Event Horses today - less careful, scopey jumpers?

[Jealoushe]

I finally got to watch the Olympic cross last night, I had taped it. All I could think about was how most ofthe horses today seem to not have the greatest jumping form, scraping over many of the fences and hanging legs everywhere. This was not the case for the Dentists horse, who was jumping nicely OVER everything.

I have every Badminton/Burghley/Olympic video from the last 10+ years and I can't say I recall the horses having such bad form, barely making it over the jumps, of course there are always a few. Are riders riding horses at this level that perhaps shouldn't be? Simply because they are bold and make it over should not be good enough. I would think if you were going 4* you want a horse clearing these fences, not scraping over them. Can I have some feedback on what you think?

[yellowbritches]

I don't think it is the horses, but the courses, and possibly the riding to a degree. In the past, the courses have been big, bold and galloping, encouraging horses to jump mostly out of a forward rhythm. Nowadays, the courses are far more technical and horses get pulled out of their forward, powerful rhythms and have to scrape over. I think if the horses were allowed to gallop on more and jump from a big, powerful rhythm, we'd see that they are still plenty scopey and careful.

Also, remember in regards to the sj, the courses are bigger, making it even harder for a tired xc horse to jump carefully.

[Jealoushe]

I can agree the riding has something to do with it. A lot of the riders I watched didn't even have a secure lower leg, I couldn't beleive they were going cross-country without those basics. Watching some of the better riders, like WFP or Mary King, you can see the difference in their leg position. I was speaking more in regards to cross-country, since it can be hard to judge on stadium day..

[yellowbritches]

And that is what I was referring to. The courses are a great deal different and don't encourage the horses to jump to the best of their abilities. They are yanked and tugged around, jumping technical, twisty combinations, and are often left with no power to jump in good, safe form. The Olympic course was actually a nice compromise, I thought. And I always tend to have a slightly less critical eye during the Olympics for the riding, as I do understand that it isn't just the REAL 4 star riders we see at Badminton, Burghley, and Rolex, but also odd riders who some how qualified and are riding for their countries. I never expect quite the same skill and form out of them, but am always pleased when they finish safely and are thrilled they got to ride in the Olympics!

[drsg4me]

Funny you should post this...I went back and watched an old video of all the "greats" last night. What a difference there is from the earlier days.
Go back and watch riders like Mark Todd, Ginny Leng, Ian Stark and horses like Charisma, and my all time favorite Murphy Himself! There is such a difference in the course styles, the riding styles, and the style of the horses!

Murphy has ALWAYS been my favorite all time horse. Anyone want to try and watch him get around that twisty turny technical course in Hong Kong? I bet there would be alot of people gasping and holding their breath!

[pony grandma]

I don't think it is the horses, but the courses, and possibly the riding to a degree. In the past, the courses have been big, bold and galloping, encouraging horses to jump mostly out of a forward rhythm. Nowadays, the courses are far more technical and horses get pulled out of their forward, powerful rhythms and have to scrape over. I think if the horses were allowed to gallop on more and jump from a big, powerful rhythm, we'd see that they are still plenty scopey and careful.

You have watched this?! (posted here in the forums several times) Hinrich Romeike's CC round on youtube - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9UsF_AZBoM Here is that old jump out of a gallop stride horse! Look how forward and easy he makes it look. He stands back and wings it, literally on the fly over these fences. Look at the trust and partnership of the horse and rider - the relaxed rein ride! I was in awe watching this footage of their ride. It made the course look smooth vs all that hauling and setting up to balance that we see done now. There was not a moment of lack of forwardness, conviction nor any hestitation in this ride. This horse was going at each and every fence.

And, I was surprised, Hinich doesn't have the best lower leg, he's snuggled into his knee and thigh. Some riders are non-traditional and it works for them when their balance is superb (P Dutton and R Jenkins come to mind). But I agree that a solid lower leg is your lifesaver. I even prefer that look in dressage vs the tippy toe.

[eventmom]

WOW! I had not seen that ride ponygrandma! I would love to hear what others thought of that video!

[pony grandma]

WOW! I had not seen that ride ponygrandma! I would love to hear what others thought of that video!

Especially that second to last angled brush fence combination that gave many riders trouble!! This is a point and shoot horse. And at the start box -- am I seeing a large ring plain ole SNAFFLE bit??

They truly, truly deserved the double gold win - the horse and the rider!!

p.s. should we start a fund so that he can come over to Rolex next spring? I want to see this ride again in person.

[Jealoushe]

anyone else?

[redpepper]

Awesome horse! Awesome ride! Why can't the USA emulate this?

[eventmom]

guys, I aked my daughters coach to give us her thoughts. She did, but in the thread on Marius's sire. You may want to take a look.
I was a bit saddened because her take was that the germans just know how to put out really ride-able horses. Ouch!

[tbeventer]

guys, I aked my daughters coach to give us her thoughts. She did, but in the thread on Marius's sire. You may want to take a look.
I was a bit saddened because her take was that the germans just know how to put out really ride-able horses. Ouch!



I agree that the Germans put out ridable horses! My gelding is a WA bred Tb who was bred by two German veterinarians that are known in Germany for their Trakahners. Well, my gelding is the most amazing horse I've ever ridden XC. He goes in a Sprenger 21mm french link ultra and although I've received comments about how "opinionated" he is across the country, he has yet to make a mistake. He is honest as the day is long, with a tremendous gallop, jump, and takes almost nothing to set up for a fence. I thought after running a handful of prelims, he'd need more bit, but he's actuall become a nicer ride... and this just as we are moving up to intermediate!
Because of him, I bought his full brother who is just 3, straight off the track. He has an even BETTER mind!
When I told their breeders how much fun the boys are, they said they breed "rideable horses that show upper level potential, not horses that will likely be successful on the track". Fortunately, their horses also have great records when racing! So, maybe the Germans really do know something that we don't!