Making friends with a stray dog - New House PICS page 61!

[vineyridge]

Another vote for keeping the government authorities out of this. They have rules and regulations that they are legally obligated to follow, and once they get an animal for whatever reason, they have to play by their rule book. In this case, you have a feral dog who could be pregnant or heartworm positive, and they would almost immediately triage her as unadoptable and put her down. They aren't to be blamed for this; there just isn't any flexibility in their procedures as a rule.

In one of my rants about HSUS, they do the training for many, many animal control departments around the US. They have a lot to do with how the agencies set up their procedures and how they administer them. And many of their recommendations (like really unreasonable forms of temperament testing) get huge numbers of dogs killed. All of this in the name of humane treatment of animals, when their stated goal is the disappearance of pets and other domestic animals.

[lauriep]

Also a vote for no AC. Take her to your own vet.

[mlranchtx]

:eek::no:

Please don't get animal control involved. Huge chance you'll never see her again....

I'm in law enforcement and I couldn't even get our animal control officer to release an injured goose to me the other day. He said he "couldn't" for whatever reason. I'm sure he put him to sleep...

Most of them just have a strict set of policies they have to follow and they become responsible for what happens if they don't follow that policy. In some cases I don't blame them but other times it's senseless.

Anyway, take her to your vet and handle it with out government involvement. :)

[gieriscm]

If you're willing to pay for her care anyway, I also vote to use your own vet and leave AC out of it. I used to be active on the oversight board for the one in my county. No question that a feral dog will be PTS as they just don't do well in a shelter environment.

[cvl]

Another vote against AC. Animals can react strangely coming out of anethesia. Say, God forbid, someone at AC gets bitten by her - you'll certainly never see her again. I agree that the better choice for Angel is your own vet. In any case - I wish you the best of luck in your decision. I look forward to your updates. You are Angel's angel :)

[LabsChewShoes]

Poor Angel. Another vote here, no animal control, they will euth her. I am pulling for you guys!

[MunchkinsMom]

Thanks everyone! I too had concerns about AC, but we have talked with them extensively, and they are willing to return her to us, they seem to be more lenient out here in the country on things like this, we mostly need them to help get her contained and controlled. Both my neighbor and I are on first name basis' with the folks at AC here, and they are good caring people in that agency. I know that is not always true in other areas of the country.

Honestly, I don't have high hopes on the tranq's working this time around either, so it remains to be seen.

I do have to share how cute she was this weekend. Last night right after dark I went out to take the fly masks off the horses, and Angel was just standing next to my youngest gelding, and didn't even move away when I went to get his mask. Actually, she sat down at watched me take the masks off both horses. Then at bedtime a few hours later, she was laying in a big mound of manure (ugh) that I had put to fill in a low spot in the pasture, and I walked right next to her, talking to her, and she again just stayed there.

This morning she was very happy to see me with the hot dogs, when I went out to toss her a few bits, she actually jumped around a bit, like a normal happy house dog!

Oh, and Saturday morning she barked at me (probably because I was a bit late with feeding, since the horses had opted to stay out overnight the night before).

I'll post how it goes tomorrow AM.

[MunchkinsMom]

I'm feeling a bit like Benedict Arnold today. Just came in from feeding the horses, and Angel was laying in the pile of used shavings (trying to fill another low spot). She waited until the horses were fed, I went out with the hot dog, and almost like a regular house dog, she jumped up, wagged her tail, barked with joy, and ran towards me until she was as close as she could feel comfortable with. Then as I tossed the bits, she came closer to eat them. So, don't I feel horrible about our plans for tomorrow? You bet I do.

Of course I praised her to high heavens on being so cute and brave and beautiful.

[MHM]

Crossing my fingers that all goes well tomorrow!

[MunchkinsMom]

Thanks. I do have to mention that I called the vet today to make sure that I am really susposed to give her all the pills in one session, she said yes, but even she is not 100% convinced that this will do the trick. She said in some dogs, the survival instinct will kick in and override the effects of the drugs, or have the reverse effect (hence the two times we tried this before and she ran around like a lunatic for an hour).

I'm just hoping this time if I feed them to her, and let her be with me at my house and my neighbors at their house watching from our various vantage points that she might relax somewhere close to the barn so we can catch her.

[shea'smom]

ACK, how nerve wracking!
Jingles for a successful day for our Dear Angel. Please let us know asap.
Like I don't have 12 dogs, 7 cats and 24 horses to worry about.

[lcw579]

Another anxiously waiting for today's Angel Update. Fingers crossed that all goes well. :yes::)

[FalseImpression]

Hoping for success... somehow I think Angel is too smart for her own good!!!

[Reds-n-Greys]

Another checking in with crossed fingers for Angel.......

[Blacklabs]

Good luck today with Angel.

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, once again Angel has eluded capture. I gave her all 7 (gasp) pills stuffed into hot dog bits at 8:30 AM, and I checked to make sure that she didn't spit any of them out, she ate them all. Then I went about my business as my neighbors (with the crate in their pickup truck) waited and watched from their house. I figured if I just went about my normal routine of cleaning stalls, etc, that she would relax. After 30 minutes, she was laying quietly, but still alert. My neighbors called the vet, who said to give it a whole hour to take effect, so we waited, I drank my coffee back up at the house and watched her. At 9:30, she was still laying quietly, but semi alert, my neighbor called and said, we might as well hang it up. So I came in the house and booted up my computer. Then I heard my neighbor calling me from my pasture, he had walked right up to her and she didn't even flinch, so we thought for sure that she was out. Well. . . he drove in with the truck (which she is not afraid of) and we now had 4 humans, and she got up, not even wobbly, and got out of the pasture under the fence (the one time I wish I had no-climb on all my perimeter fencing) and slunk down into the drainage ditch next to the road. So we all tossed our hands in the air, said chalk another win on the board for Angel, and left the scene, so she can sleep off whatever effects she has from the tranqs.

So, sorry to report that we didn't catch her, and hopefully we didn't terrorize her, I don't think we did, since she is now sleeping on my fence line as usual. Hopefully she will be back up to the barn at lunchtime.

We have decided to give up on the tranq idea, and give up on having AC try to dart her, since she appears to be resistant to tranqs anyway, and the AC folks did say that the darts don't always work either. So, back to doing what we were doing, and praying that nothing bad happens to her in the meanwhile (meaning run ins with angry farmers, rabid animals, or intact male dogs). I think if we can keep her comfortable on our properties as her home base, that we can minimize the exposure.

My next thought is that when she does come back into heat, to get my neighbor with the JRT that loves her to bring him over and see if that might work. I have a feeling it might not work if humans are involved in the "date", if her survival instincts are strong enough to override the drugs, they would be stong enough to override her hormones also.

I'll keep everyone posted on our progress. This is the closest I have ever been to doing something like a blog online. I do appreciate everyones support on this. :)

[FalseImpression]

not surprised at all... she does have more than one trick up her paws!!!

Thank you for being so patient with her. It will pay off in the looooonng run...

[MunchkinsMom]

not surprised at all... she does have more than one trick up her paws!!!

Thank you for being so patient with her. It will pay off in the looooonng run...

Thanks, I wasn't surprised either, and I'm sure that when she decides that we really are good friends, that she is going to be a special dog - heck she already is special.

I just went out for a stroll around the back yard, and she was laying in the shade next to the pasture waterer, which is about 3 feet from the fence between the pasture and the back yard, laying quietly, so I talked softly with her for a few minutes, and then she headed up to the barn. It is close to lunchtime, I'll go feed the horses in about 30 minutes and check on her again, at least if she was that close to the house, I think that is a sign that we didn't terrorize her with our antics this morning.

[MHM]

I'm sorry you weren't able to catch her, but I'm glad it sounds like there was no trauma for anyone involved!

Thanks for the continued updates. :)

[jetsmom]

Thanks for updating. I was thinking about her last night when Rusty was stretched out on the bed beside me. I still can't believe I have him, when I think about spending all of those months trying to catch him, and worrying about if he had been hit by a car, shot by someone, injured in a fight with another loose dog, or picked up by AC and euthed. About a week before I was able to get a collar on him, but was able to touch him, I duct taped a business card between his shoulderblades with a note "if found call xxx-xxxx", just in case AC were to trap him. I had started feeing him chicken by then, and that's what AC uses in their traps here, so I was worried that it would seem familiar, and he'd be trapped.

I am really pulling for you to get Angel tamed enough to handle. She sounds like she would be the perfect barn dog. It might help if she were to see you with another dog, patting and feeding it by hand. Can you borrow your friend's JRT?

[MunchkinsMom]

I am really pulling for you to get Angel tamed enough to handle. She sounds like she would be the perfect barn dog. It might help if she were to see you with another dog, patting and feeding it by hand. Can you borrow your friend's JRT?

We tried the "other dog" approach, with my neighbors Springer off leash (she growled at him and then slunk away), and with my dogs on leash, and again she ran away that time. I have not re-tried it to see how she will react now that she is a bit more comfortable with me.

Just to let you all know, she seems fine, was sleeping in the shade next to the horse trailer at lunchtime, so peacefully. . . I actually stood about a foot away from her (downwind so she didn't smell me), for about 45 seconds watching her sleep, it was so tempting to try to reach out and pet her. . . but I didn't and then she woke up, and walked past me to get to a spot where she was not frightened to be near me. It breaks my heart, because I do feel that she really wants to be with me, and so she gets as close as she can and still feel ok. At least we didn't scare her away, as long as she feels at home at the barn and in my field, I think we can continue to make progress. She will be the perfect barn dog, since that is pretty much what she is already. The only part missing is hands on affection and vet care.

jetsmom, I'm sure that as Rusty is laying there with you, he is counting his blessings that you chose to help him!

[CB/TB]

Too bad. We all hoped for a good report this morning. Back to the drawing board. I still think( broken record here!) getting her into a chain link kennel would be a big help. She'd be confined and dependent on ONE person for food, would have room to move about and maybe try the tranqs again. Leave the door open and feed her like you do in the tack room for several days, ignoring her , but gradually moving her dish to the back of the kennel . Let her come and go as she pleases until she's comfortable with you around, then shut her in and leave her alone except for feeding time. Maybe get in with her after a few days, sit down and read a book , not looking at her, not trying to pet her and just let her bide her time. You could try moving her dish closer to you over time( but not too near the door, in case she bolts) and just wait her out. Food, toys, water and a safe place to sleep , and you shouldn't feel too sorry for her. If you still think AC might be able to dart her in a confined space, that might work then. Keep trying. She's a smart girl and deserves a good home.( With you!)

[3horsemom]

well, rats! i was actually rooting for the humans to win one. i do not worry about you giving up on angel, mm. you have come this far there is no quitting now.

[carla54]

Break out the Liverwurst!!! My dogs will do back flips and dance the tango for it. (not really, but they go nuts for it!) You can cut it into small pieces or smear it onto objects, like her toys, or yourself! If you haven't tried it yet, please do!!

[MunchkinsMom]

Break out the Liverwurst!!! My dogs will do back flips and dance the tango for it. (not really, but they go nuts for it!) You can cut it into small pieces or smear it onto objects, like her toys, or yourself! If you haven't tried it yet, please do!!

OMG - the mental image of smearing myself with liverwurst just cracked me up! Plus, I wouldn't get out of the house, my 4 house dogs would maul me :eek: . I suppose I can give that a try, although she seems to really like the cheap stinky hot dogs so far.

Angel hung out by the barn all day, and whined a bit when I came down for dinner feed, and she did come towards me for the hot dog bits again. It is almost like she hits an invisible wall or line that she cannot cross if the bits fall too close to me. But at least she feels comfortable enough not to run away. Then after dinner she had a little trot around the field, and when I last peeked out, she was just laying in the field watching the horses graze.

[bdj]

Another lurker on the thread chiming in here...

MM - you've been given tons of suggestions here, but the post about you "standing close to her, but downwind" triggered something for me.

They say that if you lose a dog, you should leave a worn item of your clothing at the place where you last saw them, so that the dog has something to "come back to", that smells familiar and comforting. (Assuming, of course, that your smell is both familiar and comforting to your pup.)
Angel is a little different, because you're trying to build that familiarity, but could you put something that smells like you (a dirty old t-shirt or pillowcase or something) with her stuff - by her food bowl, or if she has a consistent place to hang out? Anything to help build that association between good things (food, toys, comfy/safe places) and you/your scent. You might have to have a couple of 'scent articles' available, so that if one gets destroyed/filthy/lost, you can replace it with a new one.

Just a thought, and something to try.
Best wishes that you get this very special girl caught and comfy!

(OH - in the event that you do get her confined, you could try this stuff: http://www.smartpakcanine.com/ProductClass.aspx?productclassid=1804&cmPreserveSource=true&cmPreserveCategory=true
ComfortZone with DAP - it's supposed to have a pheromone that can help relax dogs - a friend had it recommended by her vet - not sure how effective it really was, but it probably falls into the category of "can't hurt, might help". You can find it from other vendors, too, but the SmartPak link was quickest!)

[MunchkinsMom]

You know, that might be a good idea! Tomorrow I will wear my oldest t-shirt that is just about ready for the rag-bag anyway, and then leave it in the barn next to the food dish! Lord knows I have plenty of old t-shirts. I do remember that when we used to kennel the dogs for vacation that they would have us bring a worn item of clothing or two to leave with the dogs.

This morning she was so happy to see me, jumped up, barked, wagged her tail, and came within 3 feet of me in her excitement! That was progress.

[Buffyblue]

I'm so glad you're making such great progress with her! Keep the updates coming - I check in every day for a report!

[bdj]

I do remember that when we used to kennel the dogs for vacation that they would have us bring a worn item of clothing or two to leave with the dogs.

This morning she was so happy to see me, jumped up, barked, wagged her tail, and came within 3 feet of me in her excitement! That was progress.

Cool - I haven't had a kennel specifically ask me to bring something worn, but I will freely admit to sleeping for a few nights with the soft toy(s) that accompany the dogs to the kennel... ;)

And it sounds like Miss Angel is definitely warming up to you in the meantime! I'm sure you already know this (and I think that someone's mentioned it already), but if she's willing to come within "reach out and get a treat" distance (and hotdogs sliced into quarters the long way are great for that!) you might be able to sit down, facing AWAY from her, and let her "steal" treats from a hand stretched out behind you. Eye contact can be really intimidating for a nervous dog, and having the ability to get a bite, scoot away and then come back for another without feeling like they're being watched can help them feel a little more confident about making that approach in the first place.

Keep us posted on how y'all are doing!

[MunchkinsMom]

This morning she was her usually happy self, tail wagging, barking, and got within about 4 feet for the hot dogs.

But tonight she didn't come to the barn, was laying out by the far fenceline, and when I went out to her, she got up and slunk away, so I turned around and went back to the barn, not leaving any treats. Not sure what brought that on. Right now she is just laying out in the field watching the horses. Hopefully she will be better in the morning.

[shea'smom]

?? that sounds worrisome. Maybe somebody did something to scare her. Poor Angel, she doesn't know what's good for her.

[3horsemom]

oh gosh, i hope angel does not move back to square one. perhaps i just missed reading this but how do your dogs interact with her?

[vineyridge]

It's spring and about time for her to be going into heat, if she hasn't already. To put it mildly, estrus can cause behavior changes. :yes: Just keep on as you have. She may vanish for several days but if she considers you home, she'll come back.

Hard to tell at this point, but also if she is advanced in pregnancy, she will be far more skittish. If she's nursing, she will be spending most of her time with her puppies.

[MunchkinsMom]

This morning she was hanging out in the field, not close to the barn, and didn't come closer until I went out with the hot dogs, she did wag her tail and come towards me, but not as close as she was. I don't know if my young cutting horse has started herding her or what, I'll try to watch more closely this weekend. I know she and the gelding used to play together, he would approach her, she would jump up and run a short way away, if he stopped she would approach him, etc. He has not shown any aggression to her, and she has not shown any aggression with the horses, I have caught her chasing them in play, and if I shout to her to stop she does.

She does not interact with my dogs at all. My dogs are contained in the house yard with fencing, and I don't take them to the barn because they are afraid of the horses. There were times in the past when my daughter and I were walking our dogs near where Angel was laying, and she slunk away when we approached. My dogs do bark at her when the see her in the field - so there is no connection with them.

[jetsmom]

Was she back to normal today?

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, she seems to have made a new normal for the time being. This morning, she was waiting on the house side of the barn, as I came down, she ran around to the far side of the barn, and started heading to the fence line. So I called her and she stopped, I tossed the hot dogs, and she came towards me to get them.

At lunch, she was laying by the trailer, I had cheese (the hot dogs were thawing from the freezer), she got up and walked away, so I put the cheese in the bowl in the barn and fed the horses, and started cleaning stalls when the horses went back out after lunch. While I was doing that, Angel was just laying in the field, and when I went to dispose of the full wheelbarrow of wet shavings, she went into the barn to get the cheese. When I got back to the barn, she was in there, but she came right out, and walked slowly past me (within about 2 feet) and didn't seem too freaked out or anything. She then went back to her shady spot near the trailer.

Then my neighbor stopped over to chat, he said hello to her (he was the gentleman that was feeding her at the abandonded farm next door last year when the dogs first appeared here), and she got up and watched us for a few minutes, and then went away somewhere, probably to go sleep under the neighbors big oak tree in the back pasture.

So, no big steps of progress yet :(. I'll just keep at it.

[vineyridge]

Maybe she has connected you with the tranqs?

[MunchkinsMom]

Maybe she has connected you with the tranqs?

I sure hope not! She seems to be settling back to her routine of waiting for me in the morning, sleeping in the shade near the horse trailer, and sleeping on the shavings pile at night. I just came in from gathering up the horses (who of course were at the farthest point from the barn because the nightime grass must be the best on that side of the pasture) and Angel was sleeping on the pile. I think the flashlight made her a little anxious, she got up and trotted towards the barn, but then the little bugger went in and ate the cheese from the dog bowl while I was rounding up the herd.

She does this funny little whine thing when I come out for dinner, as I approach with the food, almost as if she is happy to see me, but scared at the same time, poor little girl. I'll just keep working at it.

[Sanely Eccentric]

I think an occasional day of Angel being a little more hesitant is fine and it's important to keep in mind the overall progress she continues to make. Sounds like you're doing a good job of building her trust and staying consistent. :yes:

[MunchkinsMom]

Big Sigh of relief this morning. Angel was very happy to see me, lots of real tail wagging (not that tentative wag if you know what I mean), and she actually ran towards me before I started tossing hot dog bits, and actually came within about 2-3 feet of me to get them! I was so excited I fed her the whole thing bit by bit. Usually I only give her half, and put the other half in the bowl in the barn with the dog food.

Then I went to feed the horses (I know, funny that I now feed the dog first!), and noticed that my youngest gelding was highly interested in something in the field - it was Angel with a while plastic orange juice container. It amused me that the dog is actually helping to de-spook my horses. So, I fed the horses, grabbed a dog biscuit, and went out to get the killer plastic container. As I approached, Angel jumped up, barked at me, wagging her tail, and jumped for the dog biscuit as I tossed it to her. I apologized for having to take away her new "toy" and picked it up and put it in the trash.

I think she is picking up some of the litter that ends up on the roadside when folks take their trips to the dump and don't cover the load (which annoys me to no end). So perhaps she is helping me out there too. The other morning it was a Mt Dew bottle.

[3horsemom]

do you think you can entice her to come closer to you before you throw the hot dog? i do not mean to armchair quarterback here. just thinking that maybe she stops bc she is waiting for the treat.
good job, mm. i cannot wait for angel to be safe, spayed and vetted.

[Mtn trails]

Maybe you can get her an actual toy that you can toss for her? Seems like she wants you to play. If she's coming within 2' of you for her hot dog treats, do you think she might be ready to take one from your hand? From that, progress to scratching her gently under the chin or on the cheek? Just some suggestions, not trying to tell you what to do because you're doing a fab job and I have a whole lot of respect for you.

[MunchkinsMom]

do you think you can entice her to come closer to you before you throw the hot dog? i do not mean to armchair quarterback here. just thinking that maybe she stops bc she is waiting for the treat.
good job, mm. i cannot wait for angel to be safe, spayed and vetted.

That is exactly what happened this morning, as I walked out to her, she noticed that I had the hot dogs, and she came to me first. I feel that this friendship is going to have to be on her terms, with encouragement and trust coming from my actions and interactions with her. As long as whatever I do appears in her mind to be non-threatening, and even better, friendly, I think she will come around, I take every little sign in that direction as a good thing.

Just came in from lunch, not sure where she is at the moment, maybe laying in the shade in the back pasture or hanging out at the abandonded farm next door.

[shea'smom]

Glad to hear she is acting like her self. Thanks for keeping us in the loop.

[MHM]

Glad to hear she is acting like her self. Thanks for keeping us in the loop.

Ditto!

[CB/TB]

Glad she's back to normal. What would she do if you sat ( on a bucket, or milk crate) as she started towards you and did the hot dog thing? Throw a few out then hold one at arm's length> Maybe a "been there, done that", but she's come so far that maybe the things you tried initially, that scared her off, might work now. I still think if you could get her to eat in a chain link dog kennel for a few days, then close her in it, things will progress faster. You would be her only source of food and companionship.

[MunchkinsMom]

I agree that the dog kennel would be the best idea, but unfortunately I have a few issues to work out. Number 1, it would have to be in the pasture, and my nosey horses would most likely get hurt on it. Number 2, I would have to find a way to sneak up on Angel if she were in there to get her closed in - not an easy task with a dog that is this smart, and that has the patience of Job in waiting until the coast is clear before coming into any building to eat. I know this because she will wait for over an hour for me to finish in the barn before she will come in to get the hot dogs and/or food in the bowl in the barn. On weekends it is even longer. She lays in the field, goes to sleep, and waits me out.

Tonight we made more progress, she came near the barn at dinner (was not hanging out at the barn) and when I went out with the hot dog, she jumped up again and ran towards me barking and wagging, and again came to within 2 feet of me, and was not acting afraid of the eye contact tonight. So I feel that she is still making progress, and that soon I will offer it in my hand (crouching down) and see what she does.

And once those hot dog bits were gone, she laid down and waited for me to finish the evening chores, even though she knew the rest of the hot dog was in the barn.

[cvl]

Have you tried interacting with her while you are sitting down on the ground? Getting down on her level might be a little bit less intimidating. Just a thought. Keep the updates coming ~ I look forward to reading them. Sounds like you are doing a great job and your patience is paying off.

[Reds-n-Greys]

Good girl Angel!! Keep it up!

[MunchkinsMom]

A tiny bit more progress this morning. She was waiting on the house side of the barn for me this morning, and sat up and gave me a sort of howl/bark as I approached, wagged her tail, and came to me before I started tossing hot dog bits. She again came within about 2 feet, and I made the attempt to crouch down to her level, which made her suspicious and she stopped and would not come closer to get two of the bits. So I stood up and went about my feeding chores. She ate the bits, and came around to the other side of the barn where she can watch me bustle around the tack/feed room.

While the horses were eating, I went back out with more hot dog, and she again jumped up and ran towards me, barking again (a happy bark), and came within two feet. So, I gave her some more hot dog and a dog biscuit. And once again, she laid down and waited until I was gone before going into the barn to look for more food (she had eaten all the food from the night before).

This is really a lesson in patience for me, and I tell myself that good things come to those who wait!

I felt bad for her, she is soaking wet because we have been having on and off rain for the past day, and I bet she was laying out in the rain waiting for me this morning. I wish she would lay in the barn and come in out of the rain!

[jetsmom]

bump..

[MunchkinsMom]

Hi everyone. Not any great progress to report, but not much regression either, things seem to be holding steady, with Angel still being happy to see me, and getting excited about the hot dogs.

Tonight, she was not around at dinner time for the horses, but a few hours later I went down to take the fly masks off, and she was waiting in the field. So I came out with the hot dogs, and she started to walk away, so I called her, and said "what have I got for you?" in my friendliest voice, and she then turned and came back to me. At about the same time, one of my neighbors and his wife came by in their gator, with a ladder banging around in the back, and when I waved to them, it made her a bit nervous. They then stopped to replace the light bulbs in the gateway to the 'hood, and I went over to chat with them, and she just layed down and waited. The neighbors commented on how good she is, especially when all 3 horses came nosing around (the rustling of the plastic bag that held the light bulbs got their attention), and Angel didn't even get up.

So, I think a little bit at a time seems to be working, I think back on the fact that I have only been at this for 5 months, and that she can now come within 3 feet of me, where as in the beginning, it was more like 50 yards that she needed for a comfort zone.

[pinkdiamondracing]

bumping up

[vineyridge]

Angel is almost as addicting as Suerte!!!

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, last night she got a special treat, we had steak for dinner, and I couldn't finish my portion, so I cut up the rest (about 6 small pieces) and brought them out when I went to take the fly masks off. She really liked that, but still not enough to cross the invisible barrier (that now ends about 2 feet from me).

She still just hangs around the barn, sleeps in the shade under the horse trailer, and barks and wags and leaps about when I come out with the treats (even dog biscuits), but still can't bring herself to cross the line.

Oh, last night was cute, while my DH was grilling the steak, he had our Aussie out in the back yard with him. Well, Cubby (the Aussie) caught sight of Angel in the field, and ran over to the fence barking (and wagging her tail). Angel sat up and looked at her but didn't approach. So, Cubby came back to my DH all proud of herself, and Angel came over and sniffed the fence where Cubby had been standing. I was sort of hoping that Cubby would go back over to see if they might become friends, but Cubby was busy investigating the other side of the yard at that point. The only reason I don't bring my dogs down to the barn is that my horses have free access to the barn, and the dogs are afraid of the horses. I suppose I can try it one day after I have the horses locked into their stalls and eating.

[MunchkinsMom]

I had a "light bulb" moment this morning. I'm going to try to incorporate some training in my treat feeding routine. Basically, as she is coming forward towards the treats, I am going to say "come" so that she can associate that word with the action that she is doing. Sort of like training puppies to sit, that when you see them about to sit, you say the word.

At lunch time she was reluctant to come to me, and when I went out to her, she slunk away under the fence, so I went back into the barn without leaving any treats, trying to get her to understand that if she wants them, she has to come to me to get them.

[3horsemom]

my goodness angel is a piece of work...poor girl.
you know, my aussiex will play with anyone. i had the thought that perhaps you could use a backdoor approach and make contact thru one of your dogs. let them play and then angel could see that your dog is comfortable with human contact. just a thought.
i think your voice command idea is a good one as well. it seems to me that angel is being rewarded for stopping 2 feet from you. not at all second guessing you mm. you are doing a great job.
how on earth angel gets thru the spring w/o a litter popping out in the near future is another miracle. keeping my fingers crossed there as well.

[CB/TB]

Don't want to go back thru all the posts , but is it possible she is spayed? Justa thought. It still sounds like you're moving forward , so keep it up.

[MunchkinsMom]

Don't want to go back thru all the posts , but is it possible she is spayed? Justa thought. It still sounds like you're moving forward , so keep it up.

Probably not. Since she went into heat about 6 weeks ago, and lured my neighbors Jack Russel to come out and play, he didn't even care that he got shocked by his invisible fence collar.

She is a tough nut to crack. This morning, she was more interested in something going on at the neighbor's across the street (most likely their new kitten, that follows the owners around the farm) although I couldn't figure out what the facination was. She was not excited to greet me, so I used the rule of no treats if she slinks under the fence. Right now she is sleeping under the horse trailer, and at least at lunch time she stayed close enough to get a few tidbits.

As to the playing with other dogs, other than the JRT when she was in heat, she has not expressed any interest in other dogs. One of my neighbors stopped by with her very friendly male (fixed) Springer, and all she did was growl at him when he approached her, then she hid under the fence. When we do walk our dogs, she slinks away if we try to approach with the dogs, so I'm not sure that will work, but I might try it again.

[MunchkinsMom]

I am so frustrated today. She seem to be regressing a bit, she keeps slinking back to the fenceline when I go out to her. So I go back to the barn, and put one treat on the corner support of the barn, and when she thinks the coast is clear, she sneaks up and gets it, looks me square in the eye as I catch her at it, and then goes back to the fence.

But she had a great day, her toys were all over the pasture, and I saw her run by several times today.

Well, tomorrow is another day.

[silver2]

Well if she went into heat 6 weeks ago.......

If you can figure out where she's denning up you might be able to cathc her when she has the pups. Or at least catch the pups.

[MHM]

MM, we're all rooting for you! Don't take her foibles too personally.

I feel so sorry for Angel. She doesn't seem to get to do the things other dogs enjoy most- having her own person and socializing with other dogs. I'm starting to wonder if she's really a loner by nature, rather than circumstance?

Did you ever put out an old T-shirt with your scent on it?

[MunchkinsMom]

Dang, knew I forgot something. I will have to put the t-shirt in the tack room next to the food bowl, so that my pesky playful gelding doesn't play with it!

This morning Angel again preferred to hang on the fenceline and wait until the coast was clear to sneak in and grag one hot dog bit. But. . . then I went out before she got back to the fence and she did come to me to get the hot dog bits, but not as close as usual. If I toss a piece that is too close for comfort, she just stares at me, and if I stare back, she looks away, so I try not to make a staring contest out of it, so I don't make her feel threatened.

Last night at bedtime, as the horses were coming in, I caught her running after the horses, so I told her "NO Chasing!" and she went and laid down.

I'm trying to be as patient as possible, this is so hard! I'm so used to dogs that love people, even the other skinny injured strays that got dumped here would come right to me, so I could help them.

[3horsemom]

what you are trying to do is hard. most people would have given up by now and chased the dog off their property.
do you think her reluctance to come closer might be bc she is pregnant? i have never had a pregnant dog so i know nothing about their behavior. just wondering.
hang in there, mm. you are doing the best that you can for this dog and that is really all you can do.

[MunchkinsMom]

do you think her reluctance to come closer might be bc she is pregnant? i have never had a pregnant dog so i know nothing about their behavior. just wondering.
hang in there, mm. you are doing the best that you can for this dog and that is really all you can do.

I sure hope not. I have no experience with pregnancy in dogs either, her last contact that I know of with the male JRT was almost two months ago,and she does not look any fatter than she did back then (despite the hot dog treats - LOL).

[fivehorses]

I think you are right to use the treats now as a quid pro quo...she needs to do something to get them or to incorporate training.

If it makes you feel any better at all, Rosie, my prego mare last year who I rescued from New Holland is still no more trusting of people than when I got her. Some animals are so sensitive and when that trust is broken, just can't cross the threshold.

I hope Angel will realize you are safe and let you and her touch. Just keep that goal in mind and take it day by day.

I think we need Ceasar Milan!!!

[Individualblue07]

Or Victoria Stillwell!!!!

haha

Where are you located at? (statewise)

[MunchkinsMom]

I'm a bit north of Ocala Florida (about 20 miles from the center of town).

We already sent in a tape and request to Cesar and at this point, he might accept our request before we make too much more progress (at this rate).

fivehorses, you are right, I changed my tactics today. I will no longer trudge out with treats in hand. I put one treat on the barn support, and when she comes to get it, if she hangs around, she gets more. If she slinks off, the treats go back into the barn with me. That seems to be working. At lunch she was more eager to come to me to get the biscuits (with some barking and tail wagging) than she has been in days.

I also think it's time for the liverwurst, maybe hot dogs are not as enticing anymore. Or a bucket of boneless KofC (that I will have to bury in the refridgerator or mark the bag as manure samples - hahaha).

Who is Victoria Stillwell? Does she have a website I can browse for tips?

[EponaRoan]

I also think it's time for the liverwurst, maybe hot dogs are not as enticing anymore. Or a bucket of boneless KofC (that I will have to bury in the refridgerator or mark the bag as manure samples - hahaha).

Who is Victoria Stillwell? Does she have a website I can browse for tips?

I think I'd pick Cesar over Victoria in a case like this. She's the one that was a judge on Greatest American Dog and has an Animal Planet show titled It's Me or the Dog. I don't think she has experience with dogs like Angel. She does have a spiffy little car in the UK version of her show though. :cool:

http://www.victoriastilwell.com/

Liverwurst is good. You might try Satin Balls for the 'jackpot' treat.

http://www.holisticdog.org/Nutrition/Satinballs/satinballs.html

They're good enough to tempt a sick dog to eat, so if Angel really, really likes them, I'd reserve them for her making progress/taking out of your hand/getting within X distance of you and improving on that.

[MunchkinsMom]

Liverwurst is good. You might try Satin Balls for the 'jackpot' treat.

http://www.holisticdog.org/Nutrition/Satinballs/satinballs.html

They're good enough to tempt a sick dog to eat, so if Angel really, really likes them, I'd reserve them for her making progress/taking out of your hand/getting within X distance of you and improving on that.

Thanks! Now, I have to tell you that I will get some "looks" from the family as I whip up a mixture of that for the dog, especially since I don't cook! (Thank heavens for food that comes with instructions, and my mother-in-law who does cook in my house). I'll feel like the Martha Stewart of the dog world.

[LabsChewShoes]

posting again i had/ have this situation...her name is girlfriend...i sat with my back to her and at the stage you are at i sat the treat next to me, dinner actually if she was to eat, she had to come to me beside me and eat, no touch yet, but she had to eat beside me.. food came out with me, and if she did not eat, it went in with me, only 1 night without dinner. she is now under my bed...bad storm here...i say have...because i am the only person she trusts, i got her to the vet once, very traumatic. she has had 2 litters, and that actually progressed our relationship quicker. she was preggo at vets,, since that litter..if i put a collar on her,,,she freaks out...and my concern, as well as my vets about spaying her, yes i could do a traumatic pick her up; get into car, as long as someone else canshut the car door quick enough, but is the after care that is our concern,, as penning, crating, etc causes wxtreme panic as well as collars leashes, she has the run of the farm, and comes in the house when I am in. i now am working on her just wearing a collar. and

[CB/TB]

When/if she does come forward for the treats, can you back up , saying"come" , holding the treat and see how far she gets to you? Maybe "come" while she's moving toward you - toss a treat. Stop when she stops, no treat. Back up "come" and if she does she gets a treat. Does that sound like something she could relate to? I second Cesar over Victoria. I've only seen her show a few times, but some of her observations and methods seem "way out there".

[LabsChewShoes]

anyway, my point is,,,make her work for her food. harsh, but the only way. as caesar says, quit feeling sorry for her, you want to hwlp, remember she is a dog, as a dog, in a pack, the way she acts would put her at the bottom, only whats left is what she can eat, she would be at the bottom of the pack, but you are giving her the dominant role and rewarding her skittish behavior and not expecting more, so if this came out the wrong way, but as i have been through this a couple times, the only way it ever worked is whrn i finally said,,,my way. you have her trust to an extent,,,,try this for 3 days, please, i really think she is ready for that step.....i hope i am not coming off as a know it all brat,,,,but you need to have this success as much as she needs it!! i am rooting for you!

[MunchkinsMom]

Thank you all for your great suggestions, and support. I am very happy to report that the "tough love" and a change in treats resulted in a big giant step for Angel tonight.

While at the grocery store, I picked up some soft stinky dog treats, and some Pedigree wet food that comes in individual pouches.

When I went to the barn to feed lunch and unload the feed, shavings, and dog food, Angel was sleeping under the trailer. I put one of the soft treats on the barn support, and went about my business. She ate it, and must have really liked it, because she was sniffing around and hanging around the barn, then when there was no more treats, she went back to napping under the trailer.

Four hours later I went down to do my chores of deep cleaning stalls, cleaning water buckets, etc. I put another treat on the barn support, and went about my business. She ate it, and again, sniffed around, actually coming to the barn aisle entrance, then went back to lay outside, but very close to the barn.

Now for the best part! I put a pouch of the wet food in her bowl, took it out in my hand so she could smell it (from a 5 foot distance), then I brought it back into the barn, and started cleaning. She would come to the barn entrance, but then sort of back off - I could tell it was really hard for her, so I didn't say anything to her at all. As I started on the second stall, I caught sight of her out of the corner of my eye, standing still as a statue right outside the tack stall door, sniffing the air. So I acted like I didn't see her, and kept cleaning. It took her 5 minutes to go 2 feet to get into the tack stall - she would take one step and freeze for 60 seconds, and then take another step, freeze again. . .until she got to the bowl. Then she stood there for a few seconds, and ate the food, which took her about 4 minutes to eat. This is the one time I wish I had a full size door on the tack stall, and not the open bottom track style door! Maybe I need to figure out how to create a "trap door" sort of thing, that I could flip down to block the bottom exit and get her contained in the tack room.

For her to come into the barn while I was in there and actually eat (not a snatch and run with the treat) was a huge step for her! After she ate, she laid back down right outside the barn doorway. Anyone driving by would think she was a well trained farm dog, waiting for her owner to finish the chores.

She also gave me a sign that she feels like the farm is her property. One of my neighbors was out riding his horse, and stopped at the fence line so we could chat. As I was walking out to talk with him, Angel (who was laying halfway between the barn and the fence at that point) actually jumped up and barked loudly at him, in a guard-dog voice - not the happy bark that she greets me with. But she didn't run towards him at all.

Also, the fact that she can sleep out in the open while I am bustling about doing chores makes me feel that she feels comfortable in my presence (within her comfort zone that is), and it is just a matter of time until she will allow me to touch her.

[Jaegermonster]

That is wonderful! I have been following along all this time.
I would do this again a couple of more days before you try to shut her in there.
You don't want to wreck the little bit of trust you have gained by all of a sudden shutting her in.
And the barking at the friend is a good sign. Once they decide that it's their house too you are well on your way :)

[Milocalwinnings]

This is an awesome update!!!

I actually think it's good that you didn't have a door to trap her in the tack stall this time. Because of that, she realized that she could safely go in there without threat. If it were me, I'd do that a couple more times to get her comfortable with going in there and then work on building some sort of latched bottom that you could close.

Keep in mind, she probably won't be happy about being closed in.... but at least you would then be able to get her confined and get her to a vet to get spayed. Once she comes home from the vet, perhaps keep her on a lead with you for a while so she gets used to being with you instead of just being around you.

[MunchkinsMom]

Thanks guys, the thought of a "trap door" was a spur of the moment thought as I was typing the update, and by the time I figure out how to do it, and actually get it done, hopefully it won't be needed :). I agree that I don't want to undo any progress we have made in the past 6 months - wow, this has been a long process.

She has been going into the tack room for months, just not while I am in the barn, she usually waits until the coast is clear - meaning either I am in the house, or on the tractor (she is smart enough to know she has at least 10 minutes while I am spreading manure before I get back to the barn). Also the past two nights she has been taking the old bath carpet out of the tackroom and playing with it in the field, I find it out there in the morning. This was the carpet that she brought "home" two months ago, I have no idea where she found it originally.

[Buffyblue]

That's great news! I'm so excited for you!

[Joy Karr]

Your story is better than the soaps or a romance novel. You may want to contact Dynamite Marketing in Boise, Idaho. They have herbal tranqualizers that don't taste or smell. You could spray it on her food, treats etc. When I walked Humane Society dogs, I used to soak the biscuits befor I went in to the kennel. It mellowed out the larger dogs especially so they didn't pull so hard shen we walked thru the trails. www.dynamitemarketing.com

[CB/TB]

Great news! Feeding her in the tack room for several days will put her at ease as long as she has an escape route. Once she realizes you really don't care, and are able to go back and forth by the door with no acknowledgement of her things will progress. Also, how about, when you do get a chance to lock her in while she eats, do you think you could risk letting her out again after she's finished? A few days of knowing she will be allowed to leave might make her even more at ease. You really don't want to confine her to the tack room for several days. If you could find an empty stall that she could use as a kennel- type confined area and easy to clean later, start feeding her there. Wonderful breakthrough for you and her! Keep up the good wokr and the reports!

[MunchkinsMom]

Great news! Feeding her in the tack room for several days will put her at ease as long as she has an escape route. Once she realizes you really don't care, and are able to go back and forth by the door with no acknowledgement of her things will progress. Also, how about, when you do get a chance to lock her in while she eats, do you think you could risk letting her out again after she's finished? A few days of knowing she will be allowed to leave might make her even more at ease. You really don't want to confine her to the tack room for several days. If you could find an empty stall that she could use as a kennel- type confined area and easy to clean later, start feeding her there. Wonderful breakthrough for you and her! Keep up the good wokr and the reports!

I think that is an excellent suggestion.

This morning, she was wonderful, waiting by the barn, jumped up when she saw me coming, tail wagging, barking her "good morning" happy bark. So I offered her one bit of hot dog, she came and ate it, and I went into the barn. Fed the horses, tossed her one more treat that she had to come towards me to get, then I went back into the barn. As I was doing barn stuff, I noticed her at the end of the aisle again, sort of sniffing around and watching me. So, I turned the horses out, took Angel's food bowl (which still had some food from the night before, added a few treats, took it out and showed it to her, and put it inside the barn aisle, in a spot where she could see me put it. Then I started cleaning stalls. She once again came into the barn to the bowl (no hesitations this time, probably because it was not in the tack room) and calmly ate her breakfast as I cleaned stalls. I did speak softly to her without making any eye contact to tell her what a good brave pretty dog she is. It took her about 5-6 minutes to eat all the food, and when she was done, she went under the trailer to take a nap. So I put the bowl away until dinner time.

I am going to ask my neighbor to stop feeding her, to see if we can speed up the process a little bit by having only one food source. I know my neighbor really wants to be friends with this dog, but she might have to resign herself to the fact that Angel has a little bit more trust in me, and I don't say that in any sort of bragging way at all.

I am so proud of her this weekend, I am hoping this is a sign that we are getting closer to the goal.

[Dune]

I am going to ask my neighbor to stop feeding her, to see if we can speed up the process a little bit by having only one food source.

Definitely do that! :yes:

[shea'smom]

Yeah for progress! You sound like you have an excellent instinct for this! I am going out of town but will check in for happy updates!

[3horsemom]

mm, this is great news. did you remember to put one of your old t-shirts out for angel?
i am so happy and proud of you both!

[MunchkinsMom]

OMG - I couldn't wait to get in and post this!

At around 4 PM I had some friends from up north come to visit, and of course they wanted to go see the barn and the horses, so the pack of humans went down to the barn (three adults, 2 kids). Angel jumped up and went into alert mode. My friend asked if she was friendly, I said, well, you can't get near her, she is still a stray. My friends huband tried crouching down and talking to her as we were messing with the horses and I think that sort of freaked her a bit, so she went walk-about off my property. An hour later after they had gone home, I went down to try to find her, but she was not around, which made me a bit worried.

We had an excellent prime rib dinner (thanks to my DH's talents in the kitchen) and I put the scraps into a baggie for Angel.

Well, I just went down to take the fly masks off the horses and fill the water buckets and there she was, sleeping outside the barn. So I grabbed the bag of beef scraps and walked out to her. She was whining and wagging, and I tossed a bit so that she would have to come to me to get it, which she did very eagerly. Wow! She liked that beef so much that she came literally to within 4 inches of my foot - probably might have come closer if my pesky gelding didn't have to get into the act to see what she was eating!

So, I took the rest of the scraps into the barn, put them in the bowl in the tack room and started on the water buckets. Because my pesky gelding was now standing in front of the tack room door (begging for horse cookies), Angel went around to the other side of the barn and was sniffing about. So I got the bowl, put it inside the barn aisle (after showing it to her, and again, she was whining like a happy dog does), and went back to the water bucket filling task. She again came into the barn, and ate calmly (well, she gave the gelding the hairy eyeball as he was still at the other end of the barn).

Figures she would prefer the prime rib over hot dogs! I did tell the family that when they eat the leftovers tomorrow to please save any scraps for me.

And, even as I was heading back up to the house and had to walk right past Angel, she didn't run away, just moved to the side a bit, and then sat and watched me. I stopped to just talk to her for a few moments to tell her how proud I was of her!

[Jaegermonster]

That is fabulous news and wonderful progress. I don't think it will be long now, esp with more prime rib.

[MunchkinsMom]

Jaegermonster - love your signature line, especially when I wake up in the morning with 3 dogs sharing my bed!

One more bit of news, I was just out on the back screened in porch with my mother-in-law, watching the sunset, and my house dogs went on alert, at first I thought it was the squirrel in the back yard, and I looked, and there was Angel! I'm not sure if she was trying to find me, or following the squirrel. She didn't stay long, but that is also progress in my book.

[Jaegermonster]

Thanks! I'm a sucker for a pretty face too :)
I have 12 dogs altogether, 3 sleep in my bed. Hubby is deployed (again) so there's lots of room.
The rest have beds throughout the house and a couple sleep downstairs on the couch or chair. I do a lot of rescuing and fostering and most of them are rescues/fosters who never left for any variety of reasons. A couple had health problems that caused them to be fostered to me, and residual problems prevented them from being adoptable, some had behavior issues etc. A couple of them I found, one got tossed out of a car in front of me when she was a tiny puppy, one was the subject of a cruelty case that I made (arrested the owner, while the dog recovered I fostered her for many months and was eventually awarded the dog in court) and so on. The cruelty one was one that took a long time to socialize. For MONTHS I could not get anywhere near her if I had something in my hand, no matter what it was. She finally came around.


I love them all. I truly believe that God sends these animals to me for a reason, although I am not an overly "religious" person, I do believe that God has a purpose for each of us.
He sent you Angel for a reason. This story will have an AWESOME ending.

[MHM]

Yay! So glad to hear about so much progress! It's amazing what you can accomplish with food. :lol:

[Chief2]

MM, I am enjoying reading about your progress! Keep up the great work!

[MunchkinsMom]

Jaegermonster - bless you for saving all those dogs, and I will say a prayer for your DH's save return.

Since I moved here 5 years ago, I have been "blessed" with many strays, hence the reason I am on a first name basis with the AC officers. And for whatever reason, every dog that I have either turned in, or had AC come and pick up (after I have had them contained) has been adopted, not a one of them had to be euthanized. One was a litter of puppies that someone dumped up the road, another was a young dog not in my neighborhood, but was also dumped from a car, we saw it happen on our way to town to go to dinner, so we picked up the lovely dog, but had to bring him to the pound that Monday.

But Angel is special, and you are probably right, for whatever reason she was sent to me. It might be that Angel will take the place of my oldest dog (who will be 11 next month) in the hopefully distant future. And since Angel seems to be happiest living with the horses, she might just be my barn dog instead of a house dog, who knows?

[jetsmom]

Wonderful updates!!!

[Thomas_1]

Glad to see that progress is being made and her basic needs are being attended to.

This seems to be taking a very long time though. Very unusual considering you've got a pack of dogs of your own already. I know that over the decades we've occasionally had a stray turn up and most likely because we've a pack of friendly well adjusted dogs in situ. It's what dogs do. They eventually join the pack. Even when they're nervous and abandoned and afraid. They'll join a pack.

Isn't she making any attempt to come in to socialise with your dogs? What does she do when they're out and about? What are your dogs doing?

[Reds-n-Greys]

WOOHOO!! What wonderful updates!!! Yea for Angel!!

MM - your patience will soon be rewarded with the most awesome barn doggie ever!

[FootPerfect]

Awesome posts, it is so fun to read!

[witherbee]

Great progress MM! So glad that Angel seems happy and is getting closer. That first head pat and ear scratch will be so meaningful and well-earned for both of you! Fingers crossed that she lets you touch her soon.

[MunchkinsMom]

Isn't she making any attempt to come in to socialise with your dogs? What does she do when they're out and about? What are your dogs doing?

She makes no attempt to make any contact with my dogs, and she has nothing to prevent it, other than a fence with no-climb that would keep them apart. My dogs do not go into the pasture or the barn with me, three of the dogs are terrified of the horses, and the other dog is not trustworthy enough (my mother-in-laws Rhodesian cross) to take out there. Yesterday was the first time I have seen Angel in the back yard in daylight, I know that she has come up at night (little dog mine evidence left behind). The few times in the past that we were out walking the dogs, she would slink away if we tried to approach her with our house dogs on leash.

When my dogs do see her in the field, they bark at her. So maybe they have set their territories between the house and the pastures.

This morning Angel was again waiting for me, and I discovered that she will not come in to the barn to eat if the horses are in the barn (even behind bars in their stalls). This morning, I tossed her some hot dog bits, and she was making progress when one neighbor drove by and shouted some encouraging words, which had the opposite effect, it made Angel nervous. So, I went into the barn, prepared her breakfast, showed her the bowl, and put it inside the barn at the end of the aisle. She really wanted it, but would not come in until the horses were done eating and had gone outside to graze. Then she came in and calmly ate while I cleaned stalls.

For some reason, she dug a very deep hole near the water pipe outside the barn this morning, and I filled it backin, and she dug it out again - I wonder what she was after. When I caught her re-digging the hole, I shook my finger at her and said "No Digging", because I don't need any holes for horse to fall into in the field. Then I filled it back in again. She did not re-dig it when I went down for lunch.

[MunchkinsMom]

I have to tell you all something cute that Angel did last night. I went to put the horses to bed between thunderstorms (it is nasty weather here today), and noticed that one of my fly masks was not hanging on the hook. I figured it most likely blew away in the wind. So I grabbed the flashlight, and flashed it around, trying to see if I could see it out in the field. Nope - but I did see Angel laying out in the field not to far from the barn.

Well, this morning (dodging more rain) I went down to feed and turnout the horses, and due to the storms, Angel was nowhere in sight - hopefully hunkered down in the abandoned farm next door - but there in the field was the missing fly mask - and the now soaking wet bath rug that she must have dragged out of the barn again sometime last night. So I guess she was actually laying on the fly mask while I was looking for it!

I wonder if that was her way of trying to stay close to her "pack" of horses. She didn't chew on it.

[lcw579]

What a great series of updates. I can't wait to hear all about the first time she lets you give her a pat. I am so addicted to this story, I can't wait for the happy ending. :)

[MunchkinsMom]

I can't wait either! At lunchtime (and even now) she is laying in the field with the horses grazing nearby. She dragged the soaking wet bath rug back out to the field again, not sure what is up with that. I put it on the concrete wash rack to dry, let's see how long it stays there. She must be pretty strong, because that sucker was heavy.

I do have some leftover prime rib to entice her with tonight, but I don't have a ton of time to spend, so I will save some for tomorrow too.

[MunchkinsMom]

Dang this dog has good taste in food! At dinner time, I went out with the prime rib tidbits in a baggie in my pocket. First I had to go fetch the bath rug out of the field again - she seems to like this game!

Then I put the horses in, and went out with the steak....well....she layed there whining and wagging, and let me get really close. Then the baggie came out, and she leaped up, and ran towards me, tail up, happy as a clam. So, I tossed a few pieces, so that she had to come to me - this time to about 6 inches from my feet, but she would not come closer.

So, back to the barn I went, put one bit on the corner post, put the rest in her bowl, and fed the horses. As I was feeding, she ate the piece on the post, and then laid down outside the barn door.

I showed her the bowl again, told her it was in the barn, and put it back in the tack stall, and started sweeping the aisle. She came in, with only one moment of hesitation, and went into the tack room to eat. I did speak to her the whole time, but didn't try to approach her yet.

It was so heartwarming to see her so happy to see me (well, happy to see me with beef that is), and getting more comfortable about being in the barn with me.

Guess I need to go to the store and get some inexpensive cuts of beef to cook up for her. So much for the cheap hot dogs.

[MHM]

Guess I need to go to the store and get some inexpensive cuts of beef to cook up for her. So much for the cheap hot dogs.

Yes, indeed, the process is almost done- she's going to have you trained up in no time! :lol:

[jetsmom]

Next time, after you've given her a piece of beef (or fried chicken!...it's cheaper), try sitting down/chouching and face away from her and extend your arm out behind you with the piece of food. Stay there resisting the urge to look, and see if she'll take it from your hand. If she does, leave your hand there for a few seconds to let her sniff it.

[CB/TB]

And, as she comes forward try backing up and saying "come", and "good girl' as she comes forward. You be the one to stop after a few steps and see what happens. A few tidbits as a reward for forward movement is nice. Keep moving teh bowl further and further into the tack room so when the time comes you'll have plenty of time to slide the barrier across. She's weakening! keep up the good work and keep the posts coming!

[MunchkinsMom]

I'm happy to report that we are having steak again for dinner! So hopefully more progress will happen this evening.

This morning, I went out to feed/turnout, and Angel was waiting for me. I fed the horses, and went out with hot dog in hand (ran out of steak last night). She got up, stretched, wagged her tail, barked, and came towards me before I tossed the tidbit. I did the backwards stepping thing after tossing another tidbit, that seemed to confuse her, so I just turned and went back to the barn, got the horses ready for turnout, and put some wet dog food in Angels bowl, showed it to her, and put it down right in front of the tack room door. And started cleaning stalls....in about 3 minutes she came in and ate the food - not all of it - but most. I did talk to her from the stall I was cleaning, so she can get used to eating and hearing my voice, and that didn't seem to bother her.

One difference today, I used to leave the uneaten food out, today I put it away, and will offer it again at lunchtime, and if she choses not to eat it then while I am there, it will get put away again until dinner. I did just see her wandering around outside the barn, not sure if she is looking for the food or a shady place to sleep.

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, steak is a great motivator! I didn't feed the horses or Angel until after dinner, and scrounged one small piece of steak to take to the barn. I put the horses in their stalls, tossed one bit of steak to Angel, put one on the corner post, put the rest in her bowl in the tack room, and went in the tack/feed room to dish out the horses feed. Out of the corner of my eye, I could see Angel inching towards the tack room while I was in it. I went about my business, walked past her with the feed buckets and doled out dinner to the horses. She stayed right there at the edge of the aisle as I scurred about, and I stayed in one stall a bit to give the last horse a scratch, and Angel came in to eat. I then walked back into the tack room to put away the empty buckets, and she scampered out, but then as soon as I left the tack room, she went right back in to get the rest of the steak, without even waiting for me to get out of sight.

I did talk to her, and made some eye contact as she was coming in and out to eat, and after she ate the last bit, she came into the aisle where I was - about 12 feet away, and looked at me licking her chops as if to say "yummy, is there any more?" I did put some wet chicken dog food in the bowl, and she did come in and eat it, but only while I was out messing with the hose, so I guess the wet dog food is no where near as good as steak.

I'm sure my house dogs would be really mad if they knew what I was feeding Angel!

[MunchkinsMom]

Another step forward tonight! I went out with "steak bits in a bag", put the horses in their stalls, went out to where Angel was laying, talking in my high happy doggie voice to her, and she jumped up, barked, and ran towards me, like any normal happy-to-see-you dog would. . . until she got to within about 6 feet, so I tossed one bit, and she raced to get it. I dropped one more much closer, and she sat and stared at me. So, I went back to the barn, put the rest in the bowl, showed her the bowl, and started doling out horse feed.

Angel came right up to the edge of the tack room door, staring at me as if to say, "hurry up in there"! So, I went to feed the horses, which means walking past her, and she only backed up about a foot to let me by. As I fed the last horse, she was heading into the tack room, I decided to just do what I had to do, so I picked up the buckets, and headed to the tack room, she jumped back, and then started barking at me and leaping about in the sand about 2 feet away from me, like a very normal happy dog would. Sort of like my house dogs at feeding time.

So I grabbed the shedding blade, and started shedding my old mare while she ate, and Angel came calmly into the barn and ate. And I did talk with her the whole time, and made plenty of eye contact, but made sure that I kept my boy language as non-threatening as possible.

Tomorrow she gets leftover kielbasa, unless my husband eats it for lunch!

[SevenDogs]

Like so many others, I am completely hooked on this thread! :)

[allpurpose]

Ohhh, you are SOOOO close to getting her ! I can't stand the suspense! This is the best bedtime reading EVER! Hoping your steak budget doesn't run out...:lol::lol:


We need some more pics -steak bits and Angel, tack room dog dish and Angel, sodden bathroom rug and Angel...you get the picture!

[CB/TB]

If she stayed about a foot away from you when you left the tack room, how about saving one piece of goodie to hold out as you pass? If she's that close and has had the good stuff, maybe she'll break down and take the piece you offer. As she comes toward you , gve the "come" command, and good dog. Also , as she goes to sit, say "sit". Word association might eventually get her to actually do it when you say it. The time is getting very close, I think. You just might have yourself a dog!

[MunchkinsMom]

If she stayed about a foot away from you when you left the tack room, how about saving one piece of goodie to hold out as you pass? If she's that close and has had the good stuff, maybe she'll break down and take the piece you offer. As she comes toward you , gve the "come" command, and good dog. Also , as she goes to sit, say "sit". Word association might eventually get her to actually do it when you say it. The time is getting very close, I think. You just might have yourself a dog!

I think that is an excellent idea, I will have to keep a few tidbits in my hand to offer her as I walk about.

This morning she didn't come into the barn while I was there, but I was in a rush this morning, someone scheduled early morning meetings at work - ARG! So I will see how she is at lunchtime - and will be sure to bring some goodies with me.

[MunchkinsMom]

Lunchtime and dinner were successful in the progress department. Today's treat du jour was kielbasa.

I went down at lunchtime, and Angel came out from under the trailer, and laid down where she could see me while I put the horses in. So far, she does not come in to the barn on her own until I let her know that there are treats to be had. When the horses were in their stalls, I went out towards her, and she started whining, then jumped up and ran towards me, so I started saying, come, come Angel, good girl, and tossed her a piece of keilbasa, put one on the corner post, and the rest in her new larger metal bowl. She came right up to the barn as I was scooping feed into the buckets in the tack stall, and went right in to eat when I started giving the feed to the horses.

After that, I did get a chance to chat with my neighbor, to tell her about the progress and to ask her not to feed her anymore, at least until we can get her caught. She agreed, but had just picked up more heartworm and flea pills, so I told her it was okay to feed her tonight then, so she gets that done. She was very happy to hear the progress, and I promised her that she would be the second person to pet Angel if and when we get her "domesticated".

At dinner, more kielbasa, same routine, but this time, she was so excited, her whole body was wiggling, and she was rushing and leaping like a normal dog would! And she came to within 4-6 inches of me to get the two treats that I tossed for her. And. . . she followed me to the barn for the rest, and only waited a few moments before coming in to get them from the bowl.

After all these months (my neighbor reminded me it was May 1, 2008 when the two dogs were dumped out here) it amazes me that suddenly she is making so much progress so quickly. For those of you that have experience in this, does that seem normal? I keep waiting for some sign of regression, and so far (knocking on wood) I haven't seen any this week.

Ok, off to get take out for the family. I'll keep everyone posted on any weekend progress.

[jetsmom]

That seems normal. It took about 8 months to get Rusty to come w/in 3 feet of me, but then I had him letting me pat him, and get a collar on him/catch him w/in a month later.

[MHM]

Wouldn't it be great if you could celebrate the anniversary of her arrival by petting her? :sadsmile:

Hats off to you (and your neighbor) for all your efforts!

[3horsemom]

this is real progress i hope. mm, i think you are going to have yourself one fine dog!!

[MunchkinsMom]

Thanks everyone. I think my neighbor felt a bit sad, I know she was hoping that Angel would become her dog early on, but I think she now realizes that perhaps this is turning out for the best.

I'm watching Dogtown on TV, and they have a shy dog that they are trying to befriend on the show right now, and the dog looks a lot like Angel, it brought tears to my eyes. And confirmed that with shy, frightened dogs, that tiny steps of progress and not doing anything to scare the dog is the way to go, so I guess my gut instincts were correct on how to handle her situation.

It also confirms that if AC had captured her, she probably would have been evaluated as not adoptable due to her shyness, so this really tells me that for whatever reason she belongs here.

[Buffyblue]

I saw that episode on Dogtown too! I'm a great believer in the idea that our animals come to us for a reason. I really think you have yourself a doggie!

[FalseImpression]

I just love this story and I am really hoping that Angel will become your friend. She is making progress, slowly but surely. I chuckle at her diet!! lucky girl!!
Good luck to both of you...

[MunchkinsMom]

I need more steak! I bought some frozen meatballs today, and she likes them, and will come into the barn to eat them, but not as happy as when I have real beef in my hands! And I did heat them up first. She won't even touch the dog food now, not even the wet food.

This morning she was laying right outside the barn waiting for breakfast (which was hot dogs), and she did come in and eat them while I was feeding the horses - but not while I was in the feed room, as soon as I stepped into the first stall, she went in to eat. She did the same with the meatballs at lunch and dinner, and did get excited when I brought her a dog biscuit after she ate the meatballs.

She's an interesting dog, after she eats, she lays right outside the barn while I do chores, just lays there, watching out, almost like a regular farm dog guarding her property.

[Auventera Two]

It took over 2 months - almost 3 months to finally catch my Pit Bull. But now he sleeps in my bed and is a wonderful part of the family! :D So keep up the good work, and hang in there! Your girl is beautiful and your hard work will be well rewarded. :)

[ptownevt]

She's an interesting dog, after she eats, she lays right outside the barn while I do chores, just lays there, watching out, almost like a regular farm dog guarding her property.

She is guarding her property. Clearly she has made your farm her home. It is also clear that she loves and trusts you. She will be the best dog you've ever had.

Pam

[Over the Hill]

Some years ago, I "borrowed" a German Shepherd bitch from a friend to be the night watch at my stables. She was a true junk yard dog, having lived her life chained to a trailer in a junk yard. She had had a litter of pups that had been taken from her. She was very stand-offish, did not associate with humans, ignored my Irish Wolfhound puppies, ignored the cats, but roamed the property at will. She was difficult to catch, extremely aggressive towards certain people ( men in particular) and from time to time I would have to leash her when workmen were present. She would growl ( seriously growl, with raised hackles and all teeth bared ). She actually escorted a hired day worker out of the tack room by the seat of his pants one day. Day laborers were not allowed in the barn.

But in time she became the most wonderful dog. She would always be there, whether I was in the south acreage mowing, she would find a high spot to lay and watch, when I went out riding, she would always have me in her sights. I don't think I ever heard her bark. No matter where I was on the property or what I was doing, I could see her watching from a distance.

I never worried about my safety and security while Sheba was on the job. She would be waiting at the front gate every morning for me to arrive. She would escort me to the gate in the evenings when I left.

Though she never became a "pet" I understood that she could not , but she served me faithfully for years. It may be that your Angel will be like Sheba, unable to be the pet that we think all dogs should be, but do not underestimate her ability to acknowledge your kindness to her. . . and serve you as well, in her own way. . .

Yours is a wonderful saga, and I find myself eagerly searching for your updates.

Best of luck to you and "your" Angel.

[MunchkinsMom]

I could hardly wait to post this, but as we all know, weekends are devoted to barn chores!

This morning, I went to the barn, hot dog in hand, and as I opened the gate (which is about 150 feet from the barn), Angel jumped up from where she was laying next to the barn, and barked and then RAN to me, tail wagging the whole way. For a moment my heart almost stopped, and she actually ran to the side of me, and wagged her tail waiting for her treats! As she was running towards me, I upped my energy levels, to happy/excited, and called her as she was running, so that she could associate her name and the word "come" with the action. It was so exciting! I felt badly that all I had was hot dogs. She did come into the barn to eat them while the horses were eating.

For dinner we had pork roast, so I put the stew beef in the refridgerator to cook up for her later this week. I took some of the roast with me to the barn. My daughter came with me. When I went out with the meat, I told my daughter to stay in the barn, but in sight. Again, Angel got up, barked, and ran to me again. And came to within 2 inches of my foot to get her treats. But she would not come into the barn while my daughter was there.

Each time I do try to offer her some from my hand, but she doesn't seem to be quite ready for that yet. I am just thrilled with the progress that she is making now.

I have to go away next weekend for a whole day, I did show my mother in law the food bowls (one for dry, the other for the wet food and table scraps), but since Angel doesn't really "know" my mother in law, she most likely will not come in to eat while she is there, so I told her it was okay to just leave the food out for her while I was gone.

[shea'smom]

Good girl Angel!

[jetsmom]

How exciting!!! Just wait...pretty soon she WILL be eating out of your hand!

[CB/TB]

Try saving a piece of the goodies she just had for dinner to offer her on the way by. If she gets the scent of the good stuff she just had,she might make the leap of faith and take it from you. Good job! Keep up with the "angel, come" and eventually, hopefully, she will when you ask> Try it with "sit", too. As soon as you see her ready/begin to sit, say it.

[MunchkinsMom]

Angel is mad at my neighbor for not feeding her. Last night when there was no food to be had, she dragged her toys out of my neighbors barn, and ripped the snout off of one of the teddy bears. She also dragged one of her barn towels out into the field. I got all this in a conversation over the fence about 30 minutes ago. And the whole time we were talking, Angel was just laying on the fenceline listening to us. When I said I was sorry, my neighbor said, don't worry about it, it is for the best for the dog, that Angel will get over her latest snit. Oh, she's also back to the "drag the bathrug" game, I had to go fetch that out of the field this morning.

She did come to greet me this morning, but not with enthusiasm, because it was raining. For breakfast she didn't come in while I was there, but I was in a bit of a rush to make a meeting. At lunch I had meatballs in hand, and she came out from under the trailer to greet me, and she did come in to the barn to eat the rest while I was cleaning stalls. Every time I crouch down to offer her a bit from my hand, she jumps back away from me, so I guess she is still not ready, but I will keep trying.

Oh, I did give her a dog biscuit, and she buried it! Silly dog.

[jetsmom]

Are you crouched down facing away from her with your hand extended behind you? Crounching down in front of a dog can sometimes appear to be a "Pounce" position that a predator would take before attacking (and would seem threatening to the dog). Make sure you are facing away, with your arm outstratched behind you w/the food.

[MunchkinsMom]

Are you crouched down facing away from her with your hand extended behind you? Crounching down in front of a dog can sometimes appear to be a "Pounce" position that a predator would take before attacking (and would seem threatening to the dog). Make sure you are facing away, with your arm outstratched behind you w/the food.

Thanks, I will try that. Might take a while, she is very suspicious of anything that is not the normal routine, so sometimes it takes a few times before any change becomes the new normal for her.

At lunchtime I went down, and before I got to the gate, I could see her in the barn aisle, so I called her, she started wagging her tail, and once again came running towards me, and we might have made more progress if my yougest gelding didn't decide to get in on the act! I couldn't tell if Munchkin (the horse) was trying to "herd" Angel or just join the game (he is cutting-horse bred).

[CB/TB]

If she'll go by you fairly close, try just extending the hand with the goodie to the side and looking away from her ( try not crouching) just chattering to her or doing what you usually do that doesn't scare her. Maybe talk to the horses or an imaginary friend. Ignore her , but hold the goodie out and maybe after a few passes she'll take the hint that the good stuff is there for the taking. If she doesn't take it, too bad for her- in the house it goes with you until the next attempt.

[MunchkinsMom]

If she'll go by you fairly close, try just extending the hand with the goodie to the side and looking away from her ( try not crouching) just chattering to her or doing what you usually do that doesn't scare her. Maybe talk to the horses or an imaginary friend. Ignore her , but hold the goodie out and maybe after a few passes she'll take the hint that the good stuff is there for the taking. If she doesn't take it, too bad for her- in the house it goes with you until the next attempt.

I think I will try that tonight with more pork roast, whenever I have the "good stuff" then she will come much closer to me. I'll keep the updates coming.

[MunchkinsMom]

Today's meals consisted of a combination of hot dogs, meatballs, and stew beef. At breakfast, she was waiting near the barn and when she saw me coming, she went to the spot close to the barn aisle and waited. I went out to her, and instead of jumping up and barking, she laid there with a soft whine, wagged her tail, and then got up and got excited when she saw the food. I gave her one piece, put another on the post, and the rest in the barn. She didn't come in until I was putting the horses fly masks on while they ate.

Then she slept under the trailer during the hottest part of the day. She did come out to eat a treat at lunchtime, but went back to sleep instead of checking the barn for more food.

Tonight more combinations, and again she came to her spot to wait. I put the horses in their stalls, gave her one piece of food, and then tried holding out my hand with another piece, standing with my back to her, but she would not come to get it. So I went into the barn with the bowl of food. As I was setting up the horse feed, I could see Angel standing at the tack room doorway, just watching to see if I was done or not. I stayed in there for almost two minutes, and she gave up and went back to her spot outside. So I fed the horses, and started grooming my old mare while she ate in her stall. Angel came in and very calmly ate her dinner. I did speak to her through the wall and it didn't seem to bother her.

Bit by bit, she is trusting me a little more every day.

Oh, after she ate dinner, she went back to her spot, I stuck my head out to tell her she was a good girl, and she belched at me! I know that is considered to be a compliment on the meal in some countries. When the horses finished eating, I went back out to Angel with a dog biscuit, and she was funny, jumped up and did a little happy dog dance, but when I tossed the biscuit, she jumped away, so I went into "game mode" and ran over and snatched up the biscuit and she did more happy dog dance, so then I tossed it to her, and she grabbed it and laid down to eat it. I can just picture being able to play with her in hopefully the near future.

[Foxhound]

Keep up the good work!
I love the "Angel Updates" and I check this page for them almost every day!

[3horsemom]

angel is quite the gourmet!! i wonder if your other dogs are looking out the window saying "hey............bring that prime rib back!!"

[Paddys Mom]

When the horses finished eating, I went back out to Angel with a dog biscuit, and she was funny, jumped up and did a little happy dog dance, but when I tossed the biscuit, she jumped away, so I went into "game mode" and ran over and snatched up the biscuit and she did more happy dog dance, so then I tossed it to her, and she grabbed it and laid down to eat it. I can just picture being able to play with her in hopefully the near future.

My dog and I play that game. :)
I give him a cookie and then he drops it and waits for me to try to pick it up before he grabs it and runs. I run and yell, "My cookie! My cookie!" and he play bows and spins around.

I check this thread every day. :yes:

[MunchkinsMom]

This morning, I was actually early for a change, and Angel was waiting out in the field, sort of surveying the neighborhood for activity. I called her, but she stayed put, so I put the meat in the dish, and took it out to her, and she stayed in place, sort of whining, and didn't move. I stopped within about 6 inches of her, and dropped a piece of meat, and she inched forward on her stomach and ate it. I showed her the bowl, put one treat on the barn post, and put the bowl in the barn. She ate the post treat, and then laid in her spot, waiting for the coast to be clear. Once the horses were done eating, and turned out, she still didn't come in until I was on the second stall, and then she came in to eat.

At dinner, I was running late, and she was not under the trailer or anywhere to be found. I called the horses to come in for dinner, and Angel followed them to the barn, as if she was just one of the herd. She laid down to wait, and again I went out with the bowl of meat, and this time she didn't move til I got close to her, then she came towards me, to within about 6 inches, and did another bowing-doggie-dance, whining, wagging, and swiping in my direction with her front feet! So, two treats went to her outside, and the rest in the barn. And again, she came to the barn, peeking in the feed room to see if I was done, and this time as soon as I started feeding the horses, she came in to eat the food in the bowl.

Just now I was heading down to take the fly masks off the horses, and Angel was barking at lord knows what, going in and out of the barn until I got down there, then she went back outside to lay down.

She still will not take food from my hand, I think starting next week I will stop dropping food to her, I will offer it from my hand, and if she doesn't take it, it will go back into the barn with me, and see what happens.

[Go Fish]

This thread is sort of like a journal...you should print it out and write a childrens' book about it. It's quite a story!

I check this thread every day...no doubt you'll have her soon! :yes:

[MHM]

Stopping 6 inches away?!? Boy, she's really splitting hairs on you! Continued good luck!

[CB/TB]

Sounds like progress! Are you saying "come" as she moves toward you? I enjoy the "journal" too, so keep up the posts. Waiting for the photo of you and her together!

[Reds-n-Greys]

So close and yet so far! Come on Angel! You can do it! MM (and the rest of us) loffs you!

[Chief2]

It's coming! Stay with it! You're almost there! Think of it this way. Instead of buying a horse and having it test you for 6 months after the fact, she's getting it all out of the way first before inking her paw print onto the document.

You could always call your book Tested by an Angel. :D

[MunchkinsMom]

It's coming! Stay with it! You're almost there! Think of it this way. Instead of buying a horse and having it test you for 6 months after the fact, she's getting it all out of the way first before inking her paw print onto the document.

You could always call your book Tested by an Angel. :D

I love that title! I'll give you credit for it when I write the book.

I sure do think she will be a very loyal farm dog after all this "test driving" that we are doing.

This morning, again she was waiting close to the barn, some of the dry dog food had been eaten, but not all of it (I leave that out all the time). So I fed the horses, put her food in the bowl, went out to give her one treat, and she stayed put with her little whiney talk, ate the treat, and I put the bowl back in the barn. She waited until I started putting on the fly masks to come in to eat, and it didn't phase her when I walked past the tack room while she was eating.

However, after breakfast, I saw her back out in the field tossing something around with glee, rolling on it, etc. I thought to myself "Good Lord, what dead thing did she bring home this time?". Found it later, looked to be perhaps the remains of a snake - UHG - which I gingerly tossed over the fence to get it out of the field.

Tonight, she was not around at dinner time, so I called her, put the horses in, and sure enough, she came trotting up to the barn and laid in her waiting spot. I fed the horses, made her dinner, went out with the bowl in hand, she sat up and sort of "talked" to me, like my house dogs do when they are excited about dinner. I put the bowl in the barn, grabbed the shedding blade, and tackled the wolly mammoth mare again, and Angel came in and calmly ate, then went back outside. What was interesting is that she laid about 3 feet from the barn in the sand, for the whole 45 minutes that I was doing barn chores. I did talk to her the whole time. It really felt as if she was just the farm dog watching her owner.

[Dune]

What was interesting is that she laid about 3 feet from the barn in the sand, for the whole 45 minutes that I was doing barn chores. I did talk to her the whole time. It really felt as if she was just the farm dog watching her owner.

Where's the "fuzzy feeling" emoticon when you need it??? :yes::sadsmile::cool:

[CB/TB]

h ow about taking a day and NOT leaving the dry food out. If she's good and hungry at night she might take the leap of faith and go for the goodie. If the neighbor isn't feeding her any more you might have a shot. Now she knows there is always food there she can take her sweet time getting close- not hungry enough, she'll wait you out and come back later to finish. Feed her breakfast , then pick up the dry food until dinner. It might take a day or two, but eventually she'll know to eat NOW , where ever the dish is( right at your feet, in the tack room, inn your hand) or wait until the next feeding. You'll still give her the two meals a day, but she'll have to eat it when you feed her, where you feed her. Yeah, i'm waiting for the book, too! Any word from Cesar?

[MunchkinsMom]

No word back from Cesar's group other than a notification that they got the video and application. I'm sure it is not like they show on TV, where he just jumps in his vehicle to the rescue!

Angel hardly touches the dry food, I'm going to leave it for this weekend, because I will be out of town for 48 hours. I will leave some of the "good stuff" for my mother-in-law to put in the bowl when she feeds the horses, so the training will have to wait til Sunday - maybe Angel will be so happy to see me that things will change, who knows.

She was about the same this morning, laying in her spot, I gave her one bit of food, put the rest in the barn, she came in while I was puttering in the tack room and stared at me, and as soon as I stepped out of the room and into a stall to tend to a horse, she walked right in and ate. Eventually I am going to park my butt on a stool in the tack room and see if she will come in while I am in there.

What was cute was after breakfast, she grabbed what is left of the Jolly Ball (she has completely chewed off the handle), and was tossing it about, leaping on it, having herself a good romp out there. You have to picture that this is a horse sized ball, I don't even know how she manages to carry it, never mind tossing it around. I estimate that she only weighs between 40-50 pounds.

My apologies, you will all have to wait til Sunday for the next update.

[Buffyblue]

My apologies, you will all have to wait til Sunday for the next update.

I'm going to feel very deprived of my Angel update! LOL! Great work so far. I'd love to see you guys on Dog Whisperer! :D

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, I could bring the laptop, but I won't have any updates to report, so I might as well just leave it home!

Right now she is sleeping under the trailer in the shade. It's starting to get hot out, I bet she goes to play in the sprinklers this afternoon.

[Joy Karr]

You are doing a great job both with Angel and in keeping all of us informed and entertained. When you write the book, plan a book tour and bring Angel so we can all meet her. Holding my breath til sunday.

[CB/TB]

I just thought of this, so it may be a moot point by the time you read posts- if you read them AFTER you do the Angel thing--- BUT. If she doesn't get any goodies while you're gone - just dry food, do you think she'd take the leap of faith and accept a handout of good stuff??? Straight from the hand that feeds her. She's decided that she wants to live there with you, so this might be the time to take the plunge. Hope you had a good weekend.

[allpurpose]

I think MIL should have been given access to this thread so SHE could keep us updated!!!!:lol::lol::lol:

Hope she's thawing the steaks out for a welcome home dinner for Munchkins Mom on Sunday night!;)

[MHM]

Eagerly awaiting a Sunday update. Maybe Angel will be so happy to see MM she'll jump up and lick her face! :lol:

[Buffyblue]

I wonder if she's tried PEANUT BUTTER!

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, after a rather tiring weekend visiting both my parents (Mom in one town, Dad and his wife in another), I made it home this afternoon, to discover that Angel was AWOL.

I guess when my MIL went to feed Saturday AM, Angel was waiting in her spot, my MIL spoke to her, but didn't try to approach her, put the food in the bowl, and brought the horses in for breakfast (the horses stayed outside overnight with free access to the stalls so I would not have too much mess to clean after a 48 hour abscence). One of the horse got too close to Angel, so she jumped up and took off. But. . . she did come and eat the food that was left in the bowl, she just didn't eat while my MIL was in sight.

So, when I got home, I went do feed the horses, and called Angel, and she didn't come, and after the horses were fed, I went out and picked some piles in the pasture, hoping that if she saw me that she would come, but no luck. So, I left the food in the bowl and came back to the house to eat my own dinner.

After dinner we were on the porch and my MIL said "there she is, just leaving the barn". I had a baggie full of scraps from the pot roast we had for dinner, so I grabbed them, called Angel and headed out to the barn. She ran around to the other side of the barn to her "spot" and waited for me. She was happy to see me, with beef in hand, sat up, and barked, then jumped up and stared at me as if to say "where the heck where you?". So I gave her some beef, and I tried offering it from my hand, but once again, no dice. ( She still comes to within inches of me, and will also let me walk out to her very close, but not enough to make physical contact.) Then I gave her one dog biscuit, and put the other in her bowl in the barn. She is funny with the biscuits, she grabs them and then sort of sits there with them for a minute, with one end sticking out of her mouth, I will have to try to get a picture of it. Then she laid down and ate it, and I started on the water bucket chores. She snuck in while I was getting the hose, and grabbed the other biscuit, and laid outside with it in her mouth, just watching me lug buckets out to empty them - with the biscuit sticking straight out like a green tongue.

So, at least I know she is okay, and not too mad at me, and we will continue with the "training".

Humm. . . peanut butter. . . haven't tried that yet. Should I put it on crackers or something? The issue with sticky food is that when I toss it to her, it gets a bit of grass and sand on it, I would think that peanut butter might be something that will have to be fed in the bowl?

[Reds-n-Greys]

MM - Glad to hear you're home.

But please , don't scare us like that!! AWOL!! You really had me going for a second. Angel is obviously happy you're home, too! That breakthru is just around the corner......

re: Peanut butter - my lab is a true PB nut especially on a Ritz....

[Indy]

Our dog loves peanut butter. He seriously would sell his fuzzy doggy soul for free access to the Jiffy jar in the pantry. He knows the jar and will follow you around the kitchen when you're holding it. But he's also never had steak or pot roast like Angel has so his tastes might be a bit pedestrian compared to hers :)

You could probably sandwich some on crackers for her - or even between two dog biscuits. That would be a tasty treat!

[MunchkinsMom]

But please , don't scare us like that!! AWOL!! You really had me going for a second.

Sorry about that, I realized it after I hit "post" that it might be a scarey thing - and I was a bit nervous myself until she appeared this evening.

Ok, I need to go raid the snack cupboard to see what we have for crackers (ssshhhh, don't tell my DH that I am stealing his crackers to feed the stray dog).

[MHM]

Ok, I need to go raid the snack cupboard to see what we have for crackers (ssshhhh, don't tell my DH that I am stealing his crackers to feed the stray dog).

You're worried he might miss the crackers after you've been feeding her everything but filet mignon?!? :lol:

[SevenDogs]

Ok, I need to go raid the snack cupboard to see what we have for crackers (ssshhhh, don't tell my DH that I am stealing his crackers to feed the stray dog).

I don't think you can call her a stray dog anymore.... she's all yours! :)

[Reds-n-Greys]

You're worried he might miss the crackers after you've been feeding her everything but filet mignon?!? :lol:


:lol::lol::lol::lol:

[MunchkinsMom]

You're worried he might miss the crackers after you've been feeding her everything but filet mignon?!? :lol:

LOL - good point! This morning I took out a rather leathery looking piece of pot roast (actually, the whole roast was on the tough side - don't tell my MIL) from the leftover container, so that she could have a breakfast of cheese, pot roast and meat balls. The only reason she doesn't get filet is that we rarely eat it at home, and there are never any leftovers when we do.

I think she is happy that I am home, she was laying in the field when I went to feed, so I put the food in the bowl, showed it to her, and fed the horses. She didn't come in the barn until I went out with bowl in hand to give her a piece of beef. She let me get really, really close, and barked and whined for me. As I was about to go back into the barn, my neighbor called me to the fence line to give me all the food that he had stockpiled up to feed her, that was so nice of him. I still had the bowl in my hand, and when I went back to the barn and put it down, she followed me up to the barn and stared at me while I was in the tack room getting horse cookies. She came in the instant that I left the tack room and entered the first stall to put on fly masks, and did't run out when I passed by to get to the next horse in line. When she finished eating, she stood in the aisle staring at me for a bit, then went out.

At lunchtime, I saw her out in the back pasture and when she heard the screen door slam, she high-tailed it to the barn, and walked right up to the aisle, but would not come in. I had a pigs-ear treat (from the neighbors food stash), I walked to the end of the aisle with it in my hand, and she was very excited, did a yowling doggie dance, but still would not take it from me. So I tossed it to her, and she grabbed it, and I said "what have you got?" in a playful voice, and she had her tail up, and ran out to the field to chew on it. I'm sure she will bury it somewhere today.

[Jaegermonster]

I think next time I would set it on the ground in between us about half way and then sit down, and see what happens.
You have made wonderful progress.

[MunchkinsMom]

Angel made another baby step towards becoming a semi-domestic animal this morning. We ran out of leftover meat in the house, so I opened one of the cans of dog food that the neighbor had given me - it is the chunky kind in gravy - and brought it to the barn. Angel was waiting in her spot. I put the food in the bowl and started doling out the horse feed, and Angel came right up to the barn, sniffing and looking at me. I told her "come on in and eat" and as soon as I stepped out of the tack/feed room, she went in to eat, she didn't wait for me to bring her any food outside, nor did she wait until I had gone into a stall. And she stayed there eating, so I didn't disturb her by going in to put the buckets away until she finished. She didn't eat the whole bowl, but went back outside, and then did the cutest thing, she came back to the barn, and grabbed her headless stuffed (well, not very stuffed now) bear, and ran into the middle of the field, and was tossing it about, and rolling upside down with it, it was precious. I feel that if she is relaxed enough to play with toys while I am there, and to come in without my tempting her with hand held goodies, that she is making progress.

At lunchtime, she was under the trailer, but came out when my younger gelding stomped by. She laid out in the field, and after I gave the horses their lunch, I brought a dog biscuit out to her. As I approached, she got up and came to me, sort of "singing" in her whiney/yowly voice, but still stopped within inches of me, would not take it from me, so I put it down, and she came and got it, and chewed it up happily.

It would be wonderful if she would just take the food from my hand, that is going to be my next milestone in this saga.

[danceronice]

I love when this thread is updated!

[Buffyblue]

She laid out in the field, and after I gave the horses their lunch, I brought a dog biscuit out to her. As I approached, she got up and came to me, sort of "singing" in her whiney/yowly voice, but still stopped within inches of me, would not take it from me, so I put it down, and she came and got it, and chewed it up happily.

It would be wonderful if she would just take the food from my hand, that is going to be my next milestone in this saga.


Next time bring your handy jar of peanut butter (mine prefer Jif creamy) and dip the end of that dog biscuit in the peanut butter. See if she'll come and take it if you aren't looking at her (face away from her, or sit facing away from her and put your hand out behind you with the biscuit and peanut butter). My two Aussies will do just about ANYTHING for a mouthful of peanut butter!

Great work so far, by the way! I love reading your updates - especially when Angel does the happy doggie dance! :)

[harveyhorses]

I love this thread, and the AWOL made me gasp, coworker asked what was wrong.
One of my dogs would never take anything from my hand, she would sleep in my lap (80 lb lab) she just had a thing about it, but I really want Angel to do that for you!! You have come so far, makes me happy.
Peanut butter rules. :yes:

[ponygirl]

This has to be one of the best "feel good" threads out here in COTH land. I read it daily :)
Try popcorn too. As nutty as it sounds I've yet to have a dog that doesn't go batty for popcorn. My rescue will turn into a pretzel for some pieces.

[MunchkinsMom]

Guess my shopping list is going to be mostly stuff for Angel! Let's see, liverwurst, peanut butter, popcorn, meatballs, hotdogs, stew beef (or whatever cut is on sale). . . and a new toy.

Again tonight, as soon as I put the food in the bowl and put it down, she came to the tack room door, and stared at me until I left the room, and then she would go in and eat. After she ate, she sat right outside the barn aisle looking at me as if to say "is that all there is?" But then she went to the fenceline and was staring wistfullly at the neighbors farm. At first I though she was missing the food, then a few minutes later I noticed they had company, and the company had brought their german shepard with them. I did a double take, because they had to put their shepard down last fall, then I realized who the dog was, and that I was not seeing ghosts. So, I think maybe Angel was trying to decide if she should go over there or not, but she didn't. When they left, she grabbed the remains of the Jolly Ball, and had a game of catch with herself.

I just came in from removing the fly masks, and Angel was just hanging out with the horses. I gave her a biscuit, and then went out to fetch the Jolly Ball, so I started kicking it around the pasture, which she watched with great interest, but she didn't get up and chase it (she didn't run away either).

[Go Fish]

Gee, that's an idea. Because she likes her toys, do you think you could teach her to play "fetch?"

[MunchkinsMom]

Gee, that's an idea. Because she likes her toys, do you think you could teach her to play "fetch?"

I'm going to try - tonight when I gave her the dog biscuit, she didn't come get it (guess it was too close to me), so I playfully grabbed it, she waltzed backwards, so I tossed it past her, and said "go get it!" when she went to get it.

[MHM]

...and the company had brought their german shepard with them. So, I think maybe Angel was trying to decide if she should go over there or not, but she didn't. When they left, she grabbed the remains of the Jolly Ball, and had a game of catch with herself.



This is the kind of stuff that just about breaks my heart. I can't wait for her to find out how much more fun it is to play with somebody else. :sadsmile:

[MunchkinsMom]

This is the kind of stuff that just about breaks my heart. I can't wait for her to find out how much more fun it is to play with somebody else. :sadsmile:

I know, I tried "playing" with a dog biscuit with her today, but it sort of freaked her out, she is still rather skittish about sudden movements.

Another baby step this morning, when I went to feed breakfast, she was laying under the fenceline, and not near the barn. I put her food in the bowl and called her, and she just stayed under the fence. So I went out with two bits of cheese, and called her, and she came running to me with her tail wagging - so I kept saying "come, come Angel - good girl" as she was coming to me. I gave her the cheese (dropped on the ground of course), and went in to feed the horses, and sure enough, she stood at the tack room door staring at me, and as soon as I stepped out, she stepped in to eat. After she ate only the cheese (she left the dog food), she came out of the tack room and into the aisle of the barn, and sort of stared at me as if to say "is there anything else?" Then she went back to the fenceline and watched my neighbor clean his boat.

[MunchkinsMom]

Do you have a door on your tack room? I'd be super tempted to shut it on her when she's in there eating. Probably not the best idea, but I am not even HALF as patient as you are!

Nope, my tack room is a converted stall, and the "door" is a track style swinging gossip door, where there is a 1 1/2 foot gap at the bottom of the door. I'm trying to dream up a way to make a swing down grate that I will hook up so she can get in, and then perhaps drop it down while she is busy eating, but it might be too early to do that right now, without causing her total panic,and hopefully by the time I figure out how to rig that up, she will be friendly enough that I won't need it.

[Twomanydawgs]

I acquired a very shy, fearful labradoodle and it took me a longggggg time to get ihm to come near me but the thing that helped the most was me sitting on the ground reading a book with treats different lengths aways from me and more in my lap. Took a few days of him just following the treats and me talking to him while he ate them and eventually he took them from my hand and I could pet him. After that he just got better and better.

[MunchkinsMom]

I think I have a dog - even if I can't pet her yet! Tonight at dinner, she was not around the barn (since my schedule is a bit, um, "flexible", the animals can't really set their watches by me. So, the horses spotted me, and came in to eat. I put them in their stalls, whistled for Angel, and fed the horses. I was heading out to get the hose to fill the water buckets, and I spotted her far out in the field sniffing the remains of the jollly ball. So I called her, and her head popped up, and she started running towards me, tail wagging, like a very happy dog. She didn't run right up to me, but within a few feet, and then started doing the happy dog dance for the cheese that I had. I gave her one piece as a reward for coming to me when I called her, and then put the rest in the barn in her bowl. She did come in and eat a little bit, but not all of it, I don't think she was very hungry for whatever reason (maybe because there was no meat).

I went shopping tonight, and stocked up on hot dogs, meatballs, liverwurst, some Milk Bone treats, and a new stuffed toy. Hopefully the people food will give her more incentive to make friends.

I'll let you all know how she likes the new toy.

Oh, I almost forgot to tell you this. After she ate dinner, she laid in her "spot" and watched be do barn chores. So I stopped to talk to her for a few minutes. I told her "if you let me, I could give you some good scratching - like this", and I went through the motions of scratching myself all over - and she perked her ears up, and cocked her head watching me, as if she was trying to figure out what the heck the crazy human was doing. I sure hope none of my neighbors spotted me while I was doing that.

[3horsemom]

this thread just makes me smile. angel has you doing tricks!!

[Chief2]

It probably looks perfectly normal to her. She probably thinks you have fleas, too! :lol:
Yup, sounds like you have a dog to me! Congratulations! :D

[SevenDogs]

Yup, yup, yup..... you have a dog! :)

[certifiedgirl]

I like this thread too, and check for updates daily. Have you tried those dog treats Beggin'
Strips? My dog will turn down real bacon, or even steak, for those things. He goes absolutely crazy when he smells one, they are like catnip for dogs!

[Reds-n-Greys]

I don't know... I think it's more ~ Angel's got a human! :winkgrin:

I can't wait for the first photo of her nose touching your hand!!!

[Indy]

I don't know... I think it's more ~ Angel's got a human! :winkgrin:

I can't wait for the first photo of her nose touching your hand!!!

Yup, Angel definitely has got a human. And it seems like she's found a good human too, one that is very well trained and even does tricks :D

[MunchkinsMom]

Aww, shucks, thanks everyone!

Well, she loves all the new stuff. Last night at bedtime, she was out in the field, laying with her new toy, and she had eaten the two milk bone treats from the bowl. Supposedly the treats are filled with real bacon - I did look at the big bag of Begging Strips at Wal-mart, but with all the other stuff I had to buy, it was a bit on the expensive side this trip.

This morning, more progress. When I got up, she was out playing in the neighbors field with the remains of the jolly ball, tossing it for herself, flinging it around, having a happy party. So, when I went to go to the barn, I whistled and called to her, and she perked up and came running back to my pasture, but laid by the riding ring fence instead of coming to the barn.

This morning she had another combo breakfast, liverwurst (is that ever messy stinky stuff), hot dogs and meatballs. I put it in the bowl, went outside the barn with the bowl and called her, and again she came running to me. I tossed her one tidbit and said "come to the barn and eat" and put the bowl back in the tack room and started preparing breakfast for the horses. And sure enough, she came and stood in the doorway and watched me. I now talk to her all the time, and she cocks her head to listen to me. But she would not come into the tack room until I had the door closed, then she went in and ate while I was putting the fly masks on the horses.

After she ate, she went out to be with her new toy (that she chewed the rope part off, and the tag - I'm constantly picking up toy pieces in the pasture, good exercise for me). I opened the stalls doors while the horses were eating, and went out with a dog biscuit. She sat up and barked, and then did the happy dog dance, I tossed the biscuit so she had to fetch it, she ate it and then looked at me. So I picked up her new toy, she got excited, I tossed it past her, and she ran after it, as I said "go get it!". Oh, I so wanted to stay and play with her, but I had to get back to the house for an early morning work meeting.

I think she wanted to play too, because she followed the horses out to the field, trying to get them to play with her. Unfortunately she picked the cranky mare, who ignored her. So then she tried to get the geldings to play, but they were more interested in grazing. She did follow them around for a while, to see if they might change their minds and come to play. I'm fortunate that I can see all the antics from my home office window.

I'll see if she wants to play more tonight!

[Susan P]

This is a great story! I can't wait to see how you eventually get her to come to you.

There is a stray dog. looks like a Labradoodle, who will come and eat, but darn, if I even look at him he scampers off. He is so shy. No talking to this dog. He is so matted but I can't get near him and he doesn't come regularly. I've seen him eating road kill before. I leave food out for him and the fox. I try to keep the fox from eating the cats and the cat food. I haven't seen this dog for a couple months or more now, but he comes at night too so I may not be there when he's there. He doesn't bother the horses and I don't think he's bothered the cats but I know he's very hungry when he comes. I've caught a glimpse of him eating the dog food a couple times. But as soon as he sees me he runs far away. It's so sad.

I think you are doing a great job with loads of patience. She sure wants things on her terms, doesn't she. :lol: Hope you catch her soon. You sure don't need her bringing her puppies to you and sooner or later that's bound to happen. :eek:


Aww, shucks, thanks everyone!

Well, she loves all the new stuff. Last night at bedtime, she was out in the field, laying with her new toy, and she had eaten the two milk bone treats from the bowl. Supposedly the treats are filled with real bacon - I did look at the big bag of Begging Strips at Wal-mart, but with all the other stuff I had to buy, it was a bit on the expensive side this trip.

This morning, more progress. When I got up, she was out playing in the neighbors field with the remains of the jolly ball, tossing it for herself, flinging it around, having a happy party. So, when I went to go to the barn, I whistled and called to her, and she perked up and came running back to my pasture, but laid by the riding ring fence instead of coming to the barn.

This morning she had another combo breakfast, liverwurst (is that ever messy stinky stuff), hot dogs and meatballs. I put it in the bowl, went outside the barn with the bowl and called her, and again she came running to me. I tossed her one tidbit and said "come to the barn and eat" and put the bowl back in the tack room and started preparing breakfast for the horses. And sure enough, she came and stood in the doorway and watched me. I now talk to her all the time, and she cocks her head to listen to me. But she would not come into the tack room until I had the door closed, then she went in and ate while I was putting the fly masks on the horses.

After she ate, she went out to be with her new toy (that she chewed the rope part off, and the tag - I'm constantly picking up toy pieces in the pasture, good exercise for me). I opened the stalls doors while the horses were eating, and went out with a dog biscuit. She sat up and barked, and then did the happy dog dance, I tossed the biscuit so she had to fetch it, she ate it and then looked at me. So I picked up her new toy, she got excited, I tossed it past her, and she ran after it, as I said "go get it!". Oh, I so wanted to stay and play with her, but I had to get back to the house for an early morning work meeting.

I think she wanted to play too, because she followed the horses out to the field, trying to get them to play with her. Unfortunately she picked the cranky mare, who ignored her. So then she tried to get the geldings to play, but they were more interested in grazing. She did follow them around for a while, to see if they might change their minds and come to play. I'm fortunate that I can see all the antics from my home office window.

I'll see if she wants to play more tonight!

[shea'smom]

Oh goodie! I got my Angel fix!!

[MunchkinsMom]

Oh, SP that is sad. . . poor stray dog! Bless you for feeding him, and maybe he will decide to hang out at your place more often. Remember, Angel has been here in my neighborhood for a year now, it has taken this long to get to this point with her.

She was funny at lunch, I gave her a treat, and put one in her bowl, and she came to the tack room door to check to see if there was anything really good to eat. While I was feeding the horses, she stood at the tack room door whining for about 2 minutes and then finally went in to get the treat.

Tonight it was more of the same, she came in to eat while I was feeding the horses, then went back outside. After I fed the horses, I went out to see if she wanted to play, but she didn't seem to be in the mood, I tossed her new toy (which doesn't look very new now that she spent the day dragging it around), but she didn't go to get it, it sort of startled her when I tossed it. I guess I need to read her mood better to see if she wants to play or not.

I just got back in from cleaning the water buckets and the whole time she was laying in the sand outside the barn aisle, watching me for a few minutes, then she stretched out and went to sleep.

Oh, I almost forgot this part. I watched her "hunt" tonight. While I was cleaning the pasture waterer, I could see her standing like a statue, watching something in the tree line at the edge of the pasture. It was a squirrel. She stood very still for the longest time, and then starting moving ever so slowly towards the squirrel. Then my husband and daughter came out making noise on their way out to a school function, and the squirrel ran up the tree, so Angel laid down to wait it out.

[MunchkinsMom]

Apparently Angel is a morning person. I could not wait to log on and post what she did today. I actually had tears in my eyes, I was so touched.

As I was heading to the barn, before I could even see her, I could hear "singing", which was Angel talking to me. I spotted her, and said "good morning little girl" and she sat up, barked, and then ran to me. So I took out a piece of hot dog, and she ran to me, and actually sniffed the piece in my hand! But it was too much for her, so she jumped back, I tossed her the piece and told her to come in the barn and eat. So close. . . and yet so far. But it is still progress.

Friday's are my rushed days due to early morning work meetings, so I put the fly masks on before feeding the horses, which makes Angel hesitant to come in to eat, due to the change in routine. She did come to sniff at the tack room door, and watch me hustle around, but wouldn't come in to eat until I was heading back to the house. And I didn't have the heart to just put the food away today, since she was so good about coming close.

Also, I did try to bring her a few bits, but if I approach her, she tends to back away if I get to close, but if it is her idea to come to me, the story is different. So, I need to be patient and remember that this friendship is going to be on her terms right now, until she can overcome her fear of humans. I feel that she is doing the very best that she can.

Also, today is her "anniversary", she has been in the neighborhood for a year.

[Foxhound]

Good girl, Angel!

[lcw579]

You are getting close, I can feel it! Sniffing your hand is such a big step. :yes:

I am amazed at your patience, MM, I think I would have tried to grab Angel by now and scared the bejeesus out of her!

[MHM]

You are getting close, I can feel it! Sniffing your hand is such a big step. :yes:

I am amazed at your patience, MM, I think I would have tried to grab Angel by now and scared the bejeesus out of her!

Ditto! A year is a long time to wait!

But Happy Anniversary! :cool:

[3horsemom]

isn't that amazing that angel has stayed put for a year? she is one very patient dog!! am i the only one surprised that she has not had a litter of pups?
while we are on the subject of strays...i picked up a stray female lab mix in the parking lot of my gym. middle-aged at least. no collar, thin but not emaciated. no microchip. she came when i called her and hopped into the back of my suv with no issue. she smelled really bad so after taking her to the vet to check for a chip, i brought her home, fed her and gave her a bath. a perfect lady about it all. i came inside after bathing her and noticed that i had blood on my hand. went back outside and found what i initially thought was a old gunshot wound inside her front rl. took her back to the vet and he took one look and said that is a ruptured tumor. it was about the size of my fist! we had to put her down so rest in peace sweet girl. at one time you must have been someone's pet. my dogs are getting microchipped asap.

[MunchkinsMom]

3h, that is sad about the lab, but at least she had some love for her last day, rather than a slow painful death on the streets somewhere.

lc, trust me, I occasionally get the mental image of myself trying to tackle her, but that is quickly followed by the image of being bitten, or landing face first into the dirt with no dog, because she is fast!

My daughter has 3 friends coming for a sleep-over tonight, should be interesting to see how Angel reacts to 4 giggling screaming 14-year-olds in the yard.

[jetsmom]

I love reading your updates MM!

[MunchkinsMom]

I love reading your updates MM!

Thanks, I thought of you tonight, we had K of C for dinner, but too late to feed much of it to Angel. I did manage to grab one piece and picked all the meat off the bones and put it in a container in the fridge for tomrrow.

Angel was her usual self for dinner, actually she was laying in the middle of the barn aisle when I went to feed (nice and shady and breezy in there), and she went out to her spot to wait, and came in and ate when I fed the horses, but what was funny is that she stood outside the tack room door and whined for 30 seconds before going in, almost as if she was having an internal arguement with herself as to whether she should go eat it or not.

Unfortunately I couldn't stay in the barn long tonight, we had a vet emergency with one of my house dogs, and I had to get back up to her asap (see my other post on that one).

An hour ago I went to take off the fly masks, and Angel was laying in the field with the Jolly Ball (which has been MIA for 3 days). I did bring her a few bits of the K of C, she seemed to like it, I'll let you know tomorrow if she likes it enough to take it from my hand in the AM

[jetsmom]

If you can warm the chicken a little in the microwave before bringing it to her, it'll make it smellier...ie more appealing.

[3horsemom]

thanks mm. you are right. she had a kind hand at the end.
angei seems to be getting close to making a physical connection with you. an emotional one was made awhile back.
sorry about your other dog. i hope it has a positive outcome. she is grand.

[MunchkinsMom]

Today's update: This morning was my blacksmith appointment, and he showed up a little early, just as I was feeding Angel. She was waiting on the house side of the barn for me, and came into the barn to eat when he pulled in. She ran out to the pasture and looked at his truck, then went to the barn aisle to see what was going on, but when his big rottie got out of the truck (on leash) she went to the fence line to wait until the coast was clear.

When the farrier was done, I went out into the field to pick up a bunch of stuff that Angel had strewn about. One of it was a drink can that she chewed to bits, I'm amazed that she can do that, and not cut her mouth to pieces!

Then I put the horses out, and started cleaning stalls, and as I was going from one stall to the other, I noticed that Angel was at the end of the barn aisle. She was also sniffing the ground where my farrier's dog had been laying. Then she came in to eat her breakfast.

Dinner was a bit late, because I wanted to watch the Derby (good race!). Angel came in to eat like always, well, she whined a bit as she went into the tack stall, not sure if she was happy about the food, or having another internal arguement with herself. Then she went out to lay with one of her toys (not one I gave her, might have been from the neighbors stash of toys). I had to unload the truckload of barn supplies, and she is funny, I can drive the truck right next to her, and she doesn't even move.

When that was done, the horses got turned out, and I went out to play with Angel. I think she really liked it, I would get the toy, and toss it for her to chase, and she would run to get it, but of course not bring it back. We did this four or five times, and then my house dogs started barking, and unfortunately one of them was my house dog with the bad back, that managed to get out the dog door and into the yard. So I had to abandon the game and go rescue Murphy.

A few minutes later, Angel was outside, playing with the Jolly Ball in the field.

I think you are right, she does have an emotional attachment to me, now if she can just cross the line and add the physical aspect.

[MunchkinsMom]

I, for one, can wait for that day when you both connect - hand to nose - because I would hate to see this adventure come to a conclusion. Selfish of me, I know. I just want the story to continue to go on and on. :lol:

Oh never fear, the nose to hand is just going to be another baby step in Angel's life story with me, I'll keep posting until you all tell me to stop already! :lol:

This morning, she was waiting on the house side of the barn, gave me a little bark, and came to me, but still won't take the food from my hand. So I gave her one piece, and called her, trying to see if she would follow me into the barn. But nope, she stood at the far end watching me. So, I made a "trail" of hot dog bits right down the middle of the barn. She came in half way, and then started another one of her interal arguements, I could hear her whining as I was putting on fly masks, and then she realized she could get to the bowl without coming down the middle of the barn, and she ran around the outside to get to the tack room.

Then she stayed with me for the whole hour that I was doing chores this moring, just laying in the shade right outside the barn and watching me work. So, I gave her a pig's ear treat for being so good, and that made her happy.

She spent the rest of the day sleeping in the shade under the horse trailer, and didn't come out while I was in and out of the barn all day.

At dinner, she came out when I called the horses, it was rather comical, I had horses coming in on my right, and Angel coming in on my left. Unfortunately, this was a "dine and dash" as I had company coming for dinner. But, we now have lots of leftover steak! So I didn't get to play with her tonight. I'll let you know how tomorrow goes.

[MunchkinsMom]

AM update. Steak did not entice Angel to take it from my hand this morning. So it was more of the same feeding routine, me dishing out horse feed, while Angel stands in the doorway of the tackroom taking turns staring at me and the food bowl. She did come in and eat while the fly masks were being put on. It's funny, I can walk right past her (within a foot) while she is waiting, but she won't come into the tack stall while I am in there or in the aisle, no matter how often I tell her to come and eat, that I will not bother her.

After breakfast, instead of cleaning stalls, I went out to play fetch with her some more, since she brought back the new toy that has been MIA for a few days. On a nice note, my neighbor was just starting her morning ride, so she came over on her horse to watch. But once Angel realized we had an audience, she would not play anymore, so she went to the far side of the barn to lay in the shade - I think she thought that I would do chores, but I had to go to a meeting.

In between meetings, I went down to clean stalls, and she was still laying in the shady side, fast asleep and dreaming. I was sorely tempted to creep up and try to pat her, but my inner voice told me that it would most likely scare her half to death, and so I didn't do it. But I did stand there for a minute or two, just watching her sleep.

[MunchkinsMom]

Dinner update. Angel was laying flat out sleeping in the barn aisle when I went to feed dinner. I could see the horses heading to the barn, so to attempt to avoid a fracas, I called Angel. She slowly got up, stretched, yawned, and slowly came out to me, but still would not accept any treats from my hand. Once again, same routine, she stares at me and the food until the coast is clear.

After dinner, she went out and laid in the field. I spread the manure in the spreader, and after I parked the equipment back in the barn, looked out, and there was Angel, having a good roll in the freshly spread manure! Then she went to play in the sprinklers. I went out to feed more ant bait to the new fire ant mounds (a never ending process). As I was heading back to the barn, Angel was out rolling around in the field with her toy. But when I went out to play with her, she slunk under the fence - guess she didn't want to play, even when I went and picked it up and tossed it, she just stayed and stared at me. Oh well.

A few minutes ago I stepped outside, and there was Angel on her hind feet, drinking out of the horse's pasture waterer. Honestly, I think she thinks she is one of the horses! She has a full bucket of water, not sure what that was all about.

[SevenDogs]

Just be glad that she rolls in the manure and THEN goes and plays in the sprinklers and not the other way around! :lol:

[VWBug]

Angel you are one tough nut to crack.

MM - kudos to you on your bottomless pit of patience. Angel will reward you in the end I'm sure, and in the meantime you are writing a future bestseller! I look forward to these updates, please keep them coming.

[lcw579]

A few minutes ago I stepped outside, and there was Angel on her hind feet, drinking out of the horse's pasture waterer. Honestly, I think she thinks she is one of the horses! She has a full bucket of water, not sure what that was all about.


Well, our dogs all like to drink out of the bird bath - I guess it tastes sweeter when it's not meant for you! ;)

MM - you have the patience of Job. This thread is like my daily soap opera.

[MunchkinsMom]

Sorry about the late update, it was a day from hades at work, another marathon all day meeting, followed by a trip to the high school to get information on the upcoming band schedule (my daughter plays the flute).

Angel made more baby steps today, when she saw me coming with breakfast, she barked and ran around to the tack room door to wait. She has moved her waiting spot to right next to the tack room door (it used to be about 6 feet away). She ate breakfast, and watched me pick up all the stuffing from her toys that she gutted overnight.

She spent part of the day sleeping in the barn aisle, it is nice and shady with a breeze in there. At lunch I went down, and she got up and came to me, with her tail wagging, which surprised me because I don't bring food with me at lunchtime. So I gave her a dog biscuit for being so good. I also moved her water bucket inside the barn (hoping the horses don't kick it over or I will move it to the tack room) so that it won't get broiling hot in the sun. Oh, she also whines now when she sees me coming, it is a happy dog whine, not a scared dog whine.

At dinner, more of the same, she would not come get the food until the coast was clear (meaning I am in a stall). Then she laid outside while I did the water bucket chores. It was too hot to play, and I had to get ready for the trip to school so I didn't have a lot of time. But, as I was doing the buckets, she suddenly jumped up and did her guard dog bark! I looked, but could not see what she was barking at. She did it again after I was back at the house, I could hear her from the house. So, I think she really has decided that the barn is her home now.

You made me laugh with the patience comments, my neighbor said the same thing the other day, that I am more patient than she could ever be. I told her it was all a good outward act, internally I am so impatient for Angel to make up her mind, but I try to put myself in her place, and how hard this is for her to trust any human. I can't even begin to imagine what could have happened in her past that makes her so afraid.

Well, I'm off to go put the ponies to bed. I'll post more tomorrow.

[Reds-n-Greys]

Awww, she's so close! Bless you for giving her all the time she needs.
I think you need to take a sick day! :cool: So you can sit outside with the treats in hand and wait her out......

[MunchkinsMom]

Awww, she's so close! Bless you for giving her all the time she needs.
I think you need to take a sick day! :cool: So you can sit outside with the treats in hand and wait her out......

I think she would have to be starving before she would even consider taking it from me, at least at this point in time. I have plenty of accrued vacation time, just can't find a good time in the work deadline timeline to take it! I'm also worried that if I did "starve" her, that she might start wandering the neighborhood looking for a new food source, so I don't think we are ready for that method quite yet. I would rather that she stay close to "home" for the time being.

I don't know what was going on in my pasture last night, but when I went out at midnight to put the horses up for the night, Angel was outside somewhere in the field, barking up a storm, and would not stop. This of course had my two geldings on high alert - the mare could care less, either she is hard of hearing, or didn't think it was worth expending any energy over. I did try to look around with the flashlight, but couldn't see what it was that had her in guard dog mode.

This morning, she started wagging her tail as soon as I got to the gate. I can now walk up to her within 4-6 inches, and she stays laying there, but will not make a move towards the treats in my hand, she actually looks away from it, which is a bit odd. And she whines as I am approaching her, and whines as she is coming in to eat. And she will stand there within 6 inches of me, listening to me talk to her, but won't move. She will come in and eat as long as I am in a stall, but not if I am in the barn aisle.

I had to go out and clean up more ripped out stuffing from her toys, soon they will be empty of all stuffing. There is only one that she has not managed to rip into yet. And the Jolly Ball is about half gone now, but she still likes to toss it about.

[VWBug]

Poor girlie. It seems that she wants to trust you SO BADLY but just can't quite bring herself to close those last few inches. But I feel certain that one day she will.

Thinking back to where you were a few months ago you can truly appreciate what you have accomplished.

I think that looking away thing is a sign of submission/respect. Or maybe I've watched too much Cesar Milan. :) Speaking of which, I sure hope they contact you because this would make a great segment.

[MunchkinsMom]

Poor girlie. It seems that she wants to trust you SO BADLY but just can't quite bring herself to close those last few inches. But I feel certain that one day she will.

Thinking back to where you were a few months ago you can truly appreciate what you have accomplished.

I think that looking away thing is a sign of submission/respect. Or maybe I've watched too much Cesar Milan. :) Speaking of which, I sure hope they contact you because this would make a great segment.

I agree, I think that she is now having internal arguements with herself, that she wants to be my friend, but still has trust issues, hence the whining to herself when her comfort levels are breached.

I watch too much Cesar myself, I get some good insights on dog pack behavior from the shows. However, if I had to bet on either Angel or Cesar, I think Angel would win. Too much open land, and too much distrust of strangers in Angel's eyes I think.

Tonight she was not at the barn for dinner, I was worried for about 10 minutes, and then sure enough, she showed up for dinner, and wolfed it down as soon as she felt safe to come in and eat - which she did while I was filling water buckets. She was wet, so she found someone's sprinkler to go play in, or was playing in the sprinklers at the entrance gate and I missed it. We didn't play because it was pretty hot out and I had to get back to the house to my own dinner. She did play fetch for a biscuit that I tossed for her to chase after dinner.

She is so cute when I talk to her, she looks and listens as if she is trying to figure it out.

Maybe I need to watch more Cesar on Friday to see if I can get some tips on how dogs invite each other to make contact. I might have to draw the line at trying to sniff her butt. :D

[MHM]

Maybe I need to watch more Cesar on Friday to see if I can get some tips on how dogs invite each other to make contact. I might have to draw the line at trying to sniff her butt. :D

Oh, come on, you've tried everything else! :lol:

[Buffyblue]

I got a visual of that one and it was definitely my big laugh of the day!

[MunchkinsMom]

I got a visual of that one and it was definitely my big laugh of the day!

Glad it made you laugh, I got a good chuckle out of it myself.

Angel continues to show signs that she feels at home here now. All her toys are in the field (well, the new toy is MIA), and she barks at people that go by. Tonight someone was out in their golf cart, and drove up on the swale on my property (outside the pasture fence) and she ran out from the barn barking at them.

She still will not take food from my hand, but stays very close to the tack room until the coast is clear to eat. After dinner tonight, I had chores to do, so she laid and watched me, I think she wanted me to play because she finally got tired of waiting and ran out to get the Jolly Ball. She brought it back to the barn and waited. So, I finished the chores, and went out to play with her. She is funny, when I was walking out towards her with one of her toys in my hand, she jumped up and ran towards me, then started to bark and jump around. So we played her version of fetch for about 3 rounds, and then she decided she had enough and went to lay down on the fence line.

I guess it is just a matter of time. . . it is a good reminder of how far we have come in the past year, and that I need to maintain my patience levels.

[MunchkinsMom]

Last night I had a very vivid dream that Angel and I were snuggling together, I hope this was a glimpse of the future.

She surprised me this morning, I had breakfast in hand, she was tossing the jolly ball around, and she stopped and came running flat out to me - for half a second I thought she would crash into me. Then she followed me into the barn aisle, and stood there, but when I opened a stall door to put on halters (which I do before feeding if I am in a rush in the AM), she went back outside to wait. Then after I fed the horses, and they finished eating and went out, she came to the tack room door and looked at me before going in to eat (I was in the aisle of the barn at that time).

So, little, by little, she is getting braver.

[lcw579]

I think this dream may come true soon - I hope!

[MunchkinsMom]

I think this dream may come true soon - I hope!

Me Too!

Tonight, again she came to greet me, and ate a piece of leftover steak that I dropped at my feet, so that is progress. But she would not come in to eat until I went out to spread the manure. Then she ate, and ran out to go play in the sprinklers! Then she laid out by the fence line, I went in to get a treat, and called her, and she actually came to me to get it. Well, she didn't take it from me, but picked it up where I dropped it, and ate while I stood there watching and talking to her.

I had a thought tonight, what are the chances that if and when she does take a treat from my hand that she might accidentally chomp my fingers in the process? Is this something I need to worry about?

[Nootka]

i bet she will be so cautious when she takes it that you have nothing to worry about. She is going to do that dog body stretch thing and grap it with her very front teeth...lol

[jetsmom]

I agree that she will probably be very cautious and gentle. Rusty takes things from my hand very gently. My GSD mix that I've had for 7 yrs practically takes my hand off!

The next time she comes running up, try facing away from her as she gets close and just hold the meat out in your fingers (palm down) behind you, and don't move or look at her. If you normally talk to her, continue to do so in the same tone of voice. A whole hot dog (warmed up a little so it is smelly), or larger piece of meat that she can take without touching your hand would be best.

[MunchkinsMom]

I agree that she will probably be very cautious and gentle. Rusty takes things from my hand very gently. My GSD mix that I've had for 7 yrs practically takes my hand off!

The next time she comes running up, try facing away from her as she gets close and just hold the meat out in your fingers (palm down) behind you, and don't move or look at her. If you normally talk to her, continue to do so in the same tone of voice. A whole hot dog (warmed up a little so it is smelly), or larger piece of meat that she can take without touching your hand would be best.

Thanks, that makes me feel better. Of my 4 house dogs, only the brittany is a finger chomper (and always has been). But only for biscuits, she was always gentle with her jaws when playing (being a bird dog).

I will try that tomorrow, maybe it is my hand position, I don't face her directly when I offer, I am usually standing sideways and looking away.

[apcohrs]

I wonder what would happen if you lay down in the grass, maybe curled up?

[witherbee]

apcohrs - we live in Florida as does MunchkinsMom (who is a friend), and there's no laying in the grass here unless you want some nasty fire any bites or heaven knows whatelse lol! Seriously, it's not like in New England (where we are both from) where you can run barefoot in the grass and sit in it. It's like being on safari here at all times. between the fire ants, snakes, hook worms, spiders and other assorted creatures, shoes and no sitting or even standing in one place too long without checking for critters is OUT lol!

Good luck MunchkinsMom - I second the thought that she will not chomp your fingers and to try facing away from her and offering the food. Hopefully your dream comes true soon! Go Angel (or should I say "come Angel"?!).

[MHM]

I agree that she's unlikely to grab your fingers.

Maybe to increase the odds that you keep all your fingers, and get her to take something directly from you, you could try to feed her l-o-n-g foods?

Foot long hot dogs? Giant beef jerky? Baguettes with peanut butter? What else? :lol:

[MunchkinsMom]

Thanks, witherbee is right, even just standing and chatting at the fence line with the neighbors, you have to make sure you are not standing in an ant hill - I've been out feeding the ants with poison bait every night for the past two weeks, there is a lot of ground to cover with 9 acres of pasture to walk!

Angel was funny last night, late at night when I went to put the horses in for the night, Angel was laying in the field (it was a full moon so I could see her pretty clearly), and she jumped up and ran under the fence. Then I could hear something crinkling - I walked out to see what she had, but it was too dark and too far away to see what she had. But whatever it was made my two geldings once again go on high alert. The young one didn't want to come in - he is very nosy, and he really wanted to see what was making the noise. Finally the sound of feed being poured made him change his mind and come in.

This morning the mystery was solved. Out in the field along with the bath rug and the remains of the jolly ball was a large potato chip bag. Once again my little trash picker must have fetched it from the roadside and brought it home.

As to the hand feeding, this morning I cut one of the hotdogs lengthwise, and tried the option of standing with my back to her and my hand outstretched, palm side down with the hot dog in her direction. No go - my arm was starting to cramp up from holding it out so long, and all Angel did was stand and stare at it.

So, I made a trail of hot dog bits down the aisle of the barn, in an effort to teach her to follow me to the food. It worked, but she still would not come into the tack room to eat while I was in there. It's funny, out in the field, she will eat treats that are dropped practically on my feet, but not inside. At least not yet.

[Foxhound]

Maybe you need something to use as an extension of yourself?
I was thinking one of those grabby tools they sell on TV would work well. You know, those things to help old people get stuff off high shelves.
However, putting the hotdog on a long stick would probably work, too. That way, she would be taking it from you, but still staying in her comfort zone.
You could eventually shorten the stick, to get her to come closer.

[Chief2]

I am wondering if someone set her up to get belted in the head that way. People who hate animals, or are involved in domestic violence with their SO's animals will do just that to a dog: lure her in with food or soft talk, and then belt her in the head. I know of one stupid owner who did this with a horse as well, thinking it taught him who was boss, and not to invade her space. She would lure him out of the top of the Dutch door with kind words and face stroking, and then belt him in the face, sending him reeling into the back of the stall. Once he changed owners, it was a long time before you could get near that part of his body again.

You may be asking too much too soon with this train of thought, and may be better off working towards body touching first (the shoulder, the back, the tail, etc.), working your way up to desensitizing the entire body and head to touch, and then finish it off with the hand feeding. But you are the one doing the work, and you know the dog, so the choice of how to go about this is really up to you.

I am enjoying reading this chronicle, and visit it each and every day.
Hurrah for Angel! :winkgrin:

[Buffyblue]

You may be asking too much too soon with this train of thought, and may be better off working towards body touching first (the shoulder, the back, the tail, etc.), working your way up to desensitizing the entire body and head to touch, and then finish it off with the hand feeding.:


You may be onto something here - I have 2 Aussies and my oldest (10 y.o.) has always been very shy with strangers. She loves to get scratched just above her tail (if there were a tail) and I always tell her "coolie scratch" and she turns her butt to me for the scratches. With strangers, she will turn her butt to them for a coolie scratch but won't let them approach her from the front or pet her head, until she knows them. Maybe it's time Angel learned about the joys of coolie scratches! :winkgrin:

[MHM]

I am wondering if someone set her up to get belted in the head that way. People who hate animals, or are involved in domestic violence with their SO's animals will do just that to a dog: lure her in with food or soft talk, and then belt her in the head.

Ugh. Some people need to get hit in the head themselves. Repeatedly. Preferably with a baseball bat. :mad:

[certifiedgirl]

Try the Beggin' Strips!!!!!

[Chief2]

Ugh. Some people need to get hit in the head themselves. Repeatedly. Preferably with a baseball bat. :mad:

I wholeheartedly agree. I can't stand it myself, but in domestic abuse cases, set-ups like that are too common. If that's what's behind this, and MM wants to keep working ahead, then keep both the hands and the feet quiet, as both are used in the attack. Also, try a tail tip touch and see what happens. If she is fine with it, proceed from there.

MM, if I had thought of this issue earlier, I would have said something. But things were going so well, that it never entered my mind.

Happy Mother's Day!

[CB/TB]

this is one of the first threads I go to just to check on any progress. Things seem to be at a stalemate now. Angel is happy with things as they are and that's fine, except the little girl really needs to get some vaccines in her and spayed if she isn't already. Would trying the tranqs again be something you could do now, since she feels safe at your place and may not go too far once they kick in. If you can't get a kennel, how about a few sections of that plastic lattice sold to hide outdoor trash cans, AC systems, etc. You could set them up as a kennel and start feeding her in there , every so often, bar the entry, then let her out so she knows she will be able to come and go. Ignore her, like you do when she's in the tack room until she feels comfortable. Even after you shut her in for good, just feed her and go , don't try to touch her yet. Go in and clean up the poop, refill water,etc and just keep talking to her as normal. She can still keep her distance, but has to stay near you . Maybe set up a chair for you to sit in while she eats. She may not come near you at first, but once she's hungry enough she will. She's at the point where she's happy and knows she has you hooked! I think she's smart enough to wait you out, however long it will take.

[MunchkinsMom]

Happy Mother's Day everyone.

I slept in this morning (left the horses out overnight) in honor of the day. Angel was waiting closer to the house side for me this morning, but just layed quietly as I approached, and sat up when I got to about a foot away, and I offered the hot dog, but again, she would not take it. I said to her "it would be a great Mother's Day gift if you would take this", but of course all she heard was "whawhah whaha wha". So I dropped it at my feet and she came to eat it. I could have reached down to try to touch her, but it might be too soon for that.

I agree that the end goal is to get her fixed and vaccinated, but I really don't want to tramatize her - especially if she was abused before, which all signs point to that possibility.

Today I put the bowl in the aisle, and she did come in and eat it while I was in the aisle, I figured she might feel more comfortable eating where she knows she can easily escape if she feels the need, but she did not seem nervous about eating with me there. Maybe for dinner I will drag out the step stool and sit in the aisle with the bowl there and see if she will come and eat, and then gradually move the bowl closer to me for each meal.

I had thought about the hot dog on a stick, or even on a string, I do have one of those grabber things, that I use for trash pickup on the roadside (we get a lot of litter out here in the country), but not sure if that would scare her or not.

She had an assortment of toys out in the pasture, so as I do each morning, I picked them all up and put them back in the toy pile next to the barn.

Off to by Beggin Strips today!

[shea'smom]

Did you explain to Miss Angel that it would be a great Mother's Day present for a whole lot of people if she would allow one small caress?!!
For a totally random thought, have you ever invited her into your car? I have picked up many stray dogs and some of them will jump right into my car.

[MunchkinsMom]

I might have to try that, but jumping into my truck is hard for dogs, the darned thing is very tall. She is not afraid of the truck at all, I can drive right next to her in it, and she won't even move. In January, I was down at the barn with the truck daily while I was doing trailer training with my horses, but that was months ago when Angel was still pretty timid.

Tonight I felt bad for her, it is so hot outside, and I don't know if the gate sprinklers go off on the weekends or not. And she didn't eat all her food because my pesky younger gelding kept coming back into the barn to see if I had any treats for him, and he parks himself right in front of the tack room door.

So, since I had to run the hose anyway to get the water to cool for the horses, I put it on a milder spray pattern and propped it up, and went in to dump the buckets, and Angel went out to play in her new sprinkler. I didn't move it until she was done. Then I tossed her a new toy that I picked up in the bargain bin at TSC, and she picked it up and trotted off with it, last seen rolling on her back with the toy in her paws.

She was not as wild about the Beggin Strips as I thought she would be, sometimes she is very cautious with new food (unless it is prime rib of course - hahaha).

Later I will go down and do more barn chores, was just waiting for it to cool off a bit, and eat my own dinner. If she wants to play, I will play with her, and try another Beggin Strip.

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, once she got a taste of the beggin strips on her own (I left one in the barn last night in her dish), they seem to be a hit. But she still will not take one from my hand, but she is less wary of me when I crouch down to offer it to her. Then, while still crouching, I toss her little bits of it, and she will eat it while I am there crouched and talking to her.

She gutted her new toy, so I had to pick up all the stuffing from the pasture this morning, and bring the bath rug back into the barn.

I have to tell you all about last night. When I went to bring the horses in for bedtime, my mare was asleep in one stall, the two geldings were laying down sleeping in the sand pit (fondly called "the beach") right outside the barn aisle, and Angel was sleeping in the grass next to them. They all live in relative harmony out there.

[SevenDogs]

I know that you really want to be able to touch her (and I have no doubt that you will be able to soon) but we do all have to remember that hands are uniquely human. Particularly if she was mistreated by human hands, it is pretty natural for her to be wary, and touch will likely be the very last thing to come.

I have a rescue horse that completely trusts me now (and I can touch him all over, including rubbing his ears which were completely off limits for three years), but if my hand comes towards his face in a certain way, he still jumps back. He looks at me afterwards like he is sorry and knows I won't hurt him, but it is just too ingrained (it has gotten less frequent, but I have had to accept that it may always happen to some extent). There were a whole lot of other ways that he showed me trust along the way, and I had to realize that I was the one that was putting all the emphasis on touch because, as a human, it was so important to me.

It bothered me when another poster said you were at a standstill because she hasn't let you touch her yet. There is so much more than just a human hand touch that you have accomplished. It will come.

[MunchkinsMom]

SD - thank so much for your words of support and encouragement, it means a lot to me. Knowing that all of you are behind me in this quest keeps me focused.

Today she came running to me, and all I had was a can of dog food (time to go shopping), so I put one chunk on a plastic spoon, and offered it to her. She would not approach to take it, so I put it on the ground, she ate it, and then started to follow me to the barn (this is something new). But she stopped at the barn entrance. I put the food in the bowl, and she ran around to the other side that is closer to the tack room and waited.

Then for whatever reason, while I did chores, she went walkabout in the pasture (maybe she was searching for a spot to do her business), before she came to eat. When I was done, I went out and again she came running to me, but still would not take a treat from my hand. She will come closer when I am crouched (a few days ago the act of crouching would cause her to jump back a ways), and eat treats that are put on the ground. I'm going to take that as another baby step forward for her.

Heck, I'm just happy on those days that she does run to me, with tail wagging and whining. She does approach in a very submissive manner as she gets closer, head down, tail wagging low.

[SED]

Thanks for the updates MM. Many of us really look forward to them. I wonder alot as to what her lfe was like to make her so wary. But dogs are such forgiving animals. It may take longer than we would all like, but she WILL get there!

[jetsmom]

Aww, don't get discouraged...it's only been 4 1/2 months! You're farther along than I was at that point.

[EponaRoan]

So, here's an idea - she likes that bathmat that she keeps dragging into the pasture. Why not use that as a 'marker' and put her food on it? Then you can place it where you'd like her to go whether it be in a tackroom or another spot. Perhaps sit on it or put a chair on it some time when you have the time to just sit there with a treat in your hand waiting for her to take it?

[MunchkinsMom]

So, here's an idea - she likes that bathmat that she keeps dragging into the pasture. Why not use that as a 'marker' and put her food on it? Then you can place it where you'd like her to go whether it be in a tackroom or another spot. Perhaps sit on it or put a chair on it some time when you have the time to just sit there with a treat in your hand waiting for her to take it?

That was suggested before, and I have thought about it. Right now that one is still in my bag of tricks yet to try. The few times that I have had time to try to wait her out, she gets tired of waiting and leaves, instead of inching closer, so I don't think she is quite ready for that step yet.

Sidebar - it is FINALLY raining on my farm right now, after 30 days of NO rain! Never thought I would be soo happy so see a T-storm blow in.

okay, back to our story. This morning Angel must have been tired from whatever she did all last night, because she was sleeping under the horse trailer, and barely lifted her head when I called her. After I fed the horses, I went out with the bowl of food, and again, she didn't come out. So, I put one bit on the barn post, and brought the rest into the barn. She did then get up, eat the bit, and come and eat in the barn as soon as the horses finished and went out.

So, some days she is really into trying to interact with me, and other days not so much.

[lcw579]

Hope she wasn't out tramping it up all night!

Now I know I am addicted to Angel's Saga - the Lost finale is on and I realized I hadn't checked this thread and just had to peek during a commercial! :lol:

[MunchkinsMom]

Hope she wasn't out tramping it up all night!

Now I know I am addicted to Angel's Saga - the Lost finale is on and I realized I hadn't checked this thread and just had to peek during a commercial! :lol:

Did you hear me laughing out loud when I read that! Nice to know that Angel's saga is as good as reality TV.

Tonight she did something very cute. I was at the house, the horses were grazing, and Angel went running up to my older gelding (who didn't even raise his head - unusual for him), and flopped down right next to him and had a good roll in the grass. I just stood and watched them together, and knew that if I went to get the camera, that the moment would be gone. It was so sweet to watch them together.

Once again she ran to me when I went out with the treats, but for some reason she stopped further away than usually, and only came closer to get a treat bit that I dropped closer to me. I don't know if it is because I now crouch down when she runs to me, maybe that means something different in doggie body language?

She did come in to eat her dinner while the horses were eating and I was picking out the afternoon manure from the stalls that my horses left for my when they came in from the rain storm today. Then she went off somewhere, not sure where. I do hope she is not coming back into heat and tramping around the 'hood.

[MunchkinsMom]

Not much new to report, Angel continues to come when I call her, when I have food in hand, this morning she sort of circled around me - every time I offered the treat, she would go to the side, and then around behind me. She won't take it if I hold it out behind me either.

Tonight it was raining (YEAH!) when I went to feed, and there was poor Angel out in the rain, looking rather forlorn. But she would not come in until she thought the coast was clear. She stood in the tack room door looking at me, so I had the idea to grab a begging strip, and offer it, she would not come in for it. So I tossed pieces of it right inside the barn aisle outside the tackroom door, but she would not come and get them until my back was turned.

However, she did come in and eat while I was picking stalls and sweeping, and didn't get nervous when I got close to the tack room with the broom, so I will take that as our daily progress sign.

After dinner she trotted around the pasture and found something, that she picked up and trotted off into my neighbors field to play with. I guess she didn't want to play with me tonight.

[MunchkinsMom]

Well, my neighbors came home with their new GSD puppy this afternoon. Needless to say, Angel is very interested in the new puppy, but not brave enough to go over - especially since of course he only goes out with his new humans.

At dinner, she came trotting up to the barn with the horses, and ate a treat, and was about to come in to eat when she spotted my neighbor out with the puppy. She ran over to the fence, under the fence, and sat on the drainage swale watching and sniffing the air. I went out with a treat in hand to see if I could distract her, but no luck.

As I was heading back to the house, I noticed her going into the tack room to eat. I guess I need to go back to "tough love" and put the food away while I am not in the barn. :(

It will be interesting to see if she attemts to make friends with the new kid on the block over time. Who knows, maybe she will end up living with them after all. And if so, that is okay with me too.

[Larksmom]

I have so enjoyed this thread. I really look forward to your posts about Angel. Best of luck to you.

[MHM]

Let's just hope the neighbor's puppy turns her into a tame dog, and not vice versa! :lol:

[lcw579]

Maybe you just need to get your own tame puppy to tempt her with? :winkgrin:

[MunchkinsMom]

If she had been around when two of my house dogs were puppies, it might have worked. She does not express any interest at all in my house dogs, not even when we let them out in the back yard - they could touch noses through the fence then, but Angel ignores them, even as they are barking at her through the fence.

I did get to meet my neighbors adorable 10-week old male GSD today, he is just too cute! She walked him over to the fence line, I climbed over to chat, and Angel sat bolt upright, and barked for a bit, then just sat and watched from the barn. I called her, but she just sat and watched. Then when my neighbor left, Angel went right past me over to where we were standing, and sniffed the ground for a bit, and then came back to the barn to eat breakfast.

Oh, this morning Angel did come to me, and was within one inch of the bit of hot dog in my hand - ONE INCH - ARG! I wish she could just "cross the line" for me.....I need more patience pills for myself.

Time to go feed lunch to the horses. I'll let you know if anything changes.

[MunchkinsMom]

After watching the very exciting Preakness race, I went down to feed the farm animals (I guess I can't say just horses any more).

We are dog-sitting for one of my other neighbors for a few days, and when they dropped off the dog, they gave me a bag of cooked boneless chicken that would have gone to waste while they were away. So I opened a can of dog food, put a good sized chunk of the chicken in a baggie and went to the barn. Put the horses in their stalls, put the dog food in the bowl, topped it off with the chicken that I broke apart, and took one piece out to Angel. The piece was about 2-3 inches long. She came running to me with tail wagging, saying "rooo, rooo, rooo" and then stopped and sniffed. I was crouched at the time, so I called her, and stood up. She came closer and sniffed some more. I kept talking to her encouragingly, and . . . she took it from me! I was so excited I could hardly wait to get back in and post this.

So, I got another piece and went out again. . . and after doing a bit of a doggy dance, and more "rooo, roooo", she took the second piece!

I then fed the horses, and she stood at the entrance to the barn watching and sniffing, but jumped back when I went back into the tack room. So, I brought her one more piece, and this time she was much less hesitant to take it! I figure three times is the charm, and left it at that for today (I don't want to push my luck quite yet).

Then she came and stared at me in the aisle, and whined, but would not go into the tack room until I stepped out of sight, and then when I came back in, she was still in the tack room eating. But as I got closer, she grabbed a piece of chicken from the bowl and took it outside to eat. Silly little dog!

I can't begin to tell you how good that makes me feel, that she trusts me enough to take food from my hand.

I'll have to bring more chicken down in an hour when I take the fly masks off the horses for the night. I think I will save the chicken as the hand held treats now, and only leave dog food in the bowls. . .well. . . maybe a few bits of chicken in the bowl.

And like you all said, she was very ladylike about it.

[Jaegermonster]

That is awesome! How exciting!
I would still keep trying to get her to take it from your hand, that is wonderful progress

[SevenDogs]

:) :yes: :)

This made my day!!!

[allpurpose]

No good dog story is complete with pictures...please????

[Buffyblue]

Wonderful news! I watched the race too with my two Aussies next to me on the bed. They didn't quite know what to make of it when I started screaming! LOL! You made quite a breakthrough today. Congratulations to you and your little Angel!

[MunchkinsMom]

No good dog story is complete with pictures...please????

I'll have to charge up the camera batteries again and see if I can get more photos of her. Or borrow my daughter's camera, her's is smaller than mine and easier to fit into my pocket, maybe Angel will be less suspicious of a smaller camera.

Buffyblue, I had my two Aussies and my neighbor's Pomeranian on the couch with me watching the race, and the Pom started barking when I started shouting!