

[CANTEREOIN]

When I was younger, going through the same transition from adolescent to not-quite-adult (ugh, those irritating teen years!) my Mom had the best saying: "That's just one person's way of trying to dim your light, to make theirs look brighter".


'nough said!

[gottagrey]

to OP - Please do not intervene on your son's behalf... that will make him look like a momma's boy and add more fuel to PEP's fire... I'm thinking there might be a hidden crush there somewhere - as often that's how crushes manifest themselves. I'm also thinking that since there are many more girls that ride than boys young teen son might be the object of many a girls attention and that young son is not devotiing enough time or attention to PEP so she's jealous of it and decides to ridicule him rather than be nice (in case being nice backfires.. and he still isn't attentive to her.. than she's not embarrassed)

What is the age range of these kids - all about the same age - if PEP is older than she is a bully and a brat, if they are about the same age, I'm going w/ the love jones theory which eventually will resolve itself. In the meantime, son needs to toughen it up - the best thing he can do to PEP is best as pleasant and nice to PEP as he can be -not to the point of being patronizing or condesending but just nice - exhibit good sportsmanship...

[JanM]

I don't have any children so like all snoopy people I am therefore perfectly qualified to comment. Actually I remember being the picked on person by a bunch of b#*$*%$ quite vividly. I know you want to do everything to help him but your support is all he really needs. It sounds as if you raised him well and this will be one of the minor hurdles he'll have to get over by himself. Think of it as training for dealing with some of the others that he's bound to encounter over the years.

Don't intervene-except to reassure your son that he is a good person, you don't ride a pedigree and an expensive price doesn't make you a better rider.

Someday, somehow little miss PEP will need something or need help--remember her behavior and just say no. Try practicing something like "I'm sorry our vehicles aren't up to your standards and I wouldn't want to embarrass you by giving you a ride" or "I'm sorry our tack just isn't the quality your horse is used to so I wouldn't dream of lending you a halter and embarrassing him"

And other posters were quite right-in today's financial climate the people who paid big bucks for horses, and have the McMansions are one wrong turn away from financial ruin. The old statement about be nice to the people you meet on the way up because you will meet them on the way back down is so true. Someday she'll get hers and karma is a real b*#*$. I've kind of enjoyed how far I've come over the years due to my own efforts, compared to some of the jerks that were so mean to me amounting to nothing because they never even tried to better themselves.

[Weatherford]

Really, since WHEN have European horses been defacto necessary for Eventing?? :eek:

All of Bruce Davidson's horses for YEARS came from out west! From ranches and farms, small tracks and breeders - some WONDERFUL horses, too!!

There have been so many GREAT grade or OTTBs in Eventing, it would be impossible to count them. Many of the great Australian horses were/are TBxbrumby! Including some on their Gold Medal teams!

Poltroon is another "grade" horse that comes to mind - a piebald, at that!

And OTTB - wonderful, wonderful horses - great, great eventers!! All the heart and talent in the world - and very, very inexpensive - right now especially.

I was bullied in hs very badly (small boarding school, too!) - One day, it got really out of hand, and I listened to it until the girl ended up (after telling me everything that was wrong with me) saying "and if you want to popular, you can't hang around with <two of my best friends>" at which point, I got REALLY, REALLY mad and told her that NO ONE was going to tell who could and could not be my friends... etc etc.... they never bothered me again - and no, I was never popular! But, I had the BEST friends, and still do!

You son will manage. Help equip him to handle it himself - give him the responses and the backbone. Most of all, help him beat the pants off the little witch... ;)

[Weatherford]

And, by the way, most of the top German horses are Irish-bred... There is NOTHING fancy about Irish breeding - it's mostly TB with a whatever's in the field thrown in... ;)

[Blue Yonder]

4) "Should you really say such bitchy things out loud? Someone might hear you and I wouldn't want them to think you actually are a bitch." I like this with a tone of real earnestness and concern.

Love this. Instead of "bitchy," though, use "COMMON." Because if PEP's preoccupied with putting your son down, she needs to feel Very Special Indeed. "Should you really say such rude things out loud? Someone might hear you and I'd hate everyone to think you were actually so common as that."

[mp]

The comments had more to do with the way his hair is styled, the quality of his clothing, things of that ilk.

You've gotten some excellent advice already, but I have to add my father's suggestion for what to say to someone who made fun of the way I was dressed.

"I can change my clothes, you know. It's such a shame you can't change your personality."

Thank-you, daddy. :)

Good luck with the little wench. She sounds perfectly horrible.

[BuddyRoo]

You said it has impacted your son in a negative way. Could you be more specific?

When I was a kid, our family couldn't afford designer clothing. I got made fun of a lot. From about 5th through 8th grade were MISERABLE years.

I will admit that I take some sick pleasure when I return home annually to find that those "kids" who were SO cool, so quick to be mean to me, etc...work at 7-11, are fat and bald and still living with their parents. (about 30 YO now)

Anyway. I know that does nothing for your son right now....

But I can remember coming home and being upset about similar...and I was told things like:

"Choose your battles to win your wars. Don't validate their opinion with a response."

and

"Discretion is the better part of valor."

and

"If they had more self confidence, they wouldn't be picking on you. You really should feel sorry for them that they are so miserable that to feel better, they have to point out something that has nothing to do with your ability or quality as a human being--but your CLOTHING. Their clothes "make" them. Do your clothes "make" you? Of course not. Carry on. Keep your chin up and your eyes on the prize."

Stuff of that nature.

And I got through it.

[cloudyandcallie]

And, by the way, most of the top German horses are Irish-bred... There is NOTHING fancy about Irish breeding - it's mostly TB with a whatever's in the field thrown in... ;)

No Irish in these bloodlines(Smaaragd-Intschu Tschuna) or any of the German bloodlines I've researched. But almost all european WBs are mixed breed.. And european WBs are a bit slow for eventing, ottbs still the best.

Your son will be prepared for adulthood. Wait till college where everyone is even more snobby.

[rainechyldes]

I run into the same issue.

My boys both are in pony club, & show - and they are the only boys in the local PC.
They ride homegrown horses and we do have 'princesses' (quite a few in fact!)

Last year I faced this with my younger son, who's mount is an Arab/ Saddlebred mare. Quite typey, but elegant, willing, *kind* and very bold. Part way through the season last year, I heard some rumblings from him about 'comments' from one of our PC's prima donnas who rides the proverbial very expensive imported WB.

All I said was, "You have two options, beat her in the ring where it counts, and ignore her." Or fight back and lower yourself to her level."

He thought about it for a moment and replied, "Mom, you can't buy class."


I was a very proud mom in the particular moment.

We all know the show ring can be a mentally tough place.. I encourage my kids to rise above it, do their thing, be proud of what they do, and be the ultimate sportsmen, learning to deal with the mind games & not fall prey to getting 'into' it with other riders is a huge part of that.

[Come Shine]

Lol. As much as things change, they stay the same.

I remember when I was growing up, eons ago, riding at a fancy barn with fancy horses. The young lad from down the street rode his horses over for lessons often wearing - GASP - rubber riding boots!!!! He would jump his wild-and-wooly mounts over anything and everything without a care as to what he was on or what he was wearing. He would just about give the HPs a stroke!

Fast forward 20 years, and it's really neat to be able to say I used to ride with someone who now competes in eventing at the Olympics.

All the best to your son. And bless Pep's heart.

[rhymeswithfizz]

Frankly, your son will encounter this type of person in all walks of life, and at all stages of life. It is a lesson to be learned. An unfortunate fact of life. Help guide him through it, there have been tons of great suggestions.

Attempting to shield him from it isn't going to help him in the long run.

[deltawave]

Well, a mare might be IN Germany, with a German name and all, but the tale is told about lots and lots of Irish mares crossing over the ocean and losing their Irish passports conveniently along the way . . . only to resurface on the mainland with a brand new nationality. ;)

Apropos of nothing, just thought I'd add another tidbit. :)

[alterdstate]

[QUOTE=BuddyRoo;3902842]You said it has impacted your son in a negative way. Could you be more specific?
"QUOTE]

He's generally an outgoing, self-confident kid. When Pep is around you can almost see him withdrawing. He gets very, very quiet and just tries not to upset the applecart. This is why it's so upsetting to me. He's always stood up for himself in the past.

[alterdstate]

I'll make an offering to the eventing gods, too. Sounds like she needs it!! Can we have her breeches soak through and reveal some ripped underwear or something? That would be especially funny! Good luck to your son-if he learns how to deal with b#$%& now hopefully he won't be dating any in the future!!

:D

[LisaB]

Crap
Poopy Hunter Princesses are infiltrating eventing land! Get out!!!
Cavaet: Not all hunter people are princesses nor poopy!

[DressageGeek "Ribbon Ho"]

You are a great mom. And I'll bet your son is a great kid.

I loved some of the responses, I don't have much to offer but this is along the same lines. The taunts only work if they find their target. If that is deflected, it actually will drive Pep nuts (ah, sweet revenge!). I had a similar Pep in my teenage years (haven't we all?) - we were not wealthy, and I wore hand me downs from an older, bigger, wider cousin. So the clothes were not trendy, did not suit my build nor my tastes, but you know what? They were good quality (aunt was wealthy) and they were FREE. The Pep in my life would constantly belittle my clothes. One time she remarked on the hemlines (too long). And I looked back at her and said, "Oh, I have to do that. The teachers and everyone asked me to. Because I am so stunning, and my legs are so gorgeous, they all realized that none of the boys would be able to concentrate if I was in class and I didn't dress this way. So I'm doing it to help them out."

She never offered up anything again. It's along the lines of, "Well, bless your heart!" Hopefully your son will be able to muster his confidence and deflect Pep's remarks.

I wonder if Pep's horse even likes her.

[Beam Me Up]

Subk has some awesome suggestions!

And in general, variants of "excuse me?" or "why would you say something like that?" are great--they are entirely polite (good at work, too!) and put the emphasis back on the person who is misbehaving, not the victim.

Along those lines, there is absolutely no reason to worry about the content about the remarks. We know this girl is full of it on the horse/riding critique side, so why give her any credence on her hygiene business either.

Not to get all Freud on a horse board, but I remember an early teen phase (at least for girls) of getting way into hygiene--lots of deodorant, scented products, accusing boys (and sometimes other girls) of being smelly, unhygienic, gross. I think it's all about sudden body awareness, repression of sexuality, blah blah blah, not about barn clothes.

Again, she's putting a lot of energy into these interactions, for just a guy with a mediocre horse and poor hygiene. Just sayin'

[Cold Spring Farm]

I always like the old biblical "turn the other cheek," and it worked well for my son.

As that old parable goes -- if someone hits you with the back of their hand, you would turn and offer the other cheek, so that were they to strike you again, they had no choice but to hit you with an open hand, which was considered very low class (and I might have those two flip-flopped!)

So -- if Pep says something insulting, your son says "Oh, I am so sorry you feel that way. But while you're at it, is there anything else that you would like to let me know, that is bothering you either about me or my horse?"

Always takes them aback!

[JanWeber]

Another Mom weighing in here. One daughter is 18; one is 21. We've run into our share of these kids (and sadly, their MOTHERS). Best advice is to be a sounding board for your son - talk to him about her motives (which it sounds like you're already doing) and encourage him to develop positive behaviors in response. Her inappropriate remarks don't need to be met by "snarkiness" on his side - I remind myself in these situations that "two wrongs don't make a right". Successful, talented people will often have others sniping at them from the sidelines - no time like the present (and with your help) to develop a classy way to respond. HE is not responsible for her behavior, but he IS responsible for how he behaves in response.

[RedMare01]

I agree with most everyone else and don't think you should get directly involved, but is there a way do interject indirectly? Maybe you could just mention what is happening to the trainer as a kind of head's up? Let them know what's going on, and maybe if they hear her say anything nasty (to anyone, not just your son) they'll correct her and she'll get a little manners lesson from an adult (embarassing :winkgrin:). Or is she a perfect little angel around everyone else?

Caitlin

[Equibrit]

Cosmic justice tends to prevail in these cases. You just wait - she'll get hers !

http://www.theosophy-nw.org/theosnw/issues/pu-mach.htm

"When we realize that law and order are the primary functions of the universe and that, since we are part of it, cosmic justice is the root of our own lives, the cause of our very being, then we begin to see that there is system in life. Fortunes and misfortunes come to us not by blind chance, but result from things that have happened in the past, errors in other lives, seeds sown; and by the same token, whatever will come to us in the future will be the harvest of the present. When once this idea catches hold of us, we look differently upon people who do wrong; we are not so anxious to avenge injustice; because when we see a little farther, we recognize that they will learn in time by suffering for what they have done. It is inevitable, and we do not have to take charge of that; our task is justly and mercifully to reestablish the harmony that has been disturbed."

[spurgirl]

In the original post you gave a clue about the type of bully this girl is-a sneaky one. Seems the comments are made in that sly undertone..ugh. I won't go into it too much here, but my darling daughter had one of these types on the bus in 6th grade, school would do nothing, bus driver saw bully go to my daughter and speak, but could not hear the insults...Anyway, I gave my daughter the lowdown on the "deaf" response-but turning the insult back on the bully. The bus driver knew ahead of time, too...
Bully: "You smell like a horse" DD: "WHAT-YOU SMELL LIKE MY HORSE?"
Bully: "Your clothes are ugly" DD: " WHAT-OH,YES, I"M SORRY YOU'RE UGLY"
Bully: "Your hair looks like a horses' tail" DD: "WHAT? YOUR PARENTS ARE PUTTING YOU UP FOR SALE?" Must be said VERY loudly!!!

I think it took all of three situations like these, and she left my daughter alone. The next kid she picked on did the same thing I told my daughter to....guess who ended up sitting by herself, ignored (or shouted at) ,for the rest of the year? Not my kid!

If your son can speak up the same way-LOUDLY, firmly, turning the girls' own "comments" back on her (doesn't take lots of thought), they will get a few looks from other people wondering whats' going on, and then it will probably stop. She wants to bug someone and "ruin their life", but she does not want to be noticed by the adults. If your son is questioned (by the trainer), he can then quietly say why he did it, and he's tired of it. Then, from the response, you can decide to stay, or switch trainers/barns. Good Luck. Mean people suck!

[chestnutmarebeware]

You might suggest to your son that a good hearty belly-laugh directed at stupid/ignorant comments works wonders! Not a weak "ha-ha, you're right" laugh, but an "I can't believe something that ignorant came out of your mouth" laugh.

He can combine it with a "have you completely lost your mind?" look. A mirror works well to practice and perfect this combo.

And tell him he'll have plenty of chances to use the skills again once he enters the business world! :lol::lol::lol:

[BuddyRoo]

Hmmm. So he really doesn't like the confrontation at all.

Wonder if he realizes that he's giving her the power by changing his behavior?

I don't have kids. So all I really have to go on is my own experience.

But I think I'd encourage him to come up with a few key phrases....

"That's nice" being my favorite.

Tell him the ol' story...there are lots of variations to this...but do it in your best southern drawl...

Two Southern Belles were sipping mint julips. One says to the other..."For my birthday, my boyfriend bought me a pair of die uh mund earrings."

Other..."That's nice."

"And for Christmas, he took me to Maui."

"That's nice."

"For Valentine's day, he's getting me a die uh mund necklace."

"That's nice."

"Is all you can say "That's Nice?" What did your boyfriend ever get for you?"

"Etiquette lessons."

"ETIQUETTE LESSONS?!!? Whatever for?"

"So I can say "That's Nice" instead of F*** YOU."


Just give him the ol' smile and nod That's Nice thing and tell him to get out there and kick butt.

[LexInVA]

ROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :)

[ZiggyStardust]

Subk has some outstanding suggestions/points. I really feel for your kid, as I was belittled similarly by particular brats as an early teen, although not so much in the horse world, thank goodness. It stays with me not just as an unpleasant experience, but also because I finally stood up for myself, which actually made me feel really great.:)

Long story short, I moved to another state in the middle of junior high (ugh, horrible) and was very shy and teased quite a bit by the neighbor kids who I think were really just trying to get a reaction. I always tried to take the high road and just ignore them, but I was very hurt inside all the same. Anyway, it finally escalated to the point where one of them invaded my personal space and I indicated to her in no uncertain terms that she was not to f*** with me ever again. And guess what? They really didn't!

So if this is affecting your son to the point where he is actually hurt by it, he needs to stand up for himself. If he really were able to let it roll off his back, he wouldn't be so concerned about it. I would say that subk's suggestions of not actually acknowledging the PEP's comments themselves, but responding with his own comments to get at the source of her problem, her insecurity, might be more likely to result in her backing the eff off. I wish I had clever things to memorize when I was young! Good luck to him, he has much better things to look forward to than PEP does.

[pines4equines]

I have not read all the posts but I wonder if this girl is jealous...either jealous that your son does not like her and this is a juvenile way to get attention or possibly in some awkward way, she hopes he'll ask her for advice?

[cloudyandcallie]

While kids do need to learn to defend themselves and should not get too upset by verbal abuse, the fact that people on this thread remember how kids made their lives miserable shows that taunting can have a lifelong effect.
Bullying for too long has been considered one of the rites of passage for kids in school. Not until the shooting tragedies at schools have people paid attention.
You should stop this bully now before she makes your son so miserable that he gives up riding. It would be nice if someone on coth with loan your son a blue blooded high performance horse to shut the bully up.:lol:

[Romany]

I have not read all the posts but I wonder if this girl is jealous...either jealous that your son does not like her and this is a juvenile way to get attention or possibly in some awkward way, she hopes he'll ask her for advice?


Bingo - just what I was thinking. What do you bet PEP is jealous that your son has an attentive mother who's there for him, and she just has money thrown her way by disinterested parents.

I agree with the suggestion to get the trainer to deal with it, then it doesn't descend into teasing him for being a momma's boy.

He sounds like a great kid; not every parent has a teenage son that's a good communicator, and not every teenager has a parent that cares so much!

[bip]

Man, I spend a lot of time lamenting the fact that I'm not the rider I was when I was a teenager. Thank goodness this thread has reminded me that it wouldn't be worth it to go back!

I'll take my fat, inflexible, uncordinated, unbrave adult self over my fit, flexible, coordinated, tormented-by-mean-rich-peers teenage self any day!

[alterdstate]

Crap
Poopy Hunter Princesses are infiltrating eventing land! Get out!!!
Cavaet: Not all hunter people are princesses nor poopy!

OMG...how did you know?!? Pep IS a former hunter princess! You're scary! Now can you give me some good stock tips? :D

[piaffequeen]

[QUOTE=Equibrit;3903177]Cosmic justice tends to prevail in these cases. You just wait - she'll get hers !

I am a firm believer in Karma-and or the cosmic justice! As far as your son-I would keep an eye on him but still encourage him to fight his own battles and to keep the communication lines open.If I was your son-I would have told her off a long time ago. She is a bully and needs to be stood up to-he is letting her win by not saying something.

This Pep princess will get her comeuppance. I think the biggest satisfaction will come when your son's mutt horse kicks the crap out of her warmblood in competition!

Like other posters there have been tons of cheap horses that have gone onto greatness-Nirvana (Jill Henselberg?) comes to mind. I think she paid $600 and the mare was on her way to the slaughterhouse!

[mkevent]

Is PEP new to the sport and has she competed yet? If she is a former hunter princess she's gonna learn real fast that this is a totally different ball of wax!! Most of the eventers I know are self reliant, down to earth people-this is a humbling sport and you need more than just $$ to succeed. I give her one season-less if she has to compete in the rain/mud/wind on a horse that's a tad "up" !!! I think you and your son should place bets on how long she'll last-it might be fun and it could help him find humor in the situation. If I'm able to laugh at frustrating situations, I'm able to let go of the angst much faster!

[bornfreenowexpensive]

OMG...how did you know?!? Pep IS a former hunter princess! You're scary! Now can you give me some good stock tips? :D


Only thing you can say is that she is isn't yet a real eventer. Tell him to ignore her. She is coming from a world where this is part of the game. I know it is hard...but if she is putting him down...she is certainly putting down others. Tell him people like that feel bad about themselves and can only make themselves feel better by putting others down. As long as he doesn't BELIEVE what she says.

He probably really needs to talk with another male rider.....not his mom. They will be able to give him the self confidence that will help him to ignore this girl.....that is a harder thing for mom's to do.

[goeslikestink]

I've changed my usual name to protect the guilty... :D

I haven't run into this before and need feedback. Recently a teenage pampered eventing princess (let's call her Pep!) who has a high dollar horse competing at the lower levels made some rather disparaging comments about my son's horse. The comments had to do with the horse's ancestry, which is of mixed heritage :eek: and the fact that he is never going to be talented enough to go above Prelim. Keep in mind that my son has been eventing longer than Pep and has a horse that is extremely bold and safe but it doesn't have a European pedigree and we sure the heck didn't mortgage the house to buy it. More than good enough for us.

While I could care less about Pep's opinion of said horse, it has impacted my teen in a negative fashion. Let me add that comments have also been made about son's personal grooming habits and clothing. Never does Pep make these comments in front of the trainer or any other adult. The trainer seems to be clueless.


tell him this mate -- men dont marry tarts they marry women
and only tarts like to be superior over others form of bullying as she devious only
says it when hes on his own but
there might be another reason-- she either fancy him and hes not interested and gives her the cold schoulder as not his type which also would account for the minor digs at his person

so he could stop it easily if he brave enough--- and the next time when she has a dig at him tell him to make sure theres an adult be good if it was the trianer and say in aloud voice

i told you already your not my type so leave me alone stop keep harassing me with your enseundo.s
and then walk away-- she will be fluffed -------- and gobless she wont do it anymore


your lad is senstive sort like mine and when one digs it sticks , and hurts and they lose a bit of self esteem and confidence so what to do
just becuase shes a girl doesnt mean he has not got to give back, my son wont and doesnt say things to girls unless hes pushed ie provoke the worse thing he hates being called is ging or ginga as he has ginger hair, has a complex about it, so i said to him learn to laugh with them - ie for exsample i told him tell them its great your staying power beats any battery -- ( hes 22yrs old) my point is the more she see him upset the more she will nit pick
so if you can make him turn it around and back to her she will stop it





my question is, as a parent, wwyd? I have told my son that he is a better person for not buying in to this sort of behavior, that it is acceptable to tell Pep that the comments are hurtful (she didn't care-"I NOTICE things" she says) and that it's best to try and let it roll off his back.

no - becuase you wll make him feel worse its like going behind his back
and he will lose trust in you to , he has to deal with this himself as part of growing up
but you can advise him how to as your a woman -- and know what girls can be like bloody awful and spiteful even girls to girls let alone boys
think it this way she wants but cant have as hes not interested and you have to ask him
or explain it to him as to why this girl is picking on him i reckon she likes him but hes so into his horses and not into girls yet he dont see it maybe



ture to a degree but sensitive people think about it a lot more and goes deeper
tell him this those that shout cant do, she has to relay on clockwork neddies to get anywhere put her on something that has to be ridden she will fail and he will exceed her
his horse has expreince and commonsense the one he has which she hasnt is a perfect partnership - and you cant buy that you feel it - thats why hes upset he doesnt like her making comments about his horse and will add i have a couple that are papered and some that are not
but any horse with a decent rider can do xyz and get there and also a good horse is worth his/her weight in gold and he has that doesnt have to be papered or high class pedigree
safe horses you cant put a price on ther heads


I've tried seperating them as much as possible but it doesn't seem to help

dont, the worse thing you can do is interefere as it wont help him later in life stand on his own two feet , and this also might be why hes a little awkward with it

life has it moments good bad joy fun sad etc he has to deal with this girl himself
and stop it he has to stand his ground and stand up to her -


. I've also explained that physical violence is out of the question. :lol: So what next? I hesitate to get involved as I think this is a pretty good life lesson but how far should it go before something is said to Pep, the trainer or Pep's parents or should I just stay out of it? I'm getting pretty darn frustrated.


monitor it after you have spoken to him again and let him try to sort it out
if he does hes on his way to become independant of you and you will have to learn to accept that

have a pep talk pardon the pun, with him, see wha he really feels doesnt need fightiing as any fight is never won with fisty cuffs battles are always won by using your brain
he just has to use his and over come her and stand up to her

[MelantheLLC]

You know, since this is a competitive sport, this could be a great lesson not only in life, but in sports psychology.

She's the competition. You don't let anything the competition says or does throw you. Male athletes trash talk one another all the time, and the point is to throw their competitors off by getting them emotional. I'm sure he understands that (or if he doesn't yet he'd better start.) The fact that she's female has thrown him off, made it seem more personal.

Keep your mind focused on yourself and your strengths.

No fear. No anger. Nothing's personal--it's a competition. May the best horse and rider win.

[EqTrainer]

While kids do need to learn to defend themselves and should not get too upset by verbal abuse, the fact that people on this thread remember how kids made their lives miserable shows that taunting can have a lifelong effect.
Bullying for too long has been considered one of the rites of passage for kids in school. Not until the shooting tragedies at schools have people paid attention.
You should stop this bully now before she makes your son so miserable that he gives up riding. It would be nice if someone on coth with loan your son a blue blooded high performance horse to shut the bully up.:lol:

:yes: I am really surprised at how many people remember this and still think it is ok. If she is crossing the line into bullying, it should be stopped. For his good and her snotty-ass good, too. She might learn something from it.

[sidepasser]

I've read this whole thread and can honestly say: My son has been there. Started a ritzy private school in 8th grade where all the kids had known each other since kindergarden. Think he wasn't the butt of jokes, ridicule and smart azz comments? well YEAH..HAIL YEAH..

Cause we weren't rich. Plain and simple. He got in on grades - his smartz and willingness to learn, tested off the charts in languages and english..heck he speaks five languages now..and he's just 18.

but he was the social outcast. Know what? he dealt. He dealt with it by using humor when someone would comment on his clothes.."tood bad you have to be a follower, I'm a leader and wear what I WANT" lol..

he dealt when school trips were trips overseas to foreign places we only read about..
he went to places that were KOOOL..like being onstage with a very HOT band and having pics to prove it..was the envy of his class that year thanks to a very loving ex-hubby who is in a big name band...lol..

Sr. shadowing when all the kids were in "up town" offices, he shadowed at a nursing home, put together an incredible collage of WWII veteran's stories and had the whole class wanting more..

It was his up beat attitude, humor and grace that got him accepted by his peers. Of course there were one or two "hairy" instances at school..but I informed the athletic director whom everyone respected and admired and also the admissions officer..and those were taken care of "behind the scenes". I never actually interfered but offered my child the chance to shine in his own way.

Amazing what some of the children who taunted him, who thought he was "beneath" them thought at graduation. He had to learn to deal with those that thought they were "above" him..

and we live in a harn..not many rich kids live in a barn house..not finished, but he was never short of kids who wanted to come to our house, who invited him to their house (even the richest of the rich doctor kids) took to him eventually. He just won them over despite bullying, snarky comments and downright abusive rude behavior.

His favorite comment to those that would tease/taunt him: "Well money sure didn't buy you class, now did it?" Talk about a shut up....and red faced, don't know what to say..that was the best come back line I have ever heard a kid dream up.

and it worked. Whenever he was being ridiculed, he was just softly say that one line..just loud enough that all those surrounding him would hear..and the abuser/tormentor would turn red..sputter, and walk away.

try it..

so sorry your child is going through this, but you absolutely cannot fight his battles for him..he will run into this all through is life and he needs one good comeback line that works for every situation.

My child is now in college, well adjusted and still brings his college friends back here to the unfinished harn..it's a work in progress, but they love it here and know that they are welcome and listened to and though I do not understand all the college speak, I do listen. For some, and for many..to be listened to and questioned, answered and paid attention to: that is enough and they are surprised that I will stop whatever I am doing and just sit and listen to them. Many of these kids have never had anyone just sit and listen and offer suggestions, comments, or nothing at all, and they send me emails..lol.."thanks for listening, thanks for the advice, thanks for having me and listening"

I think many children cry out for help, they cry out to be LISTENED to, to be heard..
unfortunately sometimes their parents are so busy making money and doing the "in" thing, they forget that "this is a child, one that needs attention".

Now my son is NOT perfect. He also has ADD and is sometimes not focused and he has embarrassed me on occasion. I love him and he tries and he thinks of others and..
remember that nursing home? He still goes back there and volunteers and listens to the WWII vets and the old ladies when he comes home from college on weekends, etc.

He's learned that sometimes all that is needed is someone to listen and care. Perhaps your son can also look at his bully in that light..maybe she just needs someone to listen, to care and even if she comes off as NASTY,,maybe the right response is: Why are you so nasty? What is wrong? Is your life so bad that you have to take it out on me? Money hasn't bought you class has it? etc.

There seems to be underlying issues with those that need to bully others, not saying your son should be the psych counselor here, but sometimes a response such as above will throw them for a loop and make the bully "THINK".

Good luck, I know you love your child and you want to wade in "arms swinging and fists knocking"..that's the way I felt sometimes, but I had to let my son figure out how to deal with a WHOLE class..and I listened and offered advice but didn't run to his rescue in an obvious manner.

Good luck with your son, he has a wonderful future and sounds like the sort of kid that will overcome this - and of course - he needs you to listen and offer advice, but also needs to learn, like my son, to deal with life's nasties...

Best regards,
Sidepasser

[Trakehner]

I ran across a few of these little cows (not the word I prefer to use) when I was 12 or so...seems that their hormones and new found boobs gave them a feeling of self-importance. Basically, evil little creatures.

One of the old ladies at the barn (who used to be one of the grand dames of Washington DC) took me aside. She sweetly said, "Dear, rip her head off, she deserves it...she's not a lady and shouldn't be treated as if she were!"

Well, alrighty then! The next time I got a snarky insult, I used every snotty, cutting and sexist remark my 12 year old vocabulary held. She looked struck and whined, "How can you say that to me"...easy and I called her a few other things. What a cathartic. She deserved it..

Give your son permission to call this creature anything and everything he wants, teach him some good insults that might hit the bullseye on this b#$%^. Let him know it's OK and she doesn't deserve to be treated like a human...go after her big time. Your son deserves to not put up with this cow, let him know that girls aren't special and untouchable and he doesn't have to suffer through her scata just because he's male.

With luck, he'll really hurt her somewhere where it counts...support your boy and if the sows mother dares to say anything, it's your turn to nail her hide to the wall...

[5]

Most cutting thing I could think of him to say to her is...
"So you are what OctoMom started out like."
I can't think the little harpy will have a retort for that one.

[Silver Snaffles]

Have been in the exact same position.

I went to Pony Club in a very wealthy area, only because my mother was the DC of the club as well as the dressage instructor.
Full of girls like PEP on WB's or TB's with the best of the best bloodlines of their choosen disciplines as well as years of experience. The sort of horses you just sat on and would do anything you asked. :yes:

There I was, on whatever had been selected from the knackers yards, or the latest auction. :eek:. My mum rescued and trained horses up, I was the one who got to put the miles on them. I usually had about 2 or 3 months on a horse, then it would be sold on. One rally I would be riding a clydesdale x arab, the next god only knows what the breeding was. Usually they were dimonds in the rough, in need of feed, training and TLC.

It got to the stage where I was so badly bullied I would cry in the trailer.

I was given the nickname " Knackery" as thats where all my horses came from. They would tease me about not having leather top boots ( I wore gaiters and short boots) not having the latest bling browband, horse boots or whatever the current fashion trend. My saddle was whatever saddle fitted the horse properly, not the latest fashion trend. If I rode up near them they would all trot away, yelling that they didn't want their horses catching my " Nags germs or lice" the worst was the silent treatment. No one would talk to me or acknowledge me. It was awful.

I went to my mum, and her advice was to suck it up and stop being a baby.

I just worked harder at riding whatever was infront of me, put the hard yards in, found a few spectacular horses which had fallen on hard times, and put the work into becoming the best I could be.

The PEP's of course, lost interest and stoped riding unless at shows, and there horses started misbehaving, and getting futher and futher down the placings, threw fits and demanded a newer, better horse.

Guess who their parents sent their prized warmbloods to? Thats right. The knackery girl to ride and help sell.

Most of the PEP's fell out of horses, into boys, or just being society bitches.

One is still a PEP, I still see her around the shows, and is still a PEP and always will be. Puts her nose in the air and pretends she can't see me when I pass her, even though she is riding a horse I found and rode for her father.
:yes:


Tell him to hang in, ignore her, she will disappear into oblivion soon enough.
SHe is most likely jealious he has more talent than her, a loving mother and girls most likely adore him.

[Mach Two]

It must be hard for Pep to ride with the silver spoon stuffed up her bum.
I have to agree with those who suggest letting your son handle it in his own way, but you can be very supportive, and also, I would suspect Pep is rather insecure....I don't want to sound like Pollyanna, but sometimes a kind word in someone like Pep's direction can go a long way. Granted she is a rude brat, but I'll bet a lonely and insecure child dwells in those expensive clothes.

Be proud of your son and his horse ....and for someone like her, a horse like your son's would not perform at all. Young men in eventing are often the target of mean teasing....usually by girls with crushes!

[LisaB]

OMG...how did you know?!? Pep IS a former hunter princess! You're scary! Now can you give me some good stock tips? :D
Yeah, don't eat yellow snow :D
Yup, this is exactly what they do. Day in and day out. I'm just shocked that she has friends who buy into this and they are eventers as well. I would, if I were you confront her and under no certain terms is this attitude allowed in eventing. Ever. And I wouldn't pinpoint your son. Just as a general rule. Eventing doesn't do belittling, we have enough to do. We're lucky to end an event in vertical order.

[Trakehner]

Granted she is a rude brat, but I'll bet a lonely and insecure child dwells in those expensive clothes.

...and this should matter to the mother of a boy being abused by this stinking cow? She's lonely..she deserves it...she's insecure?...gack!

Who cares if she's on fire in the parking lot, the woman's attacked son is who is important and needs protection, not this waste of skin....she'll look out for herself just fine without anyone's help.

Wonder if spaying will help her behaviour?

[cloudyandcallie]

...and this should matter to the mother of a boy being abused by this stinking cow? She's lonely..she deserves it...she's insecure?...gack!

Who cares if she's on fire in the parking lot, the woman's attacked son is who is important and needs protection, not this waste of skin....she'll look out for herself just fine without anyone's help.

Wonder if spaying will help her behaviour?
:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:
And we need more guys riding! She shouldn't be allowed to run even one off! I don't think she's insecure and unhappy, I think she's mean. But please don't insult cows.

[Bobthehorse]

Yeah, don't eat yellow snow :D
Yup, this is exactly what they do. Day in and day out. I'm just shocked that she has friends who buy into this and they are eventers as well. I would, if I were you confront her and under no certain terms is this attitude allowed in eventing. Ever. And I wouldn't pinpoint your son. Just as a general rule. Eventing doesn't do belittling, we have enough to do. We're lucky to end an event in vertical order.



Give her a copy of the Unwritten Rules of Eventing.

[alterdstate]

Give her a copy of the Unwritten Rules of Eventing.

Okay Bob...I'll bite. :D Unwritten Rules of Eventing?

[Alagirl]

I've read this whole thread and can honestly say: My son has been there. Started a ritzy private school in 8th grade where all the kids had known each other since kindergarden. Think he wasn't the butt of jokes, ridicule and smart azz comments? well YEAH..HAIL YEAH..

Cause we weren't rich. Plain and simple. He got in on grades - his smartz and willingness to learn, tested off the charts in languages and english..heck he speaks five languages now..and he's just 18.

but he was the social outcast. Know what? he dealt. He dealt with it by using humor when someone would comment on his clothes.."tood bad you have to be a follower, I'm a leader and wear what I WANT" lol..

he dealt when school trips were trips overseas to foreign places we only read about..
he went to places that were KOOOL..like being onstage with a very HOT band and having pics to prove it..was the envy of his class that year thanks to a very loving ex-hubby who is in a big name band...lol..

Sr. shadowing when all the kids were in "up town" offices, he shadowed at a nursing home, put together an incredible collage of WWII veteran's stories and had the whole class wanting more..

It was his up beat attitude, humor and grace that got him accepted by his peers. Of course there were one or two "hairy" instances at school..but I informed the athletic director whom everyone respected and admired and also the admissions officer..and those were taken care of "behind the scenes". I never actually interfered but offered my child the chance to shine in his own way.

Amazing what some of the children who taunted him, who thought he was "beneath" them thought at graduation. He had to learn to deal with those that thought they were "above" him..

and we live in a harn..not many rich kids live in a barn house..not finished, but he was never short of kids who wanted to come to our house, who invited him to their house (even the richest of the rich doctor kids) took to him eventually. He just won them over despite bullying, snarky comments and downright abusive rude behavior.

His favorite comment to those that would tease/taunt him: "Well money sure didn't buy you class, now did it?" Talk about a shut up....and red faced, don't know what to say..that was the best come back line I have ever heard a kid dream up.

and it worked. Whenever he was being ridiculed, he was just softly say that one line..just loud enough that all those surrounding him would hear..and the abuser/tormentor would turn red..sputter, and walk away.

try it..

so sorry your child is going through this, but you absolutely cannot fight his battles for him..he will run into this all through is life and he needs one good comeback line that works for every situation.

My child is now in college, well adjusted and still brings his college friends back here to the unfinished harn..it's a work in progress, but they love it here and know that they are welcome and listened to and though I do not understand all the college speak, I do listen. For some, and for many..to be listened to and questioned, answered and paid attention to: that is enough and they are surprised that I will stop whatever I am doing and just sit and listen to them. Many of these kids have never had anyone just sit and listen and offer suggestions, comments, or nothing at all, and they send me emails..lol.."thanks for listening, thanks for the advice, thanks for having me and listening"

I think many children cry out for help, they cry out to be LISTENED to, to be heard..
unfortunately sometimes their parents are so busy making money and doing the "in" thing, they forget that "this is a child, one that needs attention".

Now my son is NOT perfect. He also has ADD and is sometimes not focused and he has embarrassed me on occasion. I love him and he tries and he thinks of others and..
remember that nursing home? He still goes back there and volunteers and listens to the WWII vets and the old ladies when he comes home from college on weekends, etc.

He's learned that sometimes all that is needed is someone to listen and care. Perhaps your son can also look at his bully in that light..maybe she just needs someone to listen, to care and even if she comes off as NASTY,,maybe the right response is: Why are you so nasty? What is wrong? Is your life so bad that you have to take it out on me? Money hasn't bought you class has it? etc.

There seems to be underlying issues with those that need to bully others, not saying your son should be the psych counselor here, but sometimes a response such as above will throw them for a loop and make the bully "THINK".

Good luck, I know you love your child and you want to wade in "arms swinging and fists knocking"..that's the way I felt sometimes, but I had to let my son figure out how to deal with a WHOLE class..and I listened and offered advice but didn't run to his rescue in an obvious manner.

Good luck with your son, he has a wonderful future and sounds like the sort of kid that will overcome this - and of course - he needs you to listen and offer advice, but also needs to learn, like my son, to deal with life's nasties...

Best regards,
Sidepasser


Unfortunately too long to quote in my signature! :yes:

Anyhow, OP, love you, too for being so concerned. Raising a boy is so tough these days, my son has not reached dreaded teen years just yet.

Interfering is such a two edged action. The bullying already happens out of earshot of everybody else, stepping in as adult can make it go even more underground and vicious.

I second the humor approach.

people who bully are in general cowards, and small minded, only target willing targets.

While personal grooming does need to be addressed in the growing into adulthood child (both genders) it's not another child's place to do. (he can always get an assortment of horrible cheap perfume sprays and 'ask' her opinion, have her leave the barn smelling like a french hooker who fell in a perfume factory...:winkgrin: but that's just me)

I have not read everything, but being mom to an odd duckling (and having been one myself growing up) all I can try to do is to convey to my kid that doing your own thing is more important than being liked. Took me a long time to learn to do the things I like, regardless of what other people think. And that has - as of late - given me the reputation of being cool with teens and young adults.

And as to horsey....all American horses have European bloodlines. Just some came over earlier than others, like Bostonians, if your family wasn't on the Mayflower, you are a newcomer! :cool:

I hope The OP's son sticks around. Eventing is such a demanding sport, clothes and bloodlines don't mean jack, and when you go swimming in the water obsticle (I know I can't spell worth a darn...SIGH) it hurt so much less to throw the economy clothes out than the designer duds...

[Bobthehorse]

http://www.area1usea.org/denny-rules.pdf

5 and 6 are my favourites. And 5 seems to apply to Pep and her fellow ex-HPs quite well :D

[mkevent]

Bobthehorse-that is fantastic!
OP-copy it, laminate it and hang it on the front of your son's horse's stall
If any snarkiness continues-simply have your son refer to the rules-'nuff said!

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Bobthehorse-that is fantastic!
OP-copy it, laminate it and hang it on the front of your son's horse's stall
If any snarkiness continues-simply have your son refer to the rules-'nuff said!


I agree...but actually suggest that you give some copies to your trainer to "pass-out" to their students. It will carry a lot more weight that way!

[Bobthehorse]

I think there is a longer version somewhere, but those are the best ones.

Give your son a pointer, and he can just tap the sign silently when she opens her mouth. Hahah.

[Jenesmane]

As a teenager myself I felt compelled to answer. In my case the "trick" that has always worked for me is laugh! Just laugh right in her face she will feel like the smallest person. This will also show her that her obnoxious childish behavior has no effect of him.

Him----> :lol:
Her----> :mad:
You---> :D "Thats my boy!!!"

[Foxtrot's]

Horseriding, and especially eventing, is a great leveller. Trade Unionists ride side by side with CEO's, Royalty with commoners. Take the high road, and she'll get hers, even if she beats him, it won't always be that way. (Pity her, actually.) Remember David Wilding-Davies who took Crusader to the Seoul Olympics? Crusader was a reformed bucking horse of QH ancestry that David bought with his Krugerrand that he purchased from the proceeds of his trapline.

[eventingben]

I have a teenage son and my advice to him would be to ignore her. Usually people like that are looking for some sort of response and it kills them when they get nothing. Anyway, I'm a firm believer in what goes around comes around! She will get hers one way or another. She sounds like an idiot and her family most likely are too. Wouldn't waste my breath on those people.

[alterdstate]

http://www.area1usea.org/denny-rules.pdf

5 and 6 are my favourites. And 5 seems to apply to Pep and her fellow ex-HPs quite well :D

I've never read the "Unwritten Rules" and they are perfect! Thanks so much for sharing!

I've had my kid read all your responses and we have some great ideas on how to react to further onslaughts of Pep ugliness. We've also had some really great laughs and some open dialogue as a result of many of the posts.

To the folks that have said Pep's parents must be awful, they are actually lovely people. Just lovely people that aren't horsey and have lots of money. :lol: I'm sure they would be very distressed by the things that Pep has said to my son and the attitude she displays away from the trainer and other "grown-ups".

[goeslikestink]

I've read this whole thread and can honestly say: My son has been there. Started a ritzy private school in 8th grade where all the kids had known each other since kindergarden. Think he wasn't the butt of jokes, ridicule and smart azz comments? well YEAH..HAIL YEAH..

Cause we weren't rich. Plain and simple. He got in on grades - his smartz and willingness to learn, tested off the charts in languages and english..heck he speaks five languages now..and he's just 18.

but he was the social outcast. Know what? he dealt. He dealt with it by using humor when someone would comment on his clothes.."tood bad you have to be a follower, I'm a leader and wear what I WANT" lol..

he dealt when school trips were trips overseas to foreign places we only read about..
he went to places that were KOOOL..like being onstage with a very HOT band and having pics to prove it..was the envy of his class that year thanks to a very loving ex-hubby who is in a big name band...lol..

Sr. shadowing when all the kids were in "up town" offices, he shadowed at a nursing home, put together an incredible collage of WWII veteran's stories and had the whole class wanting more..

It was his up beat attitude, humor and grace that got him accepted by his peers. Of course there were one or two "hairy" instances at school..but I informed the athletic director whom everyone respected and admired and also the admissions officer..and those were taken care of "behind the scenes". I never actually interfered but offered my child the chance to shine in his own way.

Amazing what some of the children who taunted him, who thought he was "beneath" them thought at graduation. He had to learn to deal with those that thought they were "above" him..

and we live in a harn..not many rich kids live in a barn house..not finished, but he was never short of kids who wanted to come to our house, who invited him to their house (even the richest of the rich doctor kids) took to him eventually. He just won them over despite bullying, snarky comments and downright abusive rude behavior.

His favorite comment to those that would tease/taunt him: "Well money sure didn't buy you class, now did it?" Talk about a shut up....and red faced, don't know what to say..that was the best come back line I have ever heard a kid dream up.

and it worked. Whenever he was being ridiculed, he was just softly say that one line..just loud enough that all those surrounding him would hear..and the abuser/tormentor would turn red..sputter, and walk away.

try it..

so sorry your child is going through this, but you absolutely cannot fight his battles for him..he will run into this all through is life and he needs one good comeback line that works for every situation.

My child is now in college, well adjusted and still brings his college friends back here to the unfinished harn..it's a work in progress, but they love it here and know that they are welcome and listened to and though I do not understand all the college speak, I do listen. For some, and for many..to be listened to and questioned, answered and paid attention to: that is enough and they are surprised that I will stop whatever I am doing and just sit and listen to them. Many of these kids have never had anyone just sit and listen and offer suggestions, comments, or nothing at all, and they send me emails..lol.."thanks for listening, thanks for the advice, thanks for having me and listening"

I think many children cry out for help, they cry out to be LISTENED to, to be heard..
unfortunately sometimes their parents are so busy making money and doing the "in" thing, they forget that "this is a child, one that needs attention".

Now my son is NOT perfect. He also has ADD and is sometimes not focused and he has embarrassed me on occasion. I love him and he tries and he thinks of others and..
remember that nursing home? He still goes back there and volunteers and listens to the WWII vets and the old ladies when he comes home from college on weekends, etc.

He's learned that sometimes all that is needed is someone to listen and care. Perhaps your son can also look at his bully in that light..maybe she just needs someone to listen, to care and even if she comes off as NASTY,,maybe the right response is: Why are you so nasty? What is wrong? Is your life so bad that you have to take it out on me? Money hasn't bought you class has it? etc.

There seems to be underlying issues with those that need to bully others, not saying your son should be the psych counselor here, but sometimes a response such as above will throw them for a loop and make the bully "THINK".

Good luck, I know you love your child and you want to wade in "arms swinging and fists knocking"..that's the way I felt sometimes, but I had to let my son figure out how to deal with a WHOLE class..and I listened and offered advice but didn't run to his rescue in an obvious manner.

Good luck with your son, he has a wonderful future and sounds like the sort of kid that will overcome this - and of course - he needs you to listen and offer advice, but also needs to learn, like my son, to deal with life's nasties...

Best regards,
Sidepasser

echo you thats what i was kinda trying to say

[alterdstate]

I don't know if it's made my son feel better or worse but he is not the only recipient of Pep's rudeness.

After a recent event in which Pep did very well, she said "I can't WAIT to rub this in Rider X's face!" (Rider X is a former barn mate and "friend"). I believe there is no chance anything my son can say or do will change her ugliness to others. All we can do is work on his reaction to that type of behavior.

I'll be glad when teenagers are no longer a daily part of my life. :winkgrin:

[Hilary]

The response to THAT lovely piece of attitude would be "why ever would you want to do that?" with a quizzical look on your face.

And just wait for her answer.

[mkevent]

I think PEP needs one good b@%$# slapping!!!
Some people just totally lack social skills-unfortunately, you find them in all walks of life.
IMHO, even if PEP is successful, she will not be respected. If you spend enough $$, you may "buy" a better chance at success, but you can never ever buy someone's respect. Respect has to be earned the hard way. Hopefully your son will meet true eventers-the kind that live by the unwritten rules and he'll learn to laugh/ignore PEPs comments. I think PEPs sole purpose in life is @sshole 101 training-maybe when your son moves up and on, he can thank PEP for the course!

[subk]

I'll be glad when teenagers are no longer a daily part of my life. :winkgrin:
Amen sister!

The best part is realizing that you never ever have to be one again yourself!

[MaritimeH/J]

Anyone else notice an increase in teenage and preteen ridiculousness since the dawn or facebook, myspace and the like? And apparently its still a problem in person, I've just noticed that these girls seem even braver behind a computer screen too. Glad you havent mentioned your son having to deal with cyber bullying.

I agree, if you step in on your sons behalf to the parents or the girl it's just going to get worse for him, probably. But I would talk to the trainer. I was a teenager not that long ago, and if I behaved like that it would NOT have been tolerated. I let one snarky gloat about a win out of my mouth at a schooling show once and my trainer/mentor leveled that behavior pretty quick!

I recently saw some cyber-bashing going on from kid to kid, barn to barn in my area on facebook. It was getting sooo ridiculous and so mean (not tomention unnessecary and untrue) that I couldn't ignore it and I wrote a reply myself. Probably accomplished nothing but it's my hopes that something might have been taken from it:

"What every rider must learn to be successful in this sport (at least in my opinion!) is that every discipline has it's difficulties, every rider has preferences, and every horse is different. Look at both sides of every story, and generally, keep your comments about other people to yourself, especially if they are mean-spirited! There are different ways to train and ride, interchangibly in any discipline. There are different attitudes that people have when competing, but I think the best one is to challenge yourself, compete against yourself, strive for quality not quantity. We all compete to win, but if we put it above all else we lose our integrity in the process. You young riders are the next generation, stay focused and dont take the "bashing" bait, be above it.
Talent+Attitude=Success."


I think it is ironic that it is a hunter princess bashing an eventer. In my area it tends to happen the other way around!! I was a hunter rider (not princess!!) who worked at an eventing barn for a summer and took a lot of friendly torment from the other riders about my "sissy sport". Which promptly stopped when my mare and I won our division at our first event.:D I love my hunters, but from what I've read on here it seems like the "A" hunter world in some areas would scare me a little bit. Lots of overly opinionated and entitled...types. LoL.

Good luck to you and your son. And please, if it continues, speak to the trainer. If needed, remind him or her that Pep is a representitive of the barn and the teaching. Surely the trainer will not condone this behavior.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Good luck to you and your son. And please, if it continues, speak to the trainer. If needed, remind him or her that Pep is a representitive of the barn and the teaching. Surely the trainer will not condone this behavior.


And by the sounds of it...her parents would not either. Basically...this kid sounds like she has a screwed up self worth...i.e. thinking she is worth more than she is! Honestly, I've seen that a lot in the current up coming generation......perhaps a bit too much effort spent building up self esteem. She needs someone she respects to knock that chip off her shoulder. I've seen a few clinicians do that to certain young riders....some of the young riders get it, and others don't. I wouldn't be too sure that even the trainer could knock some sense into this kid. Trouble is, a lot of kids like this really don't respect anyone...they think they are above everyone.

I think the best advice has to be for your son to just ignore her....she is obviously a bad apple and while she may make snide comments.....no one who matters will believe her. She will always have her little click of friends...that is a guarantee....but ribbons at a few events or even the level that a rider competes does not make a good rider or good horseman.....and the good riders and good horsemen KNOW this.

[goeslikestink]

I don't know if it's made my son feel better or worse but he is not the only recipient of Pep's rudeness.

After a recent event in which Pep did very well, she said "I can't WAIT to rub this in Rider X's face!" (Rider X is a former barn mate and "friend"). I believe there is no chance anything my son can say or do will change her ugliness to others. All we can do is work on his reaction to that type of behavior.

I'll be glad when teenagers are no longer a daily part of my life. :winkgrin:

are you kidding you got them for life - haha mine have grown up 22 and 25 and i have a grandson haha do they need me you bet they do

i will tell you now you wait till he starts clubbing and cant drive - yet
its taxi mum next then when they drive then you have a bit of peice for a while but they still come back at you -- like rubberbands haha

[goeslikestink]

And by the sounds of it...her parents would not either. Basically...this kid sounds like she has a screwed up self worth...i.e. thinking she is worth more than she is! Honestly, I've seen that a lot in the current up coming generation......perhaps a bit too much effort spent building up self esteem. She needs someone she respects to knock that chip off her shoulder. I've seen a few clinicians do that to certain young riders....some of the young riders get it, and others don't. I wouldn't be too sure that even the trainer could knock some sense into this kid. Trouble is, a lot of kids like this really don't respect anyone...they think they are above everyone.

I think the best advice has to be for your son to just ignore her....she is obviously a bad apple and while she may make snide comments.....no one who matters will believe her. She will always have her little click of friends...that is a guarantee....but ribbons at a few events or even the level that a rider competes does not make a good rider or good horseman.....and the good riders and good horsemen KNOW this.


i would love to have her as a lesson haha matey your son is worth1000 of her

[alterdstate]

are you kidding you got them for life - haha mine have grown up 22 and 25 and i have a grandson haha do they need me you bet they do

i will tell you now you wait till he starts clubbing and cant drive - yet
its taxi mum next then when they drive then you have a bit of peice for a while but they still come back at you -- like rubberbands haha

Now I'm extremely depressed. Thanks... ;)

[Sightunseen]

I would comend you son for not snapping back at her. Being the kid who always rode the rejects(still do actully), I would have made a coment about how my parents didn't need to buy the talent in MY partnership.....so just remnd he that there are many more "rejects" in the eventing world and in the end his horse could prove to be way nicer. And as a side note it was the draft cross that jumped out of our 6' turn out not any of the fancy warmbloods

[spurgirl]

I replied to the OP several days ago (#60), and have followed the many replies with interest. Many people have said to ignore this rude young woman, and this is certainly an option, BUT it depends on the victim's situation, and how they are affected by the bullying. The OP had noticed her son becoming somewhat withdrawn, and more quiet. As my son (only 14 now) was also bullied at age 12, boys can sometimes have an even harder time of it than girls, by really internalizing their anger/pain. My son would get stomachaches, headaches, and actually even vomit before school started sometimes-all because of the stress. Thank goodness "his bully" got into other trouble and the last few months of middle school were bearable. Now my son is at a high school-a different one, away from all the jerks he used to go school with, and he loves it.

Hopefully the OP, and her son have gotten some tips on the many posts here about how to the handle this bully. Maybe out "ribboning" her will help. Maybe loudly "outing" her will help. Maybe speaking to the trainer will help. We just don't know what will work 'til we're in that situation, but I hope this family finds a resolution soon. Best of luck, he sounds like a talented young man any trainer would want in their program. Best of luck to you!

I vote we send all the bullies to the island on "Lost", where they can get stuck forever with headaches, nosebleeds, and each other:lol:!!

[mkevent]

OP-did you overhear Pep saying that comment at the last event? If you were there, you could, as a adult, set the record straight by saying something like,"I know that you're new to eventing ,Pep, and I just wanted to let you know that in this sport we all like to help each other and root for each other. You may begin to understand this when you move up the levels and realize how incredibly difficult this sport can be. You'll really want the friendship of others when you do your first 3 day -people who respect and care about you can be incredibly helpful when you're in the vet box, or at the start box when you're ready to puke your guts up."
While it would be wonderful if your son does better than Pep at competitions, it may also place an undue burden on him that would take away from his enjoyment of the sport. I would hate to see the eventing world miss out on a down to earth, honest person-and as you can see from the numerous posts, there are a lot of really good people in this sport. I would also *think* about informing the trainer of Pep's comment if you heard it personally-but I wouldn't get into anything your son said Pep said to him. Hopefully the trainer will nip this behavior in the bud and perhaps have a general talk to everyone in the barn without naming names or pointing fingers.

[Foxtrot's]

We just missed pink day yesterday. The wearing of a pink shirt to make a statement against bullying. Even cops and firemen dyed a uniform shirt to join in. Next year...

[alterdstate]

OP-did you overhear Pep saying that comment at the last event? If you were there, you could, as a adult, set the record straight by saying something like,"I know that you're new to eventing ,Pep, and I just wanted to let you know that in this sport we all like to help each other and root for each other. You may begin to understand this when you move up the levels and realize how incredibly difficult this sport can be. You'll really want the friendship of others when you do your first 3 day -people who respect and care about you can be incredibly helpful when you're in the vet box, or at the start box when you're ready to puke your guts up."
While it would be wonderful if your son does better than Pep at competitions, it may also place an undue burden on him that would take away from his enjoyment of the sport. I would hate to see the eventing world miss out on a down to earth, honest person-and as you can see from the numerous posts, there are a lot of really good people in this sport. I would also *think* about informing the trainer of Pep's comment if you heard it personally-but I wouldn't get into anything your son said Pep said to him. Hopefully the trainer will nip this behavior in the bud and perhaps have a general talk to everyone in the barn without naming names or pointing fingers.

Alas, the comments were all made out of earshot otherwise I would have said something to Pep. She's clever! She only says these types of things to her peers, never in front of adults.

There are many more down to earth types than Peps in eventing and for that, we are very thankful and it's why we've stayed in as long as we have. I am concerned that speaking to the trainer will cause issues for my son. After all, Pep is an important client, spends big bucks and this IS a business for her. And it's also he said/she said. I'm not sure this is one we can win by doing anything directly unless Pep slips. And I'm thinking snarky behavior can't be hidden forever. :D

[alterdstate]

We just missed pink day yesterday. The wearing of a pink shirt to make a statement against bullying. Even cops and firemen dyed a uniform shirt to join in. Next year...

Dang! And it would be perfect if we could stick him in a pink shirt with a big, burly cop backing him up. ;)

[VCT]

I hope there are other kids that your son can pal up with an he can *really* ignore PEB (yes, I changed the nickname - guess what I changed it to?). If he really CAN ignore her, ie. not be hurt by her remarks then thats great. Just tell him to keep an eye out for the amusing moment when karma comes around to give PEB the smackdown. It will happen. Never fails.

If PEB is really having a mental/emotional effect on your son... well then I guess I'd do whatever seems best - unfortunately, no one can say whats best except you. Like, move to a different trainer, talk to trainer, give pre-scripted comebacks to your son to use, etc.

If he can do it, he really should just stand up to her. Practice those comebacks! And no pulling punches - let that little witch know exactly where she stands. Make sure he understands that it probably won't change PEB or how she acts towards him. But it will change him, how he feels about the situation... and how he lets other people effect him.

I wish you and your son the best.

[Trakehner]

Yep, time to take the leash and gloves off your son....the b@#$%@ is going down....teach the boy some good insults and areas to attack on her that will hit her in the gut. Nail her for some physical imperfection or something that will really make her cry "foul"!

It's not being a gentleman to treat a slattern well...nail her.

[ideayoda]

Event horses do not run on their breeding (and wb tend to be too tanky to go up through the levels), they run on their training. Want to win? Do really good dressage (and then you can pull a rail in stadium because you are so far ahead. Do really good caveletti and great fence combinations, and develop good stadium. Do lots of jumping w/o stirrups and two point and have great equitation. And be able to gallop xcountry without hanging on the horse. Do all those things and the princess will be left far behind. As GM says he wants a rider with a work ethic, not one which just buys pretty horses.

And what mother doesnt muzzle their obnoxious kid? Its like buying an expensive purse, the princesses self worth goes along with the $$, too sad. Tell him why she trys to 'build herself up'. And quote (or even watch) Chariots of Fire with him. THere is a scene (its about winning an olympic medal) where a character says 'if he isnt enough without it (the medal), he will never be enough with it. Same with that girl, if she isnt enough personally, she has to build herself up with 'stuff' (in this case her horse....poor horse, its just a thing to her...likely your son has more love for his!).

Btw my ex won three national titles on a little nothing tb.....LOL

[alterdstate]

My son and I have received some excellent advice in this thread. The sad part is my son doesn't HATE Pep/Peb. If he did, thing would be much easier. However I've given him permission, actually encouraged him, to take the gloves off and set her down on her little FITS breeches the next time she thinks she needs to go after him for his low class horse, his cheap clothes, his hair or anything else she thinks beneath her.

I hope that she slips and performs her pitiful routine in front of adults that matter to her and I hope my son decides he's done with her foul behavior and lets her have it in the very near future!

Thanks again for all the advice. Eventers are super people. :)

[JanM]

It's really sad that some people only build themselves up by trying to knock others down. I work with someone like this and the sad thing is that she has everything to be happy about, but she never will be happy because inside she's a mean little person that's trying to bully everyone she encounters. People like my boss and PEB will end up alone and empty, while people like you son will have a happy life and lots of real friends.

[bamboozled]

Alas, the comments were all made out of earshot otherwise I would have said something to Pep. She's clever! She only says these types of things to her peers, never in front of adults.

There are many more down to earth types than Peps in eventing and for that, we are very thankful and it's why we've stayed in as long as we have. I am concerned that speaking to the trainer will cause issues for my son. After all, Pep is an important client, spends big bucks and this IS a business for her. And it's also he said/she said. I'm not sure this is one we can win by doing anything directly unless Pep slips. And I'm thinking snarky behavior can't be hidden forever. :D

Uh Oh. Coming from the Hunters, I've seen this teen drama play out many times. As a former Hunter Princess I will guess that this girl is into the latest fashions. Ribbons and winning "hardware" are important to her. I will also hazard a guess that she can't apply decent standing wraps or body clip nor clean a sheath.

If she is as snotty as you say, she's the kind of client that is a cancer to the rest of the kids in the barn, drawing trainer away from the true core of her business. The rest of the kids will harbor resentment and you moms will be pissed off.

The unsportsmanlike comments WILL be noticed by others, you can be assured. Your trainer will have her reputation lessened among her peers. Eventually, this girl is not "winning" enough with your trainer, she moves and your trainer is left with her original customer base.

If it is still there.

[Pferd51]

I was wondering after you mentioned that your son became withdrawn rather than stand up for himself if there was some chance he kind of liked her (cute? rich? popular?). This makes the rude comments at least some kind of attention, which may be better than being ignored. She's still a jerk, but your son may not feel like putting her in her place.

If not, while some kids can be shut up, there's also ones who you just can't get anything over. Do you remember the character played by James Spader in Pretty in Pink? Nothing in the world was going to get that character's goat--he had it all and he knew it. So don't waste too much effort if things don't look promising there.

I like the role-playing idea. Even if none of it ever gets used, it can make the situation into a running family joke rather than a bottled up feeling of inadequacy. It may not matter if your son comes up with any clever comments at the moment if he can laugh about the situation later.

And don't change your attitude about his dress and personal hygiene. If you were on him about it before, don't stop. If you weren't, don't start. I can't think of a more powerful way for PEP's insults to be validated.

[mjedge808]

"No one can make you feel inferior without your consent." - Eleanor Roosevelt.

As one who was bullied and harrassed in my youth, ignoring it can be one of the most difficult things to do. But I learned that fighting back or snapping back or coming with your own insults can encourage the bullies more, it becomes a game. Ignoring them, though hard to do at first, can drive them nuts, but eventually they get bored when there is no response to them. They find a new target.

Talk a lot with your son, reiterate that his feelings are HIS, not hers, and she can't do anything to them if he doesn't want her to. You mentioned he is usually courteous. He shouldn't stop being so just because this PEP is an ugly person. Courtesy is rarer than ever, especially with teenagers, and it's a great trait to be a nice kind person.

And as for his 'mutt' horse never getting to Prelim, how many naysayers said Teddy would never make around Rolex because he was too small? He made the big 'purebred' horses look like greenies. And Teddy was a little bit of this, and a little bit of that. Your son doesn't have to tell PEP that, but he can think about the experts that Teddy showed up when he aced the cross country in Kentucky and won gold in Brazil.

A bully is only as strong as their victim's attention...

[apparentlyinferior]

Hey guys,

thanks for all the replies. I am the son that alterdstate is talking about (also posting under a different name)

I want to make it really clear that i do NOT like this girl. how could I like someone that is completely demeaning? She thinks my horse is a piece of crap, and I'm a piece of crap. I don't get why she is so mean if she really doesn't care? :confused:

oh well. I guess my mutt and I will come across more PEP's in our lifetime and just have to learn to deal with it :yes: i love my mutt and no one can tell me otherwise. But it is a bit disheartening when someone thought to be your friend disses your horse when all you've done is compliment their's.

thanks again. i'm not a violent person otherwise i would have already taken my gloves off and thrown down :D

[imapepper]

Hey guys,
I want to make it really clear that i do NOT like this girl. how could I like someone that is completely demeaning? She thinks my horse is a piece of crap, and I'm a piece of crap. I don't get why she is so mean if she really doesn't care? :confused:


Reread the posts about people building up their own self esteem by tearing others down :( It's not nice or fair.....but it is the way some people operate. Just continue to ignore her and anyone else like her. There are a couple of fairly snappy comebacks on this thread that I quite like. But when in doubt, you can always fall back on the good ole southern expression "bless your heart" which can be loosely translated to "go f#$% yourself" ;)

[Alagirl]

Hey guys,

thanks for all the replies. I am the son that alterdstate is talking about (also posting under a different name)

I want to make it really clear that i do NOT like this girl. how could I like someone that is completely demeaning? She thinks my horse is a piece of crap, and I'm a piece of crap. I don't get why she is so mean if she really doesn't care? :confused:

oh well. I guess my mutt and I will come across more PEP's in our lifetime and just have to learn to deal with it :yes: i love my mutt and no one can tell me otherwise. But it is a bit disheartening when someone thought to be your friend disses your horse when all you've done is compliment their's.

thanks again. i'm not a violent person otherwise i would have already taken my gloves off and thrown down :D



That you don't like her does not mean she does not like you. :)

ANYHOW. A man is never lost when he has a good horse, somewhat paraphrased from an Arabic horse story. And a good horse is a good horse.

Being violent is not the answer, as satisfying as it might be to pop somebody like that right in the kisser, besides, it's still frowned upon for boys punching girls. ;)

There are numerous ways to handle this, start of with the least forceful, hm, nod, walk away, to raised eyebrows, etc, the afore mentioned ways, to the more clear 'here is a quarter, tell a parking meeter' or the unmistakable 'you bore the he** out of me, buzz off!'

Dealing with those types is a learned skill. Consider her your sparring partner. :cool:

[bornfreenowexpensive]

oh well. I guess my mutt and I will come across more PEP's in our lifetime and just have to learn to deal with it :yes: i love my mutt and no one can tell me otherwise. But it is a bit disheartening when someone thought to be your friend disses your horse when all you've done is compliment their's.


You will meet a lot of them in your life.....it is not an uncommon personality type at all. Yes it is disheartening if you considered that person a friend....but it does give you more insight into that person. They are most likely very shallow. Nothing per say wrong with that.....just not the sort of person I consider a friend. They become acquaintances. You can still "like" or at least not dislike that sort of person....they can be fun sometimes. But they are not people with whom you share your inner secrets/dreams, or who you count on.....or who you even really consider a friend. You can still hold a conversation with them.....even have some fun together.....but you just learn to ignore their shallow opinions....and you learn how to not let those opinions affect you.


You are just learning about growing up....where you will have more relationships with people who are not friends, family or strangers....and how to deal with those folks like PEP who you have to interact with possible more than you really want to. Welcome to part of the grown up world:D

[ZiggyStardust]

Hey guys,

thanks for all the replies. I am the son that alterdstate is talking about (also posting under a different name)

I want to make it really clear that i do NOT like this girl. how could I like someone that is completely demeaning? She thinks my horse is a piece of crap, and I'm a piece of crap. I don't get why she is so mean if she really doesn't care? :confused:

oh well. I guess my mutt and I will come across more PEP's in our lifetime and just have to learn to deal with it :yes: i love my mutt and no one can tell me otherwise. But it is a bit disheartening when someone thought to be your friend disses your horse when all you've done is compliment their's.

thanks again. i'm not a violent person otherwise i would have already taken my gloves off and thrown down :D

Hey Apparently, hang in there. A big part of success and happiness in life (and of course also in working with horses!) is understanding how we influence others. You have a clue about this and she doesn't, so consider yourself light years ahead already! :yes:

[Trakehner]

Don't mistake violence for not being a wimp.

She's used to getting away with being a snarky little whore because she's: 1) a girl, 2) wealthy parents and 3) she depends on people running away from ever confronting evil (she qualifies as evil).

Don't let her get away with it....no matter what modern feminism equates with violence against women...call this skank what she is in no uncertain terms, hit her, verbally, where it hurts. Girls at that age can be very easy targets...go after her, leave her crying and let her worry about showing her face around you.

There are way too many lovely girls worth knowing and caring about....destroy this self-absorbed and spoiled slattern-to-be. I hate people who abuse others because they feel they can and their victim is powerless ("But I'm a girl, you can't say anything bad to me!")

[Palisades]

So I've avoided weighing in on this because everyone else has done such a nice job, but I feel obliged to chime in and urge you to ignore Trakehner. No, her being a girl does not give her a right to be nasty to you. But going after her because of her gender (rather than because of what she says) is just as wrong. No one would encourage you to get nasty to her based on her race or her sexual orientation, so don't listen to those who encourage you to do it based on her gender. You can tell her to screw off without sinking to gendered insults, and you'll be the bigger person if you take that route.

Not that I think you really need to be told that, but I felt the need to say it anyway.

[ReSomething]

Don't mistake violence for not being a wimp.

She's used to getting away with being a snarky little whore because she's: 1) a girl, 2) wealthy parents and 3) she depends on people running away from ever confronting evil (she qualifies as evil).

Don't let her get away with it....no matter what modern feminism equates with violence against women...call this skank what she is in no uncertain terms, hit her, verbally, where it hurts. Girls at that age can be very easy targets...go after her, leave her crying and let her worry about showing her face around you.

There are way too many lovely girls worth knowing and caring about....destroy this self-absorbed and spoiled slattern-to-be. I hate people who abuse others because they feel they can and their victim is powerless ("But I'm a girl, you can't say anything bad to me!")

Geez, why stoop?

AI, change the alter to "Proud of who I am". And then live that sentiment.

This girl has a ton of issues, including being shallow, hugely nosey and downright rude. Buy an Ipod, if she makes some hateful comment turn it up and ignore her - (a strategy commonly used by adults at my work). H*ll, turn it up and ignore her before she opens her mouth. "SORRY, WHAT DID YOU SAY? I COULDN'T HEAR YOU"

Mom, I'd suggest digging deep into the family pockets for a good clinic that Proud can attend sans PEP, and preferably without her knowledge either. And yes I would make a copy of those Rules, give then to the trainer and tell Proud to tell her why. Work hard and improve your skills. Enjoy your horse. Good luck!

[Alagirl]

So I've avoided weighing in on this because everyone else has done such a nice job, but I feel obliged to chime in and urge you to ignore Trakehner. No, her being a girl does not give her a right to be nasty to you. But going after her because of her gender (rather than because of what she says) is just as wrong. No one would encourage you to get nasty to her based on her race or her sexual orientation, so don't listen to those who encourage you to do it based on her gender. You can tell her to screw off without sinking to gendered insults, and you'll be the bigger person if you take that route.

Not that I think you really need to be told that, but I felt the need to say it anyway.


naw, not because of her gender, in spite of it!

There is no way this crap would be taken as easily from a young man, it is still more commonly practiced to use firm (not to say rude) language around males, but not around females, even if they are sometimes a good bit worse than their male counter parts.

It's an art form, learned over years being exposed to this type of manure that lets us at one point not give a damn about how we come across to those who trespass on us. like that old country song: "My give-a-damn is broken" or, to but it in COTH terms: Did your Mother teach you to be this rude?

Call a spade a spade. That's all there is to it!

[Trakehner]

naw, not because of her gender, in spite of it! There is no way this crap would be taken as easily from a young man, it is still more commonly practiced to use firm (not to say rude) language around males, but not around females, even if they are sometimes a good bit worse than their male counter parts. Call a spade a spade. That's all there is to it!

That's it exactly...I wasn't saying to go after her because she was female...I was saying go after her in spite of her being a female. She depends and probably demands on being treated differently because she's a girl. She's not "responsible" for her words and actions, and if he responds to her snarkiness, she'll label herself the victim (and she'll get support too!).

Telling him to "just suck it up, be better than she is" is awfully special, but will be seen as weakness by this sort of harpy and just makes him a target for her to sharpen her claws on again and again. For her, evil is fun and without any sort of cost...he can't fight her back, she's a girl and was "just teasing".

I grew up at barns, usually the only boy in the group and my best and closest friends have been women who ride. I was always amazed at how nasty, seemingly for fun, some girls were...and yet were the first ones to tear up when you looked at them cross-eyed. To paraphrase what the Sheriff of Nottingham said in Coster's movie "Robin Hood"..."Cut out her heart with a spoon!" Not because she's a girl, in spite of her being a girl.

[Alterageous]

I guess the one detail in this whole saga I missed is how these two manage to have so much contact? If they just ride in the same area, how do they see each other so much? Or do they ride at the same barn, or what?

[findeight]

Me too...usually pretty easy to ignore some potty mouthed kid unless they are right there with you all the time.

And, Mom? Do NOT intervene. Nothing more humiliating for a teen boy then Mom getting into it.
Also, no offense to son but, OP, you may not be getting all the details. Let son handle his own business here.

[Alterageous]

I have to say I am a little stunned by people calling this girl a "waste of skin" and saying she doesn't deserve to live. We wonder how kids decide they're superior to others, when we say things like that as adults? So she's being a brat. Just don't dignify anything with a response and she'll get over it. There's a lot of brats in this world, but telling a teenager that someone who acts superior to them deserves to be called a "waste of skin" and be humiliated in various ways is not the proper course of action.

She's a TEENAGER. My guess is she doesn't know how much words sting because she herself is not that sensitive. It won't pay off for her in the end, but certainly calling someone a "waste of skin" based on the information from an apparently sensitive mother and her teenage son seems a bit ridiculous.

[Trakehner]

She's a TEENAGER. My guess is she doesn't know how much words sting because she herself is not that sensitive

OMG...there's nothing more overly sensitive to real and perceived insults than teenagers, especially the girls...what they typically are is totally insensitive to the suffering their comments cause in others...what they lack is empathy or sympathy....emotional attacks are sport for many of them.

[Alterageous]

OMG...there's nothing more overly sensitive to real and perceived insults than teenagers, especially the girls...what they typically are is totally insensitive to the suffering their comments cause in others...what they lack is empathy or sympathy....emotional attacks are sport for many of them.

Yeah, I used to do it, as a defense against those who were picking on ME. But I didn't realize how much it REALLY hurt until someone said something truly nasty to me.

So no, your comment is untrue. They understand, once someone does it to them. How can someone develop empathy if they truly have no idea how someone feels? That's part of what GROWING UP is about. So she's acting immature...omg! She's what, fourteen? We weren't all mini-perfect adults straight out of the womb.

People used to pick on my horse all the time in high school. I didn't give a crap because she was mine and I loved her. Growing a little skin is part of growing up, too.

[KBG Eventer]

It doesn't justify their actions, but every.single.person I have known who acts like that has some kind of hole in their life that their trying to fill. It seems like Pep wants attention. Stop calling your horse a "mutt" as there is nothing wrong with that at all as others have said. Be proud of you and your horse's accomplishments and partnership :).

It might be hard and even take awhile, but the best thing to take the wind of her sail is to completely, utterly ignore her. If she says something nasty pretend you didn't hear her and say "Oh...what did you say?". Actually, another even better thing to do if, for instance, she walks up to your stall at an event and starts running her mouth...simply walk away. I have done that once before. I just walked away and emerged myself into another group's conversation. The Pep was left awkwardly standing by herself.

[minnie]

So sorry you've run into a snarky young teenager. Nothing is more vicious! It doesn't matter if they actually feel they ARE superior or if they're acting that way because they're insecure within themselves. And frankly, all these expensive warmbloods are "mutts" too. There was a little of "this" and a little of "that" thrown into their breedings both past and present to make a type of horse. Breed a tb to a "dutch" and get it registered as an "oldenburg". Or an arab to a Belgian or whatever, throw in some quarter horse, a little welsh, connemara and get the baby registered through some inspection. DUH, doesn't that just scream "MUTT" to you? So, your horse is no more of a mutt than any of those more expensive creatures. He just doesn't have his lineage written down on a piece of paper.

As for show clothes, are you neat and clean and dressed appropriately for appearance? Doesn't mean Jack crap if someone's clothes are "designer" and more expensive. Years ago one of the girls showing couldn't afford show attire and showed in a boys sport coat they found in a second hand shop. She still got ribbons. More expensive clothes don't make you a better rider and a more expensive horse doesn't enable you to love or appreciate him/her any more than those less expensive.

You pretty much have to feel sorry for someone who is so unhappy within her own skin she has to verbally lash out at someone to try and make them feel inferior. It doesn't occur to happy people to "put someone else down". Poor poor girl. :)

As for comebacks, Bless your heart is always a good one.

One of my favorites has always been "are you always this rude or is this for my special benefit?" said with a HUGE grin.

It's actually quite amazing how rude you can be so long as it's said with a big smile and a sense of humor. They usually can't quite put their finger on the insult, but will get a mild uncomfortable feeling like they've been had, but are not quite sure how. You can "put her in her place" and still be a perfect gentleman about it. Probably be doing her a favor.

So, good luck and happy riding!

[cloudyandcallie]

Don't mistake violence for not being a wimp.

She's used to getting away with being a snarky little whore because she's: 1) a girl, 2) wealthy parents and 3) she depends on people running away from ever confronting evil (she qualifies as evil).

Don't let her get away with it....no matter what modern feminism equates with violence against women...call this skank what she is in no uncertain terms, hit her, verbally, where it hurts. Girls at that age can be very easy targets...go after her, leave her crying and let her worry about showing her face around you.

There are way too many lovely girls worth knowing and caring about....destroy this self-absorbed and spoiled slattern-to-be. I hate people who abuse others because they feel they can and their victim is powerless ("But I'm a girl, you can't say anything bad to me!")

I agree, from the point of view of a radical feminist who went to a women's college. But I think this is something that the parents must do, and to do so, they must get a tape recording of the witch (thanks for not insulting cows anymore) in action. Believe me she'll deny everything, so a tape recording of her acting badly towards OP's son will suffice.

Again, bullying is not a rite of passage! Like spousal abuse, it has long been considered a fact of life. It is wrong. If Collumbine and the other school shootings were not a wake up call to everyone, then they are too dense to reason with.

And belittling another's horse is not acceptable either. I, a southerner from a family where we were taught to me "ladies" would have beaten the crap out of anyone who insulted my dogs and cats and horses and bantams. (Yes my parents did make me stand up for myself but people were afraid of me, maybe one of the reasons being my father was a crack shot hunter & Virgo & engineer:eek:) My philosophy, which I passed on to my girl dogs (bitch is a good word), is that we were "ladies and would beat hell out of anyone who said we aren't.":lol: (I have aggressive Aussie bitches.)

So parents step up, get the tape recorder, let your son wear it, get a recording of the witch saying everything to him and take it to the trainer, the girl's parents, and the show stewards. And oh yes, to get her parents' attention, mention that bullying can result in a lawsuit. In which case your son will have better clothes and a more expensive horse (but keep the old one too).

[Trakehner]

"...And belittling another's horse is not acceptable either. I, a southerner from a family where we were taught to me "ladies" would have beaten the crap out of anyone who insulted my dogs and cats and horses and bantams. (Yes my parents did make me stand up for myself but people were afraid of me, maybe one of the reasons being my father was a crack shot hunter & Virgo & engineer) My philosophy, which I passed on to my girl dogs (bitch is a good word), is that we were "ladies and would beat hell out of anyone who said we aren't." (I have aggressive Aussie bitches.)"

:D:D:D

I'm an oldest brother, grew up as the "GATB" (guy at the barn) and looking out for my girl friends at the barn and later my riding students. Nobody threatened my friends, mistreated their horses (heck, any horse) or the younger kids at the barn. I hate bullies or thugs who pick on the weaker. I "spoke" with several jerk boyfriends when they tried to mistreat my friends....and would never tolerate any girl snarking at another. My friends were a team, so were my students...I pushed for them to look after each other. You snarked, you got another instructor.

So, a snarking little harridan deserves "shunning"...I'm very disappointed with her instructor...they can't claim "Gee, Stinky is picking on other students, I never knew"...yeah, right. I think some instructors (and parents) enjoy their brat being the alpha-dog.

[JollyBadger]

There will always be "Peps" at school, barns, work, clubs, team sports, etc. And there are self-help books for dealing with "difficult" people, which may help. But sometimes people like Pep dig their own graves without any help.

I had a "Pep" of my own in college. Her parents bought her a fabulously expensive, well-trained show horse. I didn't own a horse at all; usually ended up riding the less-desirable, less talented, not particularly "polished" school horses. I WAS a less experienced rider than Pep and she let me (as well as others) know that we were "inferior" to her and her fabulously expensive horse - especially when it came to sharing space in an arena.

The turning point came when the school hosted an intercollegiate show. I was not entered to compete, but I was working at the barn that day, just helping out with the show. Pep was competing, of course. She happened to draw the name of a "mutt" of a school horse that I'd ridden the previous semester. I always liked the horse, he had a huge heart and always tried to do what was asked of him, but he was far from a "finished" show horse. And sometimes, he just got confused or overwhelmed and started jigging.

So, suddenly Pep was paired up with a horse that was a far cry from the well-trained horse she owned. He wasn't giving her an easy time, either. Occasionally, as she rode past the spot where I was watching, she whispered "any tips?"

I didn't respond; it wasn't really feasible, anyway, because they were already being judged and she passed too quickly for me to say anything helpful. I can't remember whether or not she placed at all. I'm not even sure it matters; of course, she went back to riding her beautiful show horse and could talk about the "untalented mutt" she rode in the intercollegiate show.

He got treats and neck-scratches from me, though -- just for reminding her that owning a horse with a winning pedigree and a lot of training did not necessarily make HER a talented rider.

[Equibrit]

All he has to say is;

Bless your heart.

[cloudyandcallie]

All he has to say is;

Bless your heart.

She doesn't have one.:lol:

[Equibrit]

Aaaaaaah - irony !

[cheval80]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Pep's mom and trainer were on this thread offering their advice!:lol:

[cloudyandcallie]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Pep's mom and trainer were on this thread offering their advice!:lol:

Probably accusing him of having a crush on the witch and saying that he should do nothing.:lol: egotistical.

[Hony]

Probably accusing him of having a crush on the witch and saying that he should do nothing.:lol: egotistical.

More likely she has a crush on him and that's why she's being such nuissance. Girls have a funny way of expressing themselves sometimes.

[des]

In response to the comments about your horse you could just respond:
"Riders make horses, they don't buy them."
and leave it at that.

[equusaround]

Something simiilar happened to me in highschool and then to my son when he was in HS. In HS, I ran for Class President and lost; previously I had also tried out for Cheer Squad and lost and the year before that had only made the finals for the Dance Squad. After the election, one of the "dance squad girls I'd tried out with who had won, told me "if at first you don't succeed, try, try a gun". I just shrugged it off and ignored her. (To my credit, I was a "B" pony clubber, had come in 2nd in the National Rally, was a national merit scholar and was runner up for home coming queen.) but it still hurt my feelings. My revenge came when I had been out of HS for 20 years and hosted a cocktail party for our HS reunion at my home. By then, I was married to a wonderful husband, owned several nice horses, drove a new Range Rover while my husband had a BMW, had a house with horse property, a son and had 3 lawyers working for me in my law practice. My tormenter was divorced, had not attended college and was employed as a secretary, living in an apartment. She was still short, but no longer "perky" and her skin had absorbed too much sun in her teens. I was still tall, blond and all that sun screen and wearing a hat/helmet while riding had saved my skin. Living well was the best revenge. So I related this story to my son and told him to keep his chin up, a smile on his face and to not let the bastards get him down. I assured him that by not outwardly showing any emotion he was robbing his tormentors of any pleasure/power from their actions and that they would soon tire of their negative activity. Although there were a few tears, he followed my advice and he's doing well in college. [He did however quit riding at age 8 except at camp even though he had a super pony - what did I do wrong there????]

[ThreeDays]

I'm not a parent - but I can only image the anger and frustration you must feel to be aware of a situation you can't fix for your son.

Truth is - I think this is just one of the many life experiences we all have growing up. We all learn and experience on some level a person in our lives that gets under the skin and impacts our confidence with negative talk.

When I was a young rider and teen in 4-H and pony club I had a rival very much like the one you describe. I would even get phone calls from this other 'kid' trying to tell me what a rank and scary horse I was supposed to be riding in the meet (when we had round robin type of meets or gymkhanas and were randomly assigned horses). She was fortunate enough to have her own personal horse years before I did and of course that was frequently mentioned and later when I had my own she felt the need to put down my horse frequently.

What helped me at that time and the advise I would give to my child is to explain that the name of the game at this point in their lives is not to win competitions - it's to learn how to be good riders and develop their horsemanship.

Buying an expensive mount does not instantly give you credibility in the world of horseman. It's the experience and ultimately experience, patience and fortitude create good character's for not only the horse community but society at large.

I think this will work out just fine if you allow him to find his way and allow him to make this his little emotional triumph to overcome.

Now if you want to eventually get even and put a Holsteiner under him - give me a call and I'll make it happen! LOL :lol:

[Equibrit]

Something simiilar happened to me in highschool and then to my son when he was in HS. In HS, I ran for Class President and lost; previously I had also tried out for Cheer Squad and lost and the year before that had only made the finals for the Dance Squad. After the election, one of the "dance squad girls I'd tried out with who had won, told me "if at first you don't succeed, try, try a gun". I just shrugged it off and ignored her. (To my credit, I was a "B" pony clubber, had come in 2nd in the National Rally, was a national merit scholar and was runner up for home coming queen.) but it still hurt my feelings. My revenge came when I had been out of HS for 20 years and hosted a cocktail party for our HS reunion at my home. By then, I was married to a wonderful husband, owned several nice horses, drove a new Range Rover while my husband had a BMW, had a house with horse property, a son and had 3 lawyers working for me in my law practice. My tormenter was divorced, had not attended college and was employed as a secretary, living in an apartment. She was still short, but no longer "perky" and her skin had absorbed too much sun in her teens. I was still tall, blond and all that sun screen and wearing a hat/helmet while riding had saved my skin. Living well was the best revenge. So I related this story to my son and told him to keep his chin up, a smile on his face and to not let the bastards get him down. I assured him that by not outwardly showing any emotion he was robbing his tormentors of any pleasure/power from their actions and that they would soon tire of their negative activity. Although there were a few tears, he followed my advice and he's doing well in college. [He did however quit riding at age 8 except at camp even though he had a super pony - what did I do wrong there????]


So nice to see that you aren't shallow or anything.