T3D - Horse Conditioning

[tlw]

With all the threads floating around about the T3D, I got to thinking that I don't really have a very good idea about the training schedule, how to determine if my mare is three day fit, what are acceptable vitals (respiration, temp, etc.)? She finished 2d in a 1* in England (Hartpbury College) several years ago so she has been there/done that but not with me.

Currently, she gets worked 6 days a week for 45 mins. to an hour each of those days. 4 days are dressage (3d & 4th level) and two are some form of jumping, hacking and galloping (we have a 5 acre jump field with some hill to it). We attend 4 or 5 HTs a year at training level and several of them have a x-country speed of 470 mpm. We never have a problem with the time (I try and keep her speed just under 520 so she and I can be comfortable when we move up to prelim) and are always in the top 3.

I guess what I'm trying to figure out is how much more fit does she need to be for a T3D and how do I go about working up a training schedule and then how do I monitor her fitness. Any reference material suggestions would be welcomed. Thanks.

[asterix]

I am no expert, but I suspect you are probably close to fit enough, with the level of dressage you are doing, although if I were you I'd add in some hacking after the dressage several days a week.

I am sure deltawave can give you good vitals to look for -- remember that you have to have sufficiently reduced TPR after 10 minutes in the box before going out on D. Weather can play a big part in that, as can the hills or lack thereof of phases A and B. When I did the T3d A and B both included significant hills.

I have a 10 week schedule that I used to get my VERY large WB fit for the T3d -- he was going Training well and was plenty fit for that but he definitely needed the extra boost. After this program his numbers were among the best of the competitors in the vet box, and he was full of go for SJ the next day.

It's probably overkill for your horse since she has been fit enough to do a * before, but I'm happy to forward it to you. It was developed by taking the * schedule in Sally O'Connor's book and reducing the speeds and distances by the same proportion that they are reduced between an actual * and the T3d.

[tlw]

Asterix: I'd love to see your schedule if you don't mind sharing. :D My mare is a Cleveland Bay/Eng. TB cross so she is a bit more stout than our typical TB but her Eng. TB dad had a successful racing career so she has some of that in her genes. Thanks again for sharing.

[asterix]

I've sent it to zillions of COTHers :D -- coming your way.
Again, I suspect it's a bit more than she needs (look at my big man sig pics -- he's a large boy and I think 470 was very fast for us when we started this program -- he made time on steeplechase at the T3d no problem :D), but you can assess how it's going....

[MajMeadowMorgans]

asterix- could you send that my way too? Pretty please? and thank you :D

[cevent]

asterix- could you send that my way too? Pretty please? and thank you :D

Asterix: Do you mind passing it along to me too? Thanks!

[tlw]

Any idea what resting pulse rate, respiration and temp would be for a relatively fit TB cross? I assume they are lower (except the temp) the more fit one is, just like in people? Also, should they be back to normal after the 10 min. box or is some elevation ok?

[asterix]

hey, tlw, if you don't get an answer to this question on this thread, try pm-ing drjuliea -- she has been the vet for the 10 minute box at Waredaca the past several years and can give you actual, scientifically accurate answers :D

I'm pm-ing those of you who wanted it my schedule, but going forward, pm me in case I don't check this thread!

[NMK]

I can't answer your specific tbx cross questions, but I can give you a rough idea of what my conditioning program was for the T3D July. I took my horse's "base" program of work and added 10% twice weekly for three months out, then gave him a two week "let down" before the event itself. I would alternate between hill work and interval work once a week, and build the long trot set every week. Anyhow the result was he did win the best conditioned horse award (the vet at the first in-barn inspection asked me if he ever breathes) and his respiration after D in the final "hold" before being sent back to the barns was 44. Temp never went above 101 even in the July heat. If you want specific info just PM me.

Nancy

[retreadeventer]

I think you have to take a look at what you are conditioning for.
The length and speed of the R&T, and steeplechase, and XC are usually outlined in the omnibus, or you can find it online at the T3D website, the link is below on my signature line, I think it's under Education. Gretchen Butts wrote it. It explains how you should condition, what you are conditioning for in terms of distance and speed, and how to arrange a schedule. You have to work against the actual competition. 45 minutes of work in and of itself may or may not be enough -- depending on how you are doing that work.
Gretchen says you should generally be able to do about one hour of posting trot, I think, without both of you getting winded.

[Eventcrazy]

Asterix: Do you mind passing it along to me too? Thanks!

Asterix please send it my way to please! I have a welsh cob that I'm trying to get fit!

Thanks

[Thames Pirate]

Asterix, could you send it my way, too? Thanks!

[Here Comes Luther]

Asterix, me too, please? :)

[tlw]

Probably a silly question but here goes anyway: I understand taking vitals at rest to establish a baseline and I understand taking them 10 mins. after finishing work to check recovery but taking them immediately after finishing work has me stumped. You see, we usually cool down after work by taking a 5 10 min. walk. Am I supposed to hop off take vitals and then get back on and cool down for 10 mins.? It might be a bit difficult to keep her still enough to take temp and check heart rate and respiration when we have just finished a hour long work. Am I missing something?

[Kairoshorses]

Um, me, too! And if not too much trouble, in email?


kairoshorses @ yahoo. com

Thanks!

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Probably a silly question but here goes anyway: I understand taking vitals at rest to establish a baseline and I understand taking them 10 mins. after finishing work to check recovery but taking them immediately after finishing work has me stumped. You see, we usually cool down after work by taking a 5 10 min. walk. Am I supposed to hop off take vitals and then get back on and cool down for 10 mins.? It might be a bit difficult to keep her still enough to take temp and check heart rate and respiration when we have just finished a hour long work. Am I missing something?


Taking them as you work or just finished at work lets you know how stressed she is. It will also give you the base line for what is normal for her....so that when you come off xc after D....you will know whether she is still within a normal or safe range for her...or whether you need to be in PANIC mode.

Most people I know will start training with a heart monitor and take resp. while they are galloping and working them. Just like for us, you want them to condition within a certain range.....if they are getting too stressed...even if they recovery quickly...it is not good and there may be a flaw in your conditioning program or some other hidden problem.

[tlw]

Thanks BornFree. I understand the concept, but am a bit confused on the logistics of actually checking vitals when we finish our workout and we're a 10 min. walk away from the barn. I guess I should carry a thermometer and stethoscope out to the galloping field and leave it in a safe place until we finish our work so I will have it handy to use when we're done then bring it back to the barn to use again after the 10 min. cool down? Also, if I get back to the barn in, say, 5 min., should I go ahead and hose her off before taking the 10 min. vitals? Do I need to be particularly consistent on that point? Thanks.

[bornfreenowexpensive]

Thanks BornFree. I understand the concept, but am a bit confused on the logistics of actually checking vitals when we finish our workout and we're a 10 min. walk away from the barn. I guess I should carry a thermometer and stethoscope out to the galloping field and leave it in a safe place until we finish our work so I will have it handy to use when we're done then bring it back to the barn to use again after the 10 min. cool down? Also, if I get back to the barn in, say, 5 min., should I go ahead and hose her off before taking the 10 min. vitals? Do I need to be particularly consistent on that point? Thanks.


If you can get a heart rate monitor.....you will not even have to get off the horse to do the heart rate and you can do respiration while still on them. Some of the fancier models will give you temp as well. I think Deltawave posted a while ago about how to make one affordably....probably modifying one for people (that's what many people I know do).

I would just be consistent as to when you do things. You could also just do heart rate and respiration and bag temp. until you get back to the barn. I usually took their vitals before hosing them off. I got one of the 30 second thermometers from the drug store (for squrimy babies;))...worked great and very fast!

ETA--I also meant to just check respiration when you were done with your gallop (not during the gallop). And if you don't have a heart reat monitor...you of course could only check their heart rate when you were done galloping.

[deltawave]

A couple of good books on the topic--the titles are not exact but close enough for searching. :)

Hilary Clayton's book "conditioning sport horses"

Sally O'Connor's book on three day eventing

Heinz Von Opel's "Eventing Technique"

Wofford's "Training the 3 day horse and rider"

I found a heart rate monitor extremely helpful in the process of doing interval training, which I did at 5 day intervals, give or take a day. I used to try and keep Gwen in the solidly high-aerobic zone during gallops, pushing the upper limits to maximize the time spent galloping in terms of conditioning. No sense pounding an 18 year old horse's legs if I wasn't going to make big gains in terms of aerobic fitness! I'd want her heart rate up between 140 and 170 during the intervals, which took some doing as she'd been fit her whole life. Once per interval day I'd briefly (60 -90 seconds) push her into the anaerobic range (190+) to force her to adapt to that. This would require either a trip at a strong canter up a short, steep hill, or speed > 600mpm for 30-60 seconds.

I knew she was getting fitter by observing the rate of recovery of her heart rate after an interval (during the 2-4 minutes of walk between sets), which is an extremely well-validated parameter. If her heart rate would recover slowly, it was either due to a very hot day, or I'd pushed her harder than normal. This was very consistent and reliable. A very quick recovery let me "on the spot" decide to add 30 seconds to the next interval, or go a bit faster, or do the hillier part, etc. Again, maximum fitness gain with minimal pounding was my goal. There was simply no way I wanted to do 3 x 5 minutes at a modest canter and not make any gains. Far better to do 3 x 4 minutes on hills or at a faster pace and gain fitness than just let her loaf but pound on her legs all the same.

I never pay attention to respiratory rate while a horse is galloping--they couple their breathing with their galloping so their respiratory rate is always precisely as fast as their strides per minute. I did pay attention to respiratory rate during the in-between-intervals time, however. But it was far easier and more consistent to make my observations using the pulse. YMMV.

[tlw]

Very helpful information folks. Thanks. :)

[Gnep]

For the T3D a Prelim condition is rather good enough. Which means 5 days a week, 1 hour, once a week jumping, once a week gallops.

3 things I would train besides the standard HT stuff, the vet boxes, not at home at a strange place, the horses have to be relaxed it should be nothing new, dump that bucket with ice on them and have 4 guys scraping at a strange place, the horse should be used to go on a trail ride in foreign suroundings, by its self, should trott relaxed, walk relaxed. Nothing could be worse than a horse that jiggs all the way through the RT.
Last the Steepelchase, relaxed but demanding galloping at very high speeds, having a horse that gallops hard into your hand, without having to fight it, a horse that demands the speed without overhelming the rider, extremly adjustable. Comfort at 700.
And than the jumping out of speed.
How to find your stride, horse/rider, develop the speed, how to ease into the jumps, how to use the turns and how to sustain the speed.

Conservation of what your horse has to offer, that is more important than conditioning for a 3 day. Conditioning is less than 30%