No Laws To Protect My Horses!!! Why?? [Archive]

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:46 AM

A little rant here.... This past weekend was beautiful. I had my horses turned out in the field and they were pleasantly munching on grass as I was working in the barn. I hear a shot fired. Then I hear another. Then many back to back and my horses start running. I look out the barn, over to the neighbor's and see several guys shooting at targets.

This continues to go on as I try to get my horses in. They are doing laps around the field like they are trying to win the Triple Crown or something!

I try to call a couple friends who are in law enforcement to see what the laws are, but no one is around. I finally call the police - non-emergency line. The officer on the phone acts all upset that they are firing guns and sends police out. When the officer gets there (they are still firing, but it has slowed down) I tell him that I am not trying to cause problems and I don't care of the guy shoots off his gun, but I'm just concerned about my horses.

Very long story short.... The guy was 50 yards from our property line and therefore in no violation of the law. I tell the policeman that we have an 80 acre farm that is a business.... and that guy has less than an acre lot... how can it be allowed that he can scare our livestock????? Some of the guns they were shooting were some kind of black powder stuff as they were VERY VERY loud.

I am just furious that there are more laws that ALLOW people to shoot off their guns than there are that would protect my livestock (horses and cows). It just really upsets me that this guy can do what he wants on his little lot and if I were not home my horses could have gotten so scared that they ran through the fence... out on the road.... hit by a car... and potentially not only killed themselves, but also could easily kill an entire family that is in the car!!

I don't care if the people shoot their guns.... but I just think there should be some law that helps protect my horses safety!! To top it off, the policeman says 'well, this area is not as rural as it use to be, this is what happens when you have a farm like this'.... WHAT?! I was p!ssed!

Catersun

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:02 AM

Look at it as a good despooking exercise for your horses.... and it's called the second amendement... to the Consititution. Ya know, the documement that give you the RIGHT to whine about people with firearms... and as it sounds muzzleloaders. It also says people get to own, carry and use firearms. If ya don't like guns, dirt, or slow moving farm implements.. suck it up and move to the city.

Luckydonkey

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:08 AM

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:11 AM

Sorry your horses got upset. But the officer was right. There are laws to protect citizens from dangerous firearm use, such as setbacks from property lines, or distances required from dwellings. If he was firing in a dangerous manner, such as firing across property lines, the road, or standing in the road and firing, or firing too close to a dwelling, or if he was drinking - that would be a crime. If he only has a one acre lot, I'd be curious to know if he was too close to a dwelling (I don't think his own dwelling counts but I could be wrong).

Yes, black powder is loud.

But it's important for people to practice with their firearms. If the man was preparing for hunting season, it's very important they practice with their weapons to become proficient and ensure a quick and humane kill. He may not belong to a gun club, or his weapon of choice may not be able to be accommodated by local gun ranges. Or he may prefer to practice at home, just like we prefer to practice our dressage tests at home - rather than trailer out.

Again, sorry your horses got upset. Maybe you can work something out with the guy to help your horses get desensitized. Every other species of livestock manages to do just fine. With hunting season coming up (I think bow may have already started but I don't remember) - the horses are going to hear more gunfire.

Firearms use is perfectly normal around here. He's got the right to use his firearm in accordance with local laws/ordinances - and your livestock are going to have to deal with it. Rural areas are loud - loud with roosters, machinery, gunfire, tractors, etc.

If you think black powder is loud - bring your horses over here. I back up to a military firing range. Flares, artillery, small arms fire. The artillery makes the windows shake.

No biggie.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:17 AM

could you ask your neighbour for some warning before he shoots?

i understand totally, the same thing happened to us.
thanfully we came to an arrangement where they would warn us so we could remove the horses out of harms way.

Alagirl

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:18 AM

one acre and shooting guns on it....:lol::lol::lol:

saddleup

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:20 AM

I was going to suggest asking your neighbor for warning when he's going to practice his shooting so you can contain your horses.

Of course, now that you've called the cops on him, he might not be interested in helping you out.

BEARCAT

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:22 AM

Look at it as a training opportunity!

You can work on desensitizing your horses to gunshots by using balloons (and popping them), once thay are comfortable with that, move on to firecrackers, starting with quiet ones and moving onto louder ones....

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:23 AM

thanfully we came to an arrangement where they would warn us so we could remove the horses out of harms way.

That's what I do when my neighbor comes over to hunt on my farm. Not because I think he'll shoot them - but so he can get in and out of fields without the livestock coming over to "help" him. :winkgrin:

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:27 AM

Echoing everyone else here, but, yeah, your neighbor has every right to use his own land to practice shooting, as long as he does so in a safe and lawful manner. And I'll go to the ground defending his right to do so. Why? Not because I like seeing horses frightened, but because I want to be able to do what I want to on my own land, within the bounds of reasonable laws. That's part of rural life; if I wanted restrictions upon restrictions, I'd live in the 'burbs and spend way too much boarding my horses. :winkgrin:

There are plenty of laws that protect your horses from legitimate threats. People responsibly shooting in accordance with laws on their own property are not an actual threat to your horses. I'm sorry your horses were upset, and that you were. But they'll get used to it. Most of my neighbors responsibly practice their shooting all around me, some right next to the fields my horses are turned out in. Fireworks are legal here, too, and people shoot them off for any or no reason. Yeah, the first shots or fireworks cause some running around, but the horses very quickly "remember" that it's just noise (or noise and lights) and settle down. Heck, the little mooches have even learned to stay fairly near the fenceline so they can beg granola bars from one of the shooters when he's done with his practice.

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:32 AM

i understand totally, the same thing happened to us.
thanfully we came to an arrangement where they would warn us so we could remove the horses out of harms way.

How are they in harms when if the neighbor is not shooting in their direction?

I agree with the theory of using it as a training opportunity. I also find it VERY pompous of you to say that since you have 80 acres and they only have one acre that they should not be allowed to use their acre how they want because it interferes with you using your acres how you want. :eek: Wow!

I shoot on my measly 15 acres.

I shoot safely, checking around prior to shooting, having proper backing, etc But it still makes noise. :yes:

I would much rather people who use guns practice and be proficient with them than have them not be able to practice using them.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:35 AM

How are they in harms when if the neighbor is not shooting in their direction?

.

i live in the UK where people don't tend to shoot so much - my neighbours never d shot enough to de sensitise the horses, so they were running scared in fields that are too small and rocky for the job

i didn't want to take the risk if that's ok by you?

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:39 AM

I have 5 acres and 3 horses. I also have guns. I have to practice shooting, in order to stay proficient.

My neighbors have 38 acres and 5 horses. Never once have they complained because I'm target practicing.

Since I do target practice at home, my horses, as well as those belonging to my neighbors, have become desensitized to the sound of gunfire. This is a good thing, because part of both our acreages abut a hunting club's land.

I'm sorry that your horses were panicked, but if your neighbor practices enough, they'll soon become desensitized.

In a rural area there are few restrictions and no covenants, and I'd like to keep it that way. There are reasons I moved out to BFE, and one of them is to avoid HOAs and their silly pronouncements.

MistyBlue

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:42 AM

It caan be a risk, but that's why we sometimes have to desensitize our horses ourselves. It's what we do to protect our horses from themselves, despook them of things they'll probably come in contact with.

webmistress32

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:47 AM

I agree. the horses will learn to ignore it.

living in the country is wonderful. enjoy it for what it is.

lots of guns in the country ...

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:48 AM

it would be nice to find a less traumatic way for them to get used to it though, surely?

no one wants to see a horse injured when it can be avoided with a bit of attention?

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:52 AM

What confuses me is what type of law would the OP want? Some law that says neighbors to livestock are not allowed to do anything that might at any time spook or startle the livestock on the adjoining property?

I can not see how there could be a law.

I highly doubt the shooting neighbor gave it any thought that the noise might be an issue. I am guessing if the OP had called the neighbor to discuss it instead of calling the police to make an issue, the neighbor would have been more than willing to hold on shooting until the OP got her horses in the barn, etc.

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:53 AM

Of course, now that you've called the cops on him, he might not be interested in helping you out.

I was home alone and did not think it was a very good idea to go over to his house when 3 guys are shooting guns.........

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:55 AM

How are they in harms when if the neighbor is not shooting in their direction?

Just FYI - One of my horses is lame from the incident... vet appt scheduled....

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:57 AM

it would be nice to find a less traumatic way for them to get used to it though, surely?

no one wants to see a horse injured when it can be avoided with a bit of attention?

What do you suggest, Alexie? I'm not going to call my neighbors every time I want to target practice.

I agree that no one wants to see horses get hurt, but the laws are in place to protect everyone, not just the horse owner.

The UK is a very small place; the U.S. is quite large and we chafe at restrictions we consider excessive, especially those of us who live in rural areas. We don't take kindly to folks trying to tell us what to do. Now where's ma spittoon and huntin' dawg? ;)

The OP has 80 acres, and yet her horses are a mere 50 yards from her neighbor's house. I think she has room to move them to the other side of her acreage, where they won't be so traumatized.

Your situation is different, in that you have small, rocky pasturage with nowhere to put your horses. But horses need to learn to deal with and accept different things, instead of us constantly coddling them and demanding special treatment from the non-horse owning public.

Horse owners need to learn to get along with those who don't have them. We have a bad reputation as being elitist and entitled as it is, and the OP calling the police on her neighbor instead of going over and speaking to him, did nothing to change that impression.

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:00 AM

I was home alone and did not think it was a very good idea to go over to his house when 3 guys are shooting guns.........

:eek: :confused:

What?

Three men shooting guns are what? Any more dangerous than three men say racking leaves?

Did you really think they were going to turn around and shoot you?

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:00 AM

you have 80 acres? and you keep your horses right by the neighbor guys house- wonder how he feels about that. Sorry= no sympathy here- he is doing what he has the right to do on HIS property- regardless of the size of it. I agree, use it as a way to desensitize your horses...And I ccan't beleive you were complaining about someone shooting in the midle of th day either- wow!:eek:

They were about 5 acres away, thank you. At the time, we had hay down on about 30 acres, cows on another 20, my horses on 10 and then resting the rest of the fields.

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:01 AM

:eek: :confused:

What?

Three men shooting guns are what? Any more dangerous than three men say racking leaves?

Did you really think they were going to turn around and shoot you?

I really did not want to find out! :winkgrin:

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:01 AM

What do you suggest, Alexie? I'm not going to call my neighbors every time I want to target practice

fortunately for me and my horses, my neighbours were kind enough to take the time :)

In fact they were far more elitist (lawyers) than my family, and took the view that it would be nice to make an effort to get along with us.

We of course, appreciated the effort and in turn made allowances for their situation :)

Lori B

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:01 AM

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:03 AM

Practicing seems like a reasonable and responsible thing to need to do, but seriously, don't we know folks who just like to make a lot of damned noise because they think it's fun? OP is out of luck wanting legal assistance, but I'm not fully persuaded that every darned fool w/ a firearm is motivated by the need to stay sharp.

So you automatically assume the opposite?

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:04 AM

it would be nice to find a less traumatic way for them to get used to it though, surely?

no one wants to see a horse injured when it can be avoided with a bit of attention?

THANK YOU! We go from them doing basically nothing to having a day filled with what the horses would consider a warzone.

My horses are fine with vehicle traffic, loud motorcycles, fireworks, thunder/lightening.... pretty much everything, but this truly sent them over the edge.

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:06 AM

gieriscm

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:07 AM

My land is also next to a rifle range. The horses learn to cope with the noise.

FWIW the OP's complaint is one of the reasons that I believe the regulations and taxes on sound suppressors should be repealed.

Since deer hunting season is approaching it's likely that the neighbor will continue to practice for the next few weeks. I'd call and ask for a heads-up before he goes out to shoot so you can put your horses in the barn. Or, ask if he'd be willing to practice more with the .22's for a week or so to get the horses used to the noise before they haul out the bigger boomsticks again.

kcooper

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:11 AM

The OP can go and try to have a law passed if she wants. It's called a local ordinance. It can be used to restrict behavior or to require a permit or notice to others. We recently got one passed in our neighborhood because the people in the subdivisions that have now surrounded our horse farms spent the entire month of July shooting off fireworks. This caused one woman down the street to lose a foal that was trampled by its mother who was frantic and I have a retiree who lost 100 pounds due to fretting during the fireworks every night.

I agree people have the right to use their land as they wish, but if your behavior is impacting your neighbors, resonable accommodations can and should be made. I don't think it is a huge burden for my neighbors to have to give notice that they are going to shoot of fireworks for three hours. We can bring our horses in and close up the house to block the noise. The fireworks drive me crazy as well as my horses. I think hours of gunfire would do the same.

My once rural farm town area is sadly becoming a suburb. I have made changes to my manure storage in order to avoid any issues or complaints. I don't think it is unreasonable for people to be nice to each other or considerate of their neighbors (human and equine).

Auventera Two

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:11 AM

Tell me you're joking. Right?

Be thankful for the training opportunity. What will you do if you're on a trail ride and a hunter fires a gun? Or a car backfires at a show? Will your horse gallop through a fence and kill you in the process? :confused:

Seriously. People protect their horses way too much. They're horses. They'll live.

We have a LOT of gunfire around us. There are a herd of deer, at least 30 strong that live on and around our property. People turkey hunt, dove hunt, duck hunt, bear hunt, etc....We always heard gunshots. The horses don't even look up anymore.

Your horses will get over it and so can you.

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:12 AM

And they told the police they were practicing for opening day of dove season.... which was weeks ago!!!!!!!!

They do not have to have a season to be practicing for, BTW. I do not have and have never had a hunting license of any kind (though I would like to get mine and I have taken my safety course). I still practice shooting.

I agree people have the right to use their land as they wish, but if your behavior is impacting your neighbors, resonable accommodations can and should be made. I don't think it is a huge burden for my neighbors to have to give notice that they are going to shoot of fireworks for three hours. We can bring our horses in and close up the house to block the noise. The fireworks drive me crazy as well as my horses. I think hours of gunfire would do the same.

I think I will get a local ordnance passed that says my neighbor can not use his swimming pool anymore.
The horses can not see it, only the ruckus of them splashing and having fun. It startles them. This should not be allowed.

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:14 AM

Auventera Two

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:14 AM

:eek: :confused:

What?

Three men shooting guns are what? Any more dangerous than three men say racking leaves?

Did you really think they were going to turn around and shoot you?

No kidding. Sounds like the typical irrational fear of firearms. Yeah, 3 dudes target practicing will just turn around and shoot you in the shoulder because they can. Puh leaze. :rolleyes: Believe me, you're probably in more danger everytime you go to the mall and buy yourself a $300 handbag than you are talking to men in the country target practicing.

ReSomething

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:15 AM

I really did not want to find out! :winkgrin:

Gunfire has a time and place. If I were in town I would feel threatened, even on New year's Eve, (especially on New Year's) because the chance of a stray shot is very real, and generally what laws there are prohibit the discharge of a firearm within a couple hundred feet of a residence, and in town you'll never be that far away from anybody. So a gunshot is generally a bad thing in town.

Out in the sticks it is different. We did call the neghbor once, the kids were shooting it up back there and then we heard this tremendous "whoomp". We called and asked her if that huge noise was good or bad, and was everybody OK. Just a little experimental firepower. It is tough when you are home alone and don't know the neighbor well enough to give him a quick call asking him to cease and desist till you got the horses rounded up. It was a perfect desensitizing opportunity if you had been more prepared.

yellow-horse

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:17 AM

I keep mine in the paddock during hunting hours, its just easier, target practice, i do't mind so much, at least they aren't walking around all over the place shooting with dogs running around
I live a couple miles from a fort where they do artillary practice so the booming noise doesn't bother them anymore, so they got used to it
I used to board at the end of a runway and planes would take off over their heads, they got used to it
I agree it's a pia, I am surrounded by 100's of acres of woods and lots of hunting, it can get very loud out here, but since hopefully no one is on my land or aiming at me, I don't want to restrict the use of guns
I've had to go out and explain to folks walking in my woods with guns and dogs that they are on my property and don't have permission to hunt, I don't mind them walking through, I don't want them shooting because I am out there. Having hound dogs myself, I understand the dogs follow the scent and can't read my signs, I just don't want folks shooting in my woods.

Trakehner

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:21 AM

"...Very long story short.... The guy was 50 yards from our property line and therefore in no violation of the law. I tell the policeman that we have an 80 acre farm that is a business.... and that guy has less than an acre lot... how can it be allowed that he can scare our livestock????? Some of the guns they were shooting were some kind of black powder stuff as they were VERY VERY loud. I am just furious that there are more laws that ALLOW people to shoot off their guns than there are that would protect my livestock (horses and cows). It just really upsets me that this guy can do what he wants on his little lot"

How dare these peasants to use their land when it bothers their betters! My god...listen to yourself...."HIS LITTLE LOT"...don't you just hate it when the little people interrupt your life.

Is he complaining about your animal's horsesh*t everywhere, the flies, the unfriendly snob neighbor next door, the smell, the noise of your horses and the danger to his kids if your wild animals ever broke through the fences.

Jeeze-o-Flip, you make a greater impact on the area than they do and are more dependent on the goodwill of your neighbors than you realize.

Auventera Two

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:22 AM

Just FYI - One of my horses is lame from the incident... vet appt scheduled....

Then sell your farm, move to a $500,000 subdivision home on a 1/4 acre lot, pay your $5,689 property taxes each year, board your horses at a fancy schmancy dressage barn for $1,000 a month, each. And then you won't have a vet bill because your horses ran through a fence when the neighbor shot off their gun - like people tend to do - in the country. :D Simple, really!

Or you could just pay your $152 vet bill, and desensitize your horses to things they might encounter in the country.

You'd really crap a brick if you lived by the puddle jumper airport like I do. My horses frequently get buzzed by crop dusters coming in for a landing. Or when the coyotes come into the field at night and howl it up. Or when the hawks with 4' wingspans are hunting mice and swooping down within feet of horses. Or when the neighbor hauls out all the irrigation equipment and shoots off water jets 80 feet into the sky within yards of where the horses are grazing. Or when the deer jump the fence and go running across the horse pasture and jump out the other side. What on earth would you do? Go on a campaign to shut down the airport, kill all the wildlife, and write a local ordinance that irrigation equipment can't be used within X miles of your horse pasture?

Really I understand you're frustrated. Vet bills are never fun, and it's not fun to see a herd of horses running out of control. You must have been terrified. But seriously? That's farm life.

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:23 AM

This must be a regional thing, because I don't get why anyone would want to engage in "target practice" in their backyard.

I loathe guns, and won't allow one on my property. I live in one of the most violent countries in the world and the bullshit arguments about "self-defense" leave me cold. If some asshole were shooting in a rural area and disturbing livestock out here, chances are he'd see his arse in a sling very quickly. You wanna shoot at targets? Go to a freaking shooting range!

Kaeleer, you're in South Africa, so I can understand your utter loathing of guns. With the violence always bubbling just under the surface there, I wouldn't want random firearms practice either.

It's different in the rural areas of the U.S. People without guns in those areas are the exception, rather than the rule. I keep my guns for varmint control and protection. A woman living alone with no neighbors close at hand better know how to handle a gun.

I think it's a different mindset among the rural folks, as opposed to those in the suburbs and cities. Guns are just another tool, and almost everyone who has them treats them with respect.

Ambrey

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:23 AM

This must be a regional thing, because I don't get why anyone would want to engage in "target practice" in their backyard.

Guns are as American as apple pie!

I grew up in ranching country, where people drove with guns on racks in their trucks just in case that prize buck ran across the road. I agree with those who say... I don't think there's a thing you can do other than protect your horses.

Of course this was where we were the poor relations with the tiny ranch at only 600 acres, but still- in the country, people shoot at things. It's part of the whole picture. If they are even halfway intelligent, they will never shoot at anything of yours.

If you think that they're being nuisances, you can bring a civil suit, I believe, to get them to stop. I can't imagine you'd prevail, but who knows?

By the way, I hate guns. I'm a liberal gun control freak. Yet, I'd never imagine that there wouldn't be guns on a ranch- it would seem.... wrong.

LostFarmer

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:24 AM

The last thing we need is another law. I mean get real a law to not shoot if horses are around. How about a law that horses can't run while I am shooting? It messes up my concentration.

My suggestion. Go to the closet, get out your big girl undies, remove the current pair that are obviously TOO tight, and put on you BGU. Now you might be capable of dealing with life. :yes:

Miss-O

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:26 AM

Why should people make a law to protect a horse in this situation if it's YOUR responsibility to train YOUR horse when they are acting nuts?

Catalina

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:27 AM

I live in an area where the neighboring farmers have varmint rights, so they hunt year round right next to the field where my horses are. There is also a firing range about a mile away. Needless to say, the sound of gunfire coming from my backyard is quite common. When we first moved here we, and the horses, would startle everytime a gun went off. Several times my horses went into a panic when the farmer shot at a deer while he was standing near my horses (he knows not to fire towards the horses).
It didn't take long before they got used to the sound. Now, they don't even flicker an ear when a gun goes off; and I hardly even notice anymore myself.

Relax, they will get used to the sound and as long as they are not shooting at the horses, it is not a big deal.

MistyBlue

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:28 AM

There aren't laws to protect livestock from scary noises. Since they weren't shooting towards the animals and the horses were spooking from the noise, there aren't laws against scaring animals with loud noises. The animals were being a danger to themselves, they weren't in danger from the gunshots.
As a horse owner we're supposed to protect our horses from themselves. We can't always predict what new scary stuff will pop up and it can be upsetting or annoying when new things scare our horses. But after something new does pop up, instead of trying to force whatever it is to stop we need to teach our animals to get used to it. It will be better for them in the long run, they're bound to hear sharp loud noises from time to time.

Chester's Mom

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:28 AM

OK, I'll admit to calling the law on my neighbor..... but he was shooting AT my dogs (who were inside a fenced lot at the time) and he was drunk. Apparently my dogs, who are only outside from 7 am to 8 pm kept him up ALL NIGHT (from inside my bedroom, who knew?) with their barking. He then informed the officer he wasn't shooting at them, it was someone else but if it HAD been him it would be ok because everyone knows pellet guns don't hurt.

Having the law handle it kept me safe from the nasty drunk neighbor, kept my dogs safe (he was warned that no matter who it had been shooting, HE would be charged with animal abuse if it occurred again) and kept me on the right side of the law (had he made that comment to me I would have snatched the gun, shot him in the crotch repeatedly and watched to see if it hurt). The dogs he shot at (a Peke, a toy Poodle and a Cairn terrier) were body sore but not permanently hurt thank goodness.

My first choice would have been to go ask if there was a problem and try to handle it without the law and I think no matter where you live that is the best choice. I did stress to the sheriff that if the man had simply come over and told us there was a problem that we would work to fix it.... we WANT to be good neighbors. Of course to this day the guy refuses to talk to me, and hides in his house if I try to talk to him.

We are in the country enough that our animals aren't scared by gunfire ... which is a good thing since we hear it quite often! OP - maybe you can 'mend fences' with this neighbor by letting them know you (and your horses) reacted with fear and in future, can they please just FYI you first?

I hope your horses are ok, and they learn the guns won't hurt them.

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:29 AM

Just an FYI for those who think LBB is off her rocker. These are the same neighbors who use her horses and cows as targets while working on their golf swings. When LBB approached them regarding this they were really nasty with her. They also think it's funny to watch their dogs chase LBB's livestock. Do you really think they would have been rational with her if she approached them regarding the firearms? They have proven over and over again that they are irresponsible.

I can understand and accept responsible target practice, but I can pretty much guarantee that they weren't using responsible practices while firing their guns.

gieriscm

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:33 AM

The OP can go and try to have a law passed if she wants. It's called a local ordinance.

This may not be an option depending on the OP's state. Many have "range protection" laws due to development encroaching on firing ranges and the new arrivals complaining about the noise. Similar laws protect farms from complaints about sounds, smells, etc.

Just an FYI for those who think LBB is off her rocker. These are the same neighbors who use her horses and cows as targets while working on their golf swings. When LBB approached them regarding this they were really nasty with her.

Now that would tick me off.

They also think it's funny to watch their dogs chase LBB's livestock. Do you really think they would have been rational with her if she approached them regarding the firearms? They have proven over and over again that they are irresponsible.

Then shoot the dogs and be done with it. The law is firmly on LBB's side for this one in most states.

I can understand and accept responsible target practice, but I can pretty much guarantee that they weren't using responsible practices while firing their guns.

If the neighbors were shooting irresponsibly then calling the law was the right thing to do. Actually, dialing 911, not the non-emergency line, would have been appropriate. If they were shooting responsibly then there's not much you can do even if the neighbors are irresponsible a$$hats in other ways.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:33 AM

ergh that is a difficult situation to be in :(

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:37 AM

Kaeleer, you're in South Africa, so I can understand your utter loathing of guns. With the violence always bubbling just under the surface there, I wouldn't want random firearms practice either.

It's more than that. I hate guns with a visceral, gut reaction. And yes, I can fire one. I'm a damn good shot, actually, with pistol and rifle. I just hate the things.

I just got a call from a friend to say that a friend of hers (who I've only met once) was shot last night by her policeman boyfriend, who then turned the gun on himself. Holy crap!

It's different in the rural areas of the U.S. People without guns in those areas are the exception, rather than the rule. I keep my guns for varmint control and protection. A woman living alone with no neighbors close at hand better know how to handle a gun.

I live in a rural area, in an area which is known for its high crime rate. My husband is a farrier and he travels a fair bit. I know how to handle a gun. I still don't own one.

I do have eleven dogs and a rather gun-happy neighbour, but he makes me more nervous than the potential criminal out to get me.

I think it's a different mindset among the rural folks, as opposed to those in the suburbs and cities. Guns are just another tool, and almost everyone who has them treats them with respect.

I respect that. OTOH, the guy who breaks into your house to steal your gun isn't going to respect it either.

Don't do guns. Been mugged once, which included a bit of a slap-around, been victim of a smashand grab once, and had a guy threaten me at a robot once. Still won't own a gun.

Sorry, this is off-topic. I just find the politics of gun-ownership interesting.

Lori B

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:37 AM

No, Trubandloki, I don't ASSUME the opposite, but I am at the very least skeptical. If you read my post carefully, there are no conclusions being drawn.

Especially in light of additional information in the thread regarding the habits of these neighbors (dogs chasing OPs livestock, hitting golfballs at OPs animals, etc.) If the information we have is true, (IF!), then I think it's safe to suspect that 'target practice' is cover for 'scaring the crap out of neighbor's horses for fun'.

Firearm rights are fine as long as they are exercised with concomitant levels of firearm responsibility. And making a nuisance of oneself for debatable reasons doesn't exactly rise to the level of responsibility, IMHO.

threedogpack

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:46 AM

wow. You sure took a beating on this.

From a less strident and more LEO point of view.

1. As many have pointed out, it does not matter how much property you own, it matters what the law is where you live. Generally speaking, there are restrictions about how close to dwellings you can use a firearm. They may vary from area to area.

2. if the neighbors called the cops about the manure, the noise, the fact that you are disturbing their view from the front porch how would you feel about that? I have personally gotten calls about neighbors raking leaves onto their property, shoveling snow onto their property etc. And I have received calls about manure piles and flies. Tolerance and good will should be the call of the day.

3. someone mentioned local ordinances. Be careful here. Many police agencies do not enforce local ordinances and you can set yourself up for antagonism from more than just this one neighbor. I personally would want my neighbors as friends rather than enemies.

I live in town and have dogs. Seven of them. It is very likely against some local ordinance that limits how many pets you can have. When I moved in, I made a .point. of meeting and greeting all my neighbors and becoming friends with them. I had 2 dogs at the time. Since then I have fenced in my yard, and once in awhile had to speak to kids about climbing the fence. However, on the flip side, the few times my dogs have gotten out through a gate I left open by accident, those same neighbors have rounded the up and put them in my yard. I am .extremely. grateful for that and it would not have happened if I had called the cops on the kids who were climbing the fence.

be careful what you wish for, you might get it.

snbess

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:47 AM

I'm sorry the guns scared your horses and one got hurt. I, too, live in the country and have neighbors who shoot guns now and again, especially as they are prepping for hunting season. It gives my dog anxiety attacks and I feel so bad for him. I've had to make adjustments in the way his yard is fenced, because otherwise he runs. However, I do support the right of my neighbors to shoot and it has helped my horse, who now doesn't care about guns, storms, thunder, etc. The air force base has helped, too, by sending their planes over our house. I was trailriding on a new trail a couple months ago near a target range. I didn't realize the trail took us right across from it and the shots were SO loud, they seemed like they were coming at us. They weren't...we were completely safe...but the fact that the neighbors had desensitized my (OTTB) mare saved us from certain bolting. She was tense, but didn't put a foot wrong. Hopefully your horses will get used to it.

Sandra

WendellsGirl

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:48 AM

I have a similar situation to OP...neighbor likes to shoot in the very small backyard. Due to their less than responsible actions with motor vehicles, small children, and dirtbikes, I DO go make sure they are not firing towards my fenceline every time I hear them start shooting.
My complaint with backyard shooting? We live in a rural "neighborhood" and when they start shooting, noone can enjoy their afternoon. Every nice day, they spend the afternoon shooting for hours. I have had cookouts on my deck disbanded because noone could talk over the booms. My horses are used to it, but it is pretty difficult to teach a lesson over the noise - my students can't hear me. I defend rights to arms also, but when does common decency between neighbors come into play? I think, although it is legally your(my) right to shoot whenever wherever you(I) want on your(my) property, it is your(my) responsibility to be considerate to others. I look at it no differently than a neighbor who has a super loud party - its inconsiderate to close neighbors - but the law certainly does.

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:49 AM

Don't do guns. Been mugged once, which included a bit of a slap-around, been victim of a smashand grab once, and had a guy threaten me at a robot once. Still won't own a gun.

I don't carry my guns with me; they stay at home. I have a very large, very fierce looking dog, too. She's the first line of defense, and the guns are a last resort.

However, I have no intention of threatening anyone with a gun if they break into my house. If I have it in my hand, I'm going to use it.

A lot of people have gotten shot with their own guns, because they waffled about whether to shoot someone who broke into their home. It's a deadly weapon, and unless you have the mindset that you intend to use it the minute you have it in your hand, you shouldn't pick it up in the first place.

I'm sorry to hear about your friend. That totally and absolutely stinks.

Justdandy, thanks for the additional info. To the OP, I'm sorry you have such crappy neighbors. Unlike our friends and noses, we don't get to pick our neighbors!

eventchic33

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:03 AM

First and foremost learn your local laws, there are laws that protect your horses.
I.E local noise ordinance, local dog control laws. etc.etc.etc.

Second you live in the country as in doing so accept the responsibilities and HAZARDS of doing so. Stop Whining and grow up.

Third Good fences make good neighbors, if you have a business then it should be no problem to put up a privacy fence between your property and his. And write it off as a B.Ex.
And while i am sorry your horse is hurt, it is obviously not hurt bad enough to have an emergency vet call (otherwise you wouldn't be inside posting on BB) and therefore you can't be 100% sure that the noise was the cause.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:07 AM

And while i am sorry your horse is hurt, it is obviously not hurt bad enough to have an emergency vet call (otherwise you wouldn't be inside posting on BB) and therefore you can't be 100% sure that the noise was the cause.

eh?

i don't understand your logic, i'm sorry :(

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:10 AM

2. if the neighbors called the cops about the manure, the noise, the fact that you are disturbing their view from the front porch how would you feel about that? I have personally gotten calls about neighbors raking leaves onto their property, shoveling snow onto their property etc. And I have received calls about manure piles and flies. Tolerance and good will should be the call of the day.

Considering that we keep our manure pile in the middle of our property.... and that we try not to use the 5 acre field near their house.... I think we are pretty good neighbors. Not to mention our farm has been here since the 1800's... and that guy somehow got his less than 1 acre lot through the county when everything is zoned to be no less than 10 acres....

I think I have decided on a solution. I am headed to the livestock auction this week. I am going to pick up as many pigs as I can get on my trailer and put up pig fencing on the property line at the location of his house. We're suppose to get some rain this weekend, too.... ahhhh! :yes:

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:11 AM

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:12 AM

I think I have decided on a solution. I am headed to the livestock auction this week. I am going to pick up as many pigs as I can get on my trailer and put up pig fencing on the property line at the location of his house. We're suppose to get some rain this weekend, too.... ahhhh! :yes:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Hey, pigs are livestock, and as long as you're zoned for them......

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:12 AM

ooo you have bad nieghbours if you are prepared to go to those lengths

after the lawyers moved out we got the policeman and his Mrs moving in - good god i wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy

awful people

we were tempted to get some pigs in too
try not to, if you can think of a way to just ignore them and shut them out of your life then do it
the fence sounds like a good idea

eventchic33

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:13 AM

It was stated earlier that the vet was scheduled to come so the horse was not hurt bad enough to require immediate VET care. So since she was also inside b****ing about it that the horse was not injured very much and how can she prove that the injury occurred from the noise. and may not earlier or in the stall after coming in etc.etc.etc.

poltroon

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:13 AM

I had a new neighbor move in and start shooting some guns.

I admit, I was unhappy about it. I don't mind if they target shoot responsibly, but I felt very uncertain that they were responsible. This neighbor also has on several occasions done burn piles (which are allowed) unattended after dark (not allowed) quite near the tree line, such that I went out, stood watching for a bit to make sure it wasn't likely to jump to the tree line on MY side of the property line.

My horses don't care about the guns. One of our dogs does.

Over time, nothing bad happened when they were shooting, and I can only conclude they must be shooting safely, at least as far as keeping everything on their side of the river. (We are adjacent as the crow flies, but quite far away from them by road.)

But, if I had known them first, and thought they were sensible, I wouldn't have worried.

It sounds like the OP's neighbors have already shown themselves to be yahoos, which is a shame. But if they hadn't, I would suggest just calling the neighbor and asking them if they would be so kind as to give a heads-up so you can keep an eye on everything.

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:14 AM

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Hey, pigs are livestock, and as long as you're zoned for them......

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: And LBB has a very good sized trailer!!!:lol::lol::lol::lol:

Mmmmmmmmm.....pig sh!t! Even yummier.......WET pig sh!t!!!:lol::lol:

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:14 AM

An acre seems like a pretty small amount of space for operating firearms, IMHO. Even if he doesn't give a rat's patoot about neighboring horses, it just seems like it would be far too easy to put rifle shot somewhere it doesn't belong (neighboring property, livestock, etc.) .

When I was a sprat, we kids target-practiced (under Dad's supervision) in our backyard. In a normal "in-town" subdivision. In accordance with all local laws concerning discharge of firearms by private citizens. You don't need acres and acres of space to practice shooting at a stationary target.

To the OP: I'm sorry about your lame horse, I really am, but honestly, that could have happened under other circumstances, too. I recently had the vet out because mine were whoopin' it up for most of a morning for no reason other than it was chilly and windy and they were feeling their oats. Now, I guarantee, I was cussin' up a storm and bitching about the weather and how it messed up my riding plans and cost me a vet bill. But that's just the way things go and you have to suck it up, regardless of weather or firearm-owning neighbors or any of the zillion other things that Neighbor A might adore and Neighbor B find an irritant. Horses get spooked or excited and find all sorts of ways to injure themselves. I had one pull a tendon in her stall where she was supposed to be quietly eating hay and drying off from a bath, fercryinoutloud!

I see a sharp delineation in this thread, and wonder if those of us who grew up in the country (or, like me, in a "countrified" family who happened to live in town :winkgrin:) and those who grew up in more urban environments. To me, owning guns is "normal," and it's expected that if you own them, you will practice using them. And yeah, it is fun to shoot and make a lot of noise! I'm not poking fun at you, OP, really, but I do find it amusing that someone would be intimidated by a neighbor and his/her buddies just because they happen to be holding guns.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:16 AM

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:16 AM

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:16 AM

Anyplace Farm

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:16 AM

Granted, I live in a different county but in my county, your dog cannot be heard from inside your house for 25 ft (or was it yards?) outside your house. I live on a little over a quarter acre -- the biggest lot in my neighborhood. I have two JRs and trust me, I do not leave them unattended outside because they just get into stuff. We have a picket fence AND Invisible Fence.

I let them out, I watch that they pee and poo and bring them back in. Because their barking annoys even me. They are rarely out for more than 15 mins and if I have to turn my back on them, I keep an ear out.

One day, I had a repair guy come to my house to fix some blinds that were installed. The dogs were out for no more than 20 mins. They barked intermittently but not consistently. I'll be damned if one of my neighbors didn't come marching over to tell me she called the cops. I was furious! Mind you, by the time she knocked on my door, my dogs were already in. Actually, her first words were, "Oh! Of course! NOW they're in." No sh*t. Like I said. I never leave them out long.

Anyway, she was mad because little Zoe had been awakened from her nap. Bullcrap. I think mommy who was off her Prozac was disturbed. Kids sleep like the dead. And yes, this was like around noon.

Anyway, I called the cops and they said yes, she could complain but they would have to hear my dogs from 25 yds from my house and hear them for a length of time. We're talking WHILE the dogs are INSIDE. Not out.

So, I find it amazing that it is OK to raise all kinds of noise-hell with guns in one county and in another, you can get a citation for even having your dogs barking in your own home.

I ride at LBB's barn and I know that she first wanted to give the guys her number and ask them if they could just let her know before they wanted to fire off their guns. But because of past history and because they were totin' guns, she was concerned and was afraid they might target the horses in some way after the fact. So, she figured, having paid her taxes for the nice services of the law, that she'd call Johnny Law himself and ask him to deal with it.

Yes, people are pissed when you call the cops first. I was. But it most definitely sends a message that you won't tolerate others being inconsiderate of disturbing the peace.

I'm sure LBBs sitch can be patched up by her going over there and just asking them to call her first. The facts are, a wildly running horse near a road can freak out, go thru a fence and land in someone's lap while they are driving by. You can bet everyone would pay attention to scaring the sh*t out of horses then if someone's baby was killed by a flying horse. It's all fun and games until someone gets killed. Then, people give a damn.

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:19 AM

I see a sharp delineation in this thread, and wonder if those of us who grew up in the country (or, like me, in a "countrified" family who happened to live in town ) and those who grew up in more urban environments. To me, owning guns is "normal," and it's expected that if you own them, you will practice using them. And yeah, it is fun to shoot and make a lot of noise! I'm not poking fun at you, OP, really, but I do find it amusing that someone would be intimidated by a neighbor and his/her buddies just because they happen to be holding guns.

to me it's about having good neighbours and having lousy ones

having had both, i can understand how bloody crap it is to have the awful sort.

really strongly advise you to shut them out as much as you can to stop things escalating :o

Ambrey

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:21 AM

Pigs? Get some donkeys! You'll never be able to hear anything from that side of the property again!

jazzrider

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:24 AM

I think I have decided on a solution. I am headed to the livestock auction this week. I am going to pick up as many pigs as I can get on my trailer and put up pig fencing on the property line at the location of his house. We're suppose to get some rain this weekend, too.... ahhhh! :yes:

I'd be putting my money into a big, ol' ugly stockade fence with barbed wire on the top, and Christmas trees planted at least 5 lines deep along the property line (deeper, if I could afford it). On the outside I'd plant pricker bushes, really fast growing ones. :D

Alexie

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:26 AM

I'd be putting my money into a big, ol' ugly stockade fence with barbed wire on the top, and Christmas trees planted at least 5 lines deep along the property line (deeper, if I could afford it). On the outside I'd plant pricker bushes, really fast growing ones. :D

excellent idea :)

CAH

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:47 AM

Last fall, our local Township had the same problem. One taxpayer complained (loudly) that their neighbor was "target practicing" shooting their guns and the noise was scaring her horses. It got so far as Council members meeting to discuss a resolution to prohibit target shooting while on your own property. Let me tell you, they came out in droves and it would have been the end of those elected officials term of office had it went any further. People were pissed that a rural local government would even consider it.

Yes muzzleloaders (black powder) are loud. Now if they were shooting towards my house, my property and/or my horses you can bet the cops would be there in a second. But if they are not violating any laws, then you just have to suck it up.

Catersun

Sep. 23, 2008, 12:54 PM

abbydp

Sep. 23, 2008, 12:58 PM

I am sorry you are dealing with bad neighbors. I have to say, though, that the desensitizing can be good for them (providing no more lameness issues). My last barn was ALWAYS under construction. My boy now doesn't blink about a nail gun right outside his stall. Tortures me and my dog, but he doesn't even blink. Has transferred over to tolerating the hunting that goes on next to us.

Kementari

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:00 PM

I detest guns. I cannot stand them. I see no use for them 99% of the time, for 99% of the population. I would be quite happy to see the Second Amendment completely repealed. (Yes, I too am a liberal gun control freak. :winkgrin:)

BUT.

Guns ARE legal in the US, and shooting them off when an appropriate distance from property lines, homes, etc is ALSO perfectly legal. And as such, the appropriate response is to train one's horses better, not go on the offense against one's neighbors.

There are all sorts of things in the world that spook horses. Ever had a hot air balloon go overhead? That one can be fun (or not...) - should we ban hot air balloons flying over where there might be animals?

I boarded once in a place that was in one of the major flight paths for an airport. New horses found that one, um, interesting. I suppose we should have gone on the warpath to get the flight paths changed because it made the horses run around crazy.

With all the ordinances being passed all around the country prohibiting or limiting livestock for no better reason than that livestock irritate the neighbors, you would think a horseperson would be more sympathetic to people doing what they like (that is within legal bounds) on their own property. :no:

CoopsZippo

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:05 PM

BCEVENTER

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:13 PM

Guns are as American as apple pie!

Ughhh, honestly, the attitudes of American's and their guns (most of the time) creeps me out. I have never ever heard a gun out here. Rural or Urban. I work on a farm and lots of farming friends and have only ever seen one gun.

BEARCAT

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:19 PM

You can't control your environment... BUT, you can teach your horses how to handle it.

Every summer we have a sort of "Frontier days" here in town, which nephews and nieces from out of town love to attend. My little 6 year old nephew was more than happy to be armed (by me after asking parents permission) with a couple of cap guns and outfitted with a cowboy hat. He had a blast running around pretend shooting and having showdowns with his uncle. Meanwhile my horses got pretty well desensitized to gunfire as well as little people running around... while I was happily sipping a beverage on the deck... ;)
We also live close to the fire station, with occasional Flight for Life helicopter landings - horses get used to that too... and one of them is a BLM Mustang that was gathered by helicopter!!

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:23 PM

Ughhh, honestly, the attitudes of American's and their guns (most of the time) creeps me out. I have never ever heard a gun out here. Rural or Urban. I work on a farm and lots of farming friends and have only ever seen one gun.

Canadians are all stinkin' pacifists! ;)

BTW, that should be Americans; no need to use an apostrophe, since that indicates the possessive. I would think y'all Canadians would be better at that than us bloodthirsty Americans, since you don't have any guns to occupy your thoughts and time. :lol:

S1969

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:31 PM

I think if the OP was entitled "Vent...neighbors shooting, horses spooked, one is lame" it would have gained a lot more empathy from people. Everyone has had (or could imagine) that situation and could empathize with the OP. But to suggest that there should be a law protecting horses from the noise of gunfire, or a law prohibiting people from target shooting on their own property...that's a pretty tough sell.

Bad neighbors suck. I have some of my own. But short of moving, I just have to deal with it, and hope my horses can learn as well. I'm not going to call the cops or town all about their fireworks displays, their loud parties with outdoor bands, their popping wheelies on their ATVs when they drive by my pasture.

For the most part my horses deal with the gun-shooting country neighbors just fine; still working on desensitizing to umbrellas, kites, and elizabethan dog collars. :winkgrin:

Hilldale

Sep. 23, 2008, 01:47 PM

Are in Fauquier County or Loudoun County? I know in Fauquier it is unlawful to discharge any firearm within one hundred (100) yards of any regularly occupied structure without advance permission of the owner or occupant. We had a client go after their neighbor for the same reason.

BuddyRoo

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:10 PM

As someone who has been around horses awhile, I realize that there are a few things that spook horses--things like mailboxes, dogs, small children, bicycles, loud noises of any type, bumble bees, butterflies, purple flowers, yellow flowers, tarps, bags, tall grass waving in the wind, a dropped brush, a quick movement, the painted markings on the road, dark fresh blacktop, chickens, turkeys, deer, rabbits, cats, water, bridges, sheep, emus, pigs, other horses, car horns, air horns, wind, the crinkle of a plastic water bottle, the crackle of a bad speaker, their own shadow....

I mean, we ALL know that right? We should never ever expose our horses to those things and of course, everyone ELSE should know to avoid them too.

Why do people assume that non-horse people doing things that *may* spook horses are doing so intentionally? How are they to know that horses might spook at gun shots? My horses don't spook at gun shots. Shoot, I've SHOT A GUN off the back of one of them. Fireworks don't bother mine either. Maybe they didn't think about it because horses THEY know don't freak about gun shots? Maybe they just didn't know period?

Why not go and chat w/ the neighbors? Ask them if they could stop for a moment while you round up the horses?

Why not ask him to give you a ring on target practice days?

Why not use it as an opportunity to desensitize?

Horses are not as fragile as we sometimes treat them. I am sorry that your horse got hurt...but I think that calling the police and making a big deal about it is way out there as far as overreacting.

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:15 PM

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:33 PM

Conny was terrified of cattle, especially black cattle.

I thought it was only me! :lol::lol::lol:

My little bay mare is a bold sort and generally more curious than frightened by new things. She's been pastured next to cattle and had no problem. So I expected no problem hacking her down the road past my neighbor's field with his newly acquired mini-herd of Black Angus. Wrong, wrong, wrong! Black cattle are evil! They eat little bay mares! They may look like they are just peaceably standing about grazing, but they are up to no good!

Got a damn fine passage going past those evil black cows. :winkgrin:

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:46 PM

Black cattle are evil! They eat little bay mares! They may look like they are just peaceably standing about grazing, but they are up to no good!

Got a damn fine passage going past those evil black cows. :winkgrin:

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Absolutely! Conny was convinced if he turned his back on them, they grew fangs and claws and ate little bay Arabian geldings, too! :D

Poor guy, he never got over it. Cows of any color were always suspect and to be passed with a flagged tail while snorting like a freight train, but those black ones made him shake like a leaf.

God help me if one of them mooed at him! He'd be in the next county in a millisecond, with me trying to hang on as best I could! ;)

BuddyRoo

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:46 PM

Honestly--I'm not poking fun at the OP...it's just that to assume that a person would KNOW and AVOID all things that could POTENTIALLY spook a horse is silly. Especially when for every one horse who spooks at X there are at least that many if not more who will not.

So I just don't understand why we need laws to dictate common sense and neighborliness. (is that a word?) And I don't understand why *some* horse people expect that the whole rest of the world to accommodate them or their horses.

When I think about some of the things I do with one of my mares? I can virtually guarantee you that many other horses would lose their minds. Why doesn't she? Because I've invested a lot of time exposing her--not really on purpose, it's just that I've never really sheltered her. Sheltered horses seem to make for accidents and crabby owners.

MistyBlue

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:52 PM

Ughhh, honestly, the attitudes of American's and their guns (most of the time) creeps me out. I have never ever heard a gun out here. Rural or Urban. I work on a farm and lots of farming friends and have only ever seen one gun.

I know, we're all insane. :yes: :winkgrin:

May I ask, what do you do if your horse shatters a leg, is thrashing around in pain, the local vets are all on other calls and can't get there within a short time?
That's one reason why I keep a firearm at home. I'm not about to let my horses be in that much pain and fear because I might feel squeamish about firearms. I also have used a firearm to dispatch medium to large wildlife that's obviously very sick or has been mortally injured but is still alive.
It also may come in handy with roaming vicious dogs, however I prefer to use the paintball rifle first to teach them my property isn't a good hang out spot and my family and animals aren't easy targets.
I don't keep them as self defense weapons, but I do have fun on occassion with competing with them. If I *have* to use one for self defense I have that option available to me, but frankly the amount of headache that can cause makes it an absolute last ditch effort.
I personally would love more firearm control in this country...but please be aware that just because Americans *can* have firearms doesn't mean we're all like the people you see on the news. The largest portion of firearm owners have them as very handy and sometimes necessary tools or as a hobby, nothing else. It's only those who's sole information on firearms is gleaned from the news who are terrified or disgusted by guns.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 02:54 PM

This must be a regional thing, because I don't get why anyone would want to engage in "target practice" in their backyard.

I loathe guns, and won't allow one on my property. I live in one of the most violent countries in the world and the bullshit arguments about "self-defense" leave me cold. If some asshole were shooting in a rural area and disturbing livestock out here, chances are he'd see his arse in a sling very quickly. You wanna shoot at targets? Go to a freaking shooting range!

Well, fine. Stay in your own country then. In most rural areas in the US, it's perfectly normal to practice with one's firearm on one's OWN property.

LBB needs to deal with the fact that the world does not revolve around her horses or else move her horses to a suburb.

Then when her manure pile gets too big, she can have the pleasure of dealing with the zoning complaints from all her neighbors.

Let's see - what else can she complain about? Oh yeah - the neighbor's rooster crows and it wakes her up. So the neighbor has to stop raising chickens so LBB can get her beauty rest. Or, another neighbor is haying and making her allergies act up - so they have to stop haying or by God she'll make them pay her medical bills.

LBB may have jerks for neighbors, but I bet 10$ she's no fun to have as a neighbor either.

Geez guys - if someone is committing a crime that's one thing. By all means throw the book at 'em. (if the story of them hitting golf balls at her horses is true)

If someone is just enjoying their own land and you don't like it - tough noogies.

Some of you seem awfully interested in controlling other people.

Watermark Farm

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:00 PM

You should check with the county you live in. Where I live (in a fairly suburban area), I live on property with "Diverse Agriculture" zoning. Agricultural activities (which include horses here) are protected due to the zoning. Chat with someone from your county zoning department. Also find out about laws for firearms use in your particular area. Here I cannot simply go out and shoot my .22 for fun as it would violate a noise ordinance. I must go to a more rural part of the county to go shooting.

Second, take a nice bottle of wine to your neighbor and have a friendly chat, preferably with your "NRA Life Member" hat on. Explain to him the danger it's putting YOU and your horses when they do weekend target practice. See if you can work with them to agree on days/times they can do their thing, so you can put your horses in the barn beforehand. Or maybe they can call you ahead of time and let you know when they will be shooting. If they are jerks about it, make sure you do your own target practice at 6am on Sunday mornings...

Last, start getting your horses used to the sound of firearms.You can check with police department mounted units and/or civil war reenactors and get info on how they get horses to gunshots. It might be your best investment of time.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:03 PM

BuddyRoo, don't forget cattle and minis, too. :lol:

Conny was terrified of cattle, especially black cattle. It totally sucked to be him the day I moved here, since I'm surrounded by Black Angus beef cattle! Poor guy used to lose his mind whenever a cow got out and came ambling down the driveway.

Herefords.

Horse never has gotten used to them - and there are a lot of them around here and we see them often out hunting.

Guess what I'm raising next year?

Herefords.

By the time they're in the freezer the horse will either be desensitized, or will have run off to join the circus. We'll see. :cool:

(I actually do understand why LBB is upset; but it's just not realistic to expect everyone to tiptoe around our horses. Other species of livestock become used to new things - so will the horses.)

Auventera Two

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:06 PM

Thankfully I have not seen any golfballs since spring. My biggest fear with that was if they were cantering across the field and stepped on one... ouchie!!

Oh yes, ouchie indeed. How ever DID horses survive as a species? I mean after all, for centuries they've stepped on rocks the size of bowling balls. Poor little dears. :sadsmile:

Auventera Two

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:09 PM

I am a Civil War Reenactor... Yes black powder is loud. But horses do get over it. Heck my guy handles cannon fire. Not just one but a battery. Plus muskets, Henry Rifles, pistols...

It takes a little work but it can be done.

Up until recently, we had a re-enactment a few miles from our house and every spring we heard the battery of cannon fire. It was enough to make "me" jump but usually the horses just flicked up their ears, then kept grazing.

My mounted patrol/search horse has to prove she was ok with gunfire. We went out in the woods and a re-enactor came and shot guns all around us as we had to ride our patterns and such. It was a lot of fun! :D

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:10 PM

Well, fine. Stay in your own country then. In most rural areas in the US, it's perfectly normal to practice with one's firearm on one's OWN property.

LBB needs to deal with the fact that the world does not revolve around her horses or else move her horses to a suburb.

Then when her manure pile gets too big, she can have the pleasure of dealing with the zoning complaints from all her neighbors.

Let's see - what else can she complain about? Oh yeah - the neighbor's rooster crows and it wakes her up. So the neighbor has to stop raising chickens so LBB can get her beauty rest. Or, another neighbor is haying and making her allergies act up - so they have to stop haying or by God she'll make them pay her medical bills.

LBB may have jerks for neighbors, but I bet 10$ she's no fun to have as a neighbor either.

Geez guys - if someone is committing a crime that's one thing. By all means throw the book at 'em. (if the story of them hitting golf balls at her horses is true)

If someone is just enjoying their own land and you don't like it - tough noogies.

Some of you seem awfully interested in controlling other people.

JSwan - you just lost $10.:winkgrin:

I'm good friends with LBB and she leaves her neighbors alone and no....she's not going to complain about any of the things you listed. In fact, she's the first one to volunteer if any of her neighbors needs help. She lives in close proximity to the same military base that you and I live next to and her horses hear the same loud BOOMS that ours hear.

If you haven't already, please see my post on page 2 (I think). This isn't the first incident LBB's had with these neighbors. They've shown her on many occasions that they aren't exactly the most responsible people. They use her livestock as targets for driving practice (golf swing) and they laugh and watch their dogs chase her livestock.

BTW, she's far from anti-gun.:winkgrin::D

LBB called the police because this was pretty much the straw that broke the camel's back. She tried to reason with them (to no avail) when they were hitting their golf balls onto her property and at her livestock instead of into the empty field on the other side of their property and she never called AC on them when their dogs were chasing her livestock. She could have easily called AC and/or shot the neighbor's dogs, but she didn't. She's been trying to be nice and work with the neighbors, but evidently those neighbors do not want to reciprocate.

Overo Kid

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:12 PM

I would have walked over, and said, "hi--my horses are spooked by the gunfire. Could you hold off for 10 minutes so that I can catch them and put them in the barn/paddock/whatever? Listening to you all, I think they'll get used to the sound of gunfire and be better next time. Thanks--have a great day!"

Overo Kid

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:14 PM

Mmm...didn't realize the past history with golf balls! Not a good situation--I still would have walked over and asked to stop for 10 minutes while I gathered up my horses.

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:17 PM

Well, fine. Stay in your own country then. In most rural areas in the US, it's perfectly normal to practice with one's firearm on one's OWN property.

Well, aren't you just a shining beacon of light for international relations?

Just because something is normal for you doesn't mean that it is considered normal by others. That is really the gist of this thread, isn't it?

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:35 PM

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:43 PM

Why Kaleer - go back and read your post, and then get back to me. You criticized the US first, my dear. You don't know about the customs or laws of the area in which this incident took place - you just projected your own dislike of firearms, and your own nation's problems.

Yes, it's normal for gunfire to be heard in rural areas around here. As justdandy mentions, we three live in about the same area. Which is why I'm telling her to suck it up. This is a rural area, mostly farmland.

For LBB and justdandy - the gunfire is normal. Suck it up. If the neighbors allow their dogs to chase the horses - shoot the dogs and then give the neighbors a bill for the ammunition, property damage, vet bills, etc. The law is on your side on that one. Same thing with golf balls. Jerk neighbors abusing your livestock? That's a crime.

But your SOL on the gunfire. And LBB - I find it odd that you'd not take action on the dogs, but gunfire sends you over the edge. No farmer around here would ever let a dog chase livestock.

I never said I had a problem with gunfire....so no sucking it up for me, thanks. I've lived in this area long enough to know that there will be neighbors "practicing" with firearms. I (and my horses) have absolutely no issues with gunfire. In fact, we have several neighbors firing off guns and a hunt club near our house. My husband will even shoot off a couple of rounds every once in a blue moon. However, if any of them did it irresponsibly and I thought my animals or myself were in any type of danger, you bet your ass I'll be phoning the police.

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:48 PM

Why Kaleer - go back and read your post, and then get back to me.

Sweetie, darling, Angel Pie, you called?

You criticized the US first, my dear.

Treasure, exactly where did I do that? I predicated my entire post on the acknowledgement that it regional differences might have a bearing on outlook.

You don't know about the customs or laws of the area in which this incident took place

Nor did I claim to. I'm sorry, is this simply an American forum? Should those of us who don't have inimate knowledge of your quaint little customs just keep quiet?

- you just projected your own dislike of firearms, and your own nation's problems.

I was pointing out that not everybody reacts the same way to gunfire. I wasn't colouring it with a "right" or "wrong" tag, simply giving a different perspective.

You know? Perspective? That thing which sometimes makes it possible to view something from another angle and form a different opinion? Or don't you do that where you're from?

Yes, it's normal for gunfire to be heard in rural areas around here.

Ya know, I can't help thinking that, just maybe, it's not as "normal" as you think. Because, if it were, there would hardly be a thread about it, would there? It's not as if you read threads where people go "my neighbour's chicken crowed and upset my horses".

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:48 PM

However, if any of them did it irresponsibly and I thought my animals or myself were in any type of danger, you bet your ass I'll be phoning the police.

But the OP did not say they were doing irresponsibly, just that they were doing it and it scared her horses.

I agree if the neighbors have done those other things wrong she has a leg to stand on on those things, but not this one. And heck, why not change the fencing so the neighbors dogs can not chase her horses if she is not willing to shoot the neighbors dogs?

gieriscm

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:50 PM

Guess what I'm raising next year?

Herefords.

By the time they're in the freezer the horse will either be desensitized, or will have run off to join the circus. We'll see. :cool:

Sorry for the thread hijack, but... wanna sell half a cow? I'll pick up. :D

And my horse didn't get over cows until I sent him to live in the same field with them for a month.

BCEVENTER

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:51 PM

May I ask, what do you do if your horse shatters a leg, is thrashing around in pain, the local vets are all on other calls and can't get there within a short time?

I just said I have not seen or heard one. That does not meen they do not exist. I just get the feeling that *some* people are so non chalant about the use of guns and firing them off. I just can't imagine hearing gun shots coming from my neighbors back yard or having to be prewarned that there is going to be target practice and I should move my horses.

trubandloki

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:54 PM

I just said I have not seen or heard one. That does not meen they do not exist. I just get the feeling that *some* people are so non chalant about the use of guns and firing them off. I just can't imagine hearing gun shots coming from my neighbors back yard or having to be prewarned that there is going to be target practice and I should move my horses.

I can imagine gun shots going off, I have a neighbor that shoots very regularly (at least once per week, usually more) and we shoot, etc.

But I agree with you, I can not imagine having to be pre-warned about it.

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:58 PM

Guns are like backhoes, BC. When you need one, you should always be able to get your hands on it.

I agree with Misty; if I had an animal who wasn't going to recover and I knew it, there's no way I'd wait for the vet if the animal was in agony.

I own guns, but I don't own a backhoe. However, I know someone who has one, and he's told me if I ever need him and it, just to give him a call. When you have a very large animal that needs to be buried, a friend with a backhoe is important to have!

I let this man round bale my acreage that isn't fenced in, for his cattle. He says the extra hay always helps him get through the winter. When I do fence that portion in, I'm going to put gates in big enough for him to continue to get his equipment through. Those are the kind of neighbors I have. :D

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:58 PM

But the OP did not say they were doing irresponsibly, just that they were doing it and it scared her horses.

I agree if the neighbors have done those other things wrong she has a leg to stand on on those things, but not this one. And heck, why not change the fencing so the neighbors dogs can not chase her horses if she is not willing to shoot the neighbors dogs?

Hmmm....why should she go through the expense of changing her fencing when her neighbors should act RESPONSIBLY and contain their freakin' dogs?

Gnalli

Sep. 23, 2008, 03:59 PM

Well, aren't you just a shining beacon of light for international relations?

Just because something is normal for you doesn't mean that it is considered normal by others. That is really the gist of this thread, isn't it?

Not to be mean, but we really dont want to be what is considered normal in South Africa. Y'all have a lot of problems that we don't have, and I don't wnt to trade. I will however send you a big gun and ammo if you decide to change your stance about guns. Maybe if the right people in your area had guns, there would not be as many problems?

I would have a real problem with the neighbors hitting golf balls towards my animals, and I would probably be tempted to hit them back at them. I wonder how a power hitter with a corked baseball bat would do with some golf balls.....yes, that was mean.

As far as the guns, desensitise the horses. That is the only way you will fix that. The neighbors are asshats, and asshats don't change. If I have a horse that does not do well with gun fire, he either learns to deal (a spook-small- is allowed for the first one since it unexpected) or he gets a new home.

If the dogs are running your stock, SSS.

I have neighbors at the barn that are that way. They cleared out their veg patch of rocks and chunked the rocks into my pasture. Their leftover veggies get chucked into the pasture for the horses. Rebel stomps on it. Their boy came out and dug holes in the pasture. I strung another line of red tipped barb wire good and stout, chucked the rocks back over and padlocked the gate and filled the hole in, all the time, muttering about ill behaved kids.

Ambrey

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:00 PM

I just said I have not seen or heard one. That does not meen they do not exist. I just get the feeling that *some* people are so non chalant about the use of guns and firing them off. I just can't imagine hearing gun shots coming from my neighbors back yard or having to be prewarned that there is going to be target practice and I should move my horses.

Seriously, it's an "only in America" thing. People here take their right to bear arms very seriously- the NRA (National Rifle Association) is huge.

Most rural areas I know about allow gun use on your own property. They might have rules about distance from a property line or something, but in general you're allowed to do as you see fit.

Of course in the city it's totally different.

Overo Kid

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:05 PM

never mind...

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:09 PM

Not to be mean, but we really dont want to be what is considered normal in South Africa. Y'all have a lot of problems that we don't have, and I don't wnt to trade. I will however send you a big gun and ammo if you decide to change your stance about guns. Maybe if the right people in your area had guns, there would not be as many problems?

Gnalli, if carrying a gun could solve my nation's problems, I'd buy several, but I'm afraid it's a little more complicated than that ;)

I'm not going to tell anybody how to run their country, that's not what it is about. I just found the reactions that the OP is getting to be really strange. Not strange as in 'you're weird', strange as in not something I'm familiar with.

It seems to me that the fervor to protect the Second Amendment means that something as simple as common courtesy becomes unreasonable. My neighbour has a teenage adopted son who likes to ride his motorbike on weekends, something he's perfectly entitled to do. He has the courtesy not to do it when my horses are out in the paddock. I find it strange that anybody who lives in the country would let off their guns when there are horses nearby. Most posters here say that it's okay.

All righty then. It's obviously a regional thing.

sidepasser

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:09 PM

My neighbors shoot off fireworks, guns, somedays it sounds like large cannon fire..lol, when all that first started, I went down and asked them if they would stop a few minutes and let me move my horse that were in the field next to their property and being the great neighbors they were, they stopped and helped me move them up close to the barn.

After that day, they called me the next week and said "we'll be shooting after lunch", so I moved the horses over one paddock but didn't bring the up to the barn. After a few times of that, now they don't run or have fits when there is any shooting and the neighbor doesn't have to call me anymore to let me know they are shooting.

Now if I get a NEW horse I would tell them and ask that we do the same routine for a few weeks to get that horse used to the noise. Usually only a few times of hearing the "boom" and the horses could care less.

As far as the neighbor's dogs are concerned:
1. Talk to neighbor and tell them the dogs are chasing the stock
2. Animal control and the local sheriff's office can be notified
3. If you can catch the dogs, drop them by the local pound and leave them with a/c.
4. Another alternative - get a Pyranees that is from working lines..they do a great job dealing with the local roaming dog population.
5. Last resort - SSS.

Golf balls can be an effective means to get said neighbor's attention as you hit them back over the fence with a ball bat. Hopefully your aim won't send them through the neighbor's windows..

Overo Kid

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:13 PM

sidepasser, would you please move next door to ME?:D

Gnalli

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:16 PM

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:17 PM

I apologize, I did sound rude. What I meant by the sending you a big gun was for self defense. My apologies again.

That's okay, apology accepted.

Instead of a big gun, d'you think you could send over some US dollars? Now that half our cabinet has resigned, the Rand has gone through the floor :)

tidy rabbit

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:20 PM

Then sell your farm, move to a $500,000 subdivision

No No NO.. The right answer to this situation is to buy 500 acres and surround it with a jurasic park electric fence. Put your house and your barns right in the very middle of the 500 acres. Build a tunnel to the main hiway so you don't have to drive past any neighbors.

The above is my plan for my next farm. :)

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:25 PM

No No NO.. The right answer to this situation is to buy 500 acres and surround it with a jurasic park electric fence. Put your house and your barns right in the very middle of the 500 acres. Build a tunnel to the main hiway so you don't have to drive past any neighbors.

The above is my plan for my next farm. :)

What? No moat? No crocodiles? No gun turrets?

:D

Bluehorsesjp

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:26 PM

I was home alone and did not think it was a very good idea to go over to his house when 3 guys are shooting guns.........

Oh come on. Like they would turn the guns on you or something. Now that is just stupid.
Talk to your neighbors and be friendly. I'm sure if you ask nicely instead of attacking them you can get them to give you some warning so you can contain your horses.
For example, my neighbors like to ride their dirt bike up and down their driveway that abuts my turnouts. I asked polietly and they not only slow down while riding by, but will let me know so I can move horses around if I feel like I need to. It's all very adult.
I also have another neighbor who hunts on the BLM land right next to our property. He always lets me know when he is going to be hunting so I can leave the horses in. No problem.
This is what it is like to live in a rural community.

Frank B

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:28 PM

The fellow that lives next to the stable where I board is a muzzleloader enthusiast. We have some of the most bomb-proof horses in the county.

BO informs him whenever she is planning to host a show. He always jokes that she is passing up a tremendous opportunity for home-court advantage!

Saturdays around here can sound like a war zone between the Constable across the road, the Deputy beside me and the Officer behind me. Not that I don't unleash a few rounds of my own from time to time.

"Green acres is the place to be
Farm living is the life for me..."

sidepasser

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:33 PM

Gnalli, if carrying a gun could solve my nation's problems, I'd buy several, but I'm afraid it's a little more complicated than that ;)

I'm not going to tell anybody how to run their country, that's not what it is about. I just found the reactions that the OP is getting to be really strange. Not strange as in 'you're weird', strange as in not something I'm familiar with.

It seems to me that the fervor to protect the Second Amendment means that something as simple as common courtesy becomes unreasonable. My neighbour has a teenage adopted son who likes to ride his motorbike on weekends, something he's perfectly entitled to do. He has the courtesy not to do it when my horses are out in the paddock. I find it strange that anybody who lives in the country would let off their guns when there are horses nearby. Most posters here say that it's okay.

All righty then. It's obviously a regional thing.

I'm from Ga. I don't own a gun, just something I haven't gotten around to acquiring but my family has guns, for deer hunting, dove shoots, etc. I grew up with guns and can shoot with the best of them and actually do enjoy target practice every once in a while when I go visit relatives.

Kaleer, if everytime a gun went off in the US and horses were to be stabled, you would never see a horse outside it's stall. We have night hunts, day hunts, hunting with dogs, hunting without dogs, etc. All my neighbors hunt, most target practice on their one acre lots. I could care less as long as the bullets don't cross my property.

Did have that happen once, I called the Sheriff and he came out, dug the bullet out of my fence and walked down to the neighbor's and took care of that problem. Teen had broke into the locked gun cabinet and was "target shooting" w/o parent's knowledge. Parent's were not too thrilled being called off their job to come home - kid had to come up and do some "voluntary" labor for me for my trouble. I believe parents whaled the tar out of him for that little episode. Kid knew better and apologized and I've not had a problem since then.

I guess it is different for those that live in the burbs vs. city vs. rural. I grew up in a household of gun owners, and was taught how to care for and use a gun safely and properly. Guns rode in gun racks in every truck we had. Folks have turkey shoots to raise money for church, charity, etc. Just a way of life, especially in the rural areas.

My area isn't so rural now, but we are outside the city limits and there is no noise ordinance or such here. I doubt any politician worth his/her salt would want to even mumble "gun control" around here..too many gun owners and hunters. Heck we have thousand acre hunting preserves and I don't think those folks that use them are going to put up with any regulations on gun use any time soon. .

It's a way of life and most rural folks don't like others moving in an area that is decidely rural and trying to change that way of life. Mostly I reckon cause they feel that if you wanted to move to a rural area, then YOU are the one that must adjust, not the people who already live there and have farms, livestock, equipment and yes, guns.

Maybe I haven't explained this very well, but I'm a southerner and been one all my life. I consider anything above Tennesse or South Carolina as being "north" - lol..that's how deep southern I am. So maybe it works differently in other areas of the country, but if I were the OP,

I'd try to fix things with the neighbor before it gets out of hand..like go over and just jaw with them awhile and see what it would take to get the problem resolved. If she can't resolve it,

those pigs sure are going to be some nice eating when they get about 280 lbs. Be sure to keep a boar and sow so you can renew those odifirous resources..nothing like the smell of a pig lot to make a neighbor want to pack up and leave..lol.

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:37 PM

Sidepasser, actually you described it very well, thank you.

In "the country", we don't hear gunshots that often out here. In the cities, of course, you hear them all the time ;) We have rather bombproof pigeons.

Gnalli

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:38 PM

That's okay, apology accepted.

Instead of a big gun, d'you think you could send over some US dollars? Now that half our cabinet has resigned, the Rand has gone through the floor :)

UMMM, have you looked at Wall Street lately? Ours isn't in great shape either, but if I could, I would. Guns, I have plenty enough to share, lol.... I can send you some heirloom garden seeds so you can plant a garden though....:)

Gnalli

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:39 PM

What? No moat? No crocodiles? No gun turrets?

:D

I vote for all of the above!!!

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:43 PM

UMMM, have you looked at Wall Street lately? Ours isn't in great shape either, but if I could, I would. Guns, I have plenty enough to share, lol.... I can send you some heirloom garden seeds so you can plant a garden though....:)

You grow heirlooms in America? Sheesh, we still get ours the old-fashioned way : we inherit them :)

tidy rabbit

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:44 PM

tidy rabbit

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:46 PM

Oh, but we do joke about if we win the lottery we are going to build a little gate house and hire a midget to work in it. He'll be dressed as a lawn jockey, naturally.

Perhaps we could hire other midgets to work the draw bridges and stand watch in the turrets? Thanks for the ideas!

Midge

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:46 PM

I was home alone and did not think it was a very good idea to go over to his house when 3 guys are shooting guns.........

Why not? Do you think thy are going to shoot you???

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:47 PM

I feel the same way OP and Kealeer do. I haet the guns going off all teh time and my horse did not even care about them.

Its loud, rude, dangerous and every now and then they shoot each other. They shoot mostly before, during and after some social event and I have no doubt booze is involved.

If and when I get rich I will but up their small properties and they will be forced to move to places much less nice where guns wont be tolerated. They do not respect the rights of others and they do not care if the noise bothers others.

I would NEVER go argue with armed people. I already know they are inconsiderate and unreasonable, why would I think they are going to be safe to piss off?

The guns are much too loud to be conidered neighborly and how do I know if they are aiming at a sufficent backdrop or just shooting into the woods?

Sdadly, when they do kill each other evey few months nobosy calsl teh police becuase we haev no idea these gunsots are not to celebrate a commercail break in Cops or to commorate wizzing out the back door.

Legally its probably a nuisence and they shoudl be held liable if horses are injured when they should have known is was causing the livestock to be "worried or bothered"

My county has more public shooting ranges then trash dumps. I say take it there and leave it out of your backyard.:mad:

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:52 PM

Its loud, rude, dangerous and every now and then they shoot each other.

Oooh! Natural selection at work, right in your back yard. It's like having National Geographic on speed dial!

cloudyandcallie

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:58 PM

First put up a sold fence all along the side of your property that abutts the shooter.

Then built the tallest, thickest berm that you can, of dirt and rocks and manure, and cover it with grass. Bullets cannot go thru it and sound is mufflled. Alot of the new subdivisions that abutt interstates here in the south do that for noise and to prevent people throwing things onto their golf courses.

And if you can buy the guy out. Now. saves headaches and heartaches later.

arabhorse2

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:59 PM

Oooh! Natural selection at work, right in your back yard. It's like having National Geographic on speed dial!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

RoyalTRider

Sep. 23, 2008, 04:59 PM

A whole 85 acres, huh?

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:01 PM

Midge

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:08 PM

I detest guns. I cannot stand them. I see no use for them 99% of the time, for 99% of the population. I would be quite happy to see the Second Amendment completely repealed. (Yes, I too am a liberal gun control freak. :winkgrin:)

I am always surprised when people say they see no use for guns. Most people also see no use for horses. Shooting well, like riding, is an extremely difficult sport to master.

Denali6298

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:11 PM

Do your neighbors have some sort of back stop set up?? In a lot of states you have to have something to catch the bullets. I just moved to FL and am not used to neighbors being able to go all ya hoo with their guns, and quite honestly scares me due to the fact that I have been shot at during hunting season....(how many deer have you seen with bright orange wraps and a rider?) Also one of my horses was shot in the leg during turn-out one day. People can cry second amendment all they want but it won't protect them in the event of an accident.

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:14 PM

Hmmm....why should she go through the expense of changing her fencing when her neighbors should act RESPONSIBLY and contain their freakin' dogs?

Waaalll .... that really depends. If she is in an area with a leash law, then yes, it is the owners' responsibility to contain their own dogs and a visit from AC would be in order if genial conversation with the offending neighbors didn't suffice.

But there are some places where loose dogs are the norm and permitted under local law. We moved into one. I personally think it's better for dogs, humans and other critters if dogs are contained, but here loose dogs are the norm. There is no leash law. So when the neighbor's dogs began coming to "visit," Mr. CH and I just took them home and the next weekend quietly shored up the base of our fences to make them inaccessible to the dogs. They were pleasant enough dogs, but our one mare can be quite dog aggressive and will stomp an unfamiliar one into puppy pudding if it barks at her or tries to chase her.

Now our neighbors are dear, sweet people and when they saw us working on the base of our fenceline, they quietly came out and started helping from their along the shared line. Mr. CH and Neighbor Hubby then hung out drinking beer and chatting, LOL! It was very sweet and incredibly considerate of them to work on the fence, but I would never consider that a necessary or expected action. We moved here knowing that most people allowed their dogs to roam freely and accepted that culture, also realizing full well that we would be responsible for fencing dogs out rather than expecting our neighbors to fence them in. We fence ours in and think that's the best way of keeping dogs, but recognize that here we are definitely in the minority. And there ain't nothin' wrong with that.

That said, livestock protection laws are quite strong here. Dogs chasing livestock are subject to being shot, do not pass go, do not collect $200. And if they damage said livestock their owners can be held liable for vet fees or recoup of losses. We chose a "neighborly" approach and I'm glad we did; Neighbor Hubby earlier this summer shot a stray he caught harrassing the neighbor's cattle and heading for our pasture.

Thomas_1

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:17 PM

Thank goodness I live in the UK ;)

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:19 PM

Yep, except then you have drunk well armed suddenly fugitve murders trying to hide on your farm. Last week the police were all over loooking for the 3 guys that shot their friend and then ran.

I have tried fighting back by blasting early 80's punk rock into the air and hoping we could negotiate a truce, but I think they are all deaf. MOwing the grass at 3 am doesn't faze then either, but I figure all bets are off and at least tehy are sober then.

Have you tried stomping around your property, poorly dressed and disheveled, with your own shotgun slung over a shoulder, screaming at invisible people? If you're the scary neighbor, you won't have much to worry about! :winkgrin:

(I'm mostly kidding, but we used this technique to scare off some unsavories who liked to hang around some nice country property owned by my family and used by most of us for a quiet getaway. Mr. CH is a sweet, gentle man, but he's also a big, bearded guy and does a fine, fine psycho redneck imitation! I also like to think my crazed fishwife performance was award-worthy!)

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:21 PM

Thank goodness I live in the UK ;)

Yup, all you have to worry about is your horses being knifed in a gang fight :D

Catersun

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:22 PM

Well, aren't you just a shining beacon of light for international relations?

Just because something is normal for you doesn't mean that it is considered normal by others. That is really the gist of this thread, isn't it?

Jswan isn't the only one that is thinking the same thing. I am of the same opinion... what you want for your country is just fine for you and yours, but leave ours alone.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:25 PM

This isn't a 2nd amendment thing. The 2nd amendment guarantees the right to own a firearm. It doesn't say anything about being a bad neighbor.

I have not figured out a way to legislate good manners. You and others may think that it's just good manners to go up and ask your neighbor. I agree - it's good manners. But it's also not unreasonable to assume that livestock are accustomed to gunfire in this area.

It's not like walking 10 feet and ringing a bell. Your neighbors are likely out in the fields. The livestock may not belong to them - the land may be leased. There may be no other place to move the livestock - around here many people practice rotational grazing - the field they're in they stay in while the others are rested.

Besides, once hunting season starts gunfire is going to be heard anyway. Even black powder. Like I keep saying, gunfire is NORMAL at all times of the year, but more frequent before and during various seasons.

Is everyone in the area supposed to tiptoe around LBB because her horse's might get scared? You see, that's when common courtesy simply doesn't work. That's where TOLERANCE comes in.

So what if the jerk neighbors joked that they were practicing for dove season and that was 3 weeks ago? Do LBB's horse's only get scared out of season? Black powder is coming up anyway - it's going to get loud around here.

She doesn't call the cops for a REAL crime (abuse and dogs chasing livestock) - but she calls because of legal gunfire. Of course the cop is going to give her the brush off.

(I'd really like it if everyone tiptoed around me when I'm riding my young horse. I'd also like people to stop when they see my inert body lying on the ground after I've been tossed. I don't always get what I want. :cool:)

G

It seems to me that the fervor to protect the Second Amendment means that something as simple as common courtesy becomes unreasonable.

goeslikestink

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:28 PM

Oh come on. Like they would turn the guns on you or something. Now that is just stupid.
Talk to your neighbors and be friendly. I'm sure if you ask nicely instead of attacking them you can get them to give you some warning so you can contain your horses.
For example, my neighbors like to ride their dirt bike up and down their driveway that abuts my turnouts. I asked polietly and they not only slow down while riding by, but will let me know so I can move horses around if I feel like I need to. It's all very adult.
I also have another neighbor who hunts on the BLM land right next to our property. He always lets me know when he is going to be hunting so I can leave the horses in. No problem.
This is what it is like to live in a rural community.

thats what i think why didnt you got alk to them you still can by appologising for sending plod in, you far more likely to get a agreement of times etc

look mate you got to live there 24/7 the worse thing you do is to upset the neighbours only brings more crap upon crap,, so go see them a nd tlak to them, so what if it was 3 men
they wouldnt have turn the guns on you, if new neighbour then introuduce yourself as a neighbour,
bring in donkeys pigs or whatever down the fewnce line is only gong to cusae you more grief- dont be a muppet

use your brians you have to live next door to them 24/7 you want things to be amicable not blooming arguementative and one up manship-- you have 80acres he has one
so why dont you -- make for bigger fenceline or screening of the fence on that side

i live in uk, and farmer across the motorway shoots in my small wooded bit
to keep pigeons of crops wahtever,, and guess what its noly about 2acres away
if that, do i care nope, as i have a ruddy breat big motorway between me and the farmer i ride in woods that have local shoots going on all the time do i care nope do my horses care nope, they get used to things
they seen and heard things ten times louder than that-- ie crashes on motorway helicopters landing in my yard and slap bang next to horse field do they care-- nope and my place is only two acres big

in the woods ther is also a clay pigeon shoot-- right next door to a bridle path when the bloke see anyone he signals to stop till riders are out of the way

you could do the same thing with your neighbour - if youhave the balls to change the attitude and be a little smarter instead of at each other thoarts, like i said you got to live there i havent

not only that people tha get on are more likely to inform you wwhen something is amiss and you not there-

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:34 PM

JSwan, very well-stated! :yes:

My afore-mentioned free-range-dog-owning neighbors also have a small machine shop that Neighbor Hubby, his grown son and their buddies like to work in at all hours of the day and night. While I'd prefer not to have rides punctuated by banging, grinding, cars backfiring and other loud, sudden and bizarre noises, who am I to interfere with their hobby? The horses do eventually get used to it, and if I have to ride out the occasional spook ... well, those are caused as often by rampaging ducks, deer, strong wind and bay-horse-eating black cows as anything human-generated.

The horses also used to get pretty spooked when a large train came blasting down the nearby track. They can still get pretty spooked when they blow up the "big stuff" at nearby Ft. Jackson. Other things I can't, shouldn't and wouldn't want to dictate. We all have to live together and TOLERANCE, as JSwan said, goes a far way toward letting that happen.

I save my ire for the people who deliberately "invade" my home, like the kid who deliberately shot a rocket into my pasture (and got his hide tanned by daddy for it) and the religious "salespeople" who insist on coming through my closed and "no tresspassing" signed gate, all the way up my drive to pester me when I am trying to work.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:34 PM

Hmmm....why should she go through the expense of changing her fencing when her neighbors should act RESPONSIBLY and contain their freakin' dogs?

She shouldn't. There is no reason any livestock owner should have to change their fence to keep out dogs running at large.

That is why there is a law in Virginia permitting her to not only shoot such a dog, but also holds the dog owner responsible for any and all vet bills and property damage.

If she's still having problems with the dogs, then maybe she should purchase her own firearm and do some target practice in the back pasture.

And Thomas_1 - looks like not everyone is fond of the Right to Roam act - certainly no American would approve of such an erosion of property rights. If it works for you - that's great. But please don't try and tell me you live in some sort of utopia. According to some sources - the trampling hikers are wreaking havoc.

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:34 PM

The second ammendment has never been aplied ot the states. At the moment is has only been applied to one non-state--DC. It may chnage soon but right now its not a constututional right to bear arms except to the states themselves--not the peope in those states.

I see the noise scaring the livestck as an extension of the dog laws themselves. WE CAN SSS becuase harrasing livestock is against pubilc policy. By extension, harrasing them by noise should be the same.

Niethe rthe dogs or the guns are going to kill the livestock, but putting them in harms way by running them is enough to allow us to shoot dogs, so why is it not enough to at least be all frowny when humans are doing the harrasing just for fun:confused:

If running horses is enough justification for killing family pets, it ought to be enough justification for a $10 fine or citation.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:42 PM

coloredhorse

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:46 PM

Niethe rthe dogs or the guns are going to kill the livestock, but putting them in harms way by running them is enough to allow us to shoot dogs, so why is it not enough to at least be all frowny when humans are doing the harrasing just for fun:confused:

Point Number One: Dogs can and do kill livestock, costing the owners of said livestock money in vet bills, lost property or both. (Yes, guns can, too; see Point Number Three.)

Point Number Two: There is a big difference between humans harrassing livestock "just for fun" via gunfire or other "obnoxious" behavior and those engaging in an activity they find pleasurable on their own property and in accordance with applicable state and local laws.

And that's not even getting into the other "noise" issues that can spook a horse -- read my earlier post re: trains and munitions activity at the military base. Do the railroads need my permission to traverse their own tracks? Does the Army need my permission to conduct necessary training activities on its own base?

Point Number Three: For instances where humans are doing the harrassing of their neighbors or their neighbors livestock, there are state and local laws that apply to those cases ... and violations should be reported and dealt with.

:lol::lol::lol: Just occurred to me: In most areas, I would be categorized as the bleedingest-hearted of liberals, but as far as property rights goes, I think the staunchest of conservatives would give me a big sloppy kiss for my efforts! :lol::lol::lol:

Thomas_1

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:47 PM

And Thomas_1 - looks like not everyone is fond of the Right to Roam act - certainly no American would approve of such an erosion of property rights. If it works for you - that's great. But please don't try and tell me you live in some sort of utopia. According to some sources - the trampling hikers are wreaking havoc.

Hey?????? I don't know what you're reading but you probably shouldn't believe everything .

Denali6298

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:49 PM

The only thing the second amendment guarantees is the right for one to bear arms against and over controlling government, as in the government cannot take away your guns in the event off an attempted over throw. That is if you want to look at it with regards to its original intent. If one took the time to read it in its entirety, one would note the context of it all involves the state militias.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:52 PM

Thomas -

Damage being caused to sensitive habitat. Conservationists and biologists hollering. Land formerly off limits to the public now opened up to the public - against the property owners wishes. That would drive an American crazy.

Or crazier, depending on one's opinion of Americans.

But I was really referring to just the ecosystem damage.

cloudyandcallie

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:53 PM

Have you tried stomping around your property, poorly dressed and disheveled, with your own shotgun slung over a shoulder, screaming at invisible people? If you're the scary neighbor, you won't have much to worry about! :winkgrin:

(I'm mostly kidding, but we used this technique to scare off some unsavories who liked to hang around some nice country property owned by my family and used by most of us for a quiet getaway. Mr. CH is a sweet, gentle man, but he's also a big, bearded guy and does a fine, fine psycho redneck imitation! I also like to think my crazed fishwife performance was award-worthy!)

A great idea. Or maybe we could all don our crayola costumes and come visit for a BBQ. That should scare the neighbors into shooting on the other side of their acre.

sidepasser

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:55 PM

Goeslikestink does have a good point - one must live next door to neighbors and it is easier to try to work things out than to have to worry about arguments. Also nice to have an extra eye on occasion when one has to leave for any period of time.

I try very hard to be a good neighbor because I've lived on my place for over 20 years and don't want to have problems. I do have one neighbor that has done some things that I did not like, like dumping his old car w/o a motor through my fence and he and I had words over that. I had the car removed and billed him for the damages and replaced the fence.

I've read on other boards about really bad neighbors, aka the neighbor from hell..the kind that will cut fences, turn out stock, have loud parties, drugs, vandalize and steal --very sneakily so that you "know" the person did it but cannot prove it. I'd hate to live next door to that sort..

I figure a little gunfire is nothing compared to some neighbors that go out of their way to really be a pain. I hope the OP's horse is better and that she can come to some sort of agreement with her gunshooting neighbor about the dogs and chasing livestock. I doubt though that the neighbor will stop shooting his gun though..but maybe they can agree that he will let her know in advance when he is going to be shooting so she can move her horses.

Take him a six pack of good beer..uhm maybe some Budweiser instead of PBR..lol..maybe that would help..lots of stuff can be settled over a six pack. (grin)

I have a wonderful neighbor who cuts the grass along my part of the roadway and up and down my banks. Every Christmas I take him a ham or a couple of racks of ribs with a card for dinner at a local rest. for him and his wife just to let him know I appreciate it. I'm scared of riding the mower up and down that bank next to the road, so that works for me! When his dog got loose, I dragged it (literally that dog isn't really leash trained..) back down to his house and gave it back to him because he normally keeps the dog chained when it's outside. Had we been "feudin" I would have called a/c and had the dog picked up. This way, he has his errant dog and I still have a great neighbor.

Small things can help smooth over the big rotten things..

Best of luck to you OP.

Thomas_1

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:58 PM

LuvMyNSH

Sep. 23, 2008, 05:58 PM

Niethe rthe dogs or the guns are going to kill the livestock, but putting them in harms way by running them is enough to allow us to shoot dogs, so why is it not enough to at least be all frowny when humans are doing the harrasing just for fun:confused:

If a dog comes into my yard and goes after my stock - not just running up and down the fence line of his own yard chasing butterflies, but goes AFTER my stock, I'll make sure the dog goes away. If a kid intentionally does something to harass my stock, I'll call the cops.

If someone is minding their own business and enjoying their hobby on their own property with zero intent to harass or annoy the neighbors, that's something else. Even if it's a stupid hobby. I'm not the hobby police. Even if I was, I'd probably go after the My Little Pony collectors before I went after recreational shooters. Those MLP people are just weird.

I have a neighbor who is an avid hunter and has one of those fake deer he practices on. My horses couldn't care less. But there's a kid a street over who likes to practice drums in his garage with the door open - you can hear him clear as day. The first few bangs always make my horses jump. Should he not be allowed to enjoy his hobby in his own garage? The firetrucks that go screaming by rolling code scare the horses too. Should we make a law banning lights and sirens on firetrucks?

My horses aren't big on thunder either. Who do I call the cops on to fix that?

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:09 PM

That would drive us crazy ........ if only it was true!

Ah well - some scientists don't want humans to touch ANYTHING lest we leave more than a footprint. The UK must have some of them too - I thought they were all in the US. My bad.

LuvMyNSH - I had to laugh at your My Little Pony comment. Yes, there oughta be a law.... :lol::lol::lol:

Kaeleer

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:18 PM

Ah well - some scientists don't want humans to touch ANYTHING lest we leave more than a footprint. The UK must have some of them too - I thought they were all in the US. My bad.

It must get confusing, all those voices.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:22 PM

It must get confusing, all those voices.

Not as confusing as your sentence. I have no idea what you're talking about. Surely in your country there is the great debate between conservation and preservation. That debate is raging everywhere else in the world.

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:36 PM

Oh puhleeze...

Are you seriously trying to assert that anything that spooks livestock should be a criminal offense? So, when my neighbor harvests his crops and my horse bucks - I should call the cops?

I want some of what you're smokin'. :rolleyes:

Oh wait - another neighbors chickens got loose and came into my back pasture. Yeah - I should have the old man arrested and let him rot in jail.

One of my goats broke a leg the other day - I had to put him down. Maybe I can sue someone.

Shhhh.... evewybody be vewy vewy quiet. Pookums might get askeert.

No. I am seriosly stating the the public polcy behind keeping dogs from running livestock is to protect livestock.

Shooting guns for fun is not necassry for the public good. It seems that happy healthy livestock is--hence laws protecting them.

News flash, equinelaw. Hunting is guaranteed in our state constitution. So when I'm out hunting and squeeze the trigger - responsibly and ethically - TOUGH NOOGIES. And in my state, every citizen is a member of the unorganized militia.

These people were not hunting. They were enganged in an activity that harrased livestock. Harring livestock seesm to be against public polocy as evidenced by the laws on dogs that harass livestock.

There was no larger greater good in their activity that should trump protection of livestock. For example, the sirens have a greater good, but Bubba the backyard gun fun guy is not doing something more important then rasing livestock.

Hence chickens would be equal and presumably unintentional, thunder would not be controlable and the rest of your response is just idiotic but sounds like it has substance--as usual.

You can read. You see that I did not say throw then in jail. I said a samll citation. Blwoing things up to doing the slippery slope thing is either beneath you or you are just without a leg to stand on.

If this had been dairy cows running and ruining their milk you would be all save the poor farmers you ignorant urban fools!

There is no law that says OPs neighbors cannot shoot guns, but there is more precidence in public policy to support her side then the shooters side.

Her mistake was being mad beofre she got hurt or a horse was seriously injured. How dare she try and ounce of prevention!

Denali6298

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:39 PM

Amen to that equinelaw!!

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:53 PM

I see the noise scaring the livestck as an extension of the dog laws themselves. WE CAN SSS becuase harrasing livestock is against pubilc policy. By extension, harrasing them by noise should be the same.

AMEN!!!

I was gone all afternoon being the BAD neighbor that I am... helping a neighbor pack boxes and prepare for a move.... and look what has happened!!!:eek:

Some gunfire is normal in our area -- the stuff from Quantico and also the stuff from them police academy. It is not coming from next door where it makes things rattle when it goes off. Those are 2 different things.

My horses are quite desensitized. They don't mind normal gunfire as the guy who works on our farm has to shoot something from time to time. It's these major booms that happen one right after another....on and on and on, that got to them.

When I put my ring in... everyone asked why I put it on the road. The answer to that is so my horses are continually being exposed to things.... from rednecks screaming and whistling... harleys blasting their pipes.... bicyclists... firetrucks with sirens... you name it... my horses don't care. It was this gunfire that was so out of the norm and so loud that bothered them.

The neighbors are shooting into a flimsy archery target. If they miss that they are going into another field where there are cattle. They are not our cattle, but the neighbor's cattle. At the time, I did not see the cattle in that area of the field, but there could be a calf laying down in tall brush that could get hit. And my horses could have ended up over there if I was not home to get them in.... and could have gotten shot.

I won't even bother wasting my time responding to JSwan's comment about betting $10 I was a bad neighbor.... We have done more for people just this month than most people do in 5 years time!!!! Last year we gave away so much hay to people.... while everyone was b!tching about how much it cost to buy.

And the stories Just Dandy told were true.... Why didn't I call the cops on the dogs... because they would tell me to call Animal Control and the PW Animal Control department is pathetic. I did not have time to go grab a gun to shoot the dogs.... and I may have accidentally shot the neighbor since he was standing there watching as they chased my heifers. :mad:

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:57 PM

Oh, and the cop was the one who commended me for calling the police and said that I shoud NEVER go up to anyone with a gun..... and try to have a conversation.

SuperSTB

Sep. 23, 2008, 06:59 PM

I see both sides here...

Some areas- you can get a citation for "excessive" noise and I believe sustained duration of an activity that causes some sort of discomfort to local residences can get the person in trouble.

Barking dogs come to mind- when neighbors go after the owners of the dog because of excessive and sustaining barking.

Party animal neighbors are another... where they have loud parties going throughout the day even though it's prior to any 'quiet hours' that may or may not be imposed by the community.

Oh just recalled another story- person had a woodshop hobby and neighbors complained because the guy ran his loud equipment all day. I think he got a citation but the neighbors were pressing the local broohahas to make him make changes to his workshop so they didn't have to hear the noise.

So yeah- what you may or may not do on your own property is a constant battle in many communities. In OP's case she has livestock affected which is a bit more serious in my opinion that a neighbor just being annoyed with a party or a barking dog.

In the meantime- if I was in OP's shoes- and if I considered pressing the issue with local authorities- I'd sure as heck work on getting those animals a little more 'accustomed' to gunfire.

My hubby was making a display cabinet and using the aircompressor and brad gun. I walked my mare right by the garage where he was working while he was shooting the brad gun. She jumped a bit at first but it wasn't long before she could care less. You can't desensitize them from everything but at least it was a lesson she was learning in trusting me as her handler. Good tool for future "what the hell is THAT!" episodes.

Denali6298

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:01 PM

Check county code about that flimsy target thing..... I know in my county yes you can shoot on your property but you also have to be shooting into a backstop, mound o' dirt, or something else that is going to catch those bullets.

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:01 PM

Actually, J Swans comment about you being a bad neighbor was almost esactly like Facinated's comment about cookie cat in the now famous WWYD thread.

Attack the victim and exgerate any reponse way past what was said. I have no idea why we all like J Swan and let her do that to us while we cheered when Facinated was banned.

I think its becuase she has her moods and is quite pleasent most days, but watchotu if you are the one who gets her on a bad day. The next day she may be just as passionately arguing the other side.

I think this sudden gun loveness has something to do with it being an elections year. I swear even Arabhorse2 slammed another poster just a few months ago for being so pro gun:confused:

If this had been a 4th of July fireworks thread then every body woudl be all:eek::eek: Well, everybody but County:)

Denali6298

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:05 PM

Its not just an elections year, its part the D.C. decision you talked about and people getting something just because they can. My SO has a gun for just in case. :rolleyes:

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:10 PM

Yes, probably that too, but if I wasn't so lazy I am sure I could find the same posters slamming OP on the other side in the past.

Noise itself is considered polution. Most places where people are densly packed do limit noise. It is not a good thing unless it is necassary.

As I said, my horse was used to the guns, but I still hateall the loud noise 24/7 and I think it is not too oppresive to at least limit the hours so people could plan or avoid it if nedded.

What if your neighbor desiced to take up shooting while you are at work? Or starting a new horse under saddle?

Can we all agree that at least having hours if residential shooting would be a reasonble limit?

SuperSTB

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:17 PM

Noise itself is considered polution. Most places where people are densly packed do limit noise. It is not a good thing unless it is necassary...

Can we all agree that at least having hours if residential shooting would be a reasonble limit?

Yes forgot to point out the pollution thing too. My experience of years working on the Big Dig in Boston- yeah- millions were spent on noise monitoring and abatement. Millions of TAX DOLLARS I might point out.

OP- I hope things go better for you...

MistyBlue

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:24 PM

AH2 and J Swan have been gun owners for quite some time...ages actually. (not that I'm trying to aging you ladies :winkgrin: )
I might have firearms and use them on a semi-regular basis as tools and on a regular basis to maintain accuracy, I might have a collection of old/rare/unusual firearms, I might be a licensed firearms instructor and I might have a 15 year old daughter who is slowly filling my house up with shooting trophies...but I do also believe in having *much* stronger gun control than we already do. Personally I'd like to have people have to take a sanity test, a rage control test and an IQ test before being allowed to consider purchasing a firearm. (or live near me, LOL)
But firearms in general are *not* The Debil. Seriously, I promise. You'd be amazed at who has guns, uses guns and has grown up around them. I live in CT...not exactly "the country" in regards to the rest of this nation.

equinelaw

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:36 PM

Mnay new people are mving out to rural areas and think getting guns as new toys goes with teh terrotory. Like getting half a dozen dogs or a horse.

I know in my neighborhood there are fully automatic weapons. Thst not deer hunters and its not even legal. I am not going ot call the police beucase I am afraid of peopel with fullly automatic weapons.

If you were teaching the neighbors in this case, what would you have taught them about shooting in this situation? Inform first?

jaimebaker

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:39 PM

Well, my horses are used to guns. I'm used to hearing guns. But, funny story involving neighbors that either don't 'get it' or have no respect even if they DO get it. Our closest neighbor is about a mile away. Well, his brother wanted to surprise him for Christmas by flying in. By 'flying in', I mean he literally flew a little ol' plane in and landed it....guess where?? MY STALLION'S PASTURE. Apparently, he was too stooopppid to go land it at the little airport 10 miles away like a normal human being would have done:mad: I was pregnant on bedrest when my mother called to tell me there was a plane in my stud's pasture. I thought she meant one of those big remote controlled planes. Not a REAL plane :eek: So, guns I can prepare for. Ya never know what's going to come at your horses at any given moment. Ahhh...the joys of the country. Wouldn't change it for a thing but it has it's moments (I grew up in the country BTW). Now when I desensitize my horses I use anything I can think of. Balloons, metal cans, drive cars in the pastures honking horns, ANYTHING. I just honestly never know what's going to show up in the middle of nowhere. At one point an emu was loose out there. Try explaining THAT to your precious fuzzy equine (that's never seen a bird quite like that).

Sithly

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:44 PM

Facinated was a troll. And a moron. No comparison.

It's normal to hear gunshots around here, too. The horses get used to it. The BO does some shooting on the property. My horse also lives next to his shop, so he hears all sorts of machinery and shop noise. Not to mention, BO's kids are always zooming around on some little homemade vehicle or another.

I should really be paying him for all the free training I'm getting. :lol:

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 07:45 PM

Excuse me, where have I said that LBB is "to blame?"

She isn't the victim of a crime. If she was the victim of a crime, I'd support her 100%.

She's pissed because her neighbor is doing something she doesn't like and she wants to control his actions even though he (this time) is not doing anything illegal.

That's not the same as being the victim of a crime.

The neighbor committed crimes when he 1) was hitting her horses with golf balls and 2) when he permitted to let his dogs run at large and chase her livestock.

Both times, she did nothing except express displeasure. That's her choice and that's that.

This time - he was not committing a crime and she chose to call the cops.

She didn't get the result she wanted.

Well - that's the way it works. When a crime is committed, the cops can act - IF YOU CALL THEM. If a crime is not committed, exactly what do you want the cops to do?

Again, it is LEGAL to discharge a firearm on one's land around here- providing local ordinances are obeyed. He evidently was not disobeying any laws.

Whether one is pro or anti gun is not relevant. A crime was NOT committed. In fact, in this area this type of activity is NORMAL. What is so difficult to understand? Around here, there are thousands and thousands of acres of open land interspersed with a house here or there.

I'm really sorry she's got jerks for neighbors. I had one too a while back. I was lucky - they were renters.

If LBB lives near me - she should thank her lucky stars for all the gunfire. It means there are people around who can shoot all the coyotes. If she thinks black powder fire is bad - wait till she sees coyote stalking her livestock. My neighbors down the road own a dairy farm - they shot 6 coyotes in one day.

I'll take the gunfire.

But not LBB's neighbors. I wish her luck on that and I hope she can work things out with him.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:00 PM

Oh for God's sake - do you have to polish your halo in public? Give me a break. None of us has a corner on sainthood.

The guy didn't break any laws. If he had, the cop would have issued him a citation or arrested him.

And no, they are not two different things. The gunfire you think is acceptable may not be as acceptable to a person closer to the range. Or a person who is anti-gun.

What you're saying is that it's ok for YOU and so you won't take exception to it, even though someone else might differ.

So maybe the guy shooting the firearm on his own land thinks that the sound of gunfire isn't as loud as you think it is. Or maybe he just thinks that his setup is sufficient, since the weapons he was firing was a short-range weapon.

I'm still trying to figure out what you think you're going to do once hunting season starts. There will be a lot of folks out hunting, and probably hunting close to your property line. What if your horse's spook at guys in camoflauge? (or gals) What if they spook at blaze orange?

Geez - I don't see what the big deal is. You didn't call the cops when the dogs were trying to kill your animals - but now you're all aflutter because of a loud noise.

And no, equinelaw, I wouldn't have been upset if the animals in question had been dairy cows. Like I've said before - GUNFIRE IS NORMAL around here. Nice sucker punch comparing me to facinated, by the way.

I sympathize with LBB - but I do not agree with her and her reasoning.

AMEN!!!

I was gone all afternoon being the BAD neighbor that I am... helping a neighbor pack boxes and prepare for a move.... and look what has happened!!!:eek:

Some gunfire is normal in our area -- the stuff from Quantico and also the stuff from them police academy. It is not coming from next door where it makes things rattle when it goes off. Those are 2 different things.

My horses are quite desensitized. They don't mind normal gunfire as the guy who works on our farm has to shoot something from time to time. It's these major booms that happen one right after another....on and on and on, that got to them.

When I put my ring in... everyone asked why I put it on the road. The answer to that is so my horses are continually being exposed to things.... from rednecks screaming and whistling... harleys blasting their pipes.... bicyclists... firetrucks with sirens... you name it... my horses don't care. It was this gunfire that was so out of the norm and so loud that bothered them.

The neighbors are shooting into a flimsy archery target. If they miss that they are going into another field where there are cattle. They are not our cattle, but the neighbor's cattle. At the time, I did not see the cattle in that area of the field, but there could be a calf laying down in tall brush that could get hit. And my horses could have ended up over there if I was not home to get them in.... and could have gotten shot.

I won't even bother wasting my time responding to JSwan's comment about betting $10 I was a bad neighbor.... We have done more for people just this month than most people do in 5 years time!!!! Last year we gave away so much hay to people.... while everyone was b!tching about how much it cost to buy.

And the stories Just Dandy told were true.... Why didn't I call the cops on the dogs... because they would tell me to call Animal Control and the PW Animal Control department is pathetic. I did not have time to go grab a gun to shoot the dogs.... and I may have accidentally shot the neighbor since he was standing there watching as they chased my heifers. :mad:

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:08 PM

JSwan, maybe a couple stiff drinks or a high colonic will make you feel better. Try to remember to put milk in your Cheerios tomorrow and not cat piss!
:lol:

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:11 PM

Same for you, LBB. Just in case the gunfire is making you jumpy. :cool:

justdandy

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:23 PM

Sithly

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:29 PM

I'd seriously love to have a 30ft. stone wall and a moat. Not even kidding; that would be great. I'd have towers on either side of the drawbridge, and a walkway between them from which I could pour boiling oil down on intruders.

Granted, if you try to make your property idiot proof, they will simply build a better idiot.

RoyalTRider

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:40 PM

Actually, if one buys 500 acres, one doesn't need to build any fencing provided one's neighbor has less land. After all, the more land you have, the more right you have to regulate the little people.

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:54 PM

I get it now.... JSwan is ex-military police.... it's all making sense now...

Cranky Agnes

Sep. 23, 2008, 08:57 PM

Facinated was a troll. And a moron. No comparison.

Thank you! Amen to THAT!!!

Seriously, you cannot be comparing JSwan to that doofus. It's like apples and oranges. BUT, if you're going to point fingers at people for calling out the OP (meaning OPs in general) for not taking action when she SHOULD have, then I hope you're able to grow several more appendages because there are A LOT of people on this BB guilty of that.

People need to be responsible for their own actions. You can't control your neighbors (or anyone else), but you CAN choose how you react to them. Maybe this incident wouldn't have happened had the OP handled things differently the first time.

Frankly, I agree with JSwan, and most of the time in her posts, she's spot on in what she says. I think that people just don't always want to admit it and don't care for her delivery. She's blunt and honest and I can respect that. I certainly respect it more than people like the OP who are always whining about how something is unfair to them or who like to go on public BBs and blast people just because they can and because they think it makes them look better.

Sithly

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:02 PM

Actually, if one buys 500 acres, one doesn't need to build any fencing provided one's neighbor has less land. After all, the more land you have, the more right you have to regulate the little people.

True, true. The best solution would be to buy it all. Then you could have peasants.

J Swan

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:06 PM

I get it now.... JSwan is ex-military police.... it's all making sense now...

That was back in the Dark Ages.

So - what makes "sense" exactly.

Or do you also have a problem with veterans in addition to people who have less acreage than you?

Kementari

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:20 PM

I am always surprised when people say they see no use for guns. Most people also see no use for horses. Shooting well, like riding, is an extremely difficult sport to master.

Methinks you missed my point entirely - which was PRECISELY that horses, like guns, often irritate the neighbors. And since both are currently legal to use in much of the US, it would behoove us to SUAD with guns being used within legal bounds and place our energy into training our horses - lest those same gun owners decide it's altogether too obnoxious to have horses as neighbors and band together with their friends and get horses zoned right out.

I may vote for gun control every time it comes up, but I still think taking offense at people using their guns within the bounds of the law is just pointless - and rude.

threedogpack

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:38 PM

[QUOTE=Cranky Agnes;3537633]

Frankly, I agree with JSwan, and most of the time in her posts, she's spot on in what she says. I think that people just don't always want to admit it and don't care for her delivery.

I also agree with JSwan. And I also agree with which ever poster said that getting along is far better than escalating it since the OP will be living there for a long time.

I am not afraid to confront people and I am not intimidated by guns. But in this case, there is far far far too much that could happen when I was not there for me to wind things up further. It usually pays to do a cost=benefit analysis before making a decision that has the distinct possibilty of making things worse.

and if the Awful Neighbor did hit golf balls into the yard or let the dogs chase the horses.....the chances are that ignoring it will make it fade away eventually but feeding the Awful Neighbor attention he will continue to find what he can do to irritate her without crossing the line into criminal behavior that will get him arrested.

Old Equine Lady

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:50 PM

Since the neighbor was legal in shooting off the guns as the OP was informed, not much she can do now. I do agree that black powder is much more scarier than your usual gun shot and would make my horses run. They even used to live next door to a shooting range. I think the real issue is, are the neighbors trustworthy given their previous actions? When one hears black powder coming from the untrustworthy neighbors, one would panic.
I agree with aquiring pigs, donkeys and would like to add one more possible addition, guinea hens. They travel in a flock, scream a lot and the best part, they eat ticks! Our neighbors had some and we thought they were great as we had no ticks on any of our animals. That was until other neighbor complained and they went to the market. That neighbor has 9 kids, which I think all of them are driving now and the boom boom blaring from their cars is driving us crazy! But this too will pass....she said hopefully!

kcmel

Sep. 23, 2008, 09:54 PM

OP, welcome to MY world. I feel your pain. Good luck with the situation. Unfortunately, I can only offer sympathy, and no advice, having been dealing with a similar situation for several years (although to be fair, the adults are reasonable, the kids are the problem).

Derby Lyn Farms

Sep. 23, 2008, 10:45 PM

We shoot off guns behind our pastures and always do target practice. I'm glad I know how to use one just in case I ever have to. My younger horses aren't as use to the noise as the older ones, but I simply put them in the barn until they get use to the noises. I prefer to have all of my horses use to any noise, guns, dirtbikes, fireworks, so if we are in a situation they don't totally loose their marbles.

My neighbors on both sides also shoot off guns. We have 25 acres, but it is narrow so the neighbors are close. We have talked with both neighbors and simply asked them to give us a call and let us know that they are going to shoot guns off. If the young ones are out, I bring them in and give the neighbors the ok. Its easier to talk to the neighbors first instead of going straight to the authorities. Maybe go talk to the neighbors next time and ask them to cease fire until you round up the horses? Seems to work for us.

onthebit

Sep. 23, 2008, 11:25 PM

Ughhh, honestly, the attitudes of American's and their guns (most of the time) creeps me out. I have never ever heard a gun out here. Rural or Urban. I work on a farm and lots of farming friends and have only ever seen one gun.

I had to respond to this. I am married to a Canadian farmer, he has been in the states for a few years now. He had an arsenal in his house in Canada and so did all of his friends and neighbors. This was about 45 minutes east of Toronto. Oh, and supposedly there is some Canadian law about no loaded guns in a house or something? He slept with a loaded rifle by his bed every night, as did his dad and grandad, and all of his neighbors . . .

rainechyldes

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:28 AM

Ughhh, honestly, the attitudes of American's and their guns (most of the time) creeps me out. I have never ever heard a gun out here. Rural or Urban. I work on a farm and lots of farming friends and have only ever seen one gun.

Really?
I'm in BC myself, live on a farm/ and our neighbors all hunt. Odd that I hear guns all the time, and you don't:) And I like the rest of my family , and many of my horsey friends as well -- all know how to care for a gun and shoot one.

BCEVENTER

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:51 AM

Honestly, it has less to do with Canada and more to do with the states. When someone says that Guns are as American as Apple Pie?? I'm sorry. To me, that is just weird.
And OnTheBit- Again. I did not say that Canadians don't own guns, I just don't think that they are as widely 'accepted' (if that makes sence) as they are in the states.
The only thing remotely close to a gun I have heard are the berry cannons! :D

amdfarm

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:10 AM

I must be the only one trying to picture dove hunting w/ a muzzleloader!! :winkgrin:

We're less than a half mile from a gun club so my horses are very used to it. And in previous places we've been they've been exposed to hunters of all kinds and desensitized rather quickly. They're used to helicopters and the hot air balloon, planes, motorcycles, ATV's and anything else that snaps, crackles, pops, bangs and booms.

And the corner of our back fence is less than 100 yards from a golf course. The pasture grows golf balls and no injuries from them yet. If they're stepped on they squish right into the ground.... it's sandy dirt and not much grass. My son enjoys golf ball hunting and sees how many he can find every season. The most he's gotten I believe was 20 one summer.

Alexie

Sep. 24, 2008, 06:58 AM

Yup, all you have to worry about is your horses being knifed in a gang fight :D

in the UK horses aren't usually hanging around the areas the knife gangs like to frequent :winkgrin:

Trakehner

Sep. 24, 2008, 07:20 AM

FindersKeepers

Sep. 24, 2008, 07:54 AM

OP, I do feel for you. The obnoxoius neighbors, and terrified horses gets frustrating...especially given the history with yours. I am quite sure if you didn't already have a history with this lovely gentleman, it would not have been quite as upsetting.

That being said, the horses do get used to it, and we can't protect them from everything. I'm sorry you have a gimpy one now, and I do hope it is nothing serious.

For a short while in college, my mare was boarded near a shooting range. She was a nervous reck for 2 days...the third day, it was old news, and life was normal. I would simply ask your neighbor to give you a heads up the next few weeks when he's shooting to make sure your horses are in. They can get used to the sound while in the safety of their stalls, and then if they hear it when they are out, only the first shot will startle them. They'll jump, look around, and go back to their grass.

MistyBlue

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:04 AM

I must be the only one trying to picture dove hunting w/ a muzzleloader!! :winkgrin:

Feathers...that's all I'm picturing. :eek: I'd be impressed that someone could hit a fast moving dove with a muzzie...small speedy birds and large semi-accurate weapon. I never did get into black powder...at my size it's like a dwarf trying to fire a hand-held cannon.
I think baseball is supposed to be as American as apple pie. FWIW...that sport is like watching paint dry to me.

J Swan

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:23 AM

Feathers...that's all I'm picturing. :eek: I'd be impressed that someone could hit a fast moving dove with a muzzie...small speedy birds and large semi-accurate weapon. I never did get into black powder...at my size it's like a dwarf trying to fire a hand-held cannon.
I think baseball is supposed to be as American as apple pie. FWIW...that sport is like watching paint dry to me.

:lol::lol:

I think maybe the guy was joking. You're right - just a poof of feathers. I never found a use for that type of firearm - but everyone has their preference.

Ever heard one of those geez - can't remember the name - it's a noisemaker farmers use to discourage and scatter the Canada Geese. Sounds like a cannon going off. BOOM. Livestock get used to those too but it's still a bit startling.

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:30 AM

FindersKeepers - Exactly! If I did not have the history with these neighbors that I do... I would not be this upset. I still can't believe the cop believed the guys were "practicing for opening day of dove season"... hello.... you would think he'd have a clue as to what game was in/out of season and the dates!

I guess I need to clarify something. In my original post where I said that
I was calling friends and family who are in law enforcement to see what the laws were.... and then I had to resort to calling the non-emergency line. I was INQUIRING with the officer on the phone and asking what I should do. He is the one who INTERRUPTED me and went all power hungry because the neighbors were shooting off guns and scaring my livestock!! He is the one who said the cops needed to come out and so they did....

justdandy

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:42 AM

Last year we gave away so much hay to people.... while everyone was b!tching about how much it cost to buy.

:eek::eek: You beyotch!!! You GAVE hay away? You charged me freakin' $2 a bale!!!! That's it.....it's over!!! You are NOT my friend and you are THE worst neighbor anyone could have!!!!:mad:

:winkgrin::lol:

trubandloki

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:48 AM

For all of you who are offended that I suggest the OP put up fence to keep the dogs out; the reason I said that was the OP had a problem with the neighbors dogs. It was posted that she was unwilling to do what was required to take care of the problem (call animal control, shoot the dog, etc) so the only other options were put up fencing or keep complaining. :yes:

Those that think shooting is a crime because of noise issues and animal harassment issues please tell me who I contact about getting mother nature in trouble because the darn hail storms we had this year scared the crap out my horse. No pre storm call from mother nature to let me know it was coming either. Just poof, large noisy horse scaring hale every where. It could have very easily led to a vet bill.

I am sorry the OP has an issue with her neighbors, I really am. It sucks to have crappy neighbors. I have one. I admit, part of the reason I enjoy target practice is I know my neighbor hates it. (He has no livestock, btw.) He goes out of his way to make our lives miserable about just about everything.

I think if the OP had written her original post differently, so she did not come off as an elitist who insisted her higher acreage gave her more rights than the people next door with lower acreage I am thinking she would have gotten more sympathy.

FindersKeepers - Exactly! If I did not have the history with these neighbors that I do... I would not be this upset. I still can't believe the cop believed the guys were "practicing for opening day of dove season"... hello.... you would think he'd have a clue as to what game was in/out of season and the dates!

I think the officer did not care because you do not have to be practicing for something specific. There is no requirement to only practice for deer season for X number of weeks before it, etc.

Midge

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:49 AM

I still can't believe the cop believed the guys were "practicing for opening day of dove season

They don't have to have a 'reason' to shoot.

My horse was terrified by horse and carriage. Normally sensible about new sights, she just could not wrap her mind around horse and carriage. The pony four in hand trotting on the road was the icing on the cake. Well, we put her in the paddock next to the road. Took a while, but she's all okay with it now.

Cops don't like to approach people with guns because they are generally waving them around at a (potential) crime scene. Our neighbors have wandered over occasionally and said, 'What are you shooting?' (meaning what type of gun are you firing?)

When we first moved here, we were blowing stumps and Mr. Midge got a little happy with the amount of dynamite. It brought the neighbor over with a chunk of stump in his hand. We were extremely apologetic.

People who are afraid of guns and gun owners often have never handled a gun and generally have their perceptions of gun owners formed by news reports and movies. Literally millions and millions of rounds are fired every year with no ill effect. When I was attempting to compete, a couple hundred rounds a week was the norm.

Alexie

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:53 AM

yes, maybe the OP could have worded it better

but when your brains have been addled by the sheer rudeness and dangerous behaviour of the swines who live next door to you wording things well is not always that easy :o

also the fence is a great idea

i'm afraid it'll get tit-for-tat if you're not careful, and the people who win those kind of games are the ones who are prepared to do the worst things IME :o

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 24, 2008, 08:56 AM

People who are afraid of guns and gun owners often have never handled a gun and generally have their perceptions of gun owners formed by news reports and movies. Literally millions and millions of rounds are fired every year with no ill effect. When I was attempting to compete, a couple hundred rounds a week was the norm.

I'm not afraid of guns... but I am smart when I am thinking of approaching 3 rednecks who have not been too easy to deal with in the past...

I have guns... I can't even tell you how many are in this house... or in my barn!! I'm not afraid to shoot them and hell, I have even had a POLICE weapon pointed in my face before. Did I pee my pants, nope!

Did you hear the news last night... An officer was pulling over a guy near the 14th street bridge... and got shot in the chest. Makes me wonder... why do police have their hand on their weapon when going up to a vehicle?? Not because they are scared of it, but because it's smart to do. You never know what the other person is gonna do or if they forgot to take their Paxil that day!!!!!

I'm off to polish my halo some more..... I've got the girl across the street coming over to use my round pen and then another neighbor coming over to teach a lesson in my ring...... then off to helping the other neighbor finish packing for the movers. Oh yeah and I better not forget to take the boxes I had to pick up for him last night......

LaBonnieBon

Sep. 24, 2008, 09:08 AM

:eek::eek: You beyotch!!! You GAVE hay away? You charged me freakin' $2 a bale!!!! That's it.....it's over!!! You are NOT my friend and you are THE worst neighbor anyone could have!!!!:mad:

:winkgrin::lol:

Oops... I'm busted! :lol: Hopefully Miss Patty does not come on here and tell you about the hay we sold her hay for $1 a bale.... but she had to pick it up out of the field! Or Chris to tell you we gave them 1/2 our hay loft... and even delivered it!!! It's highway robbery, I know. I should be "shot"! :eek::lol:

justdandy

Sep. 24, 2008, 09:30 AM

Oops... I'm busted! :lol: Hopefully Miss Patty does not come on here and tell you about the hay we sold her hay for $1 a bale.... but she had to pick it up out of the field! Or Chris to tell you we gave them 1/2 our hay loft... and even delivered it!!! It's highway robbery, I know. I should be "shot"! :eek::lol:

You are so off the Christmas list!!!!!!!

BTW....I'm pretty much set with hay, but if you need to unload anymore hay, let me know. Like I've told you before....I'd rather give you guys the moolah than someone else.;):D

arabhorse2

Sep. 24, 2008, 09:42 AM

I think this sudden gun loveness has something to do with it being an elections year. I swear even Arabhorse2 slammed another poster just a few months ago for being so pro gun:confused:

I don't think that was me equinelaw, because I don't remember it. Plus, it would go against my belief that anyone without a felony criminal record should be able to own a gun. :confused:

But then, I'm gettin' old and don't always remember what I had for breakfast, so it's possible. :lol:

As Misty pointed out, I've had guns for a very long time. I've taken firearm safety classes, and try to practice on a regular basis to keep up my skill level.

Guns are useful tools, but you have to respect them and remember what they were made for; to kill things. I don't get a rush from shootin' varmints, but I do take satisfaction that my aim is pretty good and they don't suffer.

Some of the locals like to shoot off their guns come the 4th of July, as well as on New Year's Eve. It's annoying, but as long as they're on their own property, I find it a minor irritant.

One of my neighbors about 40 acres over has a band, and they practice in his garage. They crank the speakers up loud, and usually practice until 10:00 or 11:00 at night. I find that annoying at times too, but they're not hurting anything, and I don't go to bed until 11:00 most nights anyway.

With fireworks, as long as they have a permit, I have nothing to say. Shooting off fireworks without a permit is illegal in Virginia. Even then, I probably wouldn't turn 'em in unless they were shooting them toward my property.

MSP

Sep. 24, 2008, 10:51 AM

Wow! I guess I am late to this thread and have to confess I could only skim the post.

My 2 cents!

Non horsey folks may not have a clue that horses are flighty animals. So it might be a good idea to have a friendly talk with your neighbor and ask them if they could holler at you when they are planning on doing some target practice so you can put the horses in stalls to minimize injuries. I actually understand your concern and I would like the same consideration from my neighbors.

In my development we have a covenant that states we can not shoot fire arms on our property. However my neighbor some times has one too many (on a daily basis) and around deer season he seems to find thing to shoot at in his pond. :rolleyes:

My first ride on my filly after coming back from the trainers last year he started shooting into the pond, I had just mounted. My filly didn't react at all but I did ride out where he could see me and wave. He stopped. I think you should just improve your relationship with your neighbor and you would be happier.

With out a covenant or some other legal restriction you can not demand your neighbor stop shooting so better to ask for some cooperation. Getting your horses used to the gun fire would be a good idea.

I am a gun owner, I was raised in a gun shop (my father had a gun shop in the house) and have been shooting since I was a child. Muzzle-loaders are loud and Smokey and probably the hardest gun for a horse to become accustomed with but my father and I always shot in our back yard and never had a problem with the horses.

I think the problem is learning to get along with your neighbor more than a gun issue.

2DogsFarm

Sep. 24, 2008, 11:35 AM

Sorry but I have to agree with the posters saying "deal"
I'm a former Big City gal and a lot of "country" stuff is new to me, but I figure I'm the newcomer and I have to learn to get along as long as it's not endangering me or my horses. If I'm worried by something, I ask for an explanation.

I do have neighbors who target practice and my horses have learned to ignore the loud noises coming from across the road. I feel worse for the neighbor whose land adjoins the shooter's as the practice sometimes goes on into the night.

Apropos of nothing: one neighbor thought it was her business to let me know motorcyles were zooming past my pasture (it fronts a road) and she was worried it would scare the horses. I let her know if it did, they could retreat to the end of the pasture farthest from the road.
Same neighbor then celebrated 4th of July with a noisy display in her front yard..... which is directly across the road from the pasture.
Um - and that wasn't supposed to be scary because?????
When I went to check the horses they were fine, even watching some of the fireworks.

Also FWIW:
A new subdivision here is bordered by a public woods, open to hunting. The new homeowners had conniptions last year when hunting season opened because people were shooting(!?!?) in the woods.
:rolleyes:

Auventera Two

Sep. 24, 2008, 11:48 AM

Its loud, rude, dangerous and every now and then they shoot each other. They shoot mostly before, during and after some social event and I have no doubt booze is involved.

So what do you care?! :confused: Ignorant ass idiots shootin' each other up. Just leaves more in the social security fund for everybody else. Just give them all guns and cure the overpopulation problem.

Auventera Two

Sep. 24, 2008, 11:53 AM

Also FWIW:
A new subdivision here is bordered by a public woods, open to hunting. The new homeowners had conniptions last year when hunting season opened because people were shooting(!?!?) in the woods.
:rolleyes:

My dad and I went on a trail ride along a former railroad bed last year on opening day of gun season. We thought it would be FINE because this is a public trail running through SUBDIVISIONS and TOWNS fercripesake. That's why we chose that trail - perfectly beautiful day for riding and all the hunters were in the woods.

We didn't get a mile when two ear splitting rifle shots fired, and a wounded doe crashed out of the woods and across the trail in front of us. We looked around, completely stunned, because there were HOUSES on either side of the trail! We saw blaze orange walking through the little strip of woods between the trail and the back yards of the subdivision. We decided to turn around and go back to the trailer. :lol: (For what it's worth, my nutty hot 4 yr old Arab hardly flinched, even though I let out a shriek and jumped halfway out of my saddle. She hears gunshot at home year round and couldn't care less. I might have had broken bones if the horse reared and bolted through the woods.) There's a LOT to be said about desensitization and training.

Good god you could get shot right in town on a public trail in the backyard of a subdivision. Gotta love WI, the hunting capital of the world. This year I'll stick to my arena for a few days.

Auventera Two

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:01 PM

equinelaw

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:14 PM

"I know in my neighborhood there are fully automatic weapons. Thst not deer hunters and its not even legal. I am not going ot call the police beucase I am afraid of peopel with fullly automatic weapons."

You've gotta' change your name and take "law" out of it...you really don't have a clue except for emotion.

Automatic weapons are legal (except in 3 states or so). No crime has ever been committed with a legally registered Class 3 gun...ever! These guns cost more than your horse probably does and are highly regulated and the "stamp" to even own one costs $200. You can't hunt with them...so what?

P.S. Spell check, use it.

Wow! Its kind of nostolgic. Its been over ayear since anyone got all emtional and used spelling as an excuse for no argument. I did not realize I missed those times:)

It should be a bumper sticker! "My gun costs more then your horse!"

The justifaction for jumping down OPs throat was that poeple hunt and need self protection. I can agree with those reasons as long as the places and times for blasting away are reasonable.

If they need an fully automatic weapon perhaps what they really need is Viagra? FULLY. WAs that spelled worng so you couldn't read it?

I am emotional and there is no prohibition against that in the law. Its also why I do not own guns. I know I would use them. FULLY automatic weapons are against FEDERAL law in all states. Th eare not welcome and not needed for civilians. Guess your emotions get the better of you?

2DogsFarm

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:18 PM

I thought it was only me! :lol::lol::lol:

Got a damn fine passage going past those evil black cows. :winkgrin:

I see your Black Devil Cows and raise you.....
Quail!
Used to trailride past a breeding box full of baby quail
Ask Vern: those little puffballs can strip a 16h 1100# horse to the bone in milliseconds!!! :eek:

MSP

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:43 PM

Wow! Its kind of nostolgic. Its been over ayear since anyone got all emtional and used spelling as an excuse for no argument. I did not realize I missed those times:)

It should be a bumper sticker! "My gun costs more then your horse!"

The justifaction for jumping down OPs throat was that poeple hunt and need self protection. I can agree with those reasons as long as the places and times for blasting away are reasonable.

If they need an fully automatic weapon perhaps what they really need is Viagra? FULLY. WAs that spelled worng so you couldn't read it?

I am emotional and there is no prohibition against that in the law. Its also why I do not own guns. I know I would use them. FULLY automatic weapons are against FEDERAL law in all states. Th eare not welcome and not needed for civilians. Guess your emotions get the better of you?

The average person wouldn't know fully automatic from a semi or non-automatic gun if they got hit on the head by one. You need a class III license to own a fully automatic gun so they are not that common. You like many others are confusing assault style rifles with automatics.

For example, 95%+ of AR15s and AK47s that are owned by the average Joe or Janet are semi-automatic. They are used for target practice and because people have fun shooting them.

SmartAlex

Sep. 24, 2008, 12:59 PM

I have a question relevant to this discussion...

My husband and I were discussing this last night as we took our evening walk past our "bad Neighbor". You know the kind...
Lives in the city
Buys beautiful bucolic farm
Uses front yard of farm for friends to dump "clean fill" (in an amount clearly against zoning laws)
Adds on to everything in every direction without building permits.
Uses farm for unattended bonfires to burn plastics and mattresses and construction waste (clearly against DEC regs)
Lets numerous Neopolitan Mastiffs to run loose and unattended on farm (to keep the drug task forceout of the barn)
Shoots and runs ATVs an whoops and hollers well into the night and then goes home to quiet bed in city.

And yes, we have reported the valid and relevant violations to the appropriate (albeit seemingly unconcerned) authorities. My husband is a retired police officer, so he knows the laws and has more than the usual dose of tolerance and "live and let live" attitude. We have shot the dogs when they were off their property threatening bodily harm to humans. We have been to court. We have made depositions. We have filed paperwork. We have used what laws were available to try to eliminate the outright illegal behavior and have put up and shut up with the stuff that is merely rude and annoying according to our personal standards. And yes, we are on the verge of becoming pig farmers out of pure spite.

Anyway, we were wondering. Have neighbors always been inconsiderate idiots, or is this a modern invention? And shouldn't there be some sort of system invented so the idiots could live next to each other and the "good neighbors" could live in peace and get along. I guess I am beginning to see the purpose of the gated community. ....sigh

2bayboys

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:03 PM

I tell the policeman that we have an 80 acre farm that is a business.... and that guy has less than an acre lot...

I believe that the above statement from the OP's first post is the reason that most people have felt justified in "jumping down her throat". It implies that her superior acreage gives her more rights than that of her neighbors, to whom she referred in a later post as "rednecks".

Them's fightin' words where I come from. :D

equinelaw

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:07 PM

Gee. I though it had something to do with having to pull the trigger before each shot. Is that not correct or do we have to re-write the federal laws? Maybe it is really confusing if having to pull the trigger is too much for the average American.

Its really simple. OP said there is no law and why???? Most often responses fell into 3 catagories

1) there is no law

2) I have guns and I use them safely

3) Your horse should get used to it.

What I did, (and this is closed captioned for the reading impared) was agree with her that yes, that sucks, no there is no law, and yes, the laws at present do have lots of reasons why there could be a law and the public polices behind those laws. I tried to adress her question and help her find a solution.

Then many comparsisons between the shooting neighbors and other noises, both natural and unatural were made.

However, the main point is that it is very common and perfectly reasonable to have laws to prevent noise.

If OP wants one where she lives she can do something about it and try and get one passed as to time, place and distance from others. Harrasing livestock is seen by the courts to be bad. You would think it would also be seen to be bad my horseowners, but they are having too much fun shooting dogs that harrass livestock to care.

Now I have to go play with my nuclear arsonal that the second ammendment says I can own.

Trakehner

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:10 PM

"If they need an fully automatic weapon perhaps what they really need is Viagra? FULLY. WAs that spelled worng so you couldn't read it?

I am emotional and there is no prohibition against that in the law. Its also why I do not own guns. I know I would use them. FULLY automatic weapons are against FEDERAL law in all states. Th eare not welcome and not needed for civilians. Guess your emotions get the better of you?"

Once again...your ignorance is showing. Class 3 weapons are legal (machine guns & destructive devices) in almost all states.

Viagra and guns? Do you ride because you get off on your horse twixt your legs? A comment just as equally as stupid and inaccurate.

"Needed for civilians"...need has nothing to do with rights or legality. Once again, just because you don't like something doesn't mean other people can't enjoy them...or are somehow lacking in something if they do.

...as far as spelling and punctuation...I guess it does fit your argument.

tidy rabbit

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:16 PM

Anyway, we were wondering. Have neighbors always been inconsiderate idiots, or is this a modern invention? And shouldn't there be some sort of system invented so the idiots could live next to each other and the "good neighbors" could live in peace and get along. I guess I am beginning to see the purpose of the gated community. ....sigh

There's plenty of jackasses in gated communities too. There's really no escape. Your only hope is to move HERE: http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/061129/061129_unabomberhome_bcol_330a.standard.jpg <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< that's good old Ted K.s cabin.

equinelaw

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:20 PM

I simply do not know why you think fully automatic weapons are legal. Is that a brand new law? It certainly has not been the law forever.

I am not going to look it up. I am not that interested, but if fully automatic weapons are now legal thats just stupid. There is no reason for that in any way, shape or form.

That would be a sad thing to see in the hands of a homcidal student or mall killer.

goeslikestink

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:22 PM

TALK to them, ok so there was three people at that time, so talk when the owner is there by himself, and come up with a plan that suits both ie a warning flag red means shooting going on
blue means none, etc

like i said you both have to live there so be ameanble to both parties that way none selfish acts will interefere with the other

calling police is only going to make things worse so work something out between yourselves that will work
thats what i mean by usng your brians you cant win fights with fisty cuffs

use your head make a peice offering they are your neighbours, andto be honest it could work in your favour id you away or something and someone lurks they will inform you
as each is a nieghbour hood watchman of there property like if you saw someone of not a regualar visitor
you have to live there and so do they so try and make it work in harmony

BCLINGER

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:22 PM

Lbb: I wouldn't let those "rednecks" use my round pen - who knows what diseases they have? I Might help them pack though. You're clearly a better person than me.

riverbell93

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:24 PM

However, the main point is that it is very common and perfectly reasonable to have laws to prevent noise.

True. I personally believe, though, that it's a hard sell. Dumb people love noise, and dumb people make noise, so dumb people and their noise are usually here to stay.

Anyway, we were wondering. Have neighbors always been inconsiderate idiots, or is this a modern invention? And shouldn't there be some sort of system invented so the idiots could live next to each other and the "good neighbors" could live in peace and get along.

I'd rather cull them, but I guess that would technically be bad. Herding them together sounds good, but is there a moat big enough to keep that herd away from the rest of us? I've had the surreal experience of having multiple nightmare neighbors and believe me, putting them together is a mistake. Thery get into all sorts of mischief.

2bayboys

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:33 PM

Everythingbutwings

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:33 PM

Wow, just Wow.

LaBonnieBon, get your pigs but I'd also recommend some peacocks and guinea fowl.

Wow.

Good neighbors are a treasure, I'm sorry that yours aren't more approachable.

equinelaw

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:38 PM

The argument over the legality or illegality of fully automatic weapons is pointless here. The OP's neighbors were not firing automatic weapons. They were LEGALLY firing their legally owned weapons on their OWN property.

She didn't like it. Suggested there should be a law to protect her. There isn't. By posting on this board she invited others to agree or disagree with her point of view. It should not be a surprise to anybody that a topic discussing gun ownership and property rights is so volatile.

Thats is very true. But they did not discuss it. They slammed her for even mentioning it and made comparisons to things to relevant.

This thread is more of a trainwreck then the OP's post should have ellicted. I mentioned that before. Is there some current issue that has put people on edge about property and gun rights this week?

Many mostly polite people are defending utter rudeness. It is not consistant with their normal behavior.

trubandloki

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:43 PM

The justifaction for jumping down OPs throat was that poeple hunt and need self protection. I can agree with those reasons as long as the places and times for blasting away are reasonable.

Um wrong.

The justification for jumping down the OPs throat are multiple. The primary being that she comes off as a pompous snob with her comments about her having land and the neighbor not and because of this he is not allowed to do on his land anything that might interfere with her using her land any way she wants to.

And target shooting is a hobby and a sport for many, just like horses. People are allowed to legally enjoy their hobby on their land with out having the cops called on them.

Many mostly polite people are defending utter rudeness. It is not consistant with their normal behavior.

What?

Utter rudeness? How is enjoying some target practice on ones own land utter rudeness? If anything the OP was the rude one.

I guess in your world a farmer is rude if they happen to be harvesting while someone it trying to do something sound sensitive on some piece of property near by?

BCLINGER

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:49 PM

TRUBANDLOKI you must be a "redneck". Do you need any hay?

trubandloki

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:52 PM

TRUBANDLOKI you must be a "redneck". Do you need any hay?

Well obviously I am, and yes I could use some hay!

Equinelaw and the OP are sounding like my neighbor who watches us thru the hedge row and promptly appears in our driveway to complain any time we do anything he perceives as us ruining HIS piece of the country (we happen to own more land than he does but heck, what does that matter). I am talking about normal things like mowing not soon enough (per him) or cutting the grass too short (per him) or using the chain saw for too many hours in the day, or leaving the brush pile there too long, etc. It does not matter what we do, it is wrong in his eyes. So I have much experience with neighbors like the OP.

Edit to add - I am risking my red neck status though. All the vehicles on my property that do not run are fully insured and have a current registration.

arabhorse2

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:54 PM

I'm a Redneck-In-Training. Does that count? ;) :lol:

I fear that I might be considered a poseur with some of the locals though, since I have all my teeth, don't need a man to "take care of me", don't have any cars up on cinder blocks, have only one dog, and work outside the home to afford my horse addiction. :winkgrin:

BCLINGER

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:58 PM

ARABHORSE2: Sorry you're such a hayseed, but if you ever need any help packing, you know who to call

tidy rabbit

Sep. 24, 2008, 01:59 PM

Oh my gawd, I might be a redneck??? I would never have guessed that about myself!

I work from home.
I have an old 8N tractor in the barn that doesnt run at the moment.
I have dump truck, I've even been seen driving it.
I have 3 dogs, all of them cross breeds, 1 even has some pitbull in it.
I have some porcelain crowns.
I do like my man to take of me.
I have a pregnent mare loose and grazing on my front lawn right this very moment.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

trubandloki

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:01 PM

Tidy Rabbit I think the porcelain crowns might opt you out. Hopefully you have enough points with the other things but that much proper tooth care might really be an issue. Plus, if you are going to go for crowns they must be gold.

philosoraptor

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:05 PM

trubandloki

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:10 PM

MayS I must have missed where this neighbor was shooting every day at all hours. The OP complained about one situation in the middle of the day. Not a midnight shoot out, not the neighbor opening an illegal business (gun club).

If the neighbor had done any of those things there would have been laws against it.

BTW, in my state fireworks are illegal.

I truly hope many of you never develop a hobby that requires you to make any noise during the day.

2bayboys

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:13 PM

But the OP didn't ask why won't the neighbors be more considerate?

The OP asked why aren't there laws to protect me from this? As long as the neighbor is shooting within the parameters of *already established laws* that govern the practice, then the OP needs to find another solution to the problem other than calling the police. Many have already posted their excellent suggestions.

BCLINGER

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:15 PM

MAYS: Neighborly consideration could start with not calling your nieghbors "rednecks", then posting about all the alms lady bountiful bestows on the ignernt masses

tidy rabbit

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:15 PM

I have a neighbor whos house is on 1 & 1/2 acres, cut out of my property line. He is most definately a redneck. He hunts with both bows and guns I guess. When we bought this property he came over and asked if he could continue to hunt in our woods. We said no.

One day, he was hunting in our woods anyways. I was trail riding and he scared the crap out of my horse, I almost came off and I saw him in his cam-o gear disappear into the woods. I got my husband and went back into the woods looking for him. I made a big stink about nearly getting killed. I haven't had seen him out there again. Doesn't mean he's not there trespassing but I've never seen him again.

He also, occassionally comes out of his back door and fires one or two shots from a shotgun and goes back inside. I have NO IDEA WHAT SERIES OF EVENTS LEADS TO THIS! I can't understand it. Maybe one of you gun totten' folks could explain this for me?

His little ones ride dirt bikes on a little track in their woods. The dirt bikes do actually make me crazy, they are so loud and they go so slow! Whatever, we have motorcycles and 4 wheelers too. The one up side to this is that the horses have gotten very desensitized to all this craziness. So it's been good free training.

I have one gold crown way in the back... does that count?

amdfarm

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:17 PM

Feathers...that's all I'm picturing. :eek: I'd be impressed that someone could hit a fast moving dove with a muzzie...small speedy birds and large semi-accurate weapon. I never did get into black powder...at my size it's like a dwarf trying to fire a hand-held cannon.
I think baseball is supposed to be as American as apple pie. FWIW...that sport is like watching paint dry to me.

Exactly!! :eek: If you could even hit the darned thing! :winkgrin: I didn't get into black powder either and for that very reason, plus they're a PITA the clean. Want to take a bath, nope, gotta wait until the barrel of the muzzleloader is done first. :o My late husband deer hunted w/ one every so often. The powder horns are cool though. :)

Agree about baseball, too. ;)

Midge

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:32 PM

If they need an fully automatic weapon perhaps what they really need is Viagra? FULLY. WAs that spelled worng so you couldn't read it?

I am emotional and there is no prohibition against that in the law. Its also why I do not own guns. I know I would use them. FULLY automatic weapons are against FEDERAL law in all states. Th eare not welcome and not needed for civilians. Guess your emotions get the better of you?

Full auto (Title II weapons) are NOT against federal law. They are regulated by state law. There are most assuredly welcome by what are generally referred to as 'stamp collectors' because one has to jump through a million or so hoops and pay $200 bucks to get the stamp that allows one to purchase a Title II weapon from a Class 3 dealer. The only restriction to Title II guns is no new ones may be added to the NFA Registry. Limited supply now means only rich folk have Title II weapons.

Once again, what does 'not needed' have to do with anything? Are we not allowed to own anything that is not needed?

Midge

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:36 PM

\He also, occassionally comes out of his back door and fires one or two shots from a shotgun and goes back inside. I have NO IDEA WHAT SERIES OF EVENTS LEADS TO THIS! I can't understand it. Maybe one of you gun totten' folks could explain this for me?

Could be a number of things. If he is reloading his own ammuntion (sort of like self care, rather than the full care box of cartridge you buy at the store) he may be testing his loads. He could be adjusting the sights. He could have a new gun and is taking it for it's first ride.

MSP

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:38 PM

SmartAlex

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:45 PM

There's plenty of jackasses in gated communities too. There's really no escape. Your only hope is to move HERE: http://msnbcmedia2.msn.com/j/msnbc/Components/Photos/061129/061129_unabomberhome_bcol_330a.standard.jpg <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< that's good old Ted K.s cabin.

I’m beginning to see method in good old Ted K’s madness.

I'd rather cull them, but I guess that would technically be bad. Herding them together sounds good, but is there a moat big enough to keep that herd away from the rest of us? I've had the surreal experience of having multiple nightmare neighbors and believe me, putting them together is a mistake. They get into all sorts of mischief.

Good point!

There just ought to be some kind of law against rudeness and stupidity. The "does not play well with others" award.
One time one of our "less than good" neighbor's called the cops on us for some late night revelry. See, I admit we get a little loud ourselves now and then. My husband went over, knocked on his door, apologised and suggested next time we disturbed him to please call or come over and just let us know.
Months later, he got tired of us cutting trees to clear land, and came of to let us know at the top of his lungs all the way down the driveway how GDed bleepity bleep sick and tired he was of all the noise. Some people got no couth. He most certainly has a pig pen in his future.

MistyBlue

Sep. 24, 2008, 02:54 PM

To those who see nothing wrong with a neighbor shooting guns off right along a fenceline...question for you: would you feel the same way if it was someone using explosives to blow things up for fun? What if the neighbor on a little lot opens up a gun range for daily use and people are shooting constantly?

It wouldn't bother me if my neighbor was using legal explosives, but here in CT the only legal sized explosives are the size of roman candles. I did go over to my neighbors 3 summers ago and talk to their lads about setting off 1/4 sticks of dynamite under metal drums for fun. That happens to be a *lot* louder than a rifle or shotgun...not to mention right after I heard the boom...a drum came flying out of the sky and landed in my woods. :eek: :lol: Almost had to change my underwear after that one, LOL! I marched over there, read those boys the riot act and talked to their mom. Being semi-rural we all know each other pretty well and she was already planning on reading her own riot act to the boys. That was illegal sized explosives.
As for a gun range...I purposely bought property that can't have that type of business put in next door. About 1/4 mile away it could though...which wouldn't bother me. Actually a rifle range probably wouldn't bother me overly much either...last place I boarded was right near one. Took 48 hours for all horses to become completely comfie with the noise.
Curious if you all would feel the same way if the gunfire was late at night, waking you up? He has a right to use his gun. If you can't sleep, whose problem is it?
That's comparing apples to oranges...repeated gunfore at night is illegal in most areas after certain hours. He does not have the legal right to do so. The neighbor in this situation does have the legal right to fire during the day.
Why is it a capital offense for a dog to chase a horse and spook it... but if a human spooks it over and over from a distance with noise, that's ok?

The dog is on my property and directly going after my horses. A human firing a gun within hearing distance is staying on his property and not doing something specifically to frighten my horses. There are many horses that would spook over logging work being done. I know my neighbor's horses weren't fond of when we were clearing our property after we bought it. 3 straight 12 hour days of chainsaws, axes, extremely loud cracking noises when trees started going down and huge crashes as they slammed into the ground. It was LOUD. And scary. Then for the next 3 days there was some small blasting of stumps and ledge. So the legal noise on my property was spooking the heck out of her horses. Do I purchase a property and then never bring my horses home because the noise of clearing it will spook neighboring horses the first day or so?
It is a complicated issue. This is why areas do have zoning and ordinances. There is such a thing as a nuisance from a neighbor creating too much noise. Noise is one reason why land is zoned differently.

Yes, noise is a reason land is zoned certain ways. But if the OP is in a rural, farm or industrial zone then noise is not illegal. We have to take the good with the bad...I want the room and less humans and less expensive land and less expensive taxes of living in a rural zone. I'm actually zoned rural residential, so we do have certain noise rules but not many. Gunfire is allowed. Constant barking dogs after 9 pm isn't. As stated before, there is a reason I bought land where I did. I researched and waited for a property to come up in an area and zone that had laws I could live with. Some I might not be thrilled with, but them's the laws for this area and I knew that coming in. If a person is living in urban, suburbaban/residential zoning they're understandably not going to understand that certain things not allowed in those zones are allowed in other zones. You can't move into a rural or farm zone and then complain you want the laws changed to suit that one person's enjoyment of their property better, when most other people moved into that zone in order to do what's annoying another.
It's not about horsepeople demanding the world change. It's about neighbors being a little considerate towards other neighbors.
I do agree with this 100%...neighbors should be considerate towards each other. As much and as often as they can be. Also, as long as thier consideration isn;t ruining their own enjoyment of thier property. I won't mow my lawn, weedwack, blow leaves or run the chainsaw before 9 am in consideration of my neighbors. But I'm not letting my property go to crap if they don't want to hear noise ever. Just like clearing my property, I bought here and moved here to have my horses home. I knew the clearing would bother my neighbor's horses (one is old and blind) and so I did go and warn her and apologize in advance. her horses did go bonkers for the first day and half. Was I supposed to stop? The more a horse is exposed to things...the less it bothers them. It's actually better for the horse to become despooked to certain things than to constantly protect them from every little thing. My late mare spooked at everything, there was no fixing it for her, she was just a nervous wreck no matter what. She hated fireworks...certain ones are legal here and every 4th of July I had a week or two of her freaking out. I had to deal with it, it was MY problem, not the neighbors' problems and I wasn't about to tell them they couldn't use the legal fireworks because it scared my horse. Yes, it was inconvenient and annoying to have to sit in my barn every night for two weeks keeping her as calm as possible but that's what I had to do. All I did ask of the neighbors was to not fire them off after 10 pm so I could get some sleep, I asked nicely in advance, brought baked goods and they honored my request.
Being a considerate neighbor goes both ways when there's a noise issue that's spooking horses. It's just as inconsiderate for the person with the horses to expect the noisemakers to never make noise because it bothers the horses as it is to be making noise.

pAin't_Misbehavin'

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:04 PM

Quail!
Used to trailride past a breeding box full of baby quail
Ask Vern: those little puffballs can strip a 16h 1100# horse to the bone in milliseconds!!! :eek:

Vern is absolutely correct, and you were lucky to have someone with such finely honed instincts to protect you from the pint-sized pterodactyls. I know, I had to raise a clutch of baby quail once for an employer. By the time the little monsters were the size of a peach I couldn't go near them without thick leather gloves. When pecking my gloves got them nowhere, they'd fly at my face and try to flog me.

I can't imagine wanting to make a law against shooting in the country.:lol: And anyway, isn't it good to find out what your horses are scared of while you're not riding them, so you can work on getting them over it before the next hack turns into an E-ticket experience?

axl

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:20 PM

Blkarab

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:22 PM

My trainer's neighbors shoot off their black powder rifles all of the time, and the horses are now very used to it. I flinch more than they do, even my spooky arab mare. Her 4 year old, doesn't even flinch now. What really gets them going, it the neighbors tandem plane. When he flies over the barn, they will look up at the weird contraption in the sky :eek::winkgrin:

2DogsFarm

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:35 PM

[quote=pAin't_Misbehavin';3539139]By the time the little monsters were the size of a peach I couldn't go near them without thick leather gloves. When pecking my gloves got them nowhere, they'd fly at my face and try to flog me. [quote]

Wow...who knew?
Next time I'll thank the Old Guy for saving me once again.
He's also afeared of carts - what should I do if I ever realize my dream of getting a driving pony???

tidy rabbit

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:46 PM

tidyrabbit-maybe your neighbor has groundhogs? Because that's why I go out the back door and fire a couple of rounds every once in a while :yes:
also, just wondering, is your pregnant mare barefoot? Because that affects your redneck status :lol:

Ground hogs could absolutely be the reason! My dogs killed all them hogs 'round here; maybe the survivors relocated to the neighbors place?

Said mare has front shoes but they are coming off for the winter mid Nov.

okggo

Sep. 24, 2008, 03:51 PM

I've got neighbors on three sides of me shooting off guns and letting people dove hunt on their 100+ acres. Some times very very close. At the really loud ones, occassionally one of our guys will pick up a head or flick an ear, but mostly they ignore it. I think it is really important to get horses used to loud and scary things so they don't freak out as easily.

I used to ride a horse in a neighborhood that was very quiet, neighborhood, cul-de-sac and peaceful, no commotion. I remember riding him one day and the neighbors turned their sprinkler on. You know the noise, PHHHHHHT PHT PHT PHT and the horse literally laid a golden egg. Neighbors apologized profusely and I told them not to be sorry at all, that the horse needed to get used to that and to please put the sprinkler back on!!

I guess really, if they had seen your horses freaking out the nice thing to do would have been to talk to you, but they really didn't need to. Since you now know it is an issue with your stock, ask them when they plan to shoot next and intentionally take your horses out near the noise!

We had a wood chipper in the pasture the other day, those things are loud and spit and lord help you when a big log goes through. Our 5 month old filly was right next to us "helping" and we just figured it is b/c we try to expose them to as much as possible.

Anyway, sorry your horse got hurt, but if this is really a problem for you 1. get your horses used to it and 2. make nice with your gun toting neighbors and see if you can reach some kind of compromise.