Pad/Saddle/Sore back issues...long

[Cashela]

Ok I am at my wit's end.

I have two MFT's, both different ages, different body types. I am riding my 5 year old and a friend is riding my 9 year old. We trail ride on varying terrain any where from 5-18 miles. Both horses are brought along slowly in the spring (usually have the winter off) and built up to the higher mileage, more hills added, etc.. We vary the gaits that we ride from walking, fox trotting (my 5 year old paces), trotting and cantering.

Late last year it became apparent that my saddle was causing issues with my 5 year old, I had an Abetta trail saddle. I liked that saddle because it was light and comfortable. But it caused her to be sore. Had a massage therapist out, got her right again and took her to the tack shop with me to buy a new saddle and have her properly fitted. I got a Reinsman Miss. Trail saddle. Spent what for me was a fortune. But I wanted my horse to be comfy. Got a new pad at the same time, This is the pad we have http://www.diamondwoolpads.com/product.asp?CID=1&PID=15. This saddle is ok, but a lot heavier than I would have liked.

My friend who is riding my 9 year old has an Abetta trail saddle and a saddleright pad. She showed no signs of being sore and my friend has ridden her for about 2 years now.

So we seemed to be ok this spring with riding. Then we did an 8 mile ride and then a 13 mile ride in one weekend and both of my horses were sore. They were fine after the 8 mile ride but then sore after the 13. The 9 year old is sore on the high spot of her back right before her hips. She will dip down with pressure. The 5 year old is sore in the same spot more or less.

We had the massage therapist come out and work on them both. Turns out the 5 year old was sore in her left shoulder and hip as well. We have an appt with a Chiropractor for her this week. We were shown a massage technique that we could do on both of them. We faithfully did this and both horses were ok again. No sensitivity.

So we went on a ride this weekend. Both horses were eager to go, moved out a lot, had plenty of stamina, didn't really give us any sign that they were sore until we got off and checked their backs. This time though both horses also had like a welt on their sides where the edge of the pad would rest and where the cinches were. A friend who was riding behind me did say that I look like I put more weight in my left stirrup. So I raised that stirrup up a hole to see if that would help.

I am at my wit's end. I have two sore horses ridden by two different people with completely different tack on that are also getting welts from something...

I know people that take their horse out of the pasture after the winter off, do an 18 mile ride and they aren't the least bit ouchy. What the heck is going on?

I don't ride like a sack of potato's. I'll admit, I'm not the lightest at 192 pounds, but I'm 5'10".

Anyone have any suggestions? We have a week long camping trip in August coming up and I'd like to get this sorted out before then so I can take my own horses, if not I have one that I can borrow.

I'm seriously ready to throw in the towel and just have two lawn ornaments.

[SarahR]

I have gone through the same thing with my Paso Fino. I have had two custom made saddles (pricey---youch!), a treeless saddle, several cheapie saddles, an Aussie endurance saddle, and on and on. Tons of pads, too, probably a $1000.oo spent on pads alone. I have a Specialized saddle and really like it, as you can fiddle around with the fit yourself: www.specializedsaddles.com

I am riding her in my custom Western saddle now, though, as the saddle maker re-fitted it and it seems to be working, for now. I have the Specialized as a back-up and for our colt who's body is still changing shape. The Specialized saddles are very light weight, too. You can pick up a used one for $1000.oo if you're quick. Try watching the Endurance.net classifieds.

[katarine]

I'm living your pain. It's fun, isn't it? NOT!

Do you have any pictures you could post? Nekked profile pics, saddled, etc?

The saddles may be too long in the bars and that's digging into their loins. I have a down-hill built TWH who's a 'challenge' (cough cough) to fit and I'm still tinkering with what's going to be best.

Pictures would help, if you have them.

[marta]

took me about 3 years to get my saddle fit problems resolved.
i finally got it done when i got a real life certified saddle fitter to come out and assess and then help me pick out a saddle that fits my mare. forget those 'saddle specialists' at the tack shops. in my experience, those people were even more clueless than i was.
i found my saddle fitter at this website:
http://www.mastersaddlers.co.uk/

they have listings all over the world.

good luck!

[Cashela]

I will see what I can do about pics. I have nekked pics but I don't think I have pics of them saddled up.

[saratoga]

Saddle fit can be tough. I've been through it with 2 of my horses.

I bought a custom made DeSoto saddle, took about 4 months to get it, and it was about $1600, but for me, it was worth it, solved my saddle fit issue for my gelding and it is a fabulous saddle.

I have a Barefoot treeless saddle for my mare and that is working well for her. I bought it used from ebay for about $500.

My favorite pad is the Equipedic, $$, but I think it provides a lot of protection for the horse's back.

[jeano]

just my experience, and for what its worth. I have an ultra wide racking mare who developed the dreaded white hairs behind her withers almost a year ago. I went through a bunch of saddles and pads. Finally ended up with the WIDE tree Abetta special trail saddle and centerfired the girth. Got good gaits and more importantly a nice evenly sweated up back, white hairs are being replaced by dark ones. The pad that works best on this mare is a disgustingly cheeep fleece top/tacky neoprene underside pad that I got for about ten bucks from Chicks. Previously I had done two different thicknesses of felt pads, but she always seems to do best with very minmal padding--a thin thin waffle liner under a synthetic fleece from country supply has worked great, too.

I did find a use for my real thick felt pad, I can use it on the tres narrow gelding and use the SAME saddle on him. The other Abetta I had didnt work at all on him because he has such a short back.

I personally think gaited horses conspire with each other to be difficult to fit.

[Rachel L]

I personally think gaited horses conspire with each other to be difficult to fit.

You might be on to something.

Ugh, I have a different sort of problem with my Icelandic. She has pretty big spots with white hair and sort of crinkly feeling flesh underneath. They are the same on both sides, so I'm pretty sure its her saddle. The problem? She gives NO indication of discomfort. She is so stoic you can dig your fingers in as hard as you can and get no response. I could probably pound a nail in there and she wouldn't flinch. How the heck do you fit a horse that gives you zero feedback, even when you are obviously crippling her?

The saddle is banished to the garage for now, I am riding her bareback and in a borrowed Bob Marshall saddle until I can get my mind around the problem.

Not trying to highjack, just commiserating.

[Rachel L]

I bought a custom made DeSoto saddle, took about 4 months to get it, and it was about $1600, but for me, it was worth it, solved my saddle fit issue for my gelding and it is a fabulous saddle.

Even going custom made is no guarantee of fit. For my other horse, not the Icelandic, I have a custom made SR saddle, did the plaster cast of her back and everything. I love the saddle and its working for her and me, but I honestly can't see that it fits better than the off-the-rack saddle I was riding her in before.

[gabz]

With gaited horses, as you know, you need enough gullet HEIGHT to allow for the head/neck nod.
Along with this "uplifting" front end of the saddle, you also need FLARED saddle tree that frees up the shoulder area. This will also prevent front-to-back saddle movement... and with that said, are you using breast collars? Are the skirts of the saddles rounded? is there adequate padding behind the saddle?

Then, to be sure it all fits together, you will want a CONTOUR pad. one that lifts up in the front as well.

I have a wide-bodied MFT... my saddle lady recommended this endurance Fabtron saddle that allows the saddle to be traditionally girthed, or center-fire rigged. (page 19 from here:http://www.fabtron.com/swf/fabtron_cat.html) which helps it stay in proper place.

I bought a simple wool-felt pad for about $40 to fit under it.
http://www.horse.com/Western-Tack/Saddle-Pads/Wool-Pad-with-Adjustable-Wither-Strap-WIA15.html (can be cut / trimmed if necessary)

Check to see how far back you are placing the saddle and if it's bumping or rubbing.
And - sometimes a soft fluffy fleece pad can be just as good as a high priced one. I always avoid foam of any kind.

[saratoga]

Even going custom made is no guarantee of fit. For my other horse, not the Icelandic, I have a custom made SR saddle, did the plaster cast of her back and everything. I love the saddle and its working for her and me, but I honestly can't see that it fits better than the off-the-rack saddle I was riding her in before.


I agree that even a custom saddle is not a guarantee but it did work for me. I went through a Bob Marshall, Orthoflex, Abetta, and a Sharon Saare before the DeSoto.

But can I ask, why would you have bought a custom if your off the rack saddle fit? I have had good luck in general with off the racks and I'm all for saving money. I think it does become more difficult though to find perfect saddle fit when you start doing 50s.

[jeano]

[QUOTE=Rachel L;3310837]You might be on to something.

Ugh, I have a different sort of problem with my Icelandic. She has pretty big spots with white hair and sort of crinkly feeling flesh underneath. They are the same on both sides, so I'm pretty sure its her saddle. The problem? She gives NO indication of discomfort. She is so stoic you can dig your fingers in as hard as you can and get no response. I could probably pound a nail in there and she wouldn't flinch. How the heck do you fit a horse that gives you zero feedback, even when you are obviously crippling her?



And Sadie was the same way, never ever flinched. Aside from the white hairs and weird skin under them, she became slightly pacier, she gave me no clue that anything hurt. Which is interesting, because she is allergic to ever bug that flies and gets covered with welts and scratches her bug bites all summer long. But back pain, nope.

[Rachel L]

But can I ask, why would you have bought a custom if your off the rack saddle fit?

My horse would sometimes toss her head a little going downhill. I rode her for a while in a Bob Marshall and she seemed to do it less, so I worried that the saddle didn't fit her. With the SR, she does it less, but she is also a much more experienced trail horse now, so it could have been behavioral, not necessarily the saddle. As far as the saddle fitting the horse, a custom saddle may not have been necessary. I'm not complaining though because my off-the-rack saddle was a somewhat ugly synthetic saddle that put me in a weird position, while the SR has a wonderfully balanced seat, I can ride in it all day and not get stiff. Plus, it is absolutely beautiful, and one of the most finely crafted articles I own.

[SarahR]

My mare always gets white hair over the entire area of contact, and then it sheds out each spring. So what's up with that? I stopped worrying about the white hair and instead focus on if she is sore or not. Sometimes I wonder if soreness in unavoidable in our rough mountain terrain. It can be hours of riding downhill through tricky stuff like bogs, rocks, steps, exposed roots, sometimes all at the same time!

I've spent (ugh) around $8,000 on saddles. Not an easy thing for me, but it has been spread out over 5 years. I still don't have an ideal saddle for her. The Specialized is probably the best since I can fiddle with it. I haven't tried an Ortho-flex or similar saddle, though.

[wateryglen]

I'm curious about what a previous poster said about a saddle being too long and digging in at the loins......I have a 19" Thornhill trailriding saddle and use it on a 15.3 hand draft (perch/qh) cross who is wide in the butt and narrow at the shoulder. She's built about level or downhill. Still young at 5 and greenbroke about 4 mos. Keeps looking around and trying to bite my foot or look at me or something. I keep thinking she's telling me something hurts. She's widish and the saddle is a wide tree. Not contact along the gullet and seems to fit her fine but.....I wonder if that saddle is too long for her. What are the "symptoms"??
thanks for the info.....

[gabz]

wateryglen...
Put the saddle on the horse with no pad. rock it gently to "seat it"... Snug the girth, walk the horse, tighten the girth. Now look at the back of the saddle and if possible, have someone else walk the horse around so that you can watch. Is any part of the back of saddle rubbing on her hips or digging in to her back?

Is it even close? in other words, when a rider is mounted, will that cause the saddle to rub or dig in?
If everything is okay, then repeat with a pad. Does the pad rub anywhere? Some pads are so stiff that they cause the saddle to bridge. watch for that too.

That's why sometimes a fluffy medium pad is better than those gosh awful stiff (western) pads.

If you need to "level" the saddle - there are various lifts available, or fold a thin cotton or wool pad and place that on the back to "shim".

[DairyQueen2049]

As gabz sez, gaited horses need a bit of freedom of wither, shoulder and forearm.

No Kool Aid here, but so far the Imus is the only saddle that has been proven excellent on my horses backs.

We have 2 TWHs and we ride 25 - 30 miles a day sometimes. Tried a Dixieland and got sores. See sores with Bob Marshalls, Tuckers, Abettas, Big Horns, etc.

Switched to Imus and we have 2 happy gaiting horses - NO sores, NO white hairs.

We also use the Dixie Midnight pad under it all to allow the back to breathe.

Just our experiences, YMMV, of course. And 'ware the Kool Aid at the Gaits of Gold site.:winkgrin:

[gabz]

so far as the Imus saddles go... please research thoroughly. She has been having difficulty establishing, and keeping, a manufacturer.
Some are "originals"; then they were made at Circle Y. Last I knew, Big Horn was making them.

Dairy Queen, was it you who had minor quality issues with your's?

[katarine]

Circle Y's ownership issues were then Imus' issues. I think that's all settled.

The Imus didn't remotely fit my TWH...just an FYI...

I hate saddle hunting but now I've run one to ground, hooray.

[scrtwh]

The problem with a custom saddle, is that the fit will change with the horses condition. Ughhhh!!! So I agree with the poster that said a custom is no guarantee of fit. I do foundation WH's. They are wide backed low withered, and I ride my mare in a heather moffit fheonix dressage with a pessoa pad. Previously, I had her in a Wintec with the gullet system. She really struggled with rounding out with that saddle, so ... used on ebay for a tidy sum. My gelding is even larger than my mare. He is Midnight Sun through and through and looks like he could be part draft, maybe he is, momma was registered, daddy is unknown. anywho, I ride him in the moffit, with a thin dressage pad and he is fine. Has a nice little saddle gait. My hubby rides him in a Hilason with some generic gel pad, and that doesn't bother him either, and my hubby is a big guy and a weekend warrior if you get my drift, so ... Good luck Cashela, saddles are the bain of a horseman's existence ... :winkgrin:

[Blueskidoo]

I have had sucess with my TB's in a Tennesean saddle, and better yet is The Freedom Saddle I ordered. (www.thefreedomsaddle.com). THe saddle has flair in the shoulders and the loins so it is working really well on my short backed horses. Meleta is great to talk to about her saddle and you can get a demo to try.

[gabz]

Ah Ha! Yes, and these are made by Crates on a Steele tree I believe. I knew she had barrel saddles, but I guess the trail saddle is somewhat new.

Crates also makes a gaited horse saddle. Several friends have them and love them. I think they need a little more padding in the seat. I have the reiner version for my QH.

http://www.cratesleather.com/pages/saddles/mbrown.shtml

[SarahR]

What do people think of Orthoflex and similar type saddles with gaited horses?

[GallopingGrape]

I'm a big fan of the Orthoflex. I love the moving pannels, how they give and flex side to side, as opposed to a flex "tree" that gives in the center .

[gabz]

What do people think of Orthoflex and similar type saddles with gaited horses?

I've sat in a few ... I don't care for how little contact there is with the horse. It's like sitting on a platform above the horse. But... I've never ridden in one on a horse.

The Tucker saddles are a big hit with many gaited horse riders.
Be cautious about how long the back of the horse is, compared to any saddle you want to use.

[katarine]

I borrowed on OrthoFlex Patriot, I think it was? Incredibly close feel, very comfortable to my frame (average height, slightly tubby, LOL), very comfortable to the horse it seemed. Length was good...I really liked it a ton.

I have a Tucker River Plantation that is the bomb in terms of comfort for long rides. Love it, too.