Weird Skin Condition

[BB.MooseCow]

my horse has some unknown condition.. it's stumping my vet, so i was wondering if anyone had any ideas that could help us. Here are some pictures (not the greatest quality, they're taken from my phone):

Edited to add he is 14 years old, no history of anything like this

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=45846612&l=47dbc&id=28126111
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http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=45846636&l=a99cb&id=28126111

as bad as it looks here, it looks 100 times worse in person, its all over his ENTIRE BODY

if you have any ideas I'm open!!!

Wednesday (12th) he started getting hives, we gave him antihistmine
Thursday the hives turned into lumps(they filled my cupped hand and were squishy).. antihistimine didn't do anything
Friday "saw vet" (he looked at him thru the bars and said allergic reaction to shavings.) said anti-histimine wouldn't do anything. so he was started on dex and shavings changed to pure pine.
Sunday the lumps were gone for the most part, hives remained and continused to get worse
Monday he started to get "dandraff"
Tuesday/Wednesday you started to be able to pick scabs off
Thursday whole clumps of hair and SKIN is coming off, you dont have to pick at it, just touch him.. yesterday he refused to move, not even for hay. seemed REALLY lame untill you got him moving, we were able to trot him in the end tho and he didn't seem lame anymore. But when the vet picked up his leg for the hoof tests, he fell. he was also having muscle tremors. He actually saw a vet today, she spent a lot of time with him, taking lots of blood, gave him a shot of banamine, tested for laminitis and perscribed some meds.
Today (friday) his forearms and carpus on both forelimbs are HUGE, and his sheath is VERY swollen, it is hard for him to pee. He saw the vet again, she took more blood and skin biopsies.

He's now on
-dex
-pennicillian
-Quadrasol

His sheath is clean, I was getting him ready for horse inspections at school so I cleaned it with KY jelly. He has had it cleaned with KY before with no reaction.

Tests given

CBC- normal
muscle enzymes- normal
HYPP- neg
laminitis- neg
skin biopsy- pending


thanks for even reading this, I'm very worried. Sorry if it's a bit scattered, theres so much going on in my brain right now! Ask for clarification if you need it

Thank You!!

[shawneeAcres]

SOunds like a severe allergic reaction, who knows to what. I had a horse line time, and he kept having reoccurances. Finally sold him to someone in another area, vet was worried he would eventually die of one of these episodes. They were VERY BAD, and we knew he was allergic to something but did not know what.

[pj]

I haven't a bit of advice and I wish I did. Poor poor boy.
Nothing has changed, hay, feed, suppliments, ...nothing?
Please keep us updated.

[BB.MooseCow]

no, nothing has changed. we got a new load of shavings in, but it was from the same provider as we always get them from, i'm not in charge of the shavings so i can't tell you exactly what it is, but its always a mix of different trees and we double checked with them and they did infact send the normal shavings.

just in case it was a reaction to the shavings we switched him to pure pine. hasn't helped. but honestly i'm REALLY hoping that there was something in the shavings.. its easy for me to keep buying this new bagged pine if that makes him happy.

I just want him to be more comfortable, whatever it takes

[jetsmom]

Have they started blanketing him? Allergy to Detergent in blanket/saddle pads?
Allergy to yearly shots/ or from worming?

[BB.MooseCow]

he's been blanketed since september, i use ivory snow and have been using it all year.
got his shots in late august (they were required before i could move him to school).
was also wormed in september (we put off worming untill next week because a cold was going thru the barn- and all the horses get wormed the same day here. he wasn't affected by the cold tho. the symptoms were mainly low fever and loose stools.. he had neither)


thanks for any suggestions!

[Simkie]

Wow.

Right off the bat, the only think I can think of that you haven't mentioned would be a skin scraping. Perhaps he has some bizarre skin parasite like mange or chicken lice.

I think the skin biopsy results will be interesting.

How about allergy testing? What about running an ANA to test for auto-immune issues?

[BB.MooseCow]

oh i just forgot to mention the skin scraping, that was taken yesterday there were no results from that so i assume it was normal.
I'm not actually sure what an ANA is, is that a blood test? she ran so many different blood tests i can't remember which ones she did. I do remember her mentioning auto-immune tho, so if she didn't test for it yesterday, she might have today.. i'll write that down on my list to mention to her tho. thanks

[Simkie]

Yes, an ANA is a blood test: ANA Blood Test (http://arthritis.about.com/od/diagnostic/a/ana.htm).

[Mary in Area 1]

Did you bathe him or put anything on his body when he first got the hives? What have you put on him topically?

I would think if it was an allergy, the antihistimine would have done something. I suspect it is a REALLY bad case of rain rot, which has gotten infected and turned systemic (i.e. cellulitis).

I'm glad he's on penicillin now, but he may have to go on a sulfa drug instead depending on the type of bacteria.

Good luck and jingles for your boy. Keep us posted.

[BB.MooseCow]

when he first got the hives we diluted vetrolin and gave him a soak, then we made sure we rinsed it all off.

topiclly, we tried aloe a few days ago but he was NOT happy, it looked like it stug him. so we stopped trying. He doesn't even want to be touched :(

it does looks like rain rot, but the we're is hesitant to say that is what it is as he NEVER goes out without a blanket and NEVER in rainy/ moist conditions.

His blanket gets changed from when he goes in to when he comes out, and he's never sweaty when you feel under the blanket (it's mostly self care here at school, so i'm the one who changes his blankets and checks on him).

As well, there was not bacteria in the skin scrapings.

As well, I forgot to mention this before, it started on the underside of his belly area, and spread from there, his neck (the only place not covered by a blanket) was one of the last places he got it.

*I'm going back over to the barn now, so I'll let you know whats going on when I get back

[pj]

As well, I forgot to mention this before, it started on the underside of his belly area, and spread from there, his neck (the only place not covered by a blanket) was one of the last places he got it.

*I'm going back over to the barn now, so I'll let you know whats going on when I get back

That makes me think of the shavings. If the shavings are mixed there is always the possibility that a "bad" tree could be in one batch. I would be sure to use only pine shavings just in case.

[BB.MooseCow]

yep, from now on he's getting the premium shavings :) everyone in my barn is jealous.. of course only untill they look at dancer.

i took some more pictures this morning, i'll post them in a bit.

the only real update today is that he's looking more skin/hair.. and he's very uncomfortable walking (mainly the forelimbs, but his hind is swelling a bit now too) he was walking one foot in front of the other (like a tightrope).

When i cleaned his stall there was wet shavings which made me happy, i was worried his sheath was going to swell even more. but unfortunately he is still having trouble peeing.

he's very sick of needles right now. when i gave him his 3 shots of pennicillian today he was very frustrated, not that i blame him! after all the blood tests, needles and skin biopsies hes gotten lately! he's being really good about everything tho.

the good news is he was a lot more alert today, i tried to eat a granola bar as i was holding him and he was trying hard to get it. yesterday he just ignored it.

[EventFan]

I'd be really alert for changes and have your Vet on speed dial. There are some auto-immune diseases that you may want to test for also. Your biopsy tests, or skin scrapings will take some time to come back from the lab. Good luck!

[BB.MooseCow]

today's pictures

http://community.webshots.com/album/568832620ZPtBPl

or i've labeled the pictures on facebook.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=45853345&l=07b2b&id=28126111
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I'm going back around 3, but I have my barn tech watching him till I get back (I have to work on my finals)

[SSFLandon]

today's pictures

http://community.webshots.com/album/568832620ZPtBPl

I'm going back around 3, but I have my barn tech watching him till I get back (I have to work on my finals)

poor guy!

I don't have anything to add other then I have a mystery skin thing going on with one of mine. We are going to allergy test, skin scrape, biopsy and take more blood on Monday. Mine has been more ongoing so I am going to bring up auto immune issues.... good luck to you!

just a thought, I did not look to see what climate you are in but, could your horse have been bitten by something? My dad is an allergist and he will get clients with crazy sudden symptoms similar to your horse and they conclude that a reaction from a bite is the problem. You skin scrape might reveal that.

[BB.MooseCow]

We are in eastern ontario. it's been ranging form 0c to -10c for the past month

[pj]

You may have said but have you washed or changed his blanket since he started with this? If it should be the shavings you don't want to put the same blanket on him that he laid down in the mixed shavings with.
I feel so sorry for him (and you). This is rough.

[Chall]

So sorry, it looks awful and painful.
I would try googling for dog/cat fur loss as well as horse. Here is a Merck's definition on types of mange http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/72003.htm
and one really different case due to the coloring of the horse http://equisearch.com/horses_care/health/illnesses_injuries/hairloss_102406/index.aspx
but really your horse looks different.
You've certainly provided enough documentation in pictures. Maybe you should change the title to ask for "vet input". It seems serious enough. I hope it resolves quickly!

[BornToRide]

Poor guy :( Although it sounds like an allergic reaction initially, any possibility that this might be a reaction to some toxins, perhaps internally. Was a liver function test done as well? If not, I would request one also.

Using dex can definitely push a horse into laminitis btw! Is he still sore to walk? I would not discount that he possibly has it. Do not feed anything that is hight in starches and sugars at this point - good grass hay only - perhaps add some BP (without molasses)/Hay pellet mashes .

Selenium toxicity also causes hair loss, although I do not think it would present in such a way. However, it is also a posibility, albeit remote.

Also to consider: "The cause was a rare reaction to this drug, Bactrim. It is a common antibiotic used by millions of people," Lozano explained. "What she has is a condition called TEN -- toxic epidermal necrolysis -- which is an autoimmune reaction to a whole host of drugs." http://cnnwire.blogs.cnn.com/
And http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toxic_epidermal_necrolysis
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/1770484

(http://www.find-health-articles.com/rec_pub_17334486-toxic-epidermal-necrolysis-procaine-penicillin.htm)FHA - Toxic epidermal necrolysis due to procaine penicillin ... (http://www.find-health-articles.com/rec_pub_17334486-toxic-epidermal-necrolysis-procaine-penicillin.htm)
... reactions to procaine benzylpenicillin and sodium/potassium benzylpenicillin in horses
(http://www.find-health-articles.com/rec_pub_17334486-toxic-epidermal-necrolysis-procaine-penicillin.htm)Best wishes!

[BB.MooseCow]

You may have said but have you washed or changed his blanket since he started with this? If it should be the shavings you don't want to put the same blanket on him that he laid down in the mixed shavings with.
I feel so sorry for him (and you). This is rough.

I washed the blankets with ivory snow and double rinsed them at the same time as i changed the shavings so that none of the old shavings residue was on the blankets

So sorry, it looks awful and painful.
I would try googling for dog/cat fur loss as well as horse. Here is a Merck's definition on types of mange http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/72003.htm
and one really different case due to the coloring of the horse http://equisearch.com/horses_care/health/illnesses_injuries/hairloss_102406/index.aspx


wow, thank you for the links, i'll start reading up. trying to find a cause helps me from worrying myself sick! i'll add "vet input" to the title

Was a liver function test done as well? If not, I would request one also.

Using dex can definitely push a horse into laminitis btw!

Selenium toxicity also causes hair loss, although I do not think it would present in such a way. However, it is also a posibility, albeit remote.



no, a liver function test was not done. I'll make sure I mention it to the vet.
yes, we are aware that dex can cause laminitis, that was actually what we were initially worried about when he didn't want to wallk, but every time the vet comes back she has been testing him for laminitis, and in between we are feeling for heat in his hooves.

[BB.MooseCow]

hmm, i can't remember how to change the thread title

[AKB]

Are there weeds in your hay that could be causing a toxic reaction? Has he had any fevers? I would check his temp once or twice a day to be sure about fever. Is he up to date on worming? Someone mentioned mange, but I think the ivermectin wormers would prevent him from coming down with mange since dogs are often treated for mange with ivermectin.

Can your vet send pictures to a veterinary dermatologist at the local vet school?

[BB.MooseCow]

Are there weeds in your hay that could be causing a toxic reaction? Has he had any fevers? I would check his temp once or twice a day to be sure about fever. Is he up to date on worming? Someone mentioned mange, but I think the ivermectin wormers would prevent him from coming down with mange since dogs are often treated for mange with ivermectin.

Can your vet send pictures to a veterinary dermatologist at the local vet school?

It could be hay, i guess now that everything else is stumping us we may have to go back to the things we thought we ruled out in the beginning. it was thought that due to the pattern it spread in, that it wouldn't be ingested- but who knows now!
he's been in a normal range of tempteratures for him this whole time, except for thursday afternoon- when the vet checked he was 38.7c. everytime ive checked it was around 37.5.

it has been 11 weeks since he has been wormed, the school is worming next week (was supposed to be 2 weeks ago, but due to other horses having a cold it was moved).

The pictures I've posted have all been sent to the vet

[Hampton Bay]

I have a gelding who gets a similar reaction to gnats, complete with the same kind of hair loss, open oozy sores, etc. He was always feeling good, if very itchy.

Of course, given your location and the temperature, it is not gnats, but I know how frustrating it is to see them so uncomfortable.

The only thing I do have to ad is, once he gets a bit cleared up (not losing more hair, feeling better, etc) Healthy Hair helps a ton in growing the hair back. It is mostly lanolin and vitamin E, and it helps keep the skin moist, which I really think helps the hair grow back. I wouldn't put anything on him without the vet's OK, but that is what I have used for a couple years on scrapes as well as on my gelding.

Good luck!

[pj]

Someone mentioned mange, but I think the ivermectin wormers would prevent him from coming down with mange since dogs are often treated for mange with ivermectin.

Can your vet send pictures to a veterinary dermatologist at the local vet school?

It DOES look like mange but the skin scraping should have shown that immediately if it was.
Do horses get mange??

[jaimebaker]

Here's more info on mange in horses

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/72003.htm


It looks like mange or a severe case of rainrot. The only time I've seen giant tufts of fur come out like that was on a horse with really bad rain rot. However, I have a dog with demodectic mange and when he used to lose his hair it was in giant tufts like that. He's been on thyroid medicine for 5 years and that stopped all of his outbreaks. Can't remember what the thyroid had to do with it, but that's what my vet has him on and he's had a full coat ever since going on it.

[pj]

Here's more info on mange in horses

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/72003.htm


It looks like mange or a severe case of rainrot. The only time I've seen giant tufts of fur come out like that was on a horse with really bad rain rot. However, I have a dog with demodectic mange and when he used to lose his hair it was in giant tufts like that. He's been on thyroid medicine for 5 years and that stopped all of his outbreaks. Can't remember what the thyroid had to do with it, but that's what my vet has him on and he's had a full coat ever since going on it.
OH MY GOSH!! After fifty eight years with horses this is the first I've heard they could get mange!! Thanks for link. Learn something new every day. I've never seen one with mange and that's a good thing.

[Guyot]

I had a horse who looked just like this, unfortunately I had just bought her as a school horse and didn't have any history on her. Long story short, never found a reason for it, after tons of testing. Treated with Dex shots to keep inflammation down, as skin was hot and puffy where the fur was ruffled and where the skin was falling off.

Basically, did nothing except remove dead skin/fur by hand, administer Dex shots 2x day. Almost all fur fell out with a good layer or two of skin, sort of reminded me of a well decayed animal skin:eek: But under that was good healthy skin and once everything bad was gone, her coat came back just fine. Took a good couple of months, but never had a problem again, nor found out what it was.

I hope you find what's wrong and are able to fix it, but I would be careful about adding anything topical without vet advise...time usually fixes everything, just keep him as comfortable as possible and warm as his fur falls out. (I had to worry about sunburn and flies!) Hopefully, your horses new skin is healthy and this clears up quickly! Best of Luck!!

[just_me]

A few months ago my horse came down with hives all over his body. Dex didn't work. Antihistamines worked marginally. He lost all his hair in clumps. Scurfy clumps. Finally, he was on prednisone, antibiotics, and some kind of immune stuff.

I had allergy tests done. We're pretty sure it was the shavings. His strongest allergies were to trees (pine, cedar, and some others). After the hives were gone and his coat started growing back, he started getting hives again on the day they put a load of shaving in his stall. Pulled him out of the stall, gave him a shot of dex (the hives were just starting and we kept him away from the shavings) and the hives went away.

He's now out 24/7, no shavings, so knock on wood, he'll be ok.

Hope you figure it out.

[BB.MooseCow]

thanks!

hmm, maybe he's strangely allergic to pine too, though he's had pine in his stall many times since i've gotten him. maybe its time to try straw or peat moss

[Ghazzu]

I'd certainly put immune mediated problems at the top of the list.
Whether to an exogenous trigger or an autoimmune process is the $64K question.

Good luck, and if you don't find an answer quickly, consider doing a skin biopsy and sending to a veterinary dermatohistopathologist.

[BB.MooseCow]

yep, we did a biopsy on friday and it'll be back next week.

[Ghazzu]

yep, we did a biopsy on friday and it'll be back next week.

If it is not being read specifically by a dermatohistopathologist, you might want to request that.
It's a fairly specialized area.

[BB.MooseCow]

alright, I'll ask whos reading it. i know it is some sort of pathologist, but i don't know if he is specialised in anything specific

[vickienme]

I have helped before with hives, skin conditions allergies and such.
I recommend using my feed mix below, the garlic and applecider
vinegar do wonders. I would put him on the ABC Super Vits Plus, may
take only one round 21 days and make take two.
I would use my alternatives mentioned below. Also you can add in the
Free Choice Stress System to help calm his nerves, heal his skin and
detox his system, all very slowly and carefully.

MY FAVORITE SPECIAL FEED MIX:
I feed this mix once daily. If I have a horse that
needs supplements twice daily I'll hold out one dog food scoop (1qt)
full for next morning feeding.

Per Horse - 1 to 2 cups dry measured BP pellets without molasses,
Hydrate Beet Pulp with 1 to 2 qts hot water, (adjust as needed, fluffy not soppy)
1 ounce or so (up to 2 cups) apple cider vinegar,
from 1 teaspoon up to 3 Tablespoons garlic powder/granulated
per horse, 1/3 cup up to 2/3 cup whole flax seed per horse, 1/2 cup corn oil.

If your horse is not insulin resistant you can add 1 to 2 cups whole oats to the hydration mix and if an oldie you can also add some alfalfa pellets.

Mix into the hydrated mix when ready to feed, 1 cup stabilized rice bran (Satin Finish) per horse,
Prozyme with BG or Sr Prozyme with BG, ABC's Selenium/Vit E, (be sure to check with
your local county extension office to find out if your area is high or low in selenium)
We also have a natural Vit E supplement if your area/hay is high in selenium)
Humic Shale Ore.

Feed 2 to 4 dog food (1 qt) scoops per horse, in my case as much as needed to
help horse regain some wt if they lost alot. Very safe feed mix. Slow metabolizing
so is great in the winter too, keeps them satisfied and warm.

You can top dress with ABC PLUS and ABC HOOF for anyone needing extra.

I'm mixing for 9 to 11 horses usually.
So I'm guessing for one horse. About 2 qts hot water to 1 to 2 cups dry
Measured beet pulp per horse. 1 oz apple cider vinegar, up to
3 T garlic powder/granulated per horse. The garlic and applecider vinegar
will do wonders for their skin health and prevent fly sores, repels knats.

My mixing is in a 5 gal bucket. 2 gallons hot water with
About 1 1/2 to 2 inches in the bottom of 1 gallon jug of
Apple cider vinegar. In the other gallon I put 1 teaspoon per
Horse up to 3 Tablespoons per horse of the garlic and fill
With hot water and shake to dissolve. I use 3 T per horse
Year round of the garlic.

If you are just starting out, go with
1 Teaspoon and build up to 3 Tablespoons over a little time
Allowing the horse to get used to it. Mine love it. Smells
Like Doritos and they lick the buckets clean. You want
The beet pulp after hydrated to be fluffy and damp. Not
Soggy and fully hydrated. No little hard pieces preferably.
I just pour in some Corn Oil and stir it all around and put
the lid on and allow it to hydrate for 4 hours or more. I mix
this in the morning and feed at evening feeding and same some
for next morning when I have horses getting supplements
twice daily. During summer you can up the amt of garlic as needed
up to 3 Tablespoons daily to get your best results. Twice daily is
best during the summer as our bodies use up what we feed it
every 12 hours. During the winter, one time daily is enough and you
can reduce the amt to 1/2 the summer dose if you want to.

During the winter I feed more than I do in the summer, still
Mostly one time per day at dinner to keep them warm through
The nite and not cold or massively hungry in the morning.
I can easily feed as late as noon and not have anyone colicy
Or massively hungry and mad at me. During the summer the
Garlic and applecider vinegar really help with the insects and
I always give them their supplements daily anyway.

NOTE: Never feed this beet pulp dry. It plumps up fast and
Sticks in their throat and they choke. This requires
An ACE shot in the muscle from your vet to allow them
To relax their throat enough for it to go down. (I've
Done this 3 different times so "don't do it", they will
Eventually choke on it and get very distressed and anxious)

The Satin Finish bag says, two and 3 yr old 1# to 1 /2#'S per day
Mature horses based on 1000#'S - 2#'S heavy use down to 1#/day
Not in use horse. Extreme use cases endurance racing, eventing etc.
Custom programs available 1-800-742-3272 Satin Finsh Wilcott Farms, Inc.
P.O. Box 5, Willows, CA 95988

This will bring any horse up to speed condition wise and for an easy
keeper just feed 2 scoops daily of they hydrated mix.

I keep ABC Probi on hand for any gas colic
in the medicine cupboard, is liquid gold to me. I recommend using
a natural wormer rather than chemicals. Chemicals can really tax
an already taxed immune system and so can vaccines. I recommend
using nosodes for immunizing instead. I have access to ABC NOMS fed daily
to deter gut parasites, use the Parasite tonic to clean out any blood parasites. You can use an herbal wormer 5 days a month on the full moon
as the other option. These are just my recommendations,
alternative methods that have been working for me and mine.

[Thomas_1]

I'm thinking in order either: sarcoptic mange, rain scald or sweet itch.

Skin scrapings or biopsy results may determine though I'd be inclined to start to treat as if mange in the first instance and whilst waiting.

[goeslikestink]

here this is www.sweet-itch.co.uk click on phots to enlarge them might help and bit more informative
interesting reading http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=6&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.equinescienceupdate.co.uk%2Fc horiopt.htm&ei=n0IpSaWsBcTH-QbU0tWVAg&usg=AFQjCNFzSIhTU-FduBAJdqitz8zjbJEgyA&sig2=-6APO8jtCYLW51WBy60itw

here think thomas is right in the 1st aceessment of sarcoptic mange look here
http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=1&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.merckvetmanual.com%2Fmvm%2Fht m%2Fbc%2F72003.htm&ei=u0MpSdeOH8TO-Qb-sqibAg&usg=AFQjCNGC24rozRVm5PhytAE3ZqX5k4Rzyw&sig2=5auhUMe2Zg3cOENMV6NKeA

again click pic for enlargement

and here http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&ct=res&cd=3&url=http%3A%2F%2Fbooks.google.co.uk%2Fbooks%3Fid%3 DOyxGEbjY4l0C%26pg%3DPA255%26lpg%3DPA255%26dq%3Deq uine%2Bsarcoptic%2Bmange%26source%3Dweb%26ots%3Dx3 v8xgSeR8%26sig%3D0JxEUX1laV9TXLBKholr-ORrlEw%26hl%3Den%26sa%3DX%26oi%3Dbook_result%26res num%3D3%26ct%3Dresult&ei=u0MpSdeOH8TO-Qb-sqibAg&usg=AFQjCNHx5uSd1GkBP8dAfqoGMCP6KNdJzA&sig2=6-DE3KdKh8BnMhaeNfk2cQ

[BB.MooseCow]

They did a skin scraping which tested neg for rain scald. It really doesn't look like sweet itch either, just the pattern of hair loss and the fact that once the dea skin and hair is off it doesn't leave a sore, just skin.
i don't know about mange tho, i'll keep it on my list to talk to the vet.

i had a vet out again today because i was worried about the swelling (it was getting worse. and he was walking weird) and i was worried about laminitis.
not sign of laminitis yet, just uncomfortable swelling.
he changed the quadrasol to 20cc of bute 2x daily, the rest of the meds are staying the same as of today. he'll be back out tuesday if everything stays okay

[sublimequine]

I'm sorry I have no advice for you, but just wanted to send some jingles and well wishes for your boy. That must be really scary for you to deal with. :(

Good luck, and here's hoping you figure out the skin mystery soon!

[BB.MooseCow]

UPDATE!

his swelling seems to be going down, it may be because of the stable wraps but hey, any bit of sunshine helps!

fingers crossed we find out soon! plus we got thru the day without a vet call, that's always good news!

We sent a skin scraping/ skin biospy. along with tons of pictures to a dermatologist at the local vet school.

[Go Fish]

Pigeon Fever????

[dynamitemike]

I might have a few recommendations for you...

It sounds like the vet, vaccinations, penicillin, etc. has not done much to turn it around. Have you tried contacting a holistic vet? Also eqyss micro-tek is a great product for topical fungus, etc.

It could also be unbalanced gut motility and a mineral imbalance. Have you researched any of those avenues?

[dynamitemike]

I also know of some great products if you'd like to email me for specifics

[Leather]

What about pemphigus foliaceus? It's an auto-immune skin disease.

Great article from UC Davis on equine dermatology, including a case study of pemphigus foliaceus.

http://www.vetmed.ucdavis.edu/ceh/pubs-HR24-1-bkm-sec.pdf

[vickienme]

I have helped other people's horses who had a skin condition and hives both.
I can highly recommend Super Vitamins Plus for 21 days or 2 rounds of 21
days immune system boosting if need be. And my feed mix program [posted previously].
The benefits of garlic for the skin alone are wonderous when fed daily!
Reducing chemical wormers and vaccines can be a big help to helping the
immune system to regain it's strength and rebalance itself as well. Allergies
can show up from accumulated taxing of the immune system.

[edit]

[Simkie]

Vicki,

Perhaps you are not familiar with the rules of this forum. Advertising is not permitted. Spam is not permitted. Your repeat post breaks both rules. I recommend editing your several posts that are pimping your products.

[SSFLandon]

Vicki,

Perhaps you are not familiar with the rules of this forum. Advertising is not permitted. Spam is not permitted. Your repeat post breaks both rules. I recommend editing your several posts that are pimping your products.

I was thinking the same thing...she has posted this in a million places and it seems odd!

[BB.MooseCow]

UPDATE**

he seems to be getting better, the swelling has gone down dramaticly and he's acting like himself.

after the past 2 and a half weeks, i'm relieved!!

we forecast 80% hair loss as it seems everywhere he's bumpy he later loses the hair. but as long as its not getting worse, i can deal with the hair loss. The skin biopsy is still out, i'll let you know what it says

[shawneeAcres]

I am betting he had an allergic reaction toshavings, and probably something IN the shavings. May have been some chemicals, i.e. the wood was treated wood, that caused the problem, glad to hear he is doing better!

[ridenslide]

Did you get a new load of feed?You did mention the shavings.THATwould be my thought- think about putting him on an alternate bedding for a while.Maybe- woodypet or something along those lines-much better quality control & a lot less wood oils in them.

My horse who had been on the same feed forever, suddenly became allergic to corn :eek: when the corn supply came from a GMOtype that is no longer available- thank goodness.
He slowly became more & more sensitive until he bacame SO hypersensitive to any corn byproduct that it was CRAZY.:no:

This sent his immune system into overdrive & he was hyper-sensive to many things!WOW!

It was grim when we finally ended up at the vet school with the corn reaction. however, he is now healthy, happy & loving life.Now that they no longer produce THATparticular strain of GM corn & after almost 3 years had passed, he was ableto eat corn in moderation- still is able to. He still has sensitive chestnut TB skin,but otherwise is OK.:winkgrin:

[Wojjie]

How did the last tests go, and is his hair still staying on? Anxiously awaiting info.....

[BB.MooseCow]

heres a link to my new thread about a possible diagnosis: http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=178582

he'll end up losing almost all of his hair. he has about 40% left, and the rest is close to coming off.
still not sure what it is. but we have possibilities now
we have him on straw now just incase it is an allergy but unfortunatly it doesn't look like one right now.

sorry I meant to update this thread but when the idea of pemphigus came up I became immersed in finding out as much as I could about it.

edit: forgot to mention that all tests have either come back normal or "inconclusive" including the biopsy. we did rule out normal hives and baccteria (including rain rot/scald).

[BB.MooseCow]

I posted this on my other thread too, but I thought I'd update you too.

I took some more pictures today, still waiting on results from the vet school. He's very bald, but happy and not swollen.

near side: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007974&l=9d9f2&id=28126111
off side:http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007970&l=76fb1&id=28126111
face:http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007976&l=0affd&id=28126111 (he's yawning lol, but it shows missing hair well)
skin:http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007980&l=d50df&id=28126111
bum:http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007984&l=ddc5a&id=28126111
head on:http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=46007975&l=b0046&id=28126111

[Simkie]

WOW.

[Donkey]

Gosh, poor guy, he's almost completely naked! Glad to hear he is recovering.

[silver2]

awww, poor naked pony. And in December too.

I wodner if you will ever find out what happened. Did you investigate the possibility of accidental poisoning? I believe St Johns Wort will cause the hair to peel off in large chunks like that in toxic amounts, although I don't know if the other symptoms match. Some rodenticides will too, although I imagine your vet thought about that.

[BB.MooseCow]

Hello Everyone!!

Just a little Update:

We never found out what was wrong with my boy, We've kept him on Straw incase that is the cause but there has been no findings- so the vet's have stopped looking. He lost ALL his hair except mane, tail and the white stripe on his face. There was no old hair left, he was completely bald before it started to come back around new years.

Dancer has a FULL BEAUTIFUL coat now though, I haven't remembered my camera untill today so my apologies about taking so long to give you an update. I was a warm (-2C) day here which was a reallu nice break from the -30c weather we have been getting lately, so I took Dancer out for a photo shoot!

Here is one that shows off his coat wonderfully!: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=47011888&l=d9d0e&id=28126111

other side: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=47011884&l=a638e&id=28126111

inside light: http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=47011867&l=8a5ff&id=28126111

Thanks for all your support and suggestions- I hope I don't need them again! :)

[Simkie]

He looks awesome!

How frustrating that you never were able to figure out the cause, though!