Most cost-effective way to add more fat into horse's diet?

[sublimequine]

So, my mare is at a good, lean weight right now, she's her typical "summer fit". But now that winter is coming, I want her to gain a bit of weight for extra insulation, as she lives outside 24/7. BUT, I want to do it in a way that is safe for her gut (we just had a colic scare a few weeks ago :( ), and that won't break the bank.

In the past, I've done 1/2 cup veg or corn oil into her diet to add weight, but that is getting kind of expensive to do! I was wondering if there are any other good ways to add weight onto a horse through additional fat in the diet, that are easier on the pocketbook. :confused:

I was thinking of adding a bit of senior into her diet, as I know that's easy on the stomach. But really, I'm not sure what to do! Any ideas?

[Simkie]

Oil is still going to be the most bang for your buck. It is about 2000 kcals per cup. Price per kcal, I still think it comes out ahead.

[Ambrey]

A friend who feeds oil says the cheapest way is to buy the oil at Smart and Final or Costco in the huge 10 gallon containers.

[sublimequine]

How much oil do you folks usually feed for weight gain? It just seems like I go through it so fast, that's I guess why it seems so expensive to me.

[Ambrey]

How much oil do you folks usually feed for weight gain? It just seems like I go through it so fast, that's I guess why it seems so expensive to me.

I believe she feeds 2 cups a day. You'd be amazed at how much more you get for the money if you buy the oil in bulk, though (she uses Canola, I think).

I don't have a weight gain issue- in fact, if I could render the fat on my horses and sell it to you people I'd make a mint.

[Simkie]

I feed 2 cups of cocosoya oil a day for weight gain. It works out to $2.01 a day.

I buy it 5 gallons at a time, and with shipping, it comes to $80.20. I'd imagine that you could buy 5 gallons of canola at Sam's or wherever for up to half that cost. $1 a day is only $30 a month, which is still really reasonable, and less expensive than rice bran or flax or BOSS...

[sublimequine]

I believe she feeds 2 cups a day. You'd be amazed at how much more you get for the money if you buy the oil in bulk, though (she uses Canola, I think).

I don't have a weight gain issue- in fact, if I could render the fat on my horses and sell it to you people I'd make a mint.

My mare is a relatively easy keeper, but does need a little extra help through the winters to stay a bit on the pudgy side.

Simkie; Cocosoya's definitely not in my budget, but it looks like "plain" oil might just be my only option price-wise.

How much is rice bran, for a 50lb bag? I've never really looked into it.

[Simkie]

Last time I purchased rice bran (quite a few years ago, so prices would have only gone up) it was $40 for 40 lbs. Rice bran is only 20% fat, so you'd have to feed 5 cups to get the same amount of fat as in one cup of oil. Rice bran does have some other good things in it, but if you're looking strictly at calories, oil definitely comes out ahead in cost.

[horsegirl123]

I have a new Tb that I needed to put weight on without him getting hot. For the past month I have added Omegatin as a top dressing twice a day and I have seen a big change in him. I found this product at Tractor Supply and it runs me $25.50 for a 20lb bucket.

I did find a web site for this product.
http://www.omegatin.com/What-is-Omegatin-reg;.aspx

Good Luck.

[sid]

I've used oil for 15 years for many of my horses to give them calories without the grain/carb overload. I used Cocosoya until this summer, when it became cost prohibitive for this many horses.

Lucky for me, my friend is in the food service business and I'm now getting 5 gal. containers of Canola Oil at a cost of about $30 each.

You might find a restaurant or food manufacturing supply company to get the best price.

[deltawave]

To my mind, the ideal way to provide "heating calories" is more hay. Extra calories, extra munching time, and extra heat generated by the gut. Nature's ideal way of warming up a horse. :yes:

That said, if fat calories is what you want, and you're not hung up on Omega-3s, Omega-6s or a lot of the other stuff that tends to clutter the issue, pure vegetable oil (any kind, doesn't matter) is very calorie-rich and easy to do. There are more than twice as many calories in a pure fat, pound for pound, than any grain or cereal or protein product. So a cup of oil will get you about as many calories as a whole pound of a typical grain product.

[okggo]

I'd suggest more forage or BP as alternatives.

For fat, oils, ultimate finish, natural glo....there are quite a few nice fat supps out there right now.

[Ambrey]

My mare is a relatively easy keeper, but does need a little extra help through the winters to stay a bit on the pudgy side.

Simkie; Cocosoya's definitely not in my budget, but it looks like "plain" oil might just be my only option price-wise.

How much is rice bran, for a 50lb bag? I've never really looked into it.

I pay $32, I think, for a 40 lb bag. It lasts me forever, though, because they get just enough to make them think their supplements taste good.

[Melyni]

Flax is currently $35 for 50lb bag or 70c/lb. If you add 8 oz per day to the horses ration the cost is 35c per day and you will 40% fat of the best quality available. As in the highest level of Omega3s in any plant source. Horses love the taste as well.

Of course that's what I am paying prices may be different in your part of the world.
That's would be my recommendation
YOurs
MW

[Simkie]

Flax is currently $35 for 50lb bag or 70c/lb. If you add 8 oz per day to the horses ration the cost is 35c per day and you will 40% fat of the best quality available. As in the highest level of Omega3s in any plant source. Horses love the taste as well.

Could you please have a conversation with my horse? Because adding flax to her food makes her go off her grain for WEEKS. I've had to swap out and use a whole new product after making the mistake of feeding flax. Not all horse love flax :(

[4Martini]

I just bought a bag of Max E Glow rice bran at lunch for $26.95 (whoo hoo it has not gone up since the last bag I bought a month ago and Complete advantage was also stable since the last trip.)

Now if someone could help me with my mini stockpiling issues as I just realized I now have 2.5 months worth of feed on hand. The market is making me crazy! (and my tech job as we all know how stable those are :lol:)

[Touchstone Farm]

Try adding Purina Athlete or Purina Ultium as top dressing. Puts on weight without the mess of oil and reasonably priced for how much you use. And...doesn't make them "hot."

[sublimequine]

Try adding Purina Athlete or Purina Ultium as top dressing. Puts on weight without the mess of oil and reasonably priced for how much you use. And...doesn't make them "hot."

Are those "stomach safe", though?

[jn4jenny]

Are those "stomach safe", though?

Define "stomach safe". Any horse could react to any kind of new feed negatively, but some will be safer than others--and I'd say that something with fewer ingredients is probably a better bet. I would guess that Ultium would be relatively safe since it is a beet-pulp-based pellet, and beet pulp is quite safe. But it also has rice bran and alfalfa meal and some other stuff in it (wheat middlings, soybean hulls, etc.), so it would undoubtedly be easier to just feed the raw ingredient.

Heed deltawave's advice about the pound-per-pound calorie ratio with oil. Oil is going to be a cheaper way to pump in calories than anything else. This chart from a Sue Garlinghouse article about Rice Bran should make the point:
http://www.shady-acres.com/susan/ricebran.shtml

The best deal on oil would be to get it in huge vats of 30 gallons or more, but let's say that the best you can do is a Wally World gallon of veggie oil for $10. One gallon = 16 cups, and each cup of oil has 4000 kCal in it. So for $10, you buy 64,000 kCal, and for each $1.00 you spend, you get 6400kCal.

Ultium, which is one of the most calorie-dense feeds on the market, is 1800kcal per pound. Let's say you buy a 50 pound bag, meaning you're buying 90,000 kCals. In my area, Ultium runs about $18 a bag. That means that for each $1.00 you spend, you get about 5,000kCal.

Which would you rather have your dollar buy: 6400 kCal that you can feed by adding just one cup of volume or 5000kCal that would require you to feed over 2 pounds/nearly two quarts of feed?

ETA: It's not that I have beef with Ultium. It's a good feed. But in the context of just putting on some extra winter fat, I don't see why it would be a better choice. Oil now and ample fiber both now and later seem like a cheaper and more effective solution.

[4Martini]

That article was really interesting!

Thanks jn4jenny!

[12hooves]

So, my mare is at a good, lean weight right now, she's her typical "summer fit". But now that winter is coming, I want her to gain a bit of weight for extra insulation, as she lives outside 24/7. BUT, I want to do it in a way that is safe for her gut (we just had a colic scare a few weeks ago :( ), and that won't break the bank.

In the past, I've done 1/2 cup veg or corn oil into her diet to add weight, but that is getting kind of expensive to do! I was wondering if there are any other good ways to add weight onto a horse through additional fat in the diet, that are easier on the pocketbook. :confused:

I was thinking of adding a bit of senior into her diet, as I know that's easy on the stomach. But really, I'm not sure what to do! Any ideas?

I would use MaxEglo Rice bran pellets. It is $20-something a bag, but you only use a small amount added to their feed and before you finish one bag you will see a difference. Well, I did see a difference in my horse. I had already tried the others, oil, flax, etc. and didn't see any difference so I tried the Rice Bran and it worked. It's also easier and less messy than oil, flax, etc. You don't have to worry about it going bad either. If I can afford it, trust me, you can.:lol: I think it would be better on their digestion also.

[deltawave]

Great synthesis and doing the math, jn4j! :)

If you want CALORIES, go with fat. Pure fat, or close to it. Rice bran, Ultium, all that stuff is fat-rich, but still mostly carbohydrate and protein. And it's pricey and bulky on top of that, especially when compared to a cup or two of oil.

[sublimequine]

Great synthesis and doing the math, jn4j! :)

If you want CALORIES, go with fat. Pure fat, or close to it. Rice bran, Ultium, all that stuff is fat-rich, but still mostly carbohydrate and protein. And it's pricey and bulky on top of that, especially when compared to a cup or two of oil.

I want to stay away from the carbs and protein, really just want to be adding plain old fat. So it sounds like oil is once again the ideal choice for that, on top of being the last expensive.

[gabz]

I suggest Athlete too. You feed only 1 pound a day in addition to whatever else you are feeding and you'll see a big difference. 50 pounds = 50 days at about $20 - $25 a bag is 50 cents a day.
I'm sure there are other brands that have high fat feeds.
My horse hated oil in his feed and I hated trying to use it in the winter. It made everything god-awful tacky.

[sublimequine]

I suggest Athlete too. You feed only 1 pound a day in addition to whatever else you are feeding and you'll see a big difference. 50 pounds = 50 days at about $20 - $25 a bag is 50 cents a day.
I'm sure there are other brands that have high fat feeds.
My horse hated oil in his feed and I hated trying to use it in the winter. It made everything god-awful tacky.

My mare's a little butterball fatty and flips her lid every time there's oil in her snacks. She ends up licking the empty feedpan for minutes at a time with a glazed over look on her face. :lol:

[deltawave]

At about $0.20/pound I'd still call hay the least expensive way to add heating calories. :)

[sublimequine]

At about $0.20/pound I'd still call hay the least expensive way to add heating calories. :)

I'm at a boarding barn that doesn't offer free range hay. Besides, I know of very very few horses that will gain weight on grass hay.

[deltawave]

When I had my TB mare and she was in foal with Bonnie, I also had limited hay options but the mare needed more calories and protein and was getting finicky about a lot of concentrate. I went and bought some beautiful alfalfa from a local farmer, kept most of it in my trailer and a few bales in the barn where I boarded, and asked them to feed her 3-4 flakes each night. It can be done, although I realize that in a boarding situation the options are not limitless. :)

[sublimequine]

When I had my TB mare and she was in foal with Bonnie, I also had limited hay options but the mare needed more calories and protein and was getting finicky about a lot of concentrate. I went and bought some beautiful alfalfa from a local farmer, kept most of it in my trailer and a few bales in the barn where I boarded, and asked them to feed her 3-4 flakes each night. It can be done, although I realize that in a boarding situation the options are not limitless. :)

1. I drive a Honda. No way to transport hay.
2. I have no place to store hay, I live in an apartment and no trailer.
3. The barn would not allow me to store any hay there.

I think a lot of folks around here forget that not all of us are blessed with our own property, our own trucks and trailers, and a wealth of funds to finance all of these things. When you board your horse, you have to do the best you can with what you've got, and make compromises. Does it make it ideal for my horsekeeping? No. But until I win the lottery like everyone else around here seemingly has so money will be no object in my horsey life, so I can buy my 10 acres and truck and trailer and mountain of hay, I do the best I can. :winkgrin:

:steps off soapbox: A lot of people have no choice but to board at places where compromises must be made. Welcome to my reality. :lol:

[4Martini]

The above is why I feed rice bran.

It has a lot of fat calories and can easily be put in a ziplock back with grain and sups! It may cost a bit more than oil but not enough to get into that fight with my BO :lol: My horse already is the only one that gets grain twice a day vs. once a day so I like to make it as easy as possible!

(okay I have a truck and trailer- but that does not solve the liquid supplement issue.)

Although I did check the Ca Ph ratio after reading the article posted earlier and the brand I buy balances it.

[jn4jenny]

1. I drive a Honda. No way to transport hay.
2. I have no place to store hay, I live in an apartment and no trailer.
3. The barn would not allow me to store any hay there.

There's this wonderful thing called hay cubes that were your Flavor of the Week not even two weeks ago, but apparently you've forgotten about those?

There's also this delightful thing called alfalfa silage/haylage. It's sort of like the sauerkraut of the hay/fiber world. Alfalfa silage happens to smell like chocolate (yes, really) and stores easily in a plastic bin. Alternately, you can keep it wrapped up tight in polythene, which is how it usually comes from the farmers, and when it's wrapped it can even be left outside (which could be a nice workaround for your BO's "no room to store hay" issue.) It's very popular in Britain, I hear. I hadn't seen it with my own eyes until I moved here to the Midwest, but a friend of mine feeds a bit of it daily in the winter. I stand by the original advice about oil being cheaper and easier, but haylage is a good option if it's gotta be alfalfa and soaking cubes is deemed too much hassle.

I think a lot of folks around here forget that not all of us are blessed with our own property, our own trucks and trailers, and a wealth of funds to finance all of these things. When you board your horse, you have to do the best you can with what you've got, and make compromises.

Where do you think all of these people with their own farm and trailers came from? Exactly where you are--young and struggling, probably at a boarding barn, etc. Some of us, and I'd even dare say about half of us, are in the same position that you are. We just don't use that as an excuse to jump on people who are nice enough to try and help us.

[tpup]

I have had success with corn oil and rice bran pellets. I actually prefer the RB. My horse loves it, it's easy to add to his feed.

Since mine is a hard keeper and winter concerns me, this winter we are also starting alfalfa/timothy cubes.

[deltawave]

I think a lot of folks around here forget that not all of us are blessed with our own property, our own trucks and trailers, and a wealth of funds to finance all of these things. When you board your horse, you have to do the best you can with what you've got, and make compromises. Does it make it ideal for my horsekeeping? No. But until I win the lottery like everyone else around here seemingly has so money will be no object in my horsey life, so I can buy my 10 acres and truck and trailer and mountain of hay, I do the best I can. :winkgrin:

:steps off soapbox: A lot of people have no choice but to board at places where compromises must be made. Welcome to my reality. :lol:

Which is precisely why I said this:

I realize that in a boarding situation the options are not limitless. :)

I've owned a horse for almost 20 years. Boarded for 18 of them.

[Ambrey]

There's also this delightful thing called alfalfa silage/haylage. It's sort of like the sauerkraut of the hay/fiber world. Alfalfa silage happens to smell like chocolate (yes, really) and stores easily in a plastic bin. Alternately, you can keep it wrapped up tight in polythene, which is how it usually comes from the farmers, and when it's wrapped it can even be left outside (which could be a nice workaround for your BO's "no room to store hay" issue.)

Um, did you not read about the 100 mares who died of botulism from eating bad haylage?

Never heard of the stuff before, but you couldn't pay me to feed it to my horses now ;)

[deltawave]

One bad incident doesn't erase a century of horsekeeping practice that works.

[Ambrey]

From what I've heard here, a century of horsekeeping practice has demonstrated that haylage can be dangerous to horses if not handled extremely carefully (I believe one poster indicated that it isn't safe to even transport it off the farm!).

[deltawave]

Anything to do with horses can go wrong. Botulism is a deadly dark horse that has to be respected. It can be vaccinated against, and a lot of places that use haylage do so. One must weigh the risk vs. benefit, as in all things. When hay is scarce and forage vital, it's a tool that a lot of places use successfully.

[pokesaladannie]

Does anyone know what the pros and cons of using roasted and rolled soybeans might be? My local feed store has one of the few roasters in Ontario and I thought that this might be a useful fat booster. Any thoughts?

[jn4jenny]

From what I've heard here, a century of horsekeeping practice has demonstrated that haylage can be dangerous to horses if not handled extremely carefully (I believe one poster indicated that it isn't safe to even transport it off the farm!).

I suppose next you'll tell us that a century of horsekeeping shows that exposing horses to metal might give them tetanus and that turpentine seems to be a fine wormer based on the dozens of generations of horses that survived its use.

Haylage got a very bad reputation about 25 years ago from people who were baling and feeding it without taking the proper precautions. And just like with hay, it can go very bad and get very ugly--round bales also present a risk of botulism and we hear horror stories every year about those too.

As DW pointed out, everything in horse feeding is a compromise, and there is a vaccine for botulism. I would hope that anyone who is purchasing silage is being vigilant about how it's being baled and stored, just as they would be with traditional sun-cured hay. If anyone is SERIOUS about exploring the option of haylage, there's lots of objective info out there on the Internet about it. I'd recommend starting here:
http://www.acedomainname.com/haylagefacts.html

[Ambrey]

I suppose next you'll tell us that a century of horsekeeping shows that exposing horses to metal might give them tetanus and that turpentine seems to be a fine wormer based on the dozens of generations of horses that survived its use.

Actually, both comparisons come up short as indeed most people would not leave exposed sharp metal laying around, such as nails (even if their horses were vaccinated for tetanus), and most people would NOT use turpentine as a wormer even if many horses had survived.

But I have no dog in this fight- the opportunity for me to feed haylage is not likely to ever turn up. But before anyone follows the advice to feed it, I'd hope they'd investigate it thoroughly, including the information in this thread:

http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?t=170770

indicating, among other things, that the botulism vaccine doesn't cover all strains and is not 100%.

[sublimequine]

It's interesting on how the views of haylage are so different depending on where you're from. Around here, haylage is a cattle feed, never given to horses. Maybe it's because of the botulism thing, but probably more a tradition thing.

Went to Wal-Mart today and got a gallon of veggie oil to start maresie on for the winter. I was looking at her closely today and she could definitely use a couple pounds. She's a difficult horse to tell when she needs weight, she's the bulldog-style QH who is really bulky even when she's on the slimmer side. Right now her barrel almost doesn't match her big linebacker shoulders and huge butt, because it's all svelte and fit. :lol:

[deltawave]

Svelte and fit is good. :)

[Melyni]

Whole roast soy is a useful way to add fat. Horses usually like the taste. It does not store well when rolled, so don't buy too much at once. Shelf life is about 6 weeks.

As for feeding haylage/silage there's haylage and then there's haylage. The kind that comes in big rolls (like big round bale hay) is riskier as it has a greater chance of small mammals getting picked up and ensiled.
The stuff that is compressed in small bales and highly chopped is far safer.

BTW there have been cases of horses dying of botulism from ordinary hay and even from oats and from sweet feed that sat in the bin too long.

Silage/haylage is more common in areas where the weather makes it harder to make good hay, high humidity and too much rain for example. It's very common in Europe and the UK to feed some kind of ensiled grass or corn or alfalfa.
Horses do like the stuff and do well on it as long the don't encounter the botulism bacterium.

Yours
MW