Eventing mule!

[enjoytheride]

I went to a very nice local horse show and ran into this nice young lady on her mule, she never intended to jump the mule (bought her as something different from her upper level horse to have fun on) but at some point figured out the mule was pretty good! The mule is definetly green, but a very willing and smart equine partner over fences. She is doing a "derby" in this video which is half stadium fences and half cross country fences so when she goes off camera she's jumping some more XC fences.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJFMSrsjsa0

[easyklc]

Jeez that mule makes my green mare look like chopped liver. What a fantastic creature taking that course in stride. I LOVE the flopping ears.

[debra]

WOW! That's cool, good for her.

[TB or not TB?]

OMG cuuuuuuuuuuute! I want a mule; I heart their ears. I wish the rules would allow them. :yes:

[LAZ]

Hey,

That looks like my farm!

[enjoytheride]

Look, you're famous!

Definetly suggest anyone within a few hours considering putting LAZ's farm on your list. Runs on time, nice indoor and outdoor arenas, we always have a good time despite any horsey shenanigans. Much rather go there then a hunter show that's about 30 minutes away and wait for 3 hours for your division.


Plus, LAZ gives everyone free cookies for coming ;) right right right?

[Carol Ames]

I wish the rules would allow them. They don't? :confused: Cathy Wieschoff evented one preilm, a few years back:yes:

[zagafi]

Love me some mules--what fun!

[ChristieNCritters]

OOOH! Now I REALLY want a mule! :yes:

[eventer4ever]

That's me on my mule, Mirabella.

Thanks for posting the video! And I also suggest going to LAZ's farm for her shows! I drive over 2 hours to go.

My mules is 4 years old and half Tennessee Walking horse. As the original poster stated, I never really had any intention of showing her, much less jumping her! But she is sooooo easy, as I have dyslexia when jumping fences and she is so green but so easy to jump! That video posted is her doing her second drop and she had done her first drop the course before! I cannot say enough good things about my mule!

I need to get the rule changed so I can event her!!! Anybody else out there agree?

And a HUGE THANK YOU to enjoytheride for posting my video. She so graciously offered for me to watch the video while we were at the show and was a one of those nice people that you meet at horse shows and have such a nice, easy time to talk to!
Also, thanks to LAZ for putting on the show and I will be back in July!

Erica + Mirabella the awesome jumping mule!

[tx3dayeventer]

I wish the rules would allow them. They don't? :confused: Cathy Wieschoff evented one preilm, a few years back:yes:

Cathy is the reason the rule got changed. She was kicking everyone' butt on that mule so people got pissed and went and lobbied to have the rules changed and tada no more mules allowed to event.

[missamandarose]

Well that's no fun! I remember seeing that crazy lady on RFD-TV with the "long ears" show jumping around and doing dressage on her donks and mules and thought "well thats probably a really inexpensive way to show." And I've wanted one ever since. They're sturdy, smart and usually cheap to buy.

Lets lobby back and have them allowed again!

[SparklePlenty]

Omg! I just LOVE HER!! How fantastic... :D:D:D

[eventer4ever]

I will head up the lobbying to get this rule changed back! I am literally finishing my college degree this week and I am going to have some spare time.

However, I know nothing about the process of getting a rule changed and the proposals involved. I would need help with that, but I would be more than willing to do the work if I had someone guiding me along the process....

Please, let's get this rule changed back. I REALLY want to event my mule at a recognized events.

Erica

[whadyasay]

Cathy is the reason the rule got changed. She was kicking everyone' butt on that mule so people got pissed and went and lobbied to have the rules changed and tada no more mules allowed to event.

That's ridiculous. All mule owners should petition OR create their own venue. That mule is adorable, looks happy to be doing her job and a real treat for the owner! My boyfriend LOVES mules, I am sending him the video. He will LOVE it. Good luck with her, it is so nice to see people enjoying their animals, long eared or not. :cool:

[zagafi]

Oh, I love her name too! I really need a mule...and a mini-donk...and a Norwegian Fjord...and...well, you get the idea.

[ravenclaw]

Mules are sometimes allowed at schooling (unrecognized) events. You could contact the organizer and ask if it's okay to bring your mule.

I LOVE mules and I wish they were allowed at recognized events...my goofy TB might be scared of mules, but that's my problem. Not the mule's problem. :) I would be happy to sign a petition or write a letter. Not sure how to go about getting the rule changed, but I would be glad to be one of the voices in support of mules.

[scpezold]

My father has always said I need to get a jumping mule. He thinks they are so much smarter than horses :lol: Sometimes I think he may be right! I was at a Hunter Pace this past weekend and met a beautiful dapple grey jenny. The lady who owns her is looking to fox hunt with her :eek:

Here are a few pics of her:
http://www.shutterfly.com/progal/album.jsp?pg=4


Here she is again attending a clinic:
http://www.bitsandbytesfarm.com/training_notes/trainingnotes2006/training_notes100706.htm

[Aggie4Bar]

Lovely! I wish mules were more common in English riding sports. They're such intriguing creatures.

A neighbour of ours breeds mules. Every time I drive past, I have to slow down and check out all the longears. He has a seal brown gelding out there that is absolutely drop dead gorgeous.

ETA: I have no idea what breed of mares he uses. I was looking for them the last time I drove past, but they were too far from the road to get a good glimpse at. They're not draft, and the mules are very sporty.

[elmerandharriet]

I want to breed my Tb mare to a Jack so bad! I keep thinking about doing it!

[missamandarose]

My father has always said I need to get a jumping mule. He thinks they are so much smarter than horses :lol: Sometimes I think he may be right! I was at a Hunter Pace this past weekend and met a beautiful dapple grey jenny. The lady who owns her is looking to fox hunt with her :eek:

Here are a few pics of her:
http://www.shutterfly.com/progal/album.jsp?pg=4


Here she is again attending a clinic:
http://www.bitsandbytesfarm.com/training_notes/trainingnotes2006/training_notes100706.htm

LOL!!! I kept scrolling down the page and didnt see a mule, but DID see my trainer's dapple grey mare who someone thought was a mule from a distance!!! ROFL! I thought you meant HER and thought I would have to explain! Then I finally got to the REAL mule. She's adorable!!

I'll help with the effort if someone guides us! Its not as if we're asking to be able to bring a LION or an ELEPHANT to ride... its still an equine!

[Equa]

Couldn't you just register your equine as an animal with "unknown" on the parentage - and then put the onus on snooty event organisers to PROVE it is a Mule.

"Just because her ears are (sob) EXTRA long (gulp)...it doesn't mean she's (sniff) not a beautiful horse!"

I had the opportunity to buy a mule recently (he was used in a film) and missed out. Dammit. He was sooooo similar in looks and temperament to our little wb eventer (apart from the ears....)

[TB or not TB?]

"Just because her ears are (sob) EXTRA long (gulp)...it doesn't mean she's (sniff) not a beautiful horse!"

:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: That's awesome. You could totally feign ignorance too. "What do you mean she's not a horse?! I don't see what you're talking about. Northern Spy has big floppy ears too, but I hardly think you'd accuse him of being a mule. (huff)!"

[lucky dog farm]

Mules LOVE to jump!!! When I was a kid showing Black and Tan Coonhounds they would always have mule jumping contests. The mules owner would hand walk his/her mule up to a single fence and ask it to jump. The mules that made it over that jump would get to go again until one mule cleared the highest level. It was kind of like a puissance wall but without a rider and from a standstill. I have always wanted a mule but I think the neighbors would FREAK about the braying!

[pooh]

don't forget us that have mustangs!!! They have very cute big ears!!!!! My guy loves me to scratch them. Hopefully we will get our act together and finally get to some horse trials at teh end of the year.

[enjoytheride]

What about unrecognized eventing? The Hoosier Horse Park has Leg Up in July which runs through Training level and is unrecognized but over the same course.

[AppJumpr08]

Erica! I thought that was you two before I read down to your post :D

She's so cute!!!

How's Joe?

[flea]

You should be able to compete in unrecognized events. I did several with my mule a number of years ago. I always called first. Once they said I could "compete" but not be placed as the event was a points event for the region and people might complain. I I went HC as my main goal was to have fun and event not take home ribbons. The mule did well. Just be prepared to catch some flack if you do well!:) Actually everyone was nice about it...at least to my face.

[LAZ]

Erica & Mirabella have been here twice and I haven't heard anything negative about a mule being here. Course, if anyone had a problem I'd tell them to suck it up and cope, but I haven't heard anything other than positive feedback.

And I don't think I've heard her bray yet, either...(the mule, not Erica).

Was the mule CW rode named Kit? I remember an eventing mule running around the course at New Britton Hunt HT back in the early 80's, but I don't recall Cathy riding it--someone else from KY, I think. That thing kicked butt regularly.

[SteeleRdr]

Mulelady on her also have a LARGE mule that she hunts in VA. There is also another lady that I know, who hunts in VA, that has a mule that she hunts, and also events!! I think she did Redland and SVPC, both unrecog, last year. The pictures are somewhere, I can't recall the photographer that was there. Anyways, very nice mule, and I think they are just awesome in general.

Though I do have a story of how the same mule referenced above was brought along for a mule race, was not liking being alone, so we loaned her out pony babysitter for our race horses. The pony was NOT amused with being put in the trailer with this "crazy thing with big ears and makes noises!"

[allpurpose]

That's me on my mule, Mirabella.

Thanks for posting the video! And I also suggest going to LAZ's farm for her shows! I drive over 2 hours to go.

My mules is 4 years old and half Tennessee Walking horse. As the original poster stated, I never really had any intention of showing her, much less jumping her! But she is sooooo easy, as I have dyslexia when jumping fences and she is so green but so easy to jump! That video posted is her doing her second drop and she had done her first drop the course before! I cannot say enough good things about my mule!

I need to get the rule changed so I can event her!!! Anybody else out there agree?

And a HUGE THANK YOU to enjoytheride for posting my video. She so graciously offered for me to watch the video while we were at the show and was a one of those nice people that you meet at horse shows and have such a nice, easy time to talk to!
Also, thanks to LAZ for putting on the show and I will be back in July!

Erica + Mirabella the awesome jumping mule!

We met this winter at an Albion schooling show. Your mule was the center of attention in the warm-up ring as I recall! Glad to see her video and your nice ride! What fun!

Ceci

[eventer4ever]

I will hopefully event her at an unrecognized event this year...I am still new to this area, as I just moved from New England last year, so whoever wants to point me in the best direction as to which events to go to, where to find them, etc. It seems that a lot of people on this thread are from Indiana...I live 5 miles over the border into MI.

Thanks to everyone for all the nice things said...I for one never thought that I would be riding a mule in public, much less owning one and jumping one! But it has been so fun and I wouldn't change anything...except the rule to get them out recognized eventing again.

Erica

[JER]

You have a very nice mule.

I hope they change that silly rule and allow mules in recognized eventing. Mules compete in endurance and competitive trail without any issues -- horses get used to them pretty quickly.

I have a pet mule. He excels at dismantling fences and sees no need for jumping. :D

[RSEventer]

my Tb mare has floppy ears- has been called "Flight Check" before by others- love the mule- change the rule:D

[kansasgal]

Mules LOVE to jump!!! When I was a kid showing Black and Tan Coonhounds they would always have mule jumping contests. The mules owner would hand walk his/her mule up to a single fence and ask it to jump. The mules that made it over that jump would get to go again until one mule cleared the highest level. It was kind of like a puissance wall but without a rider and from a standstill. I have always wanted a mule but I think the neighbors would FREAK about the braying!


Oh,, yes, about 10 years ago, we lived in Ohio, and my riding instructor who was an avid eventer but would take anything in for training, had this favorite mule story....


The mule jumping contest is a big draw at the Ohio state fair, it's really quite something to watch. But it's not THAT kind of jumping....

My instructor took a mule in for training, that the owners wanted to be sure that she "trained to jump"......

So my instructor proceeded in training to teach it first with rails on the ground, then progressed up to 2 foot courses by the time the owners had a chance to come out to visit.


My instructor was pretty proud of the mule's progress, as it was her first experience with a mule... the owners were shocked to find out that there was another tyoe of "jumping training" than what THEY were expecting......

Luckily, everyone involved had a good laugh about the whole situation. Where is that mule now? I want him.....

Thanks for sharing the video, Mirabella you're SOME mule!

[flea]

Lucky Dog FArm...I have never had a problem with my mules braying. They mostly made a kind of sick weenie whinny kind of sound. Did n't bother anyone. Now donkey braying.....that's a whole different earsplitting sound sound isn't it? However, if I am prompt on feeding time or simply tip toe around the house and don't turn on the lights in the morning, they don't know I am up and remain relatively quiet.

[Watermark Farm]

Hello,

I am new here and this thread caught my eye. I am the mom of a 13-year-old girl who shows a mule in dressage and jumping and Pony Club rallies. We were aware of all the rules banning mules from eventing when we purchased our mule. We bought him anyway and have never regretted it. This guy has turned out to be a wonderful partner (and an amazing jumper) for my daughter.

Does anyone know the real reason why USEA bans mules? I contacted them a couple of years ago and was told the reason is because "mules frighten horses." I thought this was ironic since eventing stems from military tests for cavalry horses, and the cavalry included mules!!

I'd love to connect with other people who are competing mules in dressage/eventing type events. It's a little lonely for us at times...

[elmerandharriet]

I seriously want to breed my tb mare to a jack! If im not mistaken mules have a natural jumping ability and people thought it was unfair?!? but I could be wrong...

[GreyDun]

I did some research... apparently they're not allowed because they're not recognized as "equines"... then what are they??? Also, apparently they do tend to spook horses. (boo...poor excuse... my horse spooks at squirrels on the other side of the county!).

Apparently the dressage competitions are starting to allow them in, however... that's a step! Go bug the USEF and tell them what you think... or just do some unrecognized. :)

[BAC]

I have always wanted a mule and this one looks like great fun to ride. Some mules compete in endurance I think, and also in dressage, although that was several years ago, maybe the rules have changed. Its a shame they are not allowed to event, maybe a division could be started just for them.

[Watermark Farm]

I did some research... apparently they're not allowed because they're not recognized as "equines"... then what are they???

Technically, they are considered "hybrids."

I called the sport services director at USEA and am waiting to hear back. I'd just like to understand the no mules rule better.

We've attended many, many shows, and only once has a horse spooked badly at the mule, and that horse was ditzy to begin with. Normally, the horses don't notice, or look once and that's all.

Mules are intelligent and learn super fast, good and bad. You use a different approach with them. With the horse, you say "this is the way we do it" and with the mule, you say "what do you think if we try it this way?" A mule in eventing woud be interesting due to their keen sense of self-preservation ---- the horse has "heart" but the mule has heart with a brain attached.

Last year, my daughter entered her mule in a jumping class, where you jump a single jump and it's raised with each round. The fence reached 4'6" and the mule kept clearing it easily. Soon after, the mule made a decision to gently glide to a stop 5 strides out. He could have easily taken the jump, but my sense is that he knew his rider was becoming overfaced.

Odie the Pony Club mule warming up for dressage recently:
http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/watermarkfarm/Easter9a.jpg

[missamandarose]

even if a hybrid, arent they still in the same genus (or whatever... its been a while since 10th grade science) as a horse? Sad... It'd be a great thing to see more mules out there.

Hey... you're Argus's "mom" arent you?!

edited to add: ah ha... seems its the SPECIES that differs.. (it was bugging me I couldnt remember things from high school science more than 10 yrs ago!). Mules, donkeys and horses are all of the genus Equus, but donkeys have a Sub-genus (asinus). Their species are E. caballus + asinus, E. asinus and E. caballus respectively. So they ARE equines... but itsnt part domesticated horse enough?

[cloudyandcallie]

thanks for post. that is so cute.
who was the author of the article in the chronicle a while back who wrote about visiting a relative and going hunting with someone who rode to hounds on a mule?
I used to ride the 2 big mules that my great uncle over in SC had when I was a kid, but they wouldn't go very fast.

[Watermark Farm]

Heard back from USEA. It's not their rule barring mules, it's a USEF directive. USEF does not consider mules "equines."

USEA says "submit a rule change proposal, get it on the table for discussion."

http://www.usef.org/Contentpage2.aspx?id=rulebook
United States Equestrian Federation, Inc

[ravenclaw]

Heard back from USEA. It's not their rule barring mules, it's a USEF directive. USEF does not consider mules "equines."
Well, that's ridiculous. If they're not equines, then what are they?

[missamandarose]

Welll clearly my vast research on Wikipedia yesterday indicates that mules are in the genus Equus... so I don't know where the USEF got their info. Maybe there is an alternative scientific classification system that USEF uses?

[Watermark Farm]

This is from the General Rules section of the 2008 USEF Rule Book. This is the "mule rule."

I can see what USEA meant....time to submit a rule change proposal!!

GR125 Horse.
1. The term “horse” as used in these rules denotes either a horse or pony.
2. In all levels of all Federation licensed Driving and Endurance Competitions and in the
case of any other Federation Rule as it relates to the Driving or Endurance disciplines as
the context permits it, the term “horse” shall also include a mule. See DC111.4, EN102.1.
a. Mules are also eligible to compete in dressage classes with the exception of
(1) USEF Championships, USEF qualifying and selection trials, and observation
classes,
(2) any other classes designated as qualifying or selection classes for international
or international high performance competition, and
(3) championships where such participation is prohibited in the championship
selection procedures. See DR119.1.

http://www.usef.org/Contentpage2.aspx?id=rulebook
United States Equestrian Federation, Inc

[DizzyMagic]

I loved that! Thanks for posting it. It's just awesome to see people having fun on their horses...or mules!! :)

[Watermark Farm]

For those who have been following this discussion, I took USEA's advice and worked with another COTH member, Erica, to submit a Rule Change Proposal regarding mules in USEF-sanctioned events to USEF. It may now be viewed online at USEF's website. Here is the rule change proposal:
http://www.usef.org/documents/ruleChanges/085-08.pdf
085-08.pdf (application/pdf Object)

Proposed Change:
New Rule Number 0
GR125 Horse. [Chapter 1. Definitions and Governance] Add new and renumber if necessary:
2. In all levels of all Federation licensed Driving and Endurance Competitions and in the case of any other Federation Rule as it relates to the
Driving or Endurance disciplines as the context permits it, the term “horse” shall also include a mule. See DC111.4, EN102.1.
a. Mules are also eligible to compete in dressage classes with the exception of
(1) USEF Championships, USEF qualifying and selection trials, and observation classes,
(2) any other classes designated as qualifying or selection classes for international or international high performance competition, and
(3) championships where such participation is prohibited in the championship selection procedures. See DR119.1.
b. Mules are also eligible to compete in Eventing competitions at the levels of Beginner Novice, Novice, and Training only.

This is only the start of a long process, which involves review of the proposed rule change within both USEA and USEF, voting on the rule at the 2009 USEF annual meeting, etc. The proposal may not be successful, but it's a start. Thanks to everyone for your support. Now we need the support of folks on various USEA committees!

[elmerandharriet]

YAY!

[jenm]

Katie,

I'm so glad you and Erica are spearheading this rule change. I will be following it closely to see what the outcome is. I'm still a ways a way from riding/showing my wonderful mule, but it would be fun to be able to event with him.

Let me know if there is anything I can do to help.

Thank you!

[elmerandharriet]

anything happen with this?

[ChristieNCritters]

I would like to know, too! I don't have a mule now, but I SO want one, and would LOVE to be able to event with it!

[CdnRider]

I missed this thread originally...but another mule story

I onced boarded and worked at a barn that had a large cutting horse population. I was told a story once that a very high money earning cutting mare went to be live cover bred to a very high money earning cutting stallion. She came back bred.
Spring time--cute little dun foal, WAIT with long ears...a mule.

Well said mule grows up and is trained to be a cutter and since mom was such a great cutter, why not? Well mule starts winning everything, and in the cutting world that makes up for a lot of money.

And as in eventing there was a rule change. (I doubt this one will get changed)
Good luck with your rule!!

[superpony123]

thats so cool!! :lol: and such a cutie, with the floppy bunny ears :winkgrin:

[Watermark Farm]

>>>>Let me know if there is anything I can do to help.<<<<

Yes! Write to Sharon Gallagher at USEA and let her know you support this rule change proposal (reference the rule change proposal). She was very supportive of the proposal and she works with the committee who will look at it.

You can also track the "eventing mules" rule change proposal at the USEF website: http://www.usef.org/documents/ruleChanges/085-08.pdf

[Watermark Farm]

Sad news for eventing mule lovers...

I just heard back from USEA regarding the rule change proposal submitted to USEF regarding allowing mules in USEA-recognized events.

Sadly, at the recent USEF annual meeting, the eventing technical committee axed this rule change proposal this time around. I am not surprised (it took more than 10 years to push a similar change through the USDF committees), but am disappointed. After all, eventing has its roots in cavalry, and cavalry horses routinely worked alongside mules.

Here is the scoop from USEA's Sharon Gallagher (who kindly supported this proposal) regarding the USEA eventing technical committee's take on the proposal:

I am sorry to report that your rule proposal was disapproved. Apparently (I was not at the meeting), the USEF Eventing Technical Committee was adamant that mules would be a disruption to the horses during competition and were not willing to endorse the rule proposal.

If you still feel strongly about this, you could keep submitting the rule change; eventually, they just may give in.

I plan to submit this proposal again this year, and hope to garner more support this time around. Mules are currently allowed, under USEF rules, to compete in FEI level driving and endurance events, and up to the FEI level in dressage!!

Any advice or support from active trainers or UL competitors (especially those connected with the current technical committee) would be greatly appreciated. I'd also love to hear from anyone who competes a mule in unrecognized horse trials (it was suggest to me that letters of support from organizers might be helpful). My daughter competes her mule heavily in horse-only competions, including recognized dressage shows, and only once have we had a horse be bothered by the mule.

Kick on!!
Katie Margason-Moore
Santa Rosa, CA
**************************************************
Here are the eventing technical committee members. I was told that Malcolm Hook was surprised by the committee's NO vote, the idea being "eventers should be beyond that!"
There will be a new committee for next year.

Malcolm Hook, Chairman
Tom Angle
Kevin Baumgardner,
Jan Byyny,
Darren Chiacchia
Robert Costello
Derek di Grazia
Roger Haller
Loris Henry
Mike Huber
Shelley Lambert
Katie Lindsay
Diane McBroom
Tim Murray
Karen O’Connor
Wayne Quarles
Kyra Stuart
Andrew Temkin

Here is the proposal which did not pass....

Proposed Change:
New Rule Number 0
GR125 Horse. [Chapter 1. Definitions and Governance] Add new and renumber if necessary:
2. In all levels of all Federation licensed Driving and Endurance Competitions and in the case of any other Federation Rule as it relates to the
Driving or Endurance disciplines as the context permits it, the term “horse” shall also include a mule. See DC111.4, EN102.1.
a. Mules are also eligible to compete in dressage classes with the exception of
(1) USEF Championships, USEF qualifying and selection trials, and observation classes,
(2) any other classes designated as qualifying or selection classes for international or international high performance competition, and
(3) championships where such participation is prohibited in the championship selection procedures. See DR119.1.
b. Mules are also eligible to compete in Eventing competitions at the levels of Beginner Novice, Novice, and Training only.

[Shrunk "N" Da Wash]

I want a jumping mule:yes:!

[hollyhorse2000]

A work colleague of mine has two mules on order for foxhunting. He said they're bombproof and he's an older rider and is done with spooking. I can't wait to see them. He is very excited.

[cloudyandcallie]

Uh oh, what's going to happen if the mules start competing and beating the imported warmbloods?:winkgrin:

I've heard of horses being "jumping fools" but now will there be "jumping mules" in competitions? Fun times.

[JER]

[I]I am sorry to report that your rule proposal was disapproved. Apparently (I was not at the meeting), the USEF Eventing Technical Committee was adamant that mules would be a disruption to the horses during competition and were not willing to endorse the rule proposal.


This is silly.

I have been to various trail/endurance clinics where mules were among the equine participants. Horses -- including my own -- who had never seen a mule before either (1) didn't notice or (2) got over it pretty quick.

Numerous HTs are held on farms/ranches where other livestock are kept. Cows, goats, pigs (which can be a real problem for some horses), minis, chickens, emus, llamas, donkeys, you-name-it. My mares lived at a facility with some research zebras. I've shown youngsters in hand in county-fair shows with mule babies. You know what? They deal with it.

I have a mule. When a new horse comes in they look him over, sniff him, and that's the end of it. They don't react any differently than they would to another horse.

This is about riders, not horses. Perhaps we need to have some Meet-a-Mule sessions for eventers. :D

I would like to know the 'evidence' behind the Technical Committee's promulgation.

[Regal Grace]

Sad news for eventing mule lovers...

I just heard back from USEA regarding the rule change proposal submitted to USEF regarding allowing mules in USEA-recognized events.

Sadly, at the recent USEF annual meeting, the eventing technical committee axed this rule change proposal this time around. I am not surprised (it took more than 10 years to push a similar change through the USDF committees), but am disappointed. After all, eventing has its roots in cavalry, and cavalry horses routinely worked alongside mules.

Here is the scoop from USEA's Sharon Gallagher (who kindly supported this proposal) regarding the USEA eventing technical committee's take on the proposal:

I am sorry to report that your rule proposal was disapproved. Apparently (I was not at the meeting), the USEF Eventing Technical Committee was adamant that mules would be a disruption to the horses during competition and were not willing to endorse the rule proposal.

If you still feel strongly about this, you could keep submitting the rule change; eventually, they just may give in.

I plan to submit this proposal again this year, and hope to garner more support this time around. Mules are currently allowed, under USEF rules, to compete in FEI level driving and endurance events, and up to the FEI level in dressage!!

Any advice or support from active trainers or UL competitors (especially those connected with the current technical committee) would be greatly appreciated. I'd also love to hear from anyone who competes a mule in unrecognized horse trials (it was suggest to me that letters of support from organizers might be helpful). My daughter competes her mule heavily in horse-only competions, including recognized dressage shows, and only once have we had a horse be bothered by the mule.

Kick on!!
Katie Margason-Moore
Santa Rosa, CA
**************************************************
Here are the eventing technical committee members. I was told that Malcolm Hook was surprised by the committee's NO vote, the idea being "eventers should be beyond that!"
There will be a new committee for next year.

Malcolm Hook, Chairman
Tom Angle
Kevin Baumgardner,
Jan Byyny,
Darren Chiacchia
Robert Costello
Derek di Grazia
Roger Haller
Loris Henry
Mike Huber
Shelley Lambert
Katie Lindsay
Diane McBroom
Tim Murray
Karen O’Connor
Wayne Quarles
Kyra Stuart
Andrew Temkin

Here is the proposal which did not pass....

Proposed Change:
New Rule Number 0
GR125 Horse. [Chapter 1. Definitions and Governance] Add new and renumber if necessary:
2. In all levels of all Federation licensed Driving and Endurance Competitions and in the case of any other Federation Rule as it relates to the
Driving or Endurance disciplines as the context permits it, the term “horse” shall also include a mule. See DC111.4, EN102.1.
a. Mules are also eligible to compete in dressage classes with the exception of
(1) USEF Championships, USEF qualifying and selection trials, and observation classes,
(2) any other classes designated as qualifying or selection classes for international or international high performance competition, and
(3) championships where such participation is prohibited in the championship selection procedures. See DR119.1.
b. Mules are also eligible to compete in Eventing competitions at the levels of Beginner Novice, Novice, and Training only.

Or do they not give out that info. I know they would not give the names but I sure would be interested how many were Yay or Nay.

P.S. I would love to see an Eventing Mule.

[goeslikestink]

i want your mule hahaha shes lovely and such a good girly for a 4yr old shes yuuuuuuuuuuuuummmmmmmmmy

[bornfreenowexpensive]

This is silly.

I have been to various trail/endurance clinics where mules were among the equine participants. Horses -- including my own -- who had never seen a mule before either (1) didn't notice or (2) got over it pretty quick.

Numerous HTs are held on farms/ranches where other livestock are kept. Cows, goats, pigs (which can be a real problem for some horses), minis, chickens, emus, llamas, donkeys, you-name-it. My mares lived at a facility with some research zebras. I've shown youngsters in hand in county-fair shows with mule babies. You know what? They deal with it.

I have a mule. When a new horse comes in they look him over, sniff him, and that's the end of it. They don't react any differently than they would to another horse.

This is about riders, not horses. Perhaps we need to have some Meet-a-Mule sessions for eventers. :D

I would like to know the 'evidence' behind the Technical Committee's promulgation.




Well....I have one mare that I couldn't get within 1000 yards of a mule. There was a field of them next door...I tried many times to hack by them, get her used to them. It wasn't pretty. Of course, she is also freaked out by the mini-donkey that lives up the road......well, also sheep, cows, goats and often paint horses (so she has a few issues). That said....I would not be opposed to the rule even though I have a horse that would have a substantial issue.

I would make sure to have someone in your corner at the meeting and stress that they are already permitted in dressage and FEI driving/endurance. And also perhaps who knows the political history as to why they were banned to begin with.

[cssutton]

I have seen several mules in the hunt field and they seemed to do very well.

I have not seen him for several years, but at one time Larry Jenkins was hunting a mule with Keswick.

Those of you who know Larry know that he was the power behind the throne for Rodney and a great horseman.

I did kid him about riding a lowly mule when he has spent his life working with some of the very best horses.

He really did like the mule.

I don't know if he still rides a mule.

CSSJR

If we do not wish to lose our freedom, we must learn to tolerate our
neighbor's right to freedom even though he might express that freedom
in a manner we consider to be eccentric.

[cssutton]

I meant to ask how mules do in the xcountry phase. That calls for a strong gallop and constant speed over fences.

Can a mule do that as well as a TB?

CSSJR

[mtnmomma]

Cathy Weischhoff evented a mule named Kit over 20 years ago. They went prelim and placed quite often. Kit brayed after returning to the trailer but the horses didn't seem to mind.

[VCT]

That mule is awesome!! I also love the pics of the big grey mule and the pony club mule who was smart enough to take care of his young charge when the jumps got too big!

I had a small (I think its considered a small) donkey show up at my place on Thanksgiving day. He escaped from an amish neighbors pasture who is keeping it for someone who is "away" for an extended time. Essentially, they had the donkey and a couple horses basically dropped in their lap. So anyways the donk is staying here for now. He needs his feet looked after in a bad way and so we're getting him fixed up. He has not tried to escape here, though I guess they were having a helluva time with him at my neighbors. He's living in the run in shed with the old red pony. In fact, its hard to take him out of there. You have to kinda drag him and bribe him with food. He's white and has very very very long ears.

[JER]

Well....I have one mare that I couldn't get within 1000 yards of a mule. There was a field of them next door...I tried many times to hack by them, get her used to them. It wasn't pretty. Of course, she is also freaked out by the mini-donkey that lives up the road......well, also sheep, cows, goats and often paint horses (so she has a few issues). That said....I would not be opposed to the rule even though I have a horse that would have a substantial issue.


But you seem to understand that your mare is an exception.

I have a retired eventer (a great Prelim/foxhunter/jumper) who won't go anywhere near a piece of paper. Because show ribbons look like paper from a distance, he always had to have a groundperson to pick up his ribbon and he had to stand a good distance away from the other horses who were getting ribbons. There's always a work-around.

Most of the time, a mule gets a double-take and a WTF look from a horse and then it's all fine. Donkeys usually cause more disruption.

And really, how many mules are going to show up to horse trials if the USEF opens the floodgates?

[TB or not TB?]

Oh I'm sure it would be a TIDALWAVE of mules. In fact I bet they would start holding separate events just to accommodate the great mule movement. :lol::lol::lol:

[jenm]

I need to get the rule changed so I can event her!!! Anybody else out there agree?


YES!! :yes:

Love your mule and am thrilled to see your video! I have a two year old mule and can't wait to event with him. I will gladly support any effort to get the rules changed.

The current technical committee that won't consider changing the rules can Kiss My A__! :winkgrin:

[jenm]

Any advice or support from active trainers or UL competitors (especially those connected with the current technical committee) would be greatly appreciated. I'd also love to hear from anyone who competes a mule in unrecognized horse trials (it was suggest to me that letters of support from organizers might be helpful). My daughter competes her mule heavily in horse-only competions, including recognized dressage shows, and only once have we had a horse be bothered by the mule.



Katie, I don't think you are a member of the Mules Only Yahoo group, are you? That group might be a good resource to look for help. Also, I was planning on taking my boy to Mule Days in Bishop this year. I wonder if it would make sense to start a petition with signatures? We can connect offline to strategize or I could just come visit you sometime!

xo,

~jen

[JER]

b. Mules are also eligible to compete in Eventing competitions at the levels of Beginner Novice, Novice, and Training only.

I have to say that this part of the proposed rule change made me laugh.

Smurfs on mules!!! :lol::lol::lol:

::the horror, the horror::

[flea]

I evented my mule at schooling events in Texas. She was great fun. As far as the speed etc., she did fine at the novice level. She was only about 14 hands so we probably would not have gone above that. It was great to have such a level headed eventing partner. I found it kind of funny. We expect horses to fling themselves off of banks, into water, across ditches, all kinds of terrain. We expect them to get used to clippers, trailers, all manner of tack. However, the sight of a mule is too much to ask. I will say occasionally at an open show a particular horse would take offense. Most couldn't have cared less. I just stayed clear of the offended horse. I saw more horses upset by paint ponies than the mule!

[eventer4ever]

As the owner of the mule that started this thread, I am soooooo upset. I haven't checked up on here for a few days and just realized that the rule was accepted. I was already having a bad day. I was hoping for some good news to help me cope with all the snow we have in Indiana!

This is just plain ridiculous. It's eventing for goodness sake! My mule is not even remotely close to destructive at a horse show. If a horse was that upset by my mule, they shouldn't be at the show.

I will just keep eventing unrecognized stuff for this summer........ But we are going to push this again and again and again until they either see our side or give up.

Katie, let me know what we need to do to get more rallying behind this.

Let's PLEASE get mules into recognized eventing........it looks like my mule will be going to a recognized dressage show before a recognized event. Who would have thought?

Erica and her awesome jumping mule, Mirabella

[dainty do]

For those who would like to see a few more pictures of eventing mules, try this link

http://www.luckythreeranch.com/history.html

[kashmere]

This seems really... well, silly. (the proposal being dismissed, i mean.) Was it the Rolex that recently featured a water jump that was a giant wooden duck? And other such fences? If a horse can handle a humungous wooden duck... why not a mule? And isn't one of the greatest strengths of the eventing competition that it asks a horse to really, really trust his rider? And doesn't that imply a great deal of trainability and get-over-it-ability? And shouldn't a horse that can reach the level of trust etc. it takes to compete in any event be able to just deal with a mule?

I... I don't get it.

It's rendered my syntax incomprehensible.

[jenm]

This is just plain ridiculous. It's eventing for goodness sake! My mule is not even remotely close to destructive at a horse show. If a horse was that upset by my mule, they shouldn't be at the show.

But we are going to push this again and again and again until they either see our side or give up.

Katie, let me know what we need to do to get more rallying behind this.

Let's PLEASE get mules into recognized eventing........it looks like my mule will be going to a recognized dressage show before a recognized event. Who would have thought?



Erica, I'm right there with you!! And if you need a break from the snow, Katie and I are enjoying 70 degree weather here in Northern California. Come on out for some sunshine and camaraderie!

[TB or not TB?]

From the Lucky Three Ranch website: "She’d also come to appreciate the mule’s powerful sense of self-preservation"

Perhaps to fix eventing, we need to incorporate some MULE blood into the gene pool. :D (And yes, I understand the genetic ridiculousness of that statement)

[cssutton]

To correct or perhaps modify my earlier post:

I received an email from a friend who hunts with Keswick who assures me that Larry rides the classiest TB's in the field.

Whether the mule story was a joke he played on me or a one time thing, I have not yet determined.

At any rate, he is not riding one now and has not in the several years my friend has hunted with them.

CSSJR

If we do not wish to lose our freedom, we must learn to tolerate our
neighbor's right to freedom even though he might express that freedom
in a manner we consider to be eccentric.

[TheBrightSide06]

I want a mule really badly!! Can you do horse trials, dressage shows, or jumpers with them?

[eventer80]

I will help lobby!!! I grew up showing mules and loved it!! I will go buy one just to event if we can get something started!!

[JER]

I'd have to get a new mule to event. Any excuse for more mules...

My current mule would love to go to Rolex -- but only for the food and shopping.

[emlauber]

Loved it!

[HWilliams]

Does anyone have pictures of Cathy eventing her mule prelim? I would love to see that!
And your mule is awesome! I have seen videos and pics of mule jumping in Ohio. They can just crazy high!!!

[flea]

Reopening this thread. I started eventing on a mule but have evented horses for while now. It looks like I may be getting a nice paint mule and plan to event. Any more progress on mules being accepted or must we stick to scooping HT?

[KateWooten]

A lot of horses spook at my pony. What can I say... she does have a pale snout and eyeliner.

Here's me on a gaited foxhunting muley - does my ass look big ?

http://i46.photobucket.com/albums/f135/joePony/PB200192_edited.jpg

My trainer was given these two foxhunting mules to get fit for hunting. They jumped like mules, right up to the base, stop, and catleap. She worked all summer getting them to jump nicely, smoothly... you guessed it, the owner came to try them in the fall and was aghasted - he almost fell out the side door every time. You've ruined my mules ! She spent the next week yanking them to a stop before every jump and he went on to have a great foxhunting season ;)

[Fillabeana]

Oh fer cryin' out loud...

If you've ever been on a horse that saw a llama, or alpaca, for the first time, you'd know just what disruptive is. Horses seem to react the same way when they get a whiff of Mountain Lion or Bear, out on the trail. It can be a true dangerous freak-out. However, I have also never met a horse that couldn't, through simply being pastured next to alpacas for a few days, get completely OK with the alpaca/llama thing.

A trailer full of pigs? Yes, disruptive, had to be discontinued from open/breed show 'trail' classes.

If mules are disruptive to horses, why do pack strings have a ridden horse followed by several pack mules?

According to the USEF rules as I see them, mules are NOT disruptive to dressage, driving, or endurance horses (who are usually Arabians, FWIW) but cannot be exposed to Thoroughbreds.
Apparently, though, mules ARE disruptive toward selection committees for international competition in dressage.

Really, given the fact that mules have an extraordinary ability (beyond any horses) to jump and clear an obstacle from a standstill, wouldn't that make them less susceptible to a XC jumping wreck?

Perhaps if mules were accepted, during a year or two of 'transition', anyone entered in an event, who is concerned about their horse's reaction to a mule, could have a mule boarded at their own facility for a week or so until the horse was OK with it. You pay the board, someone will find a gentle mule as an acquaintance.

[jenm]

Reopening this thread. I started eventing on a mule but have evented horses for while now. It looks like I may be getting a nice paint mule and plan to event. Any more progress on mules being accepted or must we stick to scooping HT?

Watermarkfarm was working with some people on putting a petition together, but I'm not sure where it stands. It seems ridiculous that the dressage world allows mules to compete, but not the eventing world.

I ride once a month with Brian Sabo and will continue to talk with him about mules in the eventing world. My mule is getting backed this summer and then I will also ride him with Brian this fall. Maybe I can convert him into a mule lover! :winkgrin:

[Kadenz]

Have to say it's kind of ironic that mules are allowed in recognized dressage competitions (although a couple of judges seemed to be confused by it at first), yet apparently not in eventing?

My trainer coaches a trailer-in student who rides a mule in dressage. She has showed with us a few times, and it was fun to have "the mule" in our aisle. I could've found my way to our stalls blindfolded, just by following his braying. :D I don't recall any of the "hothouse flower" dressage horses being afraid of him.

[jackalini]

FantASStic stories, people! Loff the long ears, very cute.

Equal opportunity for equids, because your mules will make my mare's long ears look positively proportional and I bet a bray during a dressage test would liven things up a bit!

[sungleska]

Mules can generally out jump many horses. I have been to quite a few draft horse pulls and they usually have mule jumping prior to the pull. I have seen some tiny mules flat footed jump over some huge jumps way taller than they were. A good riding mule is hard to beat.

[kkindley]

very cool! There was a boy at Pony Club Games Nationals years back that rode a mule. I believe that's all he rode.

Would be cool to see them event!

[Calamber]

For those who have been following this discussion, I took USEA's advice and worked with another COTH member, Erica, to submit a Rule Change Proposal regarding mules in USEF-sanctioned events to USEF. It may now be viewed online at USEF's website. Here is the rule change proposal:
http://www.usef.org/documents/ruleChanges/085-08.pdf
085-08.pdf (application/pdf Object)



This is only the start of a long process, which involves review of the proposed rule change within both USEA and USEF, voting on the rule at the 2009 USEF annual meeting, etc. The proposal may not be successful, but it's a start. Thanks to everyone for your support. Now we need the support of folks on various USEA committees!

Why not USEF championships, selection trials, the observation and other competitive class your mentioned? Why not the whole ball of wax at once?
They may as well discuss the whole question. It is totally silly and would seem to have some relationship regarding those equids which the USEF would like to see improve the various breeds. Why not mules? Don't we have enough hutzpah to allow outcrosses like that and still maintain our "dignity" about "purebreds". Maybe the mule could solve a whole host of soundness and digestive issues with the horses.

I am not the person who saw this but I was told that there was a history channel? program discussing the numbers of horses in upper level competitions in years past, I think jumpers as in Grand Prix, who had mule in their heritage. Perhaps someone can dig that up to help "spur" along the discussion so to speak. If needed I will try and contact my old friend who I have lost contact with in Ohio. It was her mother who saw this show.

Another little interesting insight into the mule versus horse question came from the military. They could not use mules on caissons because the mules would not run into gun and cannon fire. It was more of a "hell no, I won't go" matter. That could also have been because the mules did not trust the drivers that they had to use. I do not know if this is indicative of a mule's famous stubborness. I do know they have a very strong sense of self preservation which is why my father would always say that I should get a mule to ride, more surefooted and I suppose he thought, smarter than a horse. The ears always baffled me as to how I could get the bridle over them. Did not really matter because we could not afford either but he did like to tease me.

[flea]

I am afraid a horse can't have mule in it's heritage as they are sterile. There was one Molly at Texas A&M long ago that could concieve and one in the seventies called Blue Moon that foaled. I am unaware of any others. Too bad!

[freshman]

[I]I am sorry to report that your rule proposal was disapproved. Apparently (I was not at the meeting), the USEF Eventing Technical Committee was adamant that mules would be a disruption to the horses during competition and were not willing to endorse the rule proposal.

My god, most horses have a bigger fit and phobia of miniature horses than mules or donkeys! Are they banned, too? Now that you mention it, I had a horse that was terrified of small dogs... Does this mean that we can ban Jack Russell from USEF events, too?

[Watermark Farm]

Reopening this thread. I started eventing on a mule but have evented horses for while now. It looks like I may be getting a nice paint mule and plan to event. Any more progress on mules being accepted or must we stick to scooping HT?

No progress. I have done nothing more.

Mules are still persona non grata for USEA-recognized events.

I'm buoyed by the fact that if the dressage folks could see fit to let mules compete, there is still a spark of hope for eventing. But it took 10 years of hard work by mule enthusiasts for this to happen.

I was told by people familiar with the rule change process, and USEA's rule change committee in particular, that the only real hope of enacting a rule change is to get a member of the USEF Eventing Technical Committee (which is made up mostly of BNTs and other such movers and shakers) to submit the rule change proposal from within the committee. It would take a lot of educating and lobbying the committee members to help it pass the first hurdle.

It is all very possible, but it would take effort. If you are serious about recognized events, I'd stick to a horse at this point.

My mule-eventing daughter placed 2nd in BN on her mule at Eventful Acres (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=owKywchh56o) (unrecognized) in September. Everyone enjoyed having the mule at the event (except the two horses who were "distracted" by him). The facility owner even gave a speech about the mule during awards. :)

In 5 years of showing this mule in literally hundreds of horse show classes, Pony Club rallies & camps (Odie is quite famous in Sierra Pacific Region), playdays, trail rides, trailering into a large eventing barn for lessons.....I can honestly say most horses' reactions are to view the mule a bit suspiciously or curiously. Most wind up liking him so much that he is regularly used as a "lead" horse for XC clinics. Here's a photo of Odie taking his C-1 rating (he's on the right). (http://xa.yimg.com/kq/groups/20890287/homepage/name/451633?type=sn)

List of current USEF Eventing Committee --- They make/decide the rule change proposals. (http://www.usef.org/_IFrames/AboutUs/Committee/CommitteeDisplay.aspx).

[Watermark Farm]

I ride once a month with Brian Sabo and will continue to talk with him about mules in the eventing world.

Jen, Yves very kindly talked to Brian about this and they both agreed banning mules was kind of silly. Yves is very eager to see Demi event Odie at a recognized event.

[BigRuss1996]

"Kit" (Cathy W.'s mule) not only evented at Recognized events before the ban but she competed and placed at Radnor Three Day event in the long format days....I competed against her and saw her go many times as I competed at a lot of the same events she did. I believe it was shortly after that that the ban went into place. I also don't remember horses really freaking out about her.
I believe this all took place shortly after the weight petition (to get rid of the weight requirement for the endurance phase) ...I remember signing it.
Maybe you all should start a petition to allow mules to compete and take it to events this year and ask riders, etc. to sign it. It will definately give you an idea of how many would be opposed to it and if the majority signs then I think USEF would be more inclined to consider allowing it.....just an idea...

[eventer4ever]

This thread was started about my mule and I would love to be able to take her to recognized events! I love to jump her. She actually carried a 14 year old over her first crossrails last weekend and was perfect.

Watermark Farm and I submitted something a few years ago, but as she said, we have to "rally the troops" to get more people that make the decisions on board.

On a personal note, my mule and I have been focusing on pleasure mule shows the past year and she has been racking up ribbons in all kinds of events! Hunter under saddle, showmanship, halter, western pleasure, contesting, etc. She is so diversified! Much more so than my horse; she seems to enjoy learning new things. I am now learning how to rope off of her! Hopefully, we will progress to real cows later this year....

Erica

[MeghanDACVA]

I didn't read all the posts so this may have already been said.

Cathy Weischoff used to have an event mule.