Matrix for New FEI Qualifications

[mjrtango93]

Anybody know where the matrix is for FEI competitions? There used to be one posted on useventing that listed what the qualifications were by CCI and CIC star level, but now I can't seem to find it. Thank you!

[SLR]

I think you'll find what you need on FEI website 2009 Rules for eventing pg. 18,19 and 20. Sorry I don't have the link handy, but printed off yesterday.

[gchildean]

go to www.fei.org and click on eventing and then on the rulles section.

[mjrtango93]

Thanks that was what I was looking for. For some reason I thought US Eventing had it on a neat little printable matrix like they do for registrations, but this will work.

[flutie1]

http://www.mauijimhorsetrials.org/CompetitorInfo/entry-info.htm

This has the "matrix" for CIC's.

[mjrtango93]

http://www.mauijimhorsetrials.org/CompetitorInfo/entry-info.htm

This has the "matrix" for CIC's.

Thanks Flutie that was exactly what I was looking for, now just to find one for CCI's. These are handy to laminate and pin in the office for entry fill out time.

[pegasusmom]

So. . . bear with me because I am slow. . . in qualifying for a CIC** can you substitute a CCI* for a CIC*?

[gchildean]

Yes, the rule states that in order to qualify for a CCI** you must have done 1 CCI* or 1* CIC** PLUS 1 CIC** or 2 CNC** (not sure waht that is). In other words, all he would need to do is 1 CIC** in order to qualify for a CCI**. I hope I made sence.

[gchildean]

OK now that I've read your question again I see now that I didn't answer it in the least bit. Sorry about that. It seems to state that you do need a CIC* in order to qualify to do a CIC**. It says nothing about a CCI* being able to be used instead. I would call USEF on that one. It sounds kinda dumb that NAJYRC wouldn't count.

[advmom]

The qualifications for a ClC ** are a min of 1 QR at either a ClC* or CNC **( which is essentially a National Int horse trial.
Given that NAYRC CCl * J requires more qualifications one would presume that a CCl* would qualify them assuming they also have the Int HT within three months done as well

[gchildean]

Not necessarily. If you used CIC* to qualify for NAJYRC than you would probably be OK (I'm not sure what the time line is) But If you only used a CCI* than you would stil be out of luck.

[NeverTime]

You just need your qualifying intermediate horse trials results. You DO NOT need to have done a CIC* to do a CIC**. The qualifications say you need one of those two qualifiers (CIC* or intermediate CNC), not both.
Seriously. I've never done a CIC* and my last CCI* was ... 2002? maybe? ... but I usually end up doing several CIC**s each year. It's not a problem as long as you've got the appropriate intermediate HT results.

[Geneva]

OK now that I've read your question again I see now that I didn't answer it in the least bit. Sorry about that. It seems to state that you do need a CIC* in order to qualify to do a CIC**. It says nothing about a CCI* being able to be used instead. I would call USEF on that one. It sounds kinda dumb that NAJYRC wouldn't count.Actually the rules state what you need to do AT MINIMUM. A CCI of a given level is objectively more demanding than a CIC of that star level, with higher qualifying requirements, thus serves as a qualifier the same as a CIC of that level. Article 506.4.4:Where a QR at a CIC is specified, one QR at a CCI of the same level is equally acceptable.

http://www.fei.org/Disciplines/Eventing/Rules/Documents/2009%20Rules%20Eventing%20after%20GA08.pdf

2 CNC** (not sure waht that is)
CN = concours national = a national event (USEF recognized instead of FEI recognized). CIC = concours international combiné or international (FEI recognized) horse trials, therefore CNC = concours national combiné, a national horse trials (USEF recognized instead of FEI recognized). Just as a CCN is the national counterpart of a CCI. Appendix A of the GRs outlines the various definitions.

[SLR]

From FEI Rules for Eventing 2009 " 4.5 Where a QR at a CIC is specified, one QR at a CCI of the same level is equally acceptable. "
This is giving me a headache. I'm trying to figure out when one has to requalify. If a rider is qualified in let's say 2008, but the qualifers were done in 2007 are they still OK for 2009 because the rider is established? and has the calendar year of 2007 plus the 2 succeeding calendar years? and does this count for championships? What if the qualifications become more stringent?
Dana BTW the CCI* Championship (NAJYRC) plus a CIC** counted as a qualifier for the CCI** last yr. :D

[gchildean]

Geneva, thank you for clarifying. Why does it have to be so darn complicated and wordy.

SLR - I have had so may questions about qualifying in the past my head is spinning also. For the longest time I thought it was a 12 month period. But we have a girl who qualified at VA last year (2008) but was unable to compete at NAJYRC this year. USEF said that she is still qualified for 2009 NAJYRC. So, I believe its more like a 20 month qualifying period. I'm sure somewhere it states exactly what the time frame is, I will look it up as soon as I get some time. You would think as a coordinator I could get my crap together, but it just seems like every time I figure one thing out something else comes up.

[SLR]

Gwen Qualifying results for Championships are " the calendar year in question and the preceding calendar year" I get that, but if you are already qualified, I think you have 2 years..... maybe, maybe not. I'll call them once the convention is over. Thanks for your help. You have alot of patience.

[pegasusmom]

Dana BTW the CCI* Championship (NAJYRC) plus a CIC** counted as a qualifier for the CCI** last yr. :D

Sandy - what did Connor do to qualify for the CIC** - guess that is my REAL question. . . . followed by where are there CIC** between now and that date that we aren't supposed to know or talk about. . . :cool:

[purplnurpl]

I still have yet to figure out where it says you even need a CIC* or a CCI* to qualify for the CIC** or CCI**.
This is all I can find: http://useventing.com/competitions.php?section=fei&id=1337

for the USEF:http://www.usef.org/documents/ruleBook/2009/12-EV.pdf
Start at the bottom and scroll up. Slow down when you get to the bits and soon you'll see the red letters marking rule changes.

From what I gathered.

CIC**

FEI: Either 1 CIC* OR 1 Inter HT qualifies you for a CIC**
USEF: 2 Inter HTs qualifies you for a CIC**

There fore you must have two Intermediate HTs. Don't blow the money on a CIC* unless you've already got one on the books.


Then for a CCI**

FEI:CIC** and two intermediate HTs (which you already have from the CIC** qualifcations)
USEF: FEI QRs + an additional 3 Inter HTs

So this year I"m doing an out at P.
then two outs at I
and then the CIC** at Maui Jim.

If I could fit in three more Intermediates between Aug-Sept I could go to Fair Hill.
which I'm not plannig on doing-I think. Well I'm not sure yet. lol.
But just an example.

So basically I gather that if you aspire to hit the **s and ***s. FEI competitions at the * level are a waste of money.

[Precious Lendon]

So it could be that the thread already covers this.

I had been researching this topic for my daughter. It appears to me that the USEF has added a layer of qualifications as stated below from the USEF rules:

3. LEVELS OF INTERNATIONAL HORSE TRIALS AND EVENTS
In all instances, at least one of the QRs must have been obtained in the current or preceeding calendar year.
All competitors and horses must meet the minimum requirements published by the FEI.

3.1 CIC* Both the competitor and the horse, though not necessarily as a combination, must have achieved 3 NQRs at either National Preliminary Horse Trials (CNC*) or National One Star Three-Day Events (CCN*).
3.2 CCI* Both the competitor and the horse, though not necessarily as a combination,
must have achieved 4 QRs at any combination of: CNC*, CCN*, CIC*.
3.3 CIC** The horse and rider, though not necessarily as a combination must have achieved 2 QRs at a CNC** or higher.
3.4 CCI** Having met the minimum requirements of the FEI, the horse and rider, though not necessarily as a combination must have achieved 3 QRs at a CNC** or higher.
3.5 CIC*** Having met the minimum requirements of the FEI, the horse and rider, though not necessarily as a combination must have achieved 2 QRs at a CNC*** or higher.
3.6 CCI*** The horse and rider must meet the minimum requirements of the FEI.
3.7 CCI**** The horse and rider must meet the minimum requirements of the FEI.

Also the FEI has changed their definition of QR with respect to cross country to be the following:

From 2009 onwards, the results at obstacles at International events need to
include, where applicable, a minimum of one clear round at a CIC and maximum 20 penalties at a CCI.

Let me know if I am misunderstanding.

[flutie1]

"... followed by where are there CIC** between now and that date that we aren't supposed to know or talk about. . . "

Dana, you're funny!
:-)

[pegasusmom]

CIC**

FEI: Either 1 CIC* OR 1 Inter HT qualifies you for a CIC**
USEF: 2 Inter HTs qualifies you for a CIC**

There fore you must have two Intermediate HTs. Don't blow the money on a CIC* unless you've already got one on the books.

So. . if you have a CCI* and a CH* (NAJYRC) then you need one or two Intermediates for the CIC**? Of course I COULD merely call USEF and get the real 411. . . but that would be too simple. . .

[purplnurpl]

CIC**

FEI: Either 1 CIC* OR 1 Inter HT qualifies you for a CIC**
USEF: 2 Inter HTs qualifies you for a CIC**

There fore you must have two Intermediate HTs. Don't blow the money on a CIC* unless you've already got one on the books.

So. . if you have a CCI* and a CH* (NAJYRC) then you need one or two Intermediates for the CIC**? Of course I COULD merely call USEF and get the real 411. . . but that would be too simple. . .

Correct you still need two QRs at the Intermediate National level.
Any CCI* or CIC* is useless due to the new USEF Qualifers needed. Nice of them eh?
There is overlap in this qualification with the FEI one intermediate needed and the USEF two intermediates needed.

All of the OTHER levels for USEF specifically state: After meeting the requirements of the FEI blah blah blah. The CIC** does not say that therefore the one FEI Intermediate counts for one of the two USEF intermediates needed. So because of the USEF even if you have a CCI* or CIC* you still need two intermediates. So people like should just skip the one stars and get QRs on the books that count for both USEF and FEI.
OK my brain hurts. : )
At least that is how I read it. I been reading it over and over for the past two weeks trying to get it just right. lol.

[mkmallory]

This is something I have been trying to figure out since I had the best cross country ride of my life at the Ocala Novemeber CCI* but missed a fence :mad:...
have we basically come to the conclusion that 2 Intermediate HTs qualify you for a CIC**?
and 1 CIC** qualifies you for a CCI**?
no CIC* or CCI* needed?
that would save me almost $1,000 and about 3 months if so!!!

[NeverTime]

MK Mallory:
You are correct that you do NOT need a CCI* to qualify for a CCI**.
Instead, you can have either two qualifying intermediate HTs and a CIC**, or two CIC** (which, to qualify for, you'd need the two int. HTs anyways).

Here's the specifics:

CCI2*: ONE qualifying result from each of the categories listed below:
Category 1
● 1 CCI1* OR 1 CIC2*

Category 2
● 1 CIC2* OR 2 Intermediate Horse Trials (CNC)

Both horse and rider must have a minimum of two qualifying scores.

[SLR]

Pegasus Mom, What Purplnurpl and Nevertime said. In answer to your question, he did 2 Int. plus CIC** .Freezing our b**ts off in OH.

[pegasusmom]

Pegasus Mom, What Purplnurpl and Nevertime said. In answer to your question, he did 2 Int. plus CIC** .Freezing our b**ts off in OH.


Got it. Finally. I am "soft" - slow old fat and tired. It ain't any warmer here. . . only the duration is a bit less!:lol: Hugs to Riley!

[mkmallory]

ok good deal thanks very much!!!
im pretty excited now..
if everything goes well, we will get to run our first CIC** this spring instead of next fall
i thought i had to have a CCI* or 2 CIC*, but apparently not! has this always been the case? or was it a recent change?
again, thanks!