Who wants to compare & contrast? Apiro vs Banderas

[Iron Horse Farm]

Just running some options for a young mare who is Contendro I/Voltaire/Wellington.

Since neither have foals on the ground, could we talk about who has a better jump and better pedigree for the big jumps? It looks like Apiro is being marketed for hunters, but is there a jumper there too? Also, temperament, temperament, temperament!

Thanks!

http://www.dreamscapefarm.com/HorseDetail.aspx?ID=289

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/apiro.html

[JB]

Apiro has at least 3 crops on the ground :)

[Nikki^]

Having seen Apiro I can say that he has a very good temperament. He's such a ham and loves the camera.
He is just lovely to watch in the ring and his movement is gorgeous. He also has excellent form over the fences. He's a lovely stallion.:D

[showjumpers66]

I'll stay out of this debate since I am biased :lol:, but we did have the opportunity to shoot video of 5 Apiro offspring in Germany. His oldest will be 4 this year. Except for the 2 year old stallion, these were long 3 year olds just started undersaddle, so are very green but they all had natural lead changes, were quiet and easy, and were good with their knees over fences.

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/Video/ApiroProgeny5.wmv

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/Video/ApiroProgeny1.wmv

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/Video/ApiroProgeny2.wmv

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/Video/ApiroProgeny3.wmv

http://www.silvercreeksporthorses.com/Video/ApiroProgeny4.wmv

[Signature]

It's so hard to compare because Banderas is only 2 years old (or coming 3) and Apiro is older and out showing in the big divisions, plus like folks mentioned, has had several foal crops.

Banderas looks quite interesting but I think has to go through stallion testing and so forth to obtain approval (someone correct me if I'm wrong) - which shouldn't be an issue as nice as he looks, BUT, Apiro is a fully approved stallion with a show record already. Just very hard to do a real comparison; each is very nice! As far as breeding, both are stocked with big names in the pedigree. If your mare is Contendro/Voltaire, she should not need even MORE jump? :)

[Nootka]

wow showjumper.. your boy has some nice babies! I think you may have sold me:yes:

[Amoroso]

I think Banderas is going to be a stallion to watch in the next few years, the Balou/Grannus/Beach Boy combination is great. I'm seriously considering breeding one of our mares to him this year because with Dreamscape Farm behind him I think he'll go in the right direction. It is tricky with younger stallions, sometimes it can play off to be ahead of the breeding curve. It is always great to have off age (riding age) offspring just when a stallion starts to take off, but it is always a gamble....especially on the first foal crop.

In comparing the two, I agree it is more difficult given the age difference. However, to me, Banderas looks to be more short coupled, which I prefer over Apiro.

[DownYonder]

It's so hard to compare because Banderas is only 2 years old (or coming 3) and Apiro is older and out showing in the big divisions, plus like folks mentioned, has had several foal crops.

Banderas looks quite interesting but I think has to go through stallion testing and so forth to obtain approval (someone correct me if I'm wrong) - which shouldn't be an issue as nice as he looks, BUT, Apiro is a fully approved stallion with a show record already. Just very hard to do a real comparison; each is very nice! As far as breeding, both are stocked with big names in the pedigree. If your mare is Contendro/Voltaire, she should not need even MORE jump? :)

Banderas is a 3 y/o this year and is licensed for Oldenburg breeding. He will need to meet his performance requirements by the end of his 6 y/o year (2012) to keep his license. Any foals sired in the meantime out of approved mares are eligible for regular registration papers.

You are right, though, that it is hard to do a fair comparison between Banderas and Apiro since Apiro is 6 years older, is fully approved and has met the performance requirements, has a show record and foals on the ground. Both stallions have great pedigrees, though, for producing hunter or jumper type foals.

[Iron Horse Farm]

I am just in love with the bloodlines. I bred to Gragenit years ago because I sooo love the Grannus influence. Yes, this mare (2006) will probably be a jumping machine, but we don't want to breed any of the jump out of her and both of these stallions bring "all jump" to the table. I have heard that Apiro has uncommonly good temperament and I don't believe that Jennifer would have imported anything that has anything less.

Forgot to mention that she is already 17 hands at 2 1/2 and I don't want a "monster" from her!

[goodmorning]

Banders looks like a nice prospect - though I'd like to see a conformation photo of him, but agree that the Grannus/Beach Boy is a nice addition to Balou.

[Oakstable]

Holly,
Since size is an issue, take a look at For Play.

He's in my area so I am going to visit him, either at his home or out at Thermal if he is showing.

[Iron Horse Farm]

Oooh Sally, let me know what you think and if it would be possible, snap a couple of headshots! I like his bloodlines too, but I must confess that I don't know a lot about him. You know that I value your opinion!

[Oakstable]

I emailed the owner to see if he is showing at Thermal. I need to go to Thermal anyway, haven't been there since they moved HITS from Indio.

Otherwise I'll go to the owner's farm.... guessing it might be an hour's drive, if that.

I think he has some foals coming so I would like to see some babies too.

[sixpoundfarm]

Holly,
Since size is an issue, take a look at For Play.

He's in my area so I am going to visit him, either at his home or out at Thermal if he is showing.

There is a thread going for this fellow, I think there is a link to photos.

http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=186099

[belle5429]

I also am interested in both stallions, both are very nice. I was interested and seeing if people have seen any TB crosses with Apiro? I have a very nice TB hunter that I would like to breed in the next year or so, either with a surragate or she will carry it. She is small 15.2 refined body, and has an dished TB head. I have talked to a few people about breeding her and they suggested to look for a stallion that is not too bulky, I don't want to go too big as far as the stallion is concerned max height 16.2 if she is carrying the foal. Any breeders have suggestions as to good crosses on her body type? Any success stories on crosses on smaller TB mares? Thanks!

[DLee]

I also am interested in both stallions, both are very nice. I was interested and seeing if people have seen any TB crosses with Apiro? I have a very nice TB hunter that I would like to breed in the next year or so, either with a surragate or she will carry it. She is small 15.2 refined body, and has an dished TB head. I have talked to a few people about breeding her and they suggested to look for a stallion that is not too bulky, I don't want to go too big as far as the stallion is concerned max height 16.2 if she is carrying the foal. Any breeders have suggestions as to good crosses on her body type? Any success stories on crosses on smaller TB mares? Thanks!

Here is my 2010 at ten days old, Apiro out of my Tb mare, although she's not necessarily all that small. I know he's a little young :lol:, but that's all I've got. :)

[Summit Springs Farm]

Our Apiro offspring only 14 hours old in the shot, of course he's obnly 18 hours old now!;)http://www.facebook.com/ProEquest?sk=wall#!/photo.php?fbid=1397031161852&set=t.100001329914984&type=1&theater

[EquusMagnificus]

Apiro is said to cross best with TB mares or refined mares. :)

[Oakstable]

In case you haven't see the Apiro colt out of a Landkoenig mare, I have photos in my blog. I'm not the owner. He is owned by a friend on the Central Coast of California.

Spectacular colt.

No. 1 foal in 2010 for RPSI.

[florida foxhunter]

I've got a friend who's been researching jumper breeding. She's found that Pilot tends to make a hotter horse.......right? So I'm surprised Aprio is so quiet.
She's been researching for a stallion to calm her Power/Pilot mare and Aprio certainly is lovely......but wouldn't going to Aprio with Pilot on both sides, risk being hotter?

[allanglos]

Banders looks like a nice prospect - though I'd like to see a conformation photo of him, but agree that the Grannus/Beach Boy is a nice addition to Balou.

http://www.shnpayback.org/stallions/banderas.xml

There are some here.

[Edgewood]

Jennifer posted some nice conformation photos of him on her FB page. He is really pretty

https://www.facebook.com/#!/media/set/fbx/?set=a.10150138977779502.339992.548609501

[TwoDreamRides]

I'll be happy to jump in on this come June.. we are expecting 1 by Apiro and 1 by Banderas, both out of Thoroughbred mares. I'll let you know what we get =]

[WDEquine]

I have a two year old by Apiro out of a GOV approved TB mare. He has a fantastic personality; a real ham, curious, clever, into everything but sensible and kind. He has been easy to start groundwork/ponying, and was exceptionally behaved at his first breed show last month. He even won his class! He has great feet, conformation, bone, and, to my chagrin, he jumps three-railers already. A very nice young horse...

[silanac]

I bred my hanoverian mare by Regazzoni to Apiro back in April. I did tons of research before i selected a stallion. Apiro did the jumpers in Germany before being imported to the states. He has a fantastic temperament, great jump and a strong hind end. Seems to be naturally balanced and really stamps his foals with his physique. He has a very rhythmic stride as well, and seeing some of his older babies that are 4,5,6 years old now seem to inherit that.

[kokoda]

I'll be happy to jump in on this come June.. we are expecting 1 by Apiro and 1 by Banderas, both out of Thoroughbred mares. I'll let you know what we get =]

Sooooo ... is it show and tell time??? Have some photos to share with us to see how these two boys did with your girls?? Inquiring minds want to know. :winkgrin:

[TwoDreamRides]

I wish!!! The Apiro baby was absorbed. So now we have 2 Banderas babies (1 2010, 1 2011) and no Apiro baby to compare to... So much for being helpful!

[Dutch]

I can't speak for Apiro, but here are some pictures of my 2010
colt, Faust NSN, by Banderas out of Never Say Never (Wanroij x Milkie XXA), taken last year. If the size of the buck has anything to say about jumping ability, this guy should be able to go all the way. He is extremely athletic with great balance.

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l98/mhaley1010/Faust%20NSN%20by%20Banderas/DSC_0001.jpg
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l98/mhaley1010/Faust%20NSN%20by%20Banderas/DSC_0079.jpg
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l98/mhaley1010/Faust%20NSN%20by%20Banderas/DSC_0075-1.jpg
http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l98/mhaley1010/Faust%20NSN%20by%20Banderas/DSC_0078-1.jpg

[EquusMagnificus]

I have an Apiro this year out of an Oldenburg mare (albeit 50% TB)...

Great match. :yes:

Baby is athletic, quiet, baby boy... He'll be a great horse for his (most-likely) amateur rider. :)

Pics:
http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150184985709171.321596.320210999170

Apiro really needs a mare with some TB or a TB mare. He produces BIG.

I have a Banderas on the way for next year, so if this thread gets bumped again, I'll report back! ;)

[JB]

Dutch, that first picture made me gasp! What a beauty!!

EM - love!

[Dutch]

Thanks JB! He sold as a stallion prospect, so here's hoping he makes it. I am expecting a full sibling in 2012.

I don't think Banderas generally passes on size, but my mare does. He does pass on a great temperament, athleticism, and if my colt is any indication, very good jumping technique.

[EquusMagnificus]

Thanks JB! :winkgrin:

Agreed, Dutch's boy is drop dead gorgeous. :yes: Fingers crossed for you that he makes to stallion-dom!

I hope my Banderas comes out as nice as Dutch's... :winkgrin:

At least this year I have a chance at something else than chestnut in the colour department!

[kokoda]

I wish!!! The Apiro baby was absorbed. So now we have 2 Banderas babies (1 2010, 1 2011) and no Apiro baby to compare to... So much for being helpful!

I'm so sorry re: the Apiro foal :no: but there's always next year, right?

What do you think of your Banderas foals?? Pictures??

[Jumper_girl221]

I have a Banderas o/o a TB mare, the chrome fairy skipped over her though :p although her feet have started turning white recently :D

Here she is at 18 weeks old...she's massive, vet says she's one of the biggest 4 month old he's seen. Restricted from her dams feed, she was just shy of 13 hands at 16 weeks old.
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30977483&l=626f2bec3c&id=149402250

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30977482&l=b494858cc3&id=149402250

Next to her 16 hand dam
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30973584&l=489f7af496&id=149402250

She will be weaned after her inspection this weekend to try and slow her growth down.

I've been thrilled with her, she seems super easy going and great to handle on the ground, but does have a bit of sass. Figured bathing out nicely and will drink out of the hose, and was great for the clippers this past weekend. Nice feet, straight-ish legs (we had some OATK that rejuvinaide took care of). Very brave and athletic, she jumped 4 different fences last weekend while her dam was being ridden (and I just happened to catch one with the camera).
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30973582&l=f5061872a7&id=149402250

I wish I could have caught the 2'3" culvert, or even my barrels, she was NICE over those, perfect tight knees! But at least it shows she wants to do what she was bred for! I wasn't too thrilled about the stress on those legs though, last time she got to stand in the center of the ring like a nice girl and watch mommy and learn patience!


Here she is at 8 weeks after her first bath.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2dADi79S7ek

[Hillside H Ranch]

I haven't had any Apiro foals, but I've had two Banderas colts. I have really liked them and would breed to him again. Here is this year's colt, at 2 1/2 months of age, out of my Lonely Boy/Monsun ox mare.

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l31/HillsideHRanch/BenicioAug16Confo2.jpg

http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l31/HillsideHRanch/BenicioAug16Confo.jpg

[TwoDreamRides]

To be entirely honest - we don't have great photos of either. I am the family photographer but based out of Atlanta, while our breeding operation is based in Canada. I have their original foal photos taken by my aunt. The fillies are full sisters and both blessed by the chrome fairy =]

They are both being presented to RPSI on Sept 18, and I will definitely update all with photos & comments on the 19th =]

See if these work... if not & you happen to be on facebook, search TimberRidge Sporthorses.

Brisa aka "Breezie", the 2010 filly
http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.462203281039.243514.307700991039#!/photo.php?fbid=462203286039&set=a.462203281039.243514.307700991039&type=1&theater

Bright As Day aka "Brandy", the 2011 filly
http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.10150356473631040.428990.307700991039&type=1#!/photo.php?fbid=10150345686151040&set=a.10150356473631040.428990.307700991039&type=1&theater

Both have the classic hunter look. I've got my eye on Brandy as my future hunter already ;) I really like Breezie also, but I think her neck might be a little bit coarse for what I prefer. Love the heads on both of them. They got their daddy's ears...

[winter]

This is an interesting thread as I now have an Apiro and a Banderas!

The Apiro is absolutely lovely. She is out of a Beach Boy x TB mare. The mare is probably 15.2, the yearling Apiro is close to that size now and has a ton of bone. Everyone is in love with her, she has his lovely eye and head. She moves very well with a ton of suspension but very flat and hunter-y. I am very excited about her. She has an interesting personality, she is very unflappable in that you can't chase, spook or startle her. She was also very shy and was nearly impossible to catch until this summer, and very cautious about people as a baby. She is very friendly now, and easy to work with, her one flaw is her 'unflappable' nature as it also makes her a little stubborn. I foresee spurs in her future ha ha. I like her very much and everyone who sees her ohs and ahs she has so much presence. I see the big hunter ring in her future (that's the hope anyhow).

My Banderas is out of a different mare. He is only a month old and we are equally in love with him. He is SO pretty. He is the prettiest foal I have ever seen, his head is so typey, so it's hard to see past that to his 'real' qualities. ;)
He seems small, but he is my only foal this year and they all seem small to me at that age. The mare is somewhat old-fashioned, not petite and not too tall, a little long. The foal is more short-coupled than the mare. The mare is a very good dressage mover, the foal also appears to have a lot of suspension and reach, with less knee than the mare (at a month old, so whatever that means). He is a very personable foal and very interested in people. I am very pleased with him as well, but time will tell of course as he grows!!

[bellaalexander]

Personally, i would not use either of those stallions on that mare. Holly, you should consider using frozen semen from an internationally proven stallion. contessa is worth that. not that apiro and banderas are bad stallions, but not proven producers in the big jumper ring.

[Fillyfolly]

I have a four-month old Banderas filly out of a small Popeye K mare (15.2 and a bit and quite fine). The filly is huge - at least 13 hands. The biggest of 8 on the farm - the rest are out of larger warmblood dams than mine. The filly is leggy and elegant and has a wonderful, big rhythmic canter. She is going to make someone a super hunter in a few years. Her temperament is exceptional - friendly, curious and so easy to work with. I wasn't going to breed again anytime soon but I'm so happy with her, my mare will have another date with Banderas in the spring.
http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2507687350102440549THDRRp
http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2984518510102440549INngBT
http://pets.webshots.com/photo/2743799650102440549eqQZTa