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View Full Version : Predisone and Antibiotic for barn dog with a bad back??



Dune
Dec. 20, 2008, 11:41 AM
So my wee Jack Russell mix is now 7 and has just been diagnosed with IVDD (Intervertebral Disc Disease).:( He was in horrible pain and didn't respond to Tramadel and Rimadyl, so my vet put him on Prednisone. My vet also prescribed antibiotics, and I questioned this since it didn't seem warranted. He told me that he had another (dog) patient that he put on prednisone and when THAT dog was referred to the surgeon, it was suggested the dog be put on antibiotics. Now...I assume that's because the OTHER dog was going to have surgery and we all know the effects that Prednisone can have. That scenario makes sense. :yes: However, MY dog has no wounds/skin condition/etc...nothing I can think of that would require antibiotics. :confused: Am I missing something??...the vet's explanation just didn't make sense to me. :no:

philosoraptor
Dec. 20, 2008, 01:09 PM
Could it be the antibiotics are for the week prior to the surgery, not for ongoing use?

idlemoon
Dec. 20, 2008, 01:42 PM
IVDD usually does not require antibiotics. If the dog is going to surgery then antibiotics would be used. I would guess the theory behind this is that pred supresses the immune system and may make your JRT more prone to infection.

If this pet is in this severe of pain, and it is not controlled with steroids and STRICT cage rest (like 6 weeks), then I would do surgery ASAP. It sounds as if this has been going on for some time as you have already been thru a bunch of NSAIDs. IVDD is not something to mess around with. In very short order the pet can become paralysed, loose motor function and not be able to be fixed. Please consider surgery if not better, and remains normal after a course of steroids.

I highly suggest surgery in an ongoing case like this, get it over with and get the pet out of pain. Seek a qualified surgeon/ neurosurgeon. I have been through this multiple times with multiple dogs, damn weiner dogs!

Lisa

Coobie
Dec. 20, 2008, 02:52 PM
I'm a surgical vet tech. I used to work for a surgeon, we did back surgeries on JRT's all the time for IVDD, all the time. I agree with Idlemoon, do the surgery and do it sooner than later. Chances are the pred isn't going to be enough. The only reason I know of for the antibiotics would be for surgery but even that's not common. Antibiotics after but not before especially if there is no surgery even scheduled. So if it was your regular vet and not the surgeon that put him on antibiotics it was really for no reason. At least schedule an appt with a specialist and go from there.

RunningwaterWBs
Dec. 20, 2008, 03:41 PM
Dune, please check your PTs.

Dune
Dec. 21, 2008, 12:51 AM
Could it be the antibiotics are for the week prior to the surgery, not for ongoing use?

Probably didn't get all my pronouns correct. MY dog is NOT going to surgery, that's why I thought the vet's reasoning was incorrect. Could you re-read my 1st post to see if you agree with my thinking?


IVDD usually does not require antibiotics. If the dog is going to surgery then antibiotics would be used. I would guess the theory behind this is that pred supresses the immune system and may make your JRT more prone to infection.

My dog is NOT going to surgery, example vet gave of putting MY dog on antibiotics was because of another dog....I guess my writing was not clear, sorry.

If this pet is in this severe of pain, and it is not controlled with steroids and STRICT cage rest (like 6 weeks), then I would do surgery ASAP. It sounds as if this has been going on for some time as you have already been thru a bunch of NSAIDs. IVDD is not something to mess around with. In very short order the pet can become paralysed, loose motor function and not be able to be fixed. Please consider surgery if not better, and remains normal after a course of steroids.

This was only the second time this type of thing happened. First time never had to go to meds, my horse chiropractor adjusted him and then he was fine. That was about a year ago. Fast forward to now, dog comes in from yard NQR. After about a day I take him to vet...Rimadyl/Tramadel for about 2 days have NO effect, in fact, he gets worse. They put him on steroids and say try to rest, no jumping on furniture, yada, yada. Well, good luck because said doggie is back to normal after being on the prednisone for a week. It is hard to contain him.:yes:



I highly suggest surgery in an ongoing case like this, get it over with and get the pet out of pain. Seek a qualified surgeon/ neurosurgeon. I have been through this multiple times with multiple dogs, damn weiner dogs!

If it gets worse or happens again, I will definitely consider surgery and contact you before I do! :yes: thanks!

Lisa


I'm a surgical vet tech. I used to work for a surgeon, we did back surgeries on JRT's all the time for IVDD, all the time. I agree with Idlemoon, do the surgery and do it sooner than later. Chances are the pred isn't going to be enough. The only reason I know of for the antibiotics would be for surgery but even that's not common. Antibiotics after but not before especially if there is no surgery even scheduled. So if it was your regular vet and not the surgeon that put him on antibiotics it was really for no reason. At least schedule an appt with a specialist and go from there.

Said doggie thinks Prednisone is a wonder drug!!:eek: He is a different dog and we are now on the weaning off period. I *thought* that the antibiotics and the reason my vet gave for prescribing them sounded HINKY, that's why I posted here. Sounds like I was right and I guess I can safely say I was also right in not forcefeeding something my lil guy didn't need. :no:

Bluey
Dec. 21, 2008, 01:06 AM
Don't quite know from your post, but it sounds like your dog needs to be confined until he heals, if it will, as the corticosteroids reduce the swelling.

Confine to a crate and take out on a leash, don't let it run around, no matter how well it feels.:eek:

If as you say this is the second time, the next one he may end up paralyzed, so try to get a second opinion, maybe from a specialist, so you know exactly what and where he has a problem and if it needs to be addressed more actively.:confused:

Sing Mia Song
Dec. 21, 2008, 10:49 AM
Prednisone is a wonder drug, but you can only go to the well so many times.

Another former surgical vet tech, past owner of a dachshund, and I would crate rest this dog for at least a month. I know he seems fine, but it's a whole lot better to do this now than have emergency surgery later when he goes down in back. Swear to god.

Dune
Dec. 21, 2008, 11:29 AM
Confine to a crate and take out on a leash, don't let it run around, no matter how well it feels.:eek:
.




Another former surgical vet tech, past owner of a dachshund, and I would crate rest this dog for at least a month. I know he seems fine, but it's a whole lot better to do this now than have emergency surgery later when he goes down in back. .


Don't worry folks, the whole reason I posted this is that I had already done research on the condition and had the question about the antibiotic. I'm well aware of how serious this is and can be, he's being confined as we speak, it's just that at first I didn't expect him to be feeling that good...especially since the other drugs didn't touch the pain. I'm so sad that my little buddy is nearing that "stage in life" where I have to be so careful with him, he's been the tough guy for so long now. :( Thanks for everyone's help!!

Bluey
Dec. 21, 2008, 01:27 PM
I wonder if the vet gave your dog antibiotics on the odd chance it may have some tick transmitted disease?
Although he should have told you if so.:confused:

Dune
Dec. 21, 2008, 01:51 PM
I wonder if the vet gave your dog antibiotics on the odd chance it may have some tick transmitted disease?
Although he should have told you if so.:confused:

Well, then he should have said that, but instead gave me that lame reason which makes me doubt his competence. (darn those owners that have a lick of sense;)). Said dog is all of 17lbs and mostly white (and on Frontline) so any ticks are quite visible as he's on the couch with me at night....I don't want those nasty things anywhere near me! :no:

abbydp
Dec. 21, 2008, 02:56 PM
Just be careful using Pred. We just had a dog that had been on it long term almost die. After much testing and searching, they realized she had one of the side efffects of long term use - thinning of the intestines. She ruptured and is fighting for her life right now.

Dune
Dec. 21, 2008, 10:36 PM
Just be careful using Pred. We just had a dog that had been on it long term almost die. After much testing and searching, they realized she had one of the side efffects of long term use - thinning of the intestines. She ruptured and is fighting for her life right now.



I'm so sorry about your dear dog.:cry: I hope she'll be all right. As for mine, this is a 2 week course and we're right in the middle of the weaning off period. I'd never put one on long term, I know it's nasty stuff. :no:

Coobie
Dec. 21, 2008, 10:42 PM
I did have a dog die from Pred. Causes severe/irreversable liver damage. He had a horrific time while I tried to nurse him back until I realized it was a losing cause. The liver damage caused his skin to basic melt or fall off until it was bloody and raw. The first area to be affected was his feet. A condition called hyperkalemic acidosis.
I HATE HATE HATE Prednisone!!!!!!

FatPalomino
Dec. 22, 2008, 12:28 AM
Pred decreases the healing time.... does your dog have any (even minor) open wound or history of needing abx's? What antibiotic did your vet prescribe?

We used Pred on an OLD rescued Great Dane that came to us with IVDD (from living in a walk in closet for the first 9 years of his life). He was NOT a surgical candidate for a variety of reasons... so we choose quality over quantity of life. We just sent him to heaven after a year of him running pain free on the farm and finally having a chance to be a dog.

Pred. is a wonderful drug, but, like all wonderful drugs, is not without side effects (esp. in long term use).

OP, you may want to consider a 2nd opinion. If surgery is within your reach, you may want to seriously consider it if the surgeon agrees it will benefit your pup.

The other 'up and coming' concept is physical therapy for pets. I have seen it make a difference in IVDD dogs that were not going to surgery.

Good luck!

CdnRider
Dec. 22, 2008, 12:41 AM
I too don't know why your vet would prescribe an antibiotic. Are you sure it is an antibiotic, what is the name of the drug?

I have seen dogs with a back injury to extremely well with pred, goodluck with your dog!

Dune
Dec. 22, 2008, 01:33 PM
Pred decreases the healing time.... does your dog have any (even minor) open wound or history of needing abx's? What antibiotic did your vet prescribe?

OP, you may want to consider a 2nd opinion. If surgery is within your reach, you may want to seriously consider it if the surgeon agrees it will benefit your pup.

The other 'up and coming' concept is physical therapy for pets. I have seen it make a difference in IVDD dogs that were not going to surgery.

Good luck!

I don't know what "abx's" is? Abscesses?? If so, no history of those or ANY open wound, that's why I was perplexed. Amoxicillin is what the vet prescribed. If the prednisone will take care of this, that's great. I'm not jumping right to the surgery without some serious research into it, he's just not at that point. Although, if necessary, and if he could have quality of life I'll do it. I am going to have a chiro look at him in another week or so, I'm going to ask her about any PT I can do for/with him. :yes:


I too don't know why your vet would prescribe an antibiotic. Are you sure it is an antibiotic, what is the name of the drug?

I have seen dogs with a back injury to extremely well with pred, goodluck with your dog!

Amoxicillin, yes, I'm sure. Thanks for having such little faith in me, guys!!:lol::winkgrin: Thanks for your well wishes, said doggie is doing MUCH better, but I guess I'll know more when he's completely off the prednisone.