Attitude question

[workinggirl]

Would a horse with EPSM show symptoms while not ridden, out in the field or lunged? I have a horse who is grumpy in the ring but not in the field or while being trail riding. Can he just hate ring work? He is a 6 year old tb/belgium draft cross, 16.3 hands. He trots in the ring fine, but cantering, forget it. Any and all opinions appreciated. Please help! Does he need physical therapy or a shrink?!!

I had his teeth check, getting adjusted today and blood work next week.

[ChocoMare]

Yes.... watch his rear legs when cantering free in the field (if he'll do it). Is it a true/quick one-two or more of a hop (single beat)? When he rolls, does he ever flip over or is it only a one-sided roll? When getting up from laying down/a roll, does he push himself into a sit for a few seconds before heaving himself up to stand? How is he with picking up/holding his rear hooves...does he jerk one or both high first? Does he prefer to have it held close to the ground, etc.?

The reluctance to canter in the ring could be a sign of mild EPSM -OR- just a big, young horse that is not yet able to properly collect and balance himself.

Check the diet:

--No sugar
--As low in NSCs as possible
--Higher fat
--Vitamin E/Selenium levels

[workinggirl]

Hi ChocoMare

I feed him 4 lbs daily Triple Crown Lite- I know it is low in starch, I'm not sure about sugars- do you know?

[Tree]

Would a horse with EPSM show symptoms while not ridden, out in the field or lunged?

If I understand EPSM correctly, a horse cannot turn the symptoms on and off at will. The symptoms can come and go but the odds of it coinciding with turn out and work would be unlikely.

I have a horse who is grumpy in the ring but not in the field or while being trail riding. Can he just hate ring work? He is a 6 year old tb/belgium draft cross, 16.3 hands. He trots in the ring fine, but cantering, forget it. Any and all opinions appreciated. Please help! Does he need physical therapy or a shrink?!!

I had his teeth check, getting adjusted today and blood work next week.

It sounds like he may either be bored with ring work and finds the great outdoors more to his liking. Have you ruled out tack fit yet? Poor saddle fit in the shoulder area can cause horses to be reluctant to canter. You may also need to consider the footing in the arena compared to the trails and fields.

[workinggirl]

Hi Tree

I am having a saddle fitter checking this on Thursday. My friends and I think it fits well, but hey- who are we?! This horse does equal ring vs trail- I try to keep things interesting. I'll keep you posted.

[kookicat]

How is he to canter out of the ring? I start all of my young horses cantering outside of the ring. Makes it so much easier for them to learn to blanace on the straight first before having to cope with corners.

[whbar158]

It sounds like he is a big guy, and I don't know how big your ring is. It could be as simple as he is just not balanced enough to canter in the ring yet or if he is lazy thinks its too much work to canter in a smaller space!

[merrygoround]

It sounds like he is a big guy, and I don't know how big your ring is. It could be as simple as he is just not balanced enough to canter in the ring yet or if he is lazy thinks its too much work to canter in a smaller space!

I'll second that. :yes:

[workinggirl]

The ring is 200x 300 feet. When I ride him in our fields sometimes he is happy sometimes not, and only in the canter. Trot work is fine. Trail, he is fine- just a little grumpy during the transition from trot to canter, but ears are up and happy in the canter. I am 5'2" 118 pounds, in case you were wondering. Maybe the saddle, maybe mild epsm. He gets 4lbs Triple Crown Lite a day. I am going to find out, so help me. Hope it doesn't break me $$$$$ (or mentally LOL)! Even easy horses are tough!

[BornToRide]

I feed him 4 lbs daily Triple Crown Lite- I know it is low in starch, I'm not sure about sugars- do you know?
Would not feed it to a potential EPSM horse because of the following ingredients:

Wheat Middlings, Soybean Hulls, Alfalfa Meal, Distillers Dried Grains, Monocalcium Phosphate, Dicalcium Phosphate, Ground Limestone, Cane Molasses, Salt, Flaxseed, Dried Yeast Fermentation Solubles, Brewers Dried Yeast, Zinc Proteinate, Copper Proteinate, Manganese Proteinate, Kelp Meal, Yeast Culture, Hydrated Sodium Calcium Aluminosilicate, Anethole, Fenugreek Seed, Lecithin, Yucca Schidigera Extract, Iron Proteinate, Magnesium Oxide, Magnesium Proteinate, Dried Trichoderma Longibrachiatum Fermentation Extract, Soybean Oil


Rather feed more hay and a low sugar/starch supplement such as Equipride. Why don't you just remove it for a while, just to see what you get?

Could also be musculo-skeletal imbalances. The main symptoms in EPSM is reluctance to go forward , being balky, difficulty holding hind legs up and more hind end sensitivity in general, even to touch.

[workinggirl]

Would not feed it to a potential EPSM horse because of the following ingredients:


Rather feed more hay and a low sugar/starch supplement such as Equipride. Why don't you just remove it for a while, just to see what you get?

Could also be musculo-skeletal imbalances. The main symptoms in EPSM is reluctance to go forward , being balky, difficulty holding hind legs up and more hind end sensitivity in general, even to touch.

Triple Crown Lite is less than 10% starch an sugar NSC combined. He gets plenty of hay- could be the sugar/starch in that? What about musclo-skeletal imbalance that you mentioned?

[ChocoMare]

Ditto BTR. Change the diet first and see if there's any improvement.

My EPSM Percheron gets free choice grass hay and then plain (molasses free) soaked beet pulp shreds and 2 cups of EquiPride. I add canola oil for the fat/energy. Anytime her work load goes up and she needs more calories, I just up the beet pulp and hay.

[BornToRide]

Triple Crown Lite is less than 10% starch an sugar NSC combined. He gets plenty of hay- could be the sugar/starch in that? ?
Could be - I would still remove the grain first, just to see. It the feed guranteed to be 10% NSC?

What about musclo-skeletal imbalance that you mentioned Pelvic rotations for example - I trimmed horses yesterday . One had to be worked because he would not stand still and he cross fired behind each direction. When the owner led the horse out of the round pen I noticed that one hip was consistently swinging higher than the other. That alone may account for the cross firing behind. Him acting up behind while being trimmed was probably also a symptom of the pelvic issue going on. He needs body work. :yes:

[workinggirl]

Triple Crown states less than 10% NSC starch and sugar combined. This is lower than the low starch formula. Isn't that low enough.

[BornToRide]

Maybe, maybe not - I would not assume. Every horse is an individual. He may react to something else in the feed you are not even aware of. You have nothing to lose by trying for 2 -4 weeks. If ít does have an effect, your horse will most certainly tell you. :)

[workinggirl]

What about hay?

[BornToRide]

I would do one thing at a time and start with the most likely cause first. Otherwise you do not know what's potentially causing the issue.

[workinggirl]

If he does have mild espm, would it show in the ring and not on trail? Or by himself?