Desperados

[hansiska]

In the interest of starting an interesting and hopefully positive thread, it's getting to be winter and I'm doing a lot of hypothetical matchmaking on behalf of my four year old Bruderherz (Bolero/ Eisenherz)/Akzent II/ Polacca x mare. I'm liking the D-line for her.

Please tell me what you know about Desperados. I very much like the Wolkenstein II in the damline on this one. Desperados has won a lot of young horse classes, but is he a flash in the pan or the real deal? Has anyone here used him? Has anyone seen foals in person? Any info would be appreciated.

Here's a link to his page (with video link):
http://www.gestuet-groenwohldhof.de/cms/de/pages/hengste/desperados.php?wb_session_id=cb9b35bddb52e0cd71ce4 bcc5ad8f6cf

[Edgewood]

Hansiska - I found him not so long ago and I really liked him as well. I was surprised that no one had ever mentioned him either. I liked his bloodlines and the videos that I saw.

Do you know if his semen is imported. I was looking at him for well in the future, none of my current mares are suitable.

[hansiska]

Yep, A-1 Performance sires has im for $675/ 2 doses.

Here's their info page on him:
http://a-1performancesires.com/Hanoverian/desperados.htm

Is this the first year anyone's imported his frozen to the US? I seem to recall them listing him as "new" but I could be misremembering this.

[railmom]

I really like this stallion and will probably use him in the future, but I only have one mare without Donnerhall blood up close! I have a friend who saw him at the 2004 and 2005 Bundeschampionat as well as some foals at the foals shows. She strongly believes he is the "real deal" ;)

Here is what Gestuet Sprehe says about his foals...

"As a sire, Desperados has turned into a real bank. His foals are chic, have good types and very good movements. Absolute top foals were seen at many of the foal shows and auctions all over Germany. His son Desert Storm was the star in the lot of foals at the Elite Fall Auction in Vechta and was sold to Switzerland for the top price of 28,500 Euros. In Verden, a filly was sold for 26,000 Euros."

Hansiska - He sounds like a really good choice for your mare!

[Dressage_Diva333]

I had some Desperados semen that I tryed to breed my Royal Appearance/ Grannus mare with. Unfortunately she did not take.

I really liked his damline as well. I saw a video of a Desperados/ Rohdiamant colt a month or two ago, I really liked him!

I got my semen from www.classicsires.com/, they are great to work with :)

[STF]

DressageDiva,
Did the vet say the semen looked good post thaw?

[Crosiadore Farm]

I saw Desperados at the Oldenburg Stallion Parade two weeks ago. As a riding horse I must say he looks like the real deal. Desperados was doing work which looked to be the equivalent of PSG and doing it very well. He is a solid looking horse but well proportioned and muscled for his age/level of training. I have not followed his foal crops too much so will not comment there. But a very attractive, talented stallion from what I saw.

[mmt]

I have seen four or five Desperados foals in Germany, all black or bay. The ones I saw all had pretty faces, good types. I did not see them move so cannot comment on that.

[Dressage_Diva333]

Yes, the semen looked good post thaw :)

The mare was a maiden though, and ended up catching first time we used Fresh semen. Just bad luck I guess :/

[hansiska]

Hansiska - He sounds like a really good choice for your mare!
:) Thanks! I keep coming back to the D-line for her. Also, doubling up on Akzent II doesn't bother me. My short list at the moment is Don Primero, Don Frederico, and Desperados. I need to hear about confirmed pregnancies via frozen with Desperados before I'd truly consider him, though. Even though I like everything I see so far, I'm too cheap to risk it!

Kendra

[Donella]

There was one at the stallion liscencing this year in Hannover. He was one the crowd fav's it seemed..really pretty face, medium frame/build..nice movement. I was suprised he wasn't liscenced.

Can't go wrong with Don Fred though:D We love ours..and both are from a heavily linebred Absatz mare.

[MoSwanson]

I saw only one weanling colt in Germany. He was a wedding gift from my friend to his new wife. The colt was tall, elegant with a pretty face and a very good walk. There was a bit more hind leg angle than I prefer. The trot was active in front with a good amount of knee to the gait mechanics and good shoulder freedom. The engagement behind could have been better. You can't base a conclusion on seeing only one offspring, but that's the only one I have seen by him...

[Ladybug Hill]

What about the jump in these? Didn't see any jump on the video.

[mmt]

Jump???? If you are thinking hunters than it maybe okay. Is that why you asked?

[Ladybug Hill]

Yes, hunters--don't need an Olympic caliber jump but a very good jump is necessary to look good up into the higher divisions. I wouldn't breed purposefully to something that didn't have a decent jump. Honestly, not sure why the jump ability would not be considered in any breeding animal.

[mmt]

You can look up his jumping scores from his testing.

I would expect that he could produce up to a 3'6" hunter, but would be rather shocked if he produced anything with "A LOT" of scope.

[password]

Has anybody heard of any frozen pregnanies and/or seen any offspring?

[password]

Not even a foal on youtube?

[SGray]

:) Thanks! I keep coming back to the D-line for her. Also, doubling up on Akzent II doesn't bother me. My short list at the moment is Don Primero, Don Frederico, and Desperados. I need to hear about confirmed pregnancies via frozen with Desperados before I'd truly consider him, though. Even though I like everything I see so far, I'm too cheap to risk it!

Kendra

hope someone answers in the affirmative as I too want to breed my mare to him

[hansiska]

I did hear back from one of the big vendors (A-1). She said she's sold Desperados semen two two breeders. One now has a pregnant mare and one still has it in the tank.

[password]

Have you seen any of his foals yet? Do you happen to know where his test scores are listed? Thanks!

[railmom]

I am bumping this up.....Just wondering about the frozen semen? Anyone know of any foals in the US?

[password]

No, but I'll help you to keep this bumped up so we can find out!:)

[Donella]

Kendra,
Have you decided yet on who to use on your lovely mare??
For the record, the Don Frederico semen we have used has been super. Two pregnancies on first round, one with half dose and one with full dose.

If you are looking for dark coated D sons, what about De Niro or even his son, DeNoir?? De Niro might be super with your girl?

[hansiska]

Hi Kyla!

Nope, haven't decided yet. Don Frederico and Don Primero are tied for first. Desperados is very nice, but I need to see pregnancies with frozen (not to mention foals). Then I have my days where I think Londonderry would be perfect for her.....

Anyone want to weigh in on who throws the quickest hindleg of the three?

I jut can't decide!

She is Bruderherz/ Akzent II so I think DeNiro has Akzent II too close.

[Dressage_Diva333]

Haniska- I've heard Don Primero's frozen semen isn't very good. But you asked for opinions on who throws the quickest hind leg, and IMO, it's Londonderry :)

Like I mentioned before, the Desperados semen I had looked good. I attribute the lack of pregnancy to my vet... who has only done frozen once before (and did get a pregnancy). And the mare was a maiden.

Let me see if I can find the link to where I saw those foals before, there were videos of them as well.

[Dressage_Diva333]

One foal... still looking for the other link I'm thinking of...

http://www.oldenburger-pferde.com/media/DE%20433330154808/FO_44.jpg

[Donella]

Hmmm,
Quickest hind leg.
Well, our Londonderry filly has a super hind leg, the inspectors did comment on it as well. Definately better than moms.

But then my two year old Don Frederico probably has the best hind leg on her of any young horse I have seen lately. Her mom is good this way though, so not sure it's a DF thing???

Ahh, so many nice boys hey?

I will say though, for temperament, you will never get better than a Londonderry. I don't think I have ever heard anything different. The only thing he wont give you is more shoulder freedom, bigger flashier front end movement.

[back in the saddle]

This is an old thread... any frozen pregnancies from Desperados?

[MoSwanson]

This is an old thread... any frozen pregnancies from Desperados?

Yes, we had a pregnancy last year. Unfortunately, the mare slipped and we lost the pregnancy. I have one more dose to use this year, hopefully with a better result...

[back in the saddle]

What does he "bring to the table" so to speak? Will he put on correct hind ends?

Did she catch on one dose?

[MoSwanson]

What does he "bring to the table" so to speak? Will he put on correct hind ends?

Did she catch on one dose?

The only foal I personally saw in Germany had perhaps a bit too much angle in the hind leg. It was only one foal, and I would hate to generalize based on that one foal. The pregnancy I got was using one dose.

[Sunnydays]

I am very keen on Desperados! Love his frame and movement, and his bloodlines especially. His licensed offspring from last fall's hanoverian keuring was just stunning, in my opinion.

[DreamStreet]

I have seen and spent time with Desperados, personally. He is trained at Gestut Groenwohldhof (where I trained for sometime with Frau Rehbein), ridden by Falk. He has a lovely personality and I know Falk really enjoys training him.

If you are considering Desperados, you should REALLY consider Don Bolero. He too stands at Gestut Groenwohldhof. He hasn't been offer for breeding for very long. He has been a personal competition horse for Kristy Oately (Australian Olympian). This stallion has three phenomenal gaits, with an incredible ability for extension. He's been a top Grand Prix horse in Europe and has THE BEST temperament!

I have just imported a Don Primero x Royal Dance stallion, who I have very high hopes for. His rideabilty is typical of the Donnerhall x Rubenstein lines and he is a very expressive mover. I'll be showing him this summer in the FEI 4 year old divisions.

[SGray]

...... Desperados has won a lot of young horse classes, but is he a flash in the pan or the real deal?....


http://www.eurodressage.com/reports/shows/2010/10hagen/mediencup.html

....Falk Rosenbauer and the 9-year old Hanoverian stallion Desperados won the first leg of the 2010 Medien Cup show circuit at the CDI Hagen.....The duo won the warm up round Intermediaire II test with 73.263% as well as the young Grand Prix horse test with 75.450%.....

[Molly Malone]

I watched that test - it was quite lovely - his piaffe and passage were wonderful.

[Donella]

I watched it too. SUPER horse!

[not again]

Has anyone used Damsey? Brentina is having a foal by him.

[Dressage_Diva333]

Is there video anywhere of that recent GP test by Desperados?

[Molly Malone]

A repeat of the young horse warm up is being shown now, followed by the final

http://cpm24.tv/index.php?lang=en
:)

[honeylips]

is the Desperados GP test on youtube or anywhere saved?

[Donella]

Reviving this thread. Anyone going to use Desperados this year? Seen any of his offspring ?? Reports on frozen quality?

I am strongly considering him for my Rosentau/A line mare ...

[Forte]

I am really interested in him too, but was waiting for someone else to try him first so I know if the frozen works!

[Donella]

I think I will email Doug and see what he has to say about the semen.

Just found this video of him...gosh he looks so talented! :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykz69dT8VI4&feature=related

[paulamc]

i have used desperados frozen semen here in Australia, have had 2 pregnancies from 2 half doses of semen only

so the frozen semen is good to go

Paulamc

[Forte]

Good to know Paula. Really, really like this guy. Has anyone found a conformation picture of him?
Unfortunately I have 3 mares to pick from and all 3 of them would result in pretty close line breeding (I've got Weltmeyer/Rubinstein, Donnerschlag/Matrose and Freestyle/Wolkenstein II).

[eks]

He is very pretty, but there is something I'm not that crazy about in his hind end...he doesn't seem to have a lot of jump or engagement compared to many other stallions out there.

[Crosiadore Farm]

He is very pretty, but there is something I'm not that crazy about in his hind end...he doesn't seem to have a lot of jump or engagement compared to many other stallions out there.

I agree and would breed with that in mind. Desperados has had some super foals though, and for sure worth a try with the right mare.

http://www.bescht-schlieckau.com/stpt1210.htm

His son Destano (Desperados/Brentano II) just finished his 30 day test in December 2010 with an 8.85, overall second at his performance test. He looks to have the better gaits, but time will tell which is the better sire.

[back in the saddle]

is the Desperados GP test on youtube or anywhere saved?

The only ones I could find:

I like him and a big time breeder told me to use him. They've seen a lot of his foals.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ghdfhrufdkc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykz69dT8VI4&feature=related

[Donella]

I watched the Meiden Cup test on ClipMyHorse.com. Maybe it is still up there? I think it was the qualifier he won..he beat out alot of very talented, very nice horses/riders that day.

He also won the Hamburg Dressage Derby...maybe that can be found on ClipMyHorse.

[back in the saddle]

i have used desperados frozen semen here in Australia, have had 2 pregnancies from 2 half doses of semen only

so the frozen semen is good to go

Paulamc


Did your vet give any details about the semen quality?

[paulamc]

I am my own 'vet'. i do all my own ultrasounding and inseminating

the semen looked ok under the scope, it might not be as totally virile as sir donnerhall but it looked fine and it worked fine

There are 4 straws in a dose.

A friend of mine had bought 2 doses of Desperados. She had used a vet for the first insemination, he used a whole dose - 4 straws for no result

As she was entitled to 2 service certificates, i did 2 mares with half doses each - 2 straws each, and both took first insemination

I have heard there are other pregnancies to him here in Australia as well so i would say the semen is fine to use

I put the semen in about 90 minutes before ovulation was due on both mares and it worked a treat

I wouldnt hesitate to buy or use it again

Paulamc

[back in the saddle]

Bred to him today and the vet said the semen was 25-30% mobility.