PDA

View Full Version : Mare won't accept contact/Giraffe Syndrome


*JumpIt*
Jan. 21, 2009, 08:11 PM
I am riding this mare who is not mine but I am the only one working with her so I just about consider her mine. She is a 10 yr. old spastic OTTB chestnut mare. Her current owner is willing to give her away to anyone who would take her, if I could afford it I'd take her.

She has a huge attitude and boundless energy even though she is on SmartCalm Ultra and minimum grain. She failed event training (couldn't get comfortable cross country) and she has a terrible jump, flat and deer-like. Though I am a hunt seat rider I think that dressage maybe might be our last chance at finding a discipline that she can feel confident in, otherwise she'll end up as a pasture puff.

We've been working on moving forward off the leg without exploding and that has gotten better. At the trot she will become relaxed and softer after a while of a lot of trotting but as soon as we canter her head goes up (giraffe syndrome) and she gets upside down. Then when we trot it take forever to get her head down and her to relax again.

She gets very fussy and pissy when you take up anything more than the minimal amount of contact, she also tries to get her tongue over the bit whenever she feels stressed.

How is the best way to approach a horse like this? Should I insist on the contact?

I hope to start taking dressage lessons with this mare but currently I can't afford it as my own horse comes first.

Here is a video of her trotting, this was after 45 minutes of hard work in the middle of the summer (she never runs out of energy). This is the closest thing to relaxing and sorta accepting a minimal amount of contact.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=94MwGk8fGxw&feature=channel_page

This is a video from when she was jumping. What you can see of her canter in this video is how it is all the time, head up and back hollow.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwddUZX0iPs&feature=channel

All tack fits her fine, no pain anywhere. Her owner has given up on her but I haven't yet.

johnnysauntie
Jan. 21, 2009, 10:33 PM
Upside down neck, hollow back, tongue over the bit, lots of fussiness and reluctance to accept contact - welcome to my life. I have an OTTB too and while he's much mellower than your girl sounds, we have some of the same challenges.

We are making progress. We started by working on strength and flexibility. I call it 'horse yoga." Gentle walk work, flexing this way and that, a little shoulder in, just a bit, serpentines, bending.

We're also working very hard on building correct top line muscles, and ground work - such as longing in side reins - is helping. As he gets stronger and more flexible, he's better able to carry himself - and when he rounds down, he's more likely to take some contact.

At the same time, I'm working hard on my balance and quieting my hands. That's part of the problem, without a doubt.

It takes time, but then suddenly you'll have a lovely ride on what seems like a different horse. At that point, you just have to focus on not falling off out of sheer surprise!

good luck!

celeste08
Jan. 21, 2009, 10:38 PM
She really does not look that bad on the videos! Very cute mare! The trot is a little quick. with horses like that I find you have to almost go too slow at the trot to get them to give their back and do lots of bending and counter bending, also to help the back to soften. Have you tried lunging first so she can get rid of some of her extra energy and relax in her back? Could help maybe. Don't give up on her, you two look very nice together, and these kind of horses may be more complicated at first but they also are the ones that become brilliant when you find the way in...

slc2
Jan. 21, 2009, 10:46 PM
She isn't bad at all, she's just going the way she's ridden. Riding lessons. She's just hacking around and putting her head where she wants to put it. An instructor can show you how to get her going to the bit better. You don't really ever bend her, in the neck or body; she needs to bend, stretch down (with a contact, not as a trick with loose reins). Correct leg yields, getting her rounder, even a little deep to stretch her back. Lessons.

BaroquePony
Jan. 21, 2009, 10:53 PM
The advice given so far is excellent.

i would like to ad that hill work, at the walk or maybe the trot, is excellent for getting any horse to lower it's head and neck because they have to use them on hills, especially going up hill. The steeper the hill, the better.

As far as getting her tongue over the bit I would use one of those rubber bit gaurds that actually have a middle section that runs up the center of the face and attaches to the top of your crown piece between the ears. I forget what its actually called, but they are used on race horses and steeplechasers a lot. They hold the bit in place.

I like them for starting young horses because they can't pick the bit up and fiddle with it too much.

J-Lu
Jan. 22, 2009, 01:13 AM
The videos don't look too bad, but then you say that this is after 45 min of hard work in the hot sun. Hmmmmmm, wonder what the first 45 min. were like.

Any idea how long she raced or what her riding/training was like between the track and you? How well does the owner ride?

I would not insist on contact with a horse like this...instead, I would insist that she listen to your seat and leg. head in the air? so what?! I'd focus on tuning her into your seat and leg through exercises like turn on the forehand, leg yield at walk and then trot, spiraling circles, serpentines, etc. Again...giraffe head? Who cares. As long as her shoulders and hind legs are responding to your requests, that's the important thing. Reward the effort with a pat or a walk break or by stopping the riding session. Once you have her hind end listening to you, the rest will come more easily.

When she realizes that it is easier to use her back during these exercises, her head will come down and she'll accept the contact better. If you make NO FUSS at all with her face, she'll learn that picking a fight or bracing against the bit no longer elicits a tug-of-war or a fight with the rider, or a way to get out of work, or isn't the unpleasant experience it was in the past. Then, she'll start to gain trust in the contact. If you reward her when she releases to the bit with a nice pat with the inside hand and a soothing word, she'll understand what you want and feel calmer about it. Rewarding for good effort is a much better training approach (much faster result) than waiting until the horse gets tired. Frequent releases of the inside rein (move hand forward and then pick up the contact again) can do alot to soften horses who have contact issues. Try it.

I would also not rule out back problems. Are you SURE that the tack fits OK? Are you SURE that there is no underlying back or neck problem that could be causing this? The four most resistant horses I ever met to going on the bit were diagnosed with 1 and 2) a degenerative bone issue in the spine and 3) an injury at the base of the neck that probably happened as a foal (before the owner purchased the horse) that would affect her "throughness" the rest of her life and 4) very bad training early on that resulted in the horse flipping over while restrained in one of those rope training devices. In other words, each horse had a reason for it's resistance. It is worth investigating with a fine-tooth comb to find the root of her issues.

J.

goeslikestink
Jan. 22, 2009, 03:33 AM
The videos don't look too bad, but then you say that this is after 45 min of hard work in the hot sun. Hmmmmmm, wonder what the first 45 min. were like.

Any idea how long she raced or what her riding/training was like between the track and you? How well does the owner ride?

I would not insist on contact with a horse like this...instead, I would insist that she listen to your seat and leg. head in the air? so what?! I'd focus on tuning her into your seat and leg through exercises like turn on the forehand, leg yield at walk and then trot, spiraling circles, serpentines, etc. Again...giraffe head? Who cares. As long as her shoulders and hind legs are responding to your requests, that's the important thing. Reward the effort with a pat or a walk break or by stopping the riding session. Once you have her hind end listening to you, the rest will come more easily.

When she realizes that it is easier to use her back during these exercises, her head will come down and she'll accept the contact better. If you make NO FUSS at all with her face, she'll learn that picking a fight or bracing against the bit no longer elicits a tug-of-war or a fight with the rider, or a way to get out of work, or isn't the unpleasant experience it was in the past. Then, she'll start to gain trust in the contact. If you reward her when she releases to the bit with a nice pat with the inside hand and a soothing word, she'll understand what you want and feel calmer about it. Rewarding for good effort is a much better training approach (much faster result) than waiting until the horse gets tired. Frequent releases of the inside rein (move hand forward and then pick up the contact again) can do alot to soften horses who have contact issues. Try it.

I would also not rule out back problems. Are you SURE that the tack fits OK? Are you SURE that there is no underlying back or neck problem that could be causing this? The four most resistant horses I ever met to going on the bit were diagnosed with 1 and 2) a degenerative bone issue in the spine and 3) an injury at the base of the neck that probably happened as a foal (before the owner purchased the horse) that would affect her "throughness" the rest of her life and 4) very bad training early on that resulted in the horse flipping over while restrained in one of those rope training devices. In other words, each horse had a reason for it's resistance. It is worth investigating with a fine-tooth comb to find the root of her issues.

J.


echo and when checking tack that includes the bridle if the bits to low it will bang on her teeth or she wll get her tongue over the bit and the horse will hollow up to advade the bit
you need to use the half halt stride which wll inform the horse that something going to change ie going from a faster pace to a more collected one or visa versa
which is used in all disiplines the half halt stride is you freind of a apce along with trot
use the full length of the areana working the horse from butt to poll to a relaxed yaw
and lenghtening and shortening your strides and in between each transition using the half halt stride check here for useful information and how to perform the half halt stride
also read the 1st 3 links as its all to do with bits and fixtures bits and bridles or bit advassions -- bits are only severe as the hands that use them
plus try and remeber if this horse has been raced as you think then her training is of one to go as they teach them to run they do not understand do not do dressage schooling or any flat work schoolinng they are get up and get out and go
so no one at this time is understanding this mare and like most people give up as they dont know
1-- the tack you using if she is an x race horse and been running
is very different to a racing saddle a- its heavier - b- it lays differently on her back
2- a rider is different to a jockey- a-- depends on weight as jockeys have a weight limit
b- the rider plus saddle are different on a horses back
so in conclusion the mussles arent used the same way from nromal riding to racing
and a normal saddle and rider can cause pressure points on a horses back due to the fact that the horse needs time off to be retrianed to build mussles up in his/her back to be able to compensate for the extra weight and mussles used
i would always start a horse of long reining with a engllish saddle so the horse adjusts and starts building mussles in his back to compensate the extra weight and different position of where that saddle lays same to if it was a western saddle as again its different
by working the horse on long reins helps the horse to become balanced and to understand basic commands and signals forwards and straight also builds up the top line

by lengthening and shortening your stride using the full lenght of then areana helps the horse to become balanced straight and forwards using an independant seat light soft hands and secure leg


then i would start the horse of onbaisc exercises as mentioned half halts in walk then in trot then mix the two then canter then mix all paces before i attemped jumping
the horse in question might not know these things which its the owners job to educate him or her and whe they dont do xyz they give up but dont blame the horse but blame the onwer or rider as the horse doesnt know
look here http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=178116

*JumpIt*
Jan. 22, 2009, 06:58 AM
Thanks for all of the great advice you all have given me a lot to work with.

I don't know her full history, I believe she raced til she was 4, I don't know what she did directly after racing, then she went to a polo farm (she failed that too), her current owner bought her when she was druged up and supposedly an angel. Her current owner is my trainer's mother who really should not have bought a horse like this. My trainer worked with her for a while then bought her own horse so she didn't have time for her. She then went to an Event trainer and I think that trainer tried to "force" the contact and I understand that the mare went "up" on her (she's always be lite on her front end) and that trainer refused to work with her anymore.

I would love to do a full vet workup on her but her owner won't put any more money into her (other than neccesities) and I can't afford it. I am positive that it is not a tack issue as she is the same exact way on the lunge.

rileyt
Jan. 22, 2009, 07:58 AM
This is a nice mare, and I expected much worse from your description.

I agree with most of what has been said, but I think you're really thinking about this the wrong way, and it is the root of your problem.

Are you sitting in a chair while you read this? Try this... push your lower back out (i.e., "round" your back). Now hollow your lower back (make in an "arch"). Do it again.

Don't read on until you've done it. Have you done it?

OK, now do it again, and notice what you do with your head and neck when you round your back vs when you arch it... I bet you 10 to 1 you "lowered" your head when you rounded your back, and raised it when you arched it.

The horse's muscles are different than ours, but the principal is the same... when the BACK comes up, the head WILL go down. Its a matter of biomechanics. I have NEVER seen a horse with a lifted/rounded back going around like a giraffe... NEVER. And this horse is locked in her shoulders (i.e., the energy she is producing behind is going in all directions, except the most important one: forward and through the TOP of her back).

So stop worrying about her head, and start riding her back. At the very beginning of the trot tape, I think I hear someone say, "Good, now release your hands". I disagree with this, and it sounds like the standard hunter instruction. (I'm really not trying to bash hunters, but I've done them long enough myself to have some thoughts about the instruction). Hunter trainers all too often focus on the head position, which they believe can be achieved by a softened hand.

Its not "wrong," necessarily, (although I don't agree with it), but I think this is an example of the type of horse that it doesn't work terribly well with. If you can find a good trainer, and even take 2-3 lessons from her where she will teach you what it feels like to ride the back up, I think you will be off and running with this mare. You're a good enough rider, I'd really try to find a GOOD dressage trainer to help you learn how to ride her back up.

As for her temperment, you would be amazed at what riding through the back will help her with. Once you can unlock her, her rhythm will improve, and I think you'll see a totally new horse. I've known and ridden a number of ex-racers and tense event horses... and the root of it all is in their back. (They may never be a bomb-proof horse...but still). When you can unlock that, they will almost always relax, and you'll have a different horse on your hands.

dalpal
Jan. 22, 2009, 08:01 AM
She isn't bad at all, she's just going the way she's ridden. Riding lessons. She's just hacking around and putting her head where she wants to put it. An instructor can show you how to get her going to the bit better. You don't really ever bend her, in the neck or body; she needs to bend, stretch down (with a contact, not as a trick with loose reins). Correct leg yields, getting her rounder, even a little deep to stretch her back. Lessons.


I agree with SLC. Slow your post down and see if she'll bring her back up to you. Right now she is a "leg traveler"....meaning, she's running her legs off and not using her back at all.

To me, she looks like she gets pissey when she gets too fast and looses her balance.

Very cute girl....just see if you can slow her tempo down and get her to actually think about using her back.

We have one at the farm right now....same scenerio....once the young rider slowed herself down, he came to her.

I think the problem for OTTBs in general.....alot of people buy these horses off the track because of their price......they haven't a clue how to rehab/retrain one....they get on and immediately start riding the horse as if it knows what all the aids means....totally confuses the horse, thus creating a quick, tight horse who is totally confused. Add to the scenerio, the fact that many people do not let them have time off, don't understand how to properly feed them (not talking to the OP, just in general...just a sore spot with me after witnessing what has happened to the one that I know)....put all of this together and then people just decide that they are "hyper", "stupid", "crazy", "dangerous"...when, in reality, they are simply confused and trying to to figure out what the rider is asking them to do......these horses spend the first part of their lives learning that contact and leg mean RUN.......so when the next rider (whether it be dressage/hunter, etc) gets on and thinks that the horse is "broke" because a jockey sat on it......they don't know what to do or go about retraining the horse......then the horse goes through a series of owners/riders.....everyone trying to do their own thing to get the poor thing to work. I wonder how many OTTBs actually do end up in the hands of a professional/knowledagble trainer when they are bought off the track.

Once again, not picking on the OP, just saying that I think in general, this is what causes the TB stereotype.

When you see pictures of our COTH members who have these wonderful 3rd, fourth level (or higher) OTTBs...you know these horses aren't crazy, stupid, or pissey.....they are capable in the right hands.

slc2
Jan. 22, 2009, 08:19 AM
I think since race horses are trained to run when the contact is taken up, the natural tendency of those who try to retrain them, is to drop the contact to get them to slow down.

And it works. It's what we used to call 'stabilized' - they're taught to hack on a loose rein, like a hunter. Rather than actually being trained that leg, seat and contact now mean something completely different, a compromise is cut with the horse, and to one degree or another, the rider is at the mercy of the horse, and the horse remains confused. When it goes slower its back goes down MORE, and its head comes up more.

Then we go from a horse that accepts a contact, along with the deal that it needs to be going forward, usually with the back very flat, to a horse that doesn't accept the contact, can't figure out why it isn't being allowed to gallop like it's supposed to (even though the rider's leg is all over his side telling him to go), and that's a horse that's pretty confused.

Especially if the horse is sore in his back to start with, which they often are, as horses are generally sore in the back whenever they're sore in the legs, which is often why they're taken OFF the track, if they AREN'T sore in the back they soon will be as the rider is now sitting down on their back and they have no back muscle.

The contact they now see as just plain old inconsistent, first of all, they can't FIND it....mare in vid keeps putting her head up and down, and what's really funny is how SLOW she moves her head, so you can see she's REALLY trying to think about it and trying different things - 'should i put my head up? where's the hand? i don't know...i'll go look for it again....damn...where did it go? What am I supposed to be doing here?'

She actually looks like she's trying to make up her own stretching exercises!

With a horse that's tight in the back after years of being that way you may find they need to warm up a LOT in stretching work - just going around all the time in the same position, or plunging their head down with the reins loose, doesn't get at the problem. Nor does making them go with their head down all the time fix the problem. They have to be up in the normal position, carryign the rider with the back muscles, then put their head down and stretch those muscles - while the head is down they aren't carrying the rider in the same way - all they're doing is stretching the muscles, that's why yo udon't hav ethem strech ALL THE TIME...

And I would bet you a lot of money her very fast running around for the first 45 min is because she is off balance, and isn't getting a hand with that.

The more off balance they are the more they run around. Then, after 45 minutes, they get tired, but believe me, they still aren't happy. They're just tired.

And the leg is telling them to go but they are then told, 'oh no, don't go that fast', and it's a wonder they're as quiet as they ARE! I'd be thoroughly pissed if it was me.

The solution is not to stabilize them (like you have done with this mare), but to actually reteach them. You can start by rubbing your legs all over her sides for 5 rides or more. Walk and do nothing but that for those rides, rub your leg all over her. Drop the reins and walk her on the buckle, and let her figure it out. 'My leg on you does not any more mean you have to run.'

The next thing is to stop 'floating' the rein, and having her stretch, reach the bit and hold it with a contact. A riding instructor can help with that. A 'passive' hand that just tries to meet where the horse happens to put its head is NOT a contact or a connection. An actual pushing the horse to the bit and keeping him there is what works, and what you're not doing.

This horse will teach you how to ride better than any other horse you ever put a leg over. She's very smart,, and she's trying to tell you alot.

foxhavenfarm
Jan. 22, 2009, 08:23 AM
She needs to learn long and low, but that could take some time. It would help unlock her shoulder and lengthen her stride. You've already gotten some really good advice, you just have to figure out what works for her.

Her jumping could also be improved as well with the right gymnastics.

I think she is very cute. If she doesn't work out for you, you can just send her to me. :winkgrin:

Posting Trot
Jan. 22, 2009, 09:18 AM
I too thought that the video showed me a very cute mare.

Great advice so far. Forget about the head. Work her to make her stronger through the back and more balanced and the acceptance of the bit will come. I'd also say forget about the tongue over the bit. Get a good dentist out there to float her teeth and check for any cracks, etc., but acceptance of the bit will come when she gets comfortable.

I'd also say hack her out of the ring at least once a week. TBs get bored easily and fussing with the bit can be one way they deal with the boredom.

Also, and don't take this the wrong way, drop the adjectives like "spastic." Although you may have meant it in a somewhat endearing way (maybe?), the way you talk and think about a horse is going to consciously or unconsciously leach into the way you work with them. If you really think so little of the horse to call her spastic, then you're not going to do your best by the horse.

JMHO.

Cheers and good luck.

Icecapade
Jan. 22, 2009, 09:38 AM
:lol::lol:

I was expecting my Arab giraffe impression. I can see the strip forehead to nose when he is pissed. Talk about inverted.

She looks like she is hurried and rushed... but not nearly as bad as you thought. I'd love to have her... but my guy is all I an handle right now.

I would definitly encourage retraining no matter how slow you think it is. I know thats very hard with a horse you can actually ride..

that and one of the crucial things that soooo many people I see at my barn who are complaining about avoidance or aggressive behavior are totally missing...

good ground work. Be able to move your horse on the ground, I don't mean NH stuff or anything specific... just be able to confidently and assertively tell you horse where you want to go... many times issues can be solved if you go back to when I do this, I expect this from you... and I want these feet to move this way...

its amazing how useful it is!

Best of luck!

*JumpIt*
Jan. 22, 2009, 10:00 AM
Ok I just want to make sure I understand everything because I want to do my best for this horse.

I should ignore the head and work on the back. I think we will work a lot on walk/trot and just leave out the canter for a while until she settles and accepts steady contact, hopefully if we can build up her back muscles at the w/t she'll easily step up to a relaxed canter.

What I'll work on is keeping a steady (but not too lite or too heavy) contact and letting her work out her own feel of the bit. I need to slow my post and help her just relax and realize that she doesn't need to work so hard. Moving her forward (not fast) off my leg but not resisting in her mouth.

I guess what I meant by "spastic" is that she is extremely sensitive (to everything) and expresses her sensitivities in a spastic manner. I dearly love her and all of her quirks, I just want her to have a good home and chance at life.

I know I'm not the best rider but I am the only one willing to work with the mare and I am willing to learn and do anything for her.

foxhavenfarm - Literally if you want her you can have her. Just let me know and I can get you in touch with the right person to talk with.

Justmyluck
Jan. 22, 2009, 10:10 AM
What I worked for my guy is lunging! I'm gonna get in trouble for this lunge her with side reins and the line attacked to the bit, if your sure shes not gonna run away from you. Lunge her in small circles, shes 10 she can hand it. Play with the line as you step into her hip and drive her forward. The smaller circles and inside pressure on the bit will make her bend. Make sure her head is is towards you though if she is looking to the outside she will not stretch down. As she accepts the bend after a two weeks or so you can slowly let the line out and let her work on carrying herself on a larger circle.

Once she can master a larger circle and is stretching down into the contact of the side reins ask her to canter, on the larger circles, as she gets better in the large circle pull her into smaller circles.

Now you wont do this every day but before you ride her is a good idea, if you ride every day lunge every other day or so. You have to get her to bend.

If you have a lunging question feel free to PM.

Also I do agree that a lot of it stems from your riding.

merrygoround
Jan. 22, 2009, 10:54 AM
At the trot I see a rather attractive mare ridden by a rider whose hands go up and down as she posts. I also see a lower leg that floats in turns, and an outside lower leg that doesn't support through the turn. BTW that video doesn' show a true "stargazer"

I played the canter video 3-4 times, the mare is quick, and even after watching that many times, possibly because of the angle, it wasn't possible for me to discern either her form or yours at the canter. But again, far from being an inverted horse, they have their nose on the horizontal.

I absolutely agree that a great deal can be accomplished by getting some instruction. Even if it's only monthly.

boosma47
Jan. 22, 2009, 11:12 AM
I love what I see in this mare. She is powerful, nicely put together ... and sensitive.

The suggestions here are excellent. Slowing yourself down and draping down and around her will help, as will a lot of slow, back to front work through transitions. You can help her relax through her back by loosening up your hips, engaging your core muscles, keeping your balance and letting her stretch into your hands. Created energy is not fast, but useful and directed. Show her where you want her to be with your body, then let her find that place.

I suspect she has always been bold, and no one ever showed her anything but hurry.

I wouldn't hesitate to try her as a jumper - after the basic work is done. I think her form will improve with gymnastic riding, flat and fences, strengthening her back, and being shown she doesn't need to rush.

Good luck with her!

meupatdoes
Jan. 22, 2009, 03:35 PM
Try to work on a lateral (side to side) as opposed to a longitudinal (up and down over the back and neck) yield.

Think of riding two lines of the horse: the inside edge and the outside edge.
You should be able to push the inside edge toward the outside edge at whim.

In simple terms this means putting inside leg on, and asking the horse to yield to the pressure by stepping away from her inside shoulder toward your outside aids and under your outside hip.

The horse should remain politely under your seat and not get faster as she yields.

First turn early up the quarterline, open your inside hand to see the inside nostril, outside hand and leg hold the outside line parallel, and then you nudge her over with the inside leg.
Then do circles where she "fishtails" a little: haunches make a wider track than the front end.
You should feel like you can get her to sweep easily away from your leg.

Once you have the lateral yield, you "own the spine".
You will be able to quickly
1.) detect
and 2.) defuse
any tension or "energy blocks" by asking for a touch of lateral yield.

Eventually you can go down the longside asking for her to push up against one leg, and then the other in a true flex/counter flex routine. (Make sure she is bending in her spine and not just at the poll.)


Eventually, you can use the lateral yield to get the longitudinal yield.
This involves taking up a steady contact, and asking for lateral yield until the horse softens both laterally and longitudinally.
If she gets resistant, throws the head up, and tries to grab the reins back, hang on tight and get very INSISTENT about the lateral yield. She must now make a SWEEPING circle away from the inside leg, etc.

The second she relaxes keep your contact at the pre-resistance level and ease up on the level of lateral pressure you put on her and let life get easy again.

But you will get nowhere until you can deftly move the spine from pushing up against one 'edge' of the horse to the other.
There's your ticket.

Ambrey
Jan. 22, 2009, 03:45 PM
http://www.barnmice.com/profiles/blogs/1773158:BlogPost:48238

This is a start to what Jane Savoie does to relax tense horses. She talks a lot more about it on her Dressage Mentor (subscription) site.

Just thought I'd share :)

BornToRide
Jan. 22, 2009, 04:16 PM
Never insist on contact . That usually back fires - you offer it and the horse takes it.

Even though you think it is not tack, it could still be unless you've already tried a gazillion bits on her for example. Even try bitless - in some cases this is what it took!

If you have a horse like this consider any of the following, if you have not already:

Teeth problems
Wrong bit or saddle fit issues (try bareback if safe)
Ulcers so the horse won't use abs correctly
Ovarian issues
EPSM or RER
Selenium deficiency
Pelvic misalignments
Other joint issues behind
Stiffness in the sacro-iliac joint, which looks like she may have
Hoof imbalances

SisterToSoreFoot
Jan. 23, 2009, 09:26 AM
I agree with SLC about the "floating rein." I'm working with an inverted horse as well--a thick necked high-set neck Morgan. To get him to lengthen his frame and accept contact, he needs to stretch down and out, reaching for the rein. The long & low work will help also help your mare relax and build the carrying power needed for proper contact. She needs to come all the way down before coming up again. As SLC said, lessons with a dressage trainer will help both you and her learn this critical step. But once she does realize she can move freely forward with a relaxed back, you will be well on your way to a different horse.