North American Registry Council

[not again]

Do we need a North American Registry Council to serve all breeders here on this side of the "pond?" (I posed this earlier):

We seem to be a diverse and fragmented group with many of the same frustrations and looking for positive direction. We pay dues to many organizations but seem to get little "bang for the buck."

How many breeders are members of USEF?
How many are members of USDF?
How many are members of USEA?
How many are members of the USHJC?
How many are members of a Breed association(s)?
How many are members of a GMO or affiliate organization of any of the above?
How many have experienced frustrations with the lack of lifetime tracking and credit/reward for our breedings successes who have gone on in performance?
How many need to sell foals to survive?
How many need to get them under saddle to maximize profit?

And most importantly, what are organizations/registries/federations/councils/clubs doing right now to help you sell your young horses?

What can we do to help ourselves and each other move forward in a positive direction as small business owners? How do we develop better marketing and public relations?
Should we format regionally? Should we function in a manner similar to the Chamber of Commerce.

There are many dedicated breeders who are trying very hard to make good breeding decisions and keep good records by registering their foals. Many have chosen to use the inspection system to get outside input on their breeding decisions. ( I suspect that often the breeders disagree with the inspectors, no matter what registry is involved.) What we all have in common is a need to develop marketing and image (public relations) improvement.
This problem should really be combined with the UELN dilemma which prevents performance tracking with any accuracy.
USEF has proven it is not interested in solving this for its membership. Many dedicated breeders are not USEF members so it is hard to develop a cohesive base.
Should a North American Registry Council be formed to lobby? Should we get behind the Expo idea in its infancy with Marydell's efforts? Do we need an all-breeds auction like the one in Ohio?
We will all have to think outside the box if American breeding is going to grow beyond its current status.

[siegi b.]

I have to say that I'm very happy with all the support the KWNP-NA provides to me and my produce.... They are known to be tough and to be in the Top Five with them on a regular basis means something to a lot of folks. So I really don't have any complaints... :-)

[ise@ssl]

I had hoped the Federation of North American Sporthorses Registries would have become an advocate for the members of the Registries that belong to it. But so far they have done just about nothing.

[Atlantis]

ise@ssl, currently their website is expired too (sporthorsefederation.org) "pending renewal or deletion". I never fully understood their goal, were they to be something similar to the WBFSH, but limited to North America?

[Home Again Farm]

I answered on another thread which has gone so far south that I doubt I will open it again. I will try to find the time to cut an paste over to here later today.

But the gist of my answer is that I would support a coalition of regional breeders' groups whose purpose would be to lobby for a one horse/ one number system with tracking and to help market through many breeders sharing in ads, a system of regional sales lists, etc. There are already many very useful breeders groups (I am thinking of those similar Midwest Breeders, etc - not registries here). A coalition among them could be quite useful IMO. I am not interested in switching registries. But a cooperative effort similar to what Fairview advocates could be tremendously useful to us all.

[tri]

Wasn't one of the things that killed off the Federation the lack of support from the Oldna and the AHS, mostly during the 100 day testing scandel?

[RiverOaksFarm]

I would support a coalition of regional breeders' groups whose purpose would be to lobby for a one horse/ one number system with tracking and to help market through many breeders sharing in ads, a system of regional sales lists, etc. There are already many very useful breeders groups (I am thinking of those similar Midwest Breeders, etc - not registries here). A coalition among them could be quite useful IMO. I am not interested in switching registries.

I would agree with what Mary Lou wrote. I am primarily involved with the Friesian Sporthorse Association, and I'm very happy with it and would have no interest in switching registries, but a coalition of registries would be an interesting concept. I do believe there is a certain strength in numbers, especially if people from all of the various registries could work together in a positive manner. There are also some things which can seem almost overwhelming to a smaller registry, which might be much more feasible as a part of a group effort.

:) gigha

[RiverOaksFarm]

(I've also just realized my response may have been presumptuous and this proposal may be targeted only at Warmblood registries?)

:) gigha

[DownYonder]

I would support a coalition of regional breeders groups or a coalition of registries, depending on the charter, by-laws, goals, etc.

I, too, had hoped that the Federation of North American Sport Horse Registries would be able to accomplish much more, but it fell apart due to internal politics and bickering over who should and should not be a member. I was also told that several key board members quit after being threatened with lawsuits over the 2004 100 DT (apparently there were threats of lawsuits from stallion owners and also from at least one of the registries involved with putting on the testing). Apparently the threats were real enough to discourage anyone else from becoming involved with the organization, so it has been pretty much defunct for a few years now.

[ise@ssl]

Downyonder that doesn't make sense. The Federation was made up of Registry members - not individuals. YES - each Registry designated a representative. If a person wanted to sue the Federation for something at a testing 4 years ago - they wouldn't be going after individuals. And since no one came forward with a suit - it's a moot point.

What happened was a lack of involvement by the various people representing many of the registries. People can lob whatever tomotoes they want at the AHS & OLDNA regarding the past 100 Day tests - but other registries DID NOT step forward. But that's history and obviously the testings are going in new directions with new players (hope the people involved understand that NOT setting up a separate corporation does expose them to people who can't accept their results - even if God is the judge).

The Federation was supposed to have a more broad agenda and it should have included being an Advocate for Sporthorse Breeders which the NGB (USEF) and USDF and other disciplines and support for Young Horse Championships and Developing Young horses. Instead it just faded away and several member registries either don't exist or aren't very active.

[DownYonder]

Sorry, my info came from several people who were either quite involved with the Federation towards the end, or had close ties to their registry representative at the Federation (and these were not Oldenburg people, but rather were involved with other registries).

It has also been suggested to me by several sources that some registries would not "step up to the plate" because they didn't like the control the major players (AHS and ISR) exerted over the Federation and the stallion testing.

At any rate, it is water under the bridge, and I wish Silver Creek super good luck in running the testings in the coming years.

[r3dd0g]

The members of the FNASHR were the registries themselves.

I'm not sure who you are referring to when you say certain registries 'would not step up to the plate.' The last Coordinator of record for the FNASHR was the AHS. Nothing has happened in over a year. If breeders want this organization to revive and change its focus, why aren't you lobbying the board of your respective registries to take some action or appoint a representative who will?

[r3dd0g]

At one point USEF was in discussion with FNASHR about setting up a Championship program similar to WBFSH--that being a ranking system based on the top 6 horses in each studbook. All that was needed was for FNASHR to develop the guidlines. Shame it never happened.

[ise@ssl]

That was one of the reasons the ISR/OLDNA stepped up and created the North American Breeders Futurity. This SHOULD HAVE been a competition sponsored by and managed by the Federation!

[tri]

Well, I can tell you, I was one of the ones who was threatened with a lawsuit and I wasn't even involved in the Federation, nor did I have a stallion. You can probably tell by my personality that it didn't scare me off, it pissed me off.

I can tell you that during the investigation done by the Federation of the 100 day test in question, the AHS and the Oldna refused to cooperate - that is a matter of public record.

So, if you want the Federation revived or a new organization set up - these big registries need to be held accountable to it and not just thumb their noses. I don't think that will happen.

Ilona, based on the lack of cooperation in the past, what can you tell us about what would make your registry cooperate in the future, how that would happen and what can you say that would give anyone any kind of comfort level that if they made the effort, that it wouldn't end up in the same manner if EB decided he didn't like something?

[ise@ssl]

Tri - I'm NOT going to get into the stallion testing because it's not worth it.
I KNOW that the Federation could have and should have stepped up to do many other things for breeders but the issues surrounding the Stallion Testing is what they hide behind to excuse themselves from being totally disfunctional.

And FYI - I am no longer on the Advisory Board for the Registry but gladly accepted the position of Awards Coordinator and immediately instituted the Star Breeder Award Program. I am currently working on other programs.

I have also been the person DONATING those fabulous quarter sheets to the NABF Awards to the tune of $1000 a year. But it's PATHETIC that we had so few horses competing in it this year. Harmony Sporthorses sponsors the cash awards and the 6 yo division had 2 HORSES.

[tri]

excuse themselves from being totally disfunctional.

Well since the AHS and the Oldna were some of the major players until the stallion testing, are you saying that it is the AHS and the Oldna that are "totally disfunctional"????

So, lets not argue. I'm asking sincerely. What word are you giving that if the Federation or a new organization was formed, that your registry - the major player - would cooperate and make themselves acountable to it???

That is the million dollar question isn't it?

[r3dd0g]

I KNOW that the Federation could have and should have stepped up to do many other things for breeders but the issues surrounding the Stallion Testing is what they hide behind to excuse themselves from being totally disfunctional.

With what funding? FNASHR included a handful of registries.

[tri]

Yes, a handful of registries most of which are cash strapped. There is not enough breeders to support all these itzy bitzy fragments of registries. With each one having to cough up money to advertise, to inspect, to issue papers, to test, etc, the money is just spread too thin to implement anything. It is a waste of resources.

[ise@ssl]

Tri you never stop.

First of all the ISR/OLDNA has been expanding their programs and DID organize the North American Breeders Futurity. It's always trying to do more for it's members. My idea for the Star Breeder Awards was well received and we are looking to do more. WHY? Because the Federation doesn't seem to have any function and our NGB and USDF aren't really breeders supportive.

and R3ddog - I did offer suggestions on another thread - stallion auctions or silent auctions to raise money by the Federation for programs or support for Young Horses.

[r3dd0g]

Tri you never stop.

I did offer suggestions on another thread - stallion auctions or silent auctions to raise money by the Federation for programs or support for Young Horses.

And why can't that still happen?

FNASHR representatives are/were primarily employees of the various registries and in most cases probably did/do not have the authority to initiate actions on behalf of their registry. In my limited observation they basically carried back reports of what went on at the meetings, which were more and more frequently limited to who acted badly.

The registries already hit up the stallion owners for dozens of auctions. When you consider how many stallions are licensed in multiple registries, I'm surprised the stallion owners don't call a complete moratorium on stallion auctions.

[ise@ssl]

I give up - the original question was if we needed a North American Registry Council.
I felt the Federation was to serve that role and hasn't.
But the point may be moot - the economy is in a tail-spin and recovery will be about 4 years - 8 if Mr. O is elected. We are already taking a hard look at the breeding for next year and will pull back significantly with breeding our big mares and focus on breeding our pony mares.

[tri]

Ilona, look I'm not trying to argue with you and I am sorry that it came across that way. We have more in common than you think.

You are so right with the economy and that is why I am pushing for consolidation so that there aren't redundant services having to be paid such as having 3 back to back inspections done by 3 different registries in one area when there could have been one large inspection done.

We were planning on opening up several new locations which would have hired new people, etc. We have put those plans on hold and if O gets in, we will scrap it altogether.

It is imperative that U.S. breeders find ways to cut costs and have a more competitive product.