Unbridled's Song?

[Bogie]

I read in another forum that Unbridled's Song's progeny have had soundness issues? Is that true?

[DickHertz]

I'm not sure, but I think most sires these days thrown unsound babies. Maybe it has something to do with most sires only running 10-12 times...just a guess.

[vineyridge]

Yes. That's why it's so important what mares are sent to him.

[Drvmb1ggl3]

Unbridled's Song does have a name for throwing unsoundness. Whether it's warranted or not, one would have to provide statistics to prove it, which would be kinda hard to do. But, yes, he has name for throwing unsound offspring.

As to there being more unsound horses know, well that is something people like to roll off, but once again, one would need to provide statistics to prove it rather that just anecdotal evidence. If you read historical books on racing it appears they had their share of breakdowns in the old days.
One thing that is true is that horses make less starts now that in the past, avg number of starts has decreased in the last several decades. Some people like to wave that one in the air and say it's because horses are inherently less sound now. Yet there are all kinds of other factors that can and could contribute to that, purse structures, numbers of horses in training, different training approaches.
Besides, if you raced horses as often as they used to race them 50 years ago (2yos with up to 20 starts) you'd have mobs on forums like this demanding that trainers be hung from the rafters.

[tbmorgan]

Well, here's a concept...run them LESS frequently, over a LONGER period of time! How about having colts run their 3 yr. old year and then, instead of retiring to stud after running enough races that you can still count on your fingers, COME BACK at 4...and heck...even at 5! Prove their soundness and longevity and truly earn the right to be a breeding stallion!
(I'm not holding my breath, by the way...big Kudos to Curlin but he's a major exception, not the rule, sadly.)

Katja

[JER]

Unbridled's Song also throws height which might be part of the problem.

He is 17hh and many of his offspring are as well.

[miss_critic]

If you believe in evolution, how can breeding a horse that retires unsound help the breed? Seems to me I hear about Unbridled Song break downs or retirements more than not.

[Twomanydawgs]

Yes alot of his babies do grow to be huge but they need the legs to be able to carry that big body...look at the mare's pics...long sloping pasterns..spindly legs...I have a 17.1 2 yr old colt by Sweetsouthernsaint BUT he has the bone to support his big body. I'm not going to race him but if I was planning on racing him, he would not be started until late in his 3 yr old yr.

[cloudyandcallie]

I don't breed but for those who do, they should check out not how much money was won by a horse, but how long the horse raced and if he/she retired sound. Like the Loyal Pal ads say about him racing, was it 9 years or so? I "lucked" up with my mare, as I bought her w/o papers and by the time I figured out her tattoo and found out she had Round Table on one side and War Admiral on the other, I was lucky as Round Table was the leading broodmare sire, and he raced in the triple crown and was a strong big bodied horse, and War Admiral was the same, except he had that 'tude problem, which is inherited! So I didn't know about Unbridled's Song until I saw it on another thread. Good to know when I do buy another OTTB or two, to make sure I get another sound one. It is hard enough to keep a horse sound while racing, but to have the ones who are born with issues of heredity, it is awful. Like there are 2 more Barbaros out there, a full brother 2 yr old and a full brother yearling, and I expect their legs will shatter just like Barbaro's did, for reasons of heredity and the racing industy, not because of "accidents" or "missteps". Will things change, no way, cause the racing industry wants speed, and excitement. too bad for the horses, and for those of us who would like to see mature horses racing on turf, and training on turf.

[cloudyandcallie]

hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. isn't Curlin' still racing cause his owners got in trouble with the law and he is in limbo or was taken from the owners? big story in newspapers about that a few weeks ago. I don't know the facts, but he is not retired to stud because of issues with $$$$ fraud or something like that.
One of my friends bought an old OTTB gelding and showed him locally for 5 yrs or so.. He had been on the track 9 or 10 yrs and then his owner in SC sold him. My friends decided that they wanted a big mare 1/2 TB and 1/2 WB, 5 yrs old, so they sold the old TB gelding cheap, and ended up with a stringhalt mare. Their old gelding is giving lessons at a local barn. And still going strong at 20plus years of age. They tried to buy him back but the owner wouldn't sell him. So the old tough guys who survived the track just keep on going like the energizer bunny.

[Laurierace]

Average starts per runner:

17.04 Boundary
16.61 Rahy
14.82 Cherokee Run
14.34 Distorted Humor
12.75 Unbidled's Song
12.43 A.P. Indy
11.38 Storm Cat
11.17 Pulpit
10.95 Elusive Quality
9.43 Forestry
8.47 Giant's Causeway

[vineyridge]

I don't think it's just Unbridled's Song by himself that is the problem with his foals. Except for his sire line, he is from lines with the reputation of being extremely sound.

It's when he is put to mares that reinforce the unsoundness in the sire line that the foal is at risk. JMHO

[Laurierace]

I have a mare in foal to Buddha right now, his sire is Unbridled Song. He was not the soundest horse in the world by any means but ran very successfully throughout his short career. My mare retired 100% sound, no bute, no nothing. Her problem was breathing, she had three throat surgeries, each of which allowed her to run successfully for a couple of months. I figure Buddha can definitely breath if he made over 1 mil in a short career, so hopefully she is sound enough for the both of them. God help us if the foal gets her wind and his legs. In the end it really is a crap shoot. One thing is for sure, I am going to have a beautiful foal as they are both gorgeous.

[Vesper Sparrow]

I just acquired a Buddha gelding for lower-level dressage and hopefully foxhunting. He IS gorgeous. He turns 3 end of May and has some polo training but we're taking it slow and easy with him. He has a very nice temperament.
I just hope he doesn't get too big, though, since I'm only 5'4". :)

[hitchinmygetalong]

If you breed a stallion to one mare, and resulting foal has conformational/soundness issues, the stallion is throwing 100% unsound.

If you breed a stallion to two mares, and one mare produces a foal with conformational/soundness issues, the stallion is throwing 50% unsound.

Rinse and repeat.

It's a numbers game, and we are missing half the equation by not analyzing every single mare.

Have fun with that.