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View Full Version : Spin Off: Where was Klaus Balkenhol



freestyle2music
Aug. 24, 2008, 12:27 PM
It's not a secret that I am a fan of Courtney and Mythilus. When you read my posts of many months back you can all read that CK and Mythilus were my favourites (and still are). But it was also obvious that already during the GP she already had some problems with the "getting short in the neck", which was (toooo) extremely punished by some of the judges.

I really expected that Klaus had solved this problem before the GPS and the FTM, like i saw Johann Hinemann do this with Ferro. But in the GPS and FTM the problem got bigger and bigger. So where was Klaus ? Was he busy negotiating his contract with Russia, Spain or Sweden :D

egontoast
Aug. 24, 2008, 12:49 PM
Don't know but it is interesting that everyone makes a huge fuss about 'where was sjef?" but no one worries about the location of other SOs and trainers when other riders finish. :confused:

Who cares where the SO/trainer of a rider is when someone medals? The rider did well or didn't do well .

Only people looking for something to WHINE about make a big issue about this.

passagedreamer
Aug. 24, 2008, 12:58 PM
Think Klaus is moving on. But that was coming long ago.

But the coach can't make the change happen over night. Courtney had a beautiful GP but she has ALWAYS had that horse too short in the neck.And I thought the judging was fair for her and they need to punish the short neck. At times, you can't put a piece of paper between his neck and chin. But than when she has him up and out on the short sides and it looks beautiful. He was short in the neck in CA and he is a very strong horse ( and the horse had down time in Hong Kong due to shipping sickness ) and it doesn't look like the easiest neck to ride. Once she is able to ride him up and out thru the whole test and all the movements, than she will get the scores !

Dune
Aug. 24, 2008, 01:05 PM
Have NO idea about Klaus, not even any juicy rumors floating around, but I'm glad to see that you also appreciated this pair. Once they get that issue sorted out they are a pair to watch out for!:yes::cool:

Mardi
Aug. 24, 2008, 03:09 PM
yes, they are a beautiful pair. Very elegant.

hsheffield
Aug. 24, 2008, 03:19 PM
I have heard that KB's USEF contract expires this year and that it's not expected that he'll be rehired.

Has anyone else heard this?

Seems a shame...

DownYonder
Aug. 24, 2008, 04:43 PM
Look for Robert Dover to be hired as the next US coach.

XHalt
Aug. 24, 2008, 05:49 PM
Look for Robert Dover to be hired as the next US coach.

yup!

ise@ssl
Aug. 24, 2008, 06:40 PM
Oh please no - say it ain't so...........

slc2
Aug. 24, 2008, 06:45 PM
What's the matter with Robert Dover, ise? :lol:

I too think Balkenhol will be moving on. Too bad.

I don't really think there is much of a way to ride Mythilus except at least somewhat short in neck. I think it can get a little better, but I think it's part of the territory.

magdelene
Aug. 25, 2008, 02:20 AM
Herr Balkenhol signs new contracts with his past student Nadine Capellmann. Some say Bechtolsheimer too. I think he is staying in Germany now.

passagedreamer
Aug. 25, 2008, 08:33 AM
slc2 : if she can ride him up and out beautifully on the short sides, she can one day do it throughout the test. Strenght issue in both rider and horse ??!! Just a guess....

And No to Robert Dover, great guy but he is moving on and not doing much more with the Dressage world

And let's just go back to having a Chef' ..... Klaus got paid too much $$$ and got greedy with selling horses..... Team Chef' sounds good to me

TeddyRocks
Aug. 25, 2008, 11:19 AM
Oh please no - say it ain't so...........

Where is the comparison? Why would you "down grade" from KB to RD??? HELP us...

TeddyRocks
Aug. 25, 2008, 11:20 AM
And No to Robert Dover, great guy but he is moving on and not doing much more with the Dressage world

And let's just go back to having a Chef' ..... Klaus got paid too much $$$ and got greedy with selling horses..... Team Chef' sounds good to me

Oh please yes. This would be good...

DownYonder
Aug. 25, 2008, 11:45 AM
And No to Robert Dover, great guy but he is moving on and not doing much more with the Dressage world

And let's just go back to having a Chef' ..... Klaus got paid too much $$$ and got greedy with selling horses..... Team Chef' sounds good to me

He-he, I totally agree. On all points. ;)

canyonoak
Aug. 25, 2008, 11:54 AM
No, Team Chef is just not a good idea. It does not work.

There is no team when there is a Team Chef.

What works best in the US,at any rate, is having a Team Coach strong enough to gain the respect of the riders and organize a team effort.

IMHO

FEIwannabe
Aug. 25, 2008, 12:04 PM
What is a Team Chef?



Does he/she make lunch for the riders :winkgrin:

No really it's an honest question.

Mardi
Aug. 25, 2008, 01:03 PM
The full title is "Chef d'Equipe".
Which translates to Leader (or boss, or chief) of the Team.

It's the title USET gives to the coach of each team.

passagedreamer
Aug. 25, 2008, 02:11 PM
What I think we need is someone who has repsect within the FEI, who knows the ropes inside and out, who knows what the judges want in the ring, someone who will go to the FEI and support us ( if needed ).
Listen, we all ride and train up to the shows, once we get there, their is NOT MUCH a coach can do to change things. They are to help and guide you and make the most of what you have coming into the show.
My vote would be someone like Linda Zang or Alex Stiener ( that is IF they would want to do it )
And I feel that we or the US should just offer more "training programs or training sessions" whatever you want to call them.

Xhltsalute
Aug. 25, 2008, 03:34 PM
Ooooo............my vote would be for Axel too.

slc2
Aug. 25, 2008, 03:47 PM
"if she can ride him on the sides....strength issue"

yes, strength issue. the horse vs the rider, in the bridle.

shadowdancer
Aug. 27, 2008, 12:35 AM
Frankly, I'm astounded that KB was allowed to carry on with the profiteering he did in the United States for so long! He will "retire" as one of the richest policemen in the world. But coaching another country in Europe probably won't be an option for him. He is too well known over here.

Look for an American who has patriotic interests in promoting dressage in your country.

shadowdancer
Aug. 27, 2008, 12:36 AM
...and pray that nobody writes a book about his shenanigans.

CDE Driver
Aug. 27, 2008, 01:02 AM
The full title is "Chef d'Equipe".
Which translates to Leader (or boss, or chief) of the Team.

It's the title USET gives to the coach of each team.

I am no expert on the dressage team, I come from the driving world.

The driving teams have a Chef d' Equipe and a Coach. My understanding is the Chef d' Equipe is in charge of all the arrangements, equipment, knowing the rules and making sure the team gets to where they need to be with everything they need.

The coach is just that, the person that coaches the team, both before they leave in training camps and at the event.

It sounds like the USEF has different designations for the different disciplines.

ise@ssl
Aug. 27, 2008, 08:31 AM
CDE Driver - I tend to agree with you on the literal translation. But I suppose we could go down the list of Coach's or Chef D'equipe for our teams or other countries teams and we'd be hard pressed to find people without any conflict of interest.

slc2
Aug. 27, 2008, 08:59 AM
I think it is absolutely absurd to suggest any national coach DOESN'T profiteer while coaching.

In fact, coaches make most of their money buying and selling horses, like all trainers and instructors.

Come on. Let's have a wee bit of realism. It's business that people are in. Coaches are in this world to make money, just like everyone else - just like you and everyone else in the world.

Horses cost MILLIONS of dollars. You aren't ever going to get around this until the Olympic horses sell for five dollars apiece.

A certain American clinician I know, actually cut a lower level amateur's session to 20 minutes, so he could go in the house and show the clinic host videos of 'her next new horse' that she did not know she was going to buy. He was willing to cut someone's session short to sell a five thousand dollar horse, shadow, and make five hundred bucks. He would have been a lot MORE eager if the horse cost 500k.

This is not exactly something Klaus invented.

A friend of mine years ago took lessons from ANOTHER great European classicist who was brought over here to train the team and developing horses. There she was at Gladstone, riding around on her horse. Most of the time the BNT ignored everyone, and acted as if they were far, far beneath him, and most of the time, his wife actually did the coaching.

During the session, the coach kept remarking, BOY I REALLY LOVE YOUR HORSE.

They talked for a little while. Then the guy said, 'OH! I know why I like your horse so much! I just happen to have a full brother to him for sale. And he would win internationally'.

He doesn't even need to suggest gently this guy's current horse never would do that, which the rider already knows, as he knows the horse is becoming unsound, which the BNT can also see....and guess what? He will throw in free riding lessons for a month with the sale of the horse, special today, come on down.

The horse business is all about selling and commissions. People in the horse business, with few exceptions, do not have a salary. What they make, they make by selling. And buy low, sell high, isn't exactly a new business concept. One should not exactly be shocked to see an international trainer try to make some money.

What these guys at that level are selling, most of the time, is dreams. There is no real blue book for that.

ridgeback
Aug. 27, 2008, 10:06 AM
I think it is absolutely absurd to suggest any national coach DOESN'T profiteer while coaching.

In fact, coaches make most of their money buying and selling horses, like all trainers and instructors.

Come on. Let's have a wee bit of realism. It's business that people are in. Coaches are in this world to make money, just like everyone else - just like you and everyone else in the world.

Horses cost MILLIONS of dollars. You aren't ever going to get around this until the Olympic horses sell for five dollars apiece.

A certain American clinician I know, actually cut a lower level amateur's session to 20 minutes, so he could go in the house and show the clinic host videos of 'her next new horse' that she did not know she was going to buy. He was willing to cut someone's session short to sell a five thousand dollar horse, shadow, and make five hundred bucks. He would have been a lot MORE eager if the horse cost 500k.

This is not exactly something Klaus invented.

A friend of mine years ago took lessons from ANOTHER great European classicist who was brought over here to train the team and developing horses. There she was at Gladstone, riding around on her horse. Most of the time the BNT ignored everyone, and acted as if they were far, far beneath him, and most of the time, his wife actually did the coaching.

During the session, the coach kept remarking, BOY I REALLY LOVE YOUR HORSE.

They talked for a little while. Then the guy said, 'OH! I know why I like your horse so much! I just happen to have a full brother to him for sale. And he would win internationally'.

He doesn't even need to suggest gently this guy's current horse never would do that, which the rider already knows, as he knows the horse is becoming unsound, which the BNT can also see....and guess what? He will throw in free riding lessons for a month with the sale of the horse, special today, come on down.

The horse business is all about selling and commissions. People in the horse business, with few exceptions, do not have a salary. What they make, they make by selling. And buy low, sell high, isn't exactly a new business concept. One should not exactly be shocked to see an international trainer try to make some money.

What these guys at that level are selling, most of the time, is dreams. There is no real blue book for that.

Serioulsy SLC I have never seen anyone have an opinion on every subject don't you EVER leave this board and take a break for weeks or even months at a time?

Sure they make money but it's a bit sleazy when horse trainers make you buy one from them even though you have a perfectly nice horse.. I would love to hear what the German riders think of him when he was their coach and who got rid of him.

slc2
Aug. 27, 2008, 10:17 AM
yes, actually i do.

but seriously ridgeback why do yiou have so many opinions, don't you ever take a break from bit**ing about darfur and human rights here? why don't you go out and vote for a repulican, get some fast food, kill a baby seal, and smack a vegan over the head with it? :lol:

it is not my opinion at all of what should happen (bemmelmans is my choice but very unlikely), it is an observation of what appears to be going on. if i had my way all top gp horses would be trained without any extreme methods, the winners would all look like reiner klimke and ahlerich, and horses would be marked on obedience and how quiet they were at the halt.

ridgeback
Aug. 27, 2008, 10:21 AM
seriously ridgeback don't you ever take a break from bit**ing about darfur and human rights here? why don't you go out and vote for a repulican, get some fast food, kill a baby seal, and smack a vegan over the head with it? :lol:

What are you talking about oh if you don't like my signature don't read it.. but i did change it for you:) I feel sorry for anyone who lives on this board it breaks my heart. :(:(:cry:

BahamaMama
Aug. 27, 2008, 10:51 AM
What are you talking about oh if you don't like my signature don't read it.. but i did change it for you:) I feel sorry for anyone who lives on this board it breaks my heart. :(:(:cry:

Ridgeback please leave this board. UDBB will welcome you :D

ridgeback
Aug. 27, 2008, 12:57 PM
Ridgeback please leave this board. UDBB will welcome you :D

Ahh do you think so:lol: Ok I will do whatever you say:lol::lol::lol:.. Hmmm only 39 posts now who are you really:lol::lol::lol: lets see maybe another alias of ????;) OH I get it now you were Moderator49trying to come on like you were a moderator of the board what happened did they nail you for it:)

freestyle2music
Aug. 27, 2008, 02:10 PM
Please Ridgeback don't go, because we can't do without your wisdom and unbiassed opinions. You always shine so many light on all these topics, and we really can't do without it.

ridgeback
Aug. 27, 2008, 02:18 PM
Please Ridgeback don't go, because we can't do without your wisdom and unbiassed opinions. You always shine so many light on all these topics, and we really can't do without it.

:lol::lol::lol: Can you say Kettle...I think I'm the 5th or more person that has said that to you:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol:...Theo do you have another alias again:lol: At least I don't get kicked off boards...Maybe you should take the advice I gave SLC, try taking a break from the board get a job or some outside activity it's not healthy to live on any forum.. Theo go back to ignoring me PLEASE

Gucci Cowgirl
Aug. 27, 2008, 03:06 PM
There is a HUGE difference between an "O" judge like Steiner or Zang, and an Olympic level trainer/rider/coach like Balkenhol or Boldt or Theodorescu.

We need a real "coach of Olympians", not a politically correct tour-bus driver.

Judge and teacher are very, very different positions with different responsibilities, and abilities.

Kareen
Aug. 27, 2008, 04:55 PM
v. well said Gucci Cowgirl. Trainer-wise I daresay Balkenhol didn't do too bad a job did he? As far as profit goes I think he did what he was allowed to get away with. Here people don't tolerate that much BN-BSing because there is more competition and less BN-hype. If someone threw the kind of money at me I guess I wouldn't throw it back either *LOL*

petitefilly
Aug. 27, 2008, 10:25 PM
...and pray that nobody writes a book about his shenanigans.

Hey! A book? Now there is something I'd buy! :):):):):):) All the dirt fit to print about dressage? The ends and outs of dressage worldwide? Who did who in, and why? It would be a best seller! Write the book!!!! :):):):):):)

DownYonder
Aug. 28, 2008, 07:01 AM
Does anyone remember when KB was hired as the U.S. coach?

ise@ssl
Aug. 28, 2008, 10:15 AM
Good God - if anyone attempted to print all the dirt in the Horse World it would be like a full set of Encyclopedia Britannica! AND MORE each year.

As far as a Dressage Coach for the US - I think it always comes back to the fact that our FEI riders often already work with someone and aren't always amenible to being coached by another person. We are such a huge country with riders in various regions - rarely are they at one place at the same time. It's rather the opposite in European countries. Look at Gladstone - it's our USET headquarter facility but rarely used now that it's surrounded by a golf course that struggling to stay in business. What a shame - the entire sight could have been purchased with NJ Green Trust money and turned into a world class training facility for several equestrian disciplines.

If Klaus made commissions selling horses - well apparantely it would have been known by the officials of our NGB and they haven't had a problem with it.

AiryFairy
Aug. 28, 2008, 10:30 PM
Now that Theodorescu is gone, maybe someone who actually understands how to train a horse in the classical way would be a good idea....

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=tPBET2Nb5Pk&feature=related

Note the lack of curb rein in the piaffe - unlike what we saw in many of the Olympic riders, with that curb shank yanked all the way back through the whole test.

http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=g63g9r9_N3Q&feature=related

Pommederue
Aug. 29, 2008, 12:29 AM
Perhaps Dover should have a new "Search For American's Next Team Coach" series?

slc2
Aug. 29, 2008, 07:37 AM
philipe karl may be great but all those horses are over round in the neck, low in the poll, weak in the contact, short in the neck, and dropped in the back with the hind legs out behind them. the idea of backing a horse to make him piaffe is quite old and if you back up around a piaffe in a test, you are going to lose a heck of a lot of points. i don't think he will be anyones national coach soon though i'm sure some will borrow some tricks from his bag of tricks.

Mardi
Sep. 3, 2008, 12:34 AM
Does anyone remember when KB was hired as the U.S. coach?

He was hired in early 2001.