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View Full Version : Okay, I don't want to start a revolution but...



pines4equines
Apr. 7, 2008, 12:49 PM
Here's what I heard. We are in an area that the county is putting in a horse park. This horse park will have 2 show rings and some trails. It's about 50 acres but they might be able to add another 250 on. It is going to be great for schooling and trail riding as we have plans to incorporate all sorts of obstacles and even event-type jumps.

Anyway, I run an e-newsletter in our area and I have been talking about his park on the e-newsletter about how there will be show rings, trails and everything for everyone horsey...

I kid you not but I got a response from a hunter rider asking that we make sure that the trail riders are not seen from the show rings. Meaning that we're a bunch of rag-tag horse people.

I have to say the snobbery in the horse industry knows no bounds. The horse industry is suffering from a lack of newcomers to the industry. Apparently kids are more involved in cheaper sports such as soccer, internet (oops that's what I'm doing) and other. And less kids are getting involved with horses. When we ostracize one group within our own group, we divide ourselves. We need to stay together as what we are...HORSE PEOPLE and welcome newbies, no matter what discipline they want to ride.

www.horselife.com is trying to get an advertising campaign started similiar to the "Got Milk", RV and boating ads to generate new people in to the horse industry. So let's forget the snobbery and welcome all horse people of all kinds.

Sorry I guess I ranted...:eek:

pandorasboxx
Apr. 7, 2008, 01:00 PM
I kid you not but I got a response from a hunter rider asking that we make sure that the trail riders are not seen from the show rings.:eek:

LOL what an arse. Mebbe the hunter rider was just concerned that anything outside the ring like trail riders would frighten or spook the sensitive show horses and cause an accident? :lol:

Either way, it's pretty hilarious. I admit I've frightened myself some early mornigs with my trail get-up.:eek:

AnotherRound
Apr. 7, 2008, 01:12 PM
I understand your reaction to her, but please please brush it off. I would bet few people would agree with her. If so, make the horse park for all the other people in the world except those few. :cool:

I wish you luck - I would love nothing more than to have a public horse park in our area. Very nice, congrats on all your work.

Auventera Two
Apr. 7, 2008, 01:51 PM
You have no idea how many times I've heard stuff like this. Somebody from coth posted over on the manure pile that endurance horses are just hillbilly nags. :lol:

Seriously, just brush it off. People are threatened and offended that a group of riders don't polish their boots and obsess endlessly over bling and prestigious names on the pedigree.

I quite enjoy my hillbilly nag and I think she's lovely. A truly beautiful mare with a tremendous heart and spirit and nothing is like the feeling of viewing the great open wildnerness from between those cute little bay ears.

I do agree to some extent that some recreational trail riders have made a bad name for us all by drinking and riding. That's a practice I don't agree with at all and I wish was ilegal. Around here, it's common to see groups of weekend warriors with a beer in one hand, reins in the other, big mud boots crammed through their stirrups, pajama pants, ill fitting saddles, crappy looking skinny/wormy horses, and trailers that should be enjoying their retirement in the junk heap. But seriously, they don't represent all trail or endurance riders. I think most of us be sure to have safe tack, healthy happy horses, and we ride safely. We don't always match, the tack isn't always clean, the horse may be muddy or dirty, but that's just what happens when you trail ride. And I see nothing wrong with it.

There will always be Arena Queens and then Trail Riders.

ChocoMare
Apr. 7, 2008, 02:17 PM
HI kid you not but I got a response from a hunter rider asking that we make sure that the trail riders are not seen from the show rings.

Hmmm, sounds like that person needs a little Southern phraseology: Welll, bless your heart! We'll take that under advisement." :winkgrin: :lol:

Puhleeze. :rolleyes: Just another reason why I left that world behind over 20 years ago.

clanter
Apr. 7, 2008, 02:41 PM
just tell her to shut her eyes

Just Wondering
Apr. 7, 2008, 02:47 PM
Somebody from coth posted over on the manure pile that endurance horses are just hillbilly nags. :lol:




Yep. Hillbilly nags that are in the best shape of any discipline in the world! (per my vet)

katarine
Apr. 7, 2008, 02:55 PM
is it possible that the H/J in question was thinking of the commotion big riding groups can make, heading out? Example: just say it's 12-15 racking horses heading out down a hard-pack dirt road- that is RIGHT beside the arena...that's going to make some noise. Or a bunch of kids on ponies, yee-hawing a little bit where you could hear the racket but not see it- or someone on a fresh horse getting the spun & dumped deal off their horse- horses can be bothered by stuff like that. That is potentially totally distracting to those in the ring. Maybe not- maybe she does look down her nose..but maybe so, that's all I'm saying.

I've been on both sides: showing your horse in what the HORSE expects is a horse show environment, with its own unique noises, smells, sights, etc...only to have a cidiot BANG BANG BANG her STROLLER from the top of the bleachers to the bottom, in an indoor, echo-y arena, thanks, or been riding a perfect rail class, in the zone- when another cidiot SLAPS an umbrella open just over the rail from you, thanks. I don't want the uber quiet of dressage, I just recognize that there are potential distractions that are reasonable to discuss.

And where did drinking come into this discussion? I rode yesterday with Mr Kat and we packed in a six pack, packed OUT over a twelvepack. How DARE we drink a beer or three over a 4 hour ride, AND pick up trash? Devils!! Fruit of the devil's loins.

Auventera Two
Apr. 7, 2008, 03:02 PM
is it possible that the H/J in question was thinking of the commotion big riding groups can make, heading out? Example: just say it's 12-15 racking horses heading out down a hard-pack dirt road- that is RIGHT beside the arena...that's going to make some noise. Or a bunch of kids on ponies, yee-hawing a little bit. Totally fine to do so ...but potentially totally distracting to those in the ring.

I've been on both sides: showing your horse in what the HORSE expects is a horse show environment, with its own unique noises, smells, sights, etc...only to have a cidiot BANG BANG BANG her STROLLER from the top of the bleachers to the bottom, in an indoor, echo-y arena, thanks, or been riding a perfect rail class, in the zone- when another cidiot SLAPS an umbrella open just over the rail from you, thanks. I don't want the uber quiet of dressage, I just recognize that there are potential distractions that are reasonable to discuss.

And where did drinking come into this discussion? I rode yesterday with Mr Kat and we packed in a six pack, packed OUT over a twelvepack. How DARE we drink a beer or three over a 4 hour ride, AND pick up trash? Devils!! Fruit of the devil's loins.

Well, that's why I like the old saying that you can't control everyone else at the show, but instead you control your own horse. ;) I've met some crazy crap out on the trails that my horse sure didn't expect. A bear, a mini horse loose in the woods, a helicoper landing in a hay field, kids in a swimming pool, trucks driving down the trail, ATVs screaming around curves,

Yeah, it sucks when you get a spook or a leap or a snort and blow, but hey, it happens. I got dumped once over a stopsign. God forbid somebody just run out there and erect a stopsign RIGHT IN FRONT OF US when it wasn't there 3 seconds ago. Those darned government workers anyhow. :lol: It's just the fun and exhileration of riding horses. If we wanted perfect behavior and no chance of upset, we'd ride mechanical machines that didn't have brains or personalities. We want a certain level of adrenaline and "unknown" or we wouldn't have horses in our lives. Heck, my adrenaline has shot through the roof standing in my kitchen window watching that Crazyabian gallop a thousand miles an hour straight toward a pasture fence.

clanter
Apr. 7, 2008, 03:10 PM
We used to show in Huntington West Virginia...to get into the ring you have to go under the miniature roller coaster which was running

We left our horses in Kentucky to be shown on the county fair circuit because the fairs would have whirly things set up next to the ring… you came out with a show horse that could be ridden anywhere and not blink an eye at anything

katarine
Apr. 7, 2008, 03:39 PM
If we wanted perfect behavior and no chance of upset, we'd ride mechanical machines that didn't have brains or personalities.

A2, be fair, no head in the clouds here. Answer that question when you've worked very hard to prepare and spent a ton of time and money and miles...to have a class blown for you, courtesy of the cidiot and her stroller. I don't want to live under glass, I just want a fair shake at showing my horse, nothing more than that. And that's all I'm suggesting the 'whiner' is asking for. Don't be so busy making out like you and your hillbilly nag (your words, I like my horses better than that, thanks) out to be oh so superior or you are NO better that the 'show queen' you are intent on looking down on, what with her polished boots and all that.

pines4equines
Apr. 7, 2008, 03:46 PM
This is why I LOVE trail people! Just like your horses, nothing rankles you! Good on you! And see you on the trails one of these days. I'll be riding the bay!

Frustraltered
Apr. 7, 2008, 04:03 PM
This is an alter

Auventera Two
Apr. 7, 2008, 05:16 PM
If we wanted perfect behavior and no chance of upset, we'd ride mechanical machines that didn't have brains or personalities.

A2, be fair, no head in the clouds here. Answer that question when you've worked very hard to prepare and spent a ton of time and money and miles...to have a class blown for you, courtesy of the cidiot and her stroller. I don't want to live under glass, I just want a fair shake at showing my horse, nothing more than that. And that's all I'm suggesting the 'whiner' is asking for. Don't be so busy making out like you and your hillbilly nag (your words, I like my horses better than that, thanks) out to be oh so superior or you are NO better that the 'show queen' you are intent on looking down on, what with her polished boots and all that.

I showed whole life up until the last few years. One of the most notable experiences was when I was showing a walking horse and we were flying around the rail as a pickup truck drove right up to the arena fence, a guy got out and slammed the door. The horse jumped about 3 feet sideways, and we still pinned 3rd. It happens.

I've had a LOT of scary things happen at shows. Cows near the dressage ring, an out of control horse slamming into my mare in the warmup pen, ambulances going by with sirens running, the PA system screaming in an ear splitting crackle. Those are the ones I can remember offhand. I'm sure there's more I can't even recall.

Ever shown under a dressage judge who had the audacity to get up and walk out of the judges tent and bump into the flower pot on her way past?! Ohh the horrors. Maybe she should be called an idiot and blamed for my horse's spook? No. No one is to blame. It just happens. That's the chance you take when you haul your horse off your property and choose to ride it in a strange surroundings with other horses, their riders, and a bunch of spectators who aren't horse-wise.

If I've learned anything from trail, endurance and mounted search and rescue/patrol, it's that you ALWAYS expect the unexpected and ride through it with tact. The horse will usually respond in favor and you do the best you can.

I'm not looking down my nose at anyone. Only saying that you can't cry and whine when the world doesn't stop and stand still for you at a show. Have you ever been in a warmup ring? That's the most terrifying place at the whole show. I showed for years. And my horses did spook, and I had to just deal with it. I'm not better than anyone else. It just HAPPENS. Thats life when you ride horses.

If the hunter riders don't want the "distraction" then they could spend some more time training and desensitizing their show horses to handle things. I didn't see the show manager at the big dressage show running across the road to tell the farmer he had to move his cows because their presence was scaring the dressage horses. Those of us with scared horses just had to deal with it and welcome the training experience.

Nothing but my opinion of course. ;) :cool:

Auventera Two
Apr. 7, 2008, 05:19 PM
This is why I LOVE trail people! Just like your horses, nothing rankles you!

That's right.

Just this weekend I learned a valuable lesson. My young mare spooked at a boulder on the side of the trail as we galloped past it and the guy I was riding with said "Just ride! Don't worry!" So I kept my eyes on the trail, my butt in the saddle and we galloped past a dozen more boulders without a reaction. Just shut up and ride. No excuses. My new motto.

katarine
Apr. 7, 2008, 06:09 PM
People are threatened and offended that a group of riders don't polish their boots and obsess endlessly over bling and prestigious names on the pedigree.


Looks like a view from down one's nose to me.

you showed walking horses, huh? And I thought you were all miss shock and awe about walking horses/big lick? Now you showed walkers? And they don't pin walkers, they tie them. Remember?

On second thought- nevermind. It's completely reasonable and delightful and fabulous to fly by on a herd of racking horses smack through the middle of a pack of blind leadliners, followed closely by a ferris wheel on wheels, run by monkeys on crack, with hungy lions as passengers . Anything less is unacceptable and doesn't adequately test a horse's mettle. Not REALLY.

Huntertwo
Apr. 7, 2008, 06:25 PM
LOL what an arse. Mebbe the hunter rider was just concerned that anything outside the ring like trail riders would frighten or spook the sensitive show horses and cause an accident? :lol:

Either way, it's pretty hilarious. I admit I've frightened myself some early mornigs with my trail get-up.:eek:

LOL....ME thinks you're right!

I went to watch a Hunter show about a month ago and felt like I was at a darn PGA tournament. It was soooo silent I thought someone was holding up the "Quiet" signs you see during the professional Golf tournaments...:lol:

tpup
Apr. 7, 2008, 06:58 PM
We used to show in Huntington West Virginia...to get into the ring you have to go under the miniature roller coaster which was running

:D:lol::D:lol::D:lol:

What a riot!

Auventera Two
Apr. 8, 2008, 10:03 AM
LOL....ME thinks you're right!

I went to watch a Hunter show about a month ago and felt like I was at a darn PGA tournament. It was soooo silent I thought someone was holding up the "Quiet" signs you see during the professional Golf tournaments...:lol:


:lol: It's like that at the western pleasure shows too. People whisper to each other in the bleachers. I think the dressage grounds are even livlier with more commotion than that.

I really enjoyed watching some Saddlebred demos at our horse fair last year. The announcer told everyone to clap and cheer, whistle, pound the bleachers. He said that the Saddlebreds really show out when their fans make noise. It gave me goose bumps. Those big powerful horses really struttin' their stuff, getting bigger and puffier, the more noise everybody made. The riders had huge smiles on their faces, truly loving every minute.

Ahhh well, there's something for everyone!

Chief2
Apr. 8, 2008, 11:57 AM
I am wondering if the hunter person has a herd bound horse who would be distracted to see other horses going off into the woods, and become a PITA in the ring? Or perhaps while she would be showing her sister would be taking the companion horse off for a trail ride, and the same behavior would ensue? Either way, the behavior would result in a score reduction at the very least for this rider. Perhaps showing elsewhere would be a better choice for her.

Frankly, fifty acres (to start with) isn't really large enough to hide trail riding horses from those in the ring, so some tolerance is going to be needed at the start here. Once you get the adjoining parcel incorporated in, it will be easier. So, to keep peace in the family, I would position the ring away from the majority of trail heads on the total 300 acres (if possible) at the start of things. Then once the expansion goes in, you will be all set and everyone will be happy. Or as happy as they could probably be, anyways.

What is the motivator for getting dressed up like a penguin, only to ride in endless circles for a subjective judgement and maybe a ribbon or a score? I just don't get it. :(

Auventera Two
Apr. 8, 2008, 12:01 PM
What is the motivator for getting dressed up like a penguin, only to ride in endless circles for a subjective judgement and maybe a ribbon or a score? I just don't get it. :(

:lol: Buuwwwwhhhaaa I'm sorry but that was funny. I quit chasing my tail a few years ago. Life is too darned short.

ChocoMare
Apr. 8, 2008, 12:02 PM
What is the motivator for getting dressed up like a penguin, only to ride in endless circles for a subjective judgement and maybe a ribbon or a score? I just don't get it. :(

:lol: :lol: :lol: I love it!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

I basically summed that question up into one word, as I was riding home from a show in the rain. ... Purpose?

Funny, I just could never, ever answer that and so, chucked it all! I ride when I want, dressed how I want, doing what I want. Tis true freedom, to be sure. :yes:

pines4equines
Apr. 8, 2008, 12:03 PM
Arh, arh to Chief 2s last line about dressing like a penguin to ride in circles. Suzi Drnec of Hobby Horse CLothing Company was once quoted as saying: "Why pay thousands of dollars to wear something to ride around in circles?" (She sells less expensive westen show clothing.)

Arh, arh all the way to the barn!

CosMonster
Apr. 8, 2008, 01:09 PM
I think it's kind of funny that a thread that started out because a h/j made a snobby comment has turned into one demonstrating trail/endurance riders' snobbiness. :)

Seriously, though, I realize that most of you probably mean this in fun and don't look down on the majority of show riders you meet in real life. I just want to point out that show riders by no means have a monopoly on rudeness...as the OP said, "the snobbiness in this industry knows no bounds..." In fact, I grew up riding h/j and dressage, and wanted to try my hand at endurance for many years but didn't because of the condescending attitude I got from a lot of endurance riders--nevermind the fact that I'd ridden in the back country since I was little, they just assumed that because I was competing in dressage at the same time I must not have any idea of how to ride outside a ring. :lol: I don't care if people think I don't have as much experience as I do, but I do expect them not to be nasty about it.

Fortunately I later met a great group of people who gave me the help I needed to get started without treating me like a drooling idiot or a snobby airhead (both of which I hope aren't true :lol:), and am working towards my first 50. I think my first exposure to endurance riders was not representative of all of them, but I also don't think most h/j riders really care if someone rides by in bright pink biothane tack, either. Except maybe the young teen fashionista bunch, but who cares what a bunch of 13 y/os think? ;)

Huntertwo
Apr. 8, 2008, 03:17 PM
I understand your reaction to her, but please please brush it off. I would bet few people would agree with her. If so, make the horse park for all the other people in the world except those few. :cool:

I wish you luck - I would love nothing more than to have a public horse park in our area. Very nice, congrats on all your work.

Wouldn't that be great? Sadly, I don't know if CT has enough open land for a horse park. And if we do, you know developers are going to grab it first. :no:

I DO envy the people who live close to the Bucks County Horse Park in PA.
Hubby so badly wants to move back to PA to be near his family. I told him I'll go under one circumstance... I want to be within 20 miles of this place.

http://www.buckscountyhorsepark.org/ Man, I'd give anything to live close to this place...:(

Huntertwo
Apr. 8, 2008, 03:22 PM
We used to show in Huntington West Virginia...to get into the ring you have to go under the miniature roller coaster which was running

We left our horses in Kentucky to be shown on the county fair circuit because the fairs would have whirly things set up next to the ring… you came out with a show horse that could be ridden anywhere and not blink an eye at anything

We used to show at a local Fair that sounds very familiar to what you describe. :yes:

Outside the ring, we had the Fair (of course going on), pig races right near the rail, HELICOPTER rides within 200 feet of the ring, plus an assortment of carnival rides.

It was strange that few, if none of the horses in ring were ever bothered by it. Maybe too much going on for their brains to take it in??? :winkgrin:

JSwan
Apr. 8, 2008, 03:23 PM
I'm glad that your county is putting in a horse park! I'm sorry the hunter rider appeared to diss trail riders - but is it possible you misinterpreted her response?

I worked on a trail system long ago - and it was tough to try and balance all the needs and wants of the various groups. One of the problems that horse people have is people conducting loud or exuberant sports/activities near the horses. It's just a liability.

On the other hand - the equestrians need to realize that the parks are for everyone, and they're going to have to compromise a bit or risk being eliminated from the park system altogether.

Usually this comes up on multi-use trail plans - not so much different horse activities. Rather than make fun of the show rider - perhaps it's an opportunity for you to take a look at the plans, and see if improvements can be made, or if the designs are really good for horsemen. It could very well be that you notice a ring is too close to something like a pool, or another activity that isn't very compatible with horses.

I do think horse people need to get over a lot of this "pookums might get scared" response to everything. But for parks, it's really something that needs to be planned for. It's quite common for "horse trails" to be taken over by people racing around or otherwise abusing the park. So maybe making sure trails have easy access to a park employee or kiosk would be a good idea too.

Maybe treating her comment as an opportunity - rather than an insult - (even if that's what the rider intended), might prove helpful in making a really good park!

Good luck.


Here's what I heard. We are in an area that the county is putting in a horse park. This horse park will have 2 show rings and some trails. It's about 50 acres but they might be able to add another 250 on. It is going to be great for schooling and trail riding as we have plans to incorporate all sorts of obstacles and even event-type jumps.

Anyway, I run an e-newsletter in our area and I have been talking about his park on the e-newsletter about how there will be show rings, trails and everything for everyone horsey...

I kid you not but I got a response from a hunter rider asking that we make sure that the trail riders are not seen from the show rings. Meaning that we're a bunch of rag-tag horse people.

I have to say the snobbery in the horse industry knows no bounds. The horse industry is suffering from a lack of newcomers to the industry. Apparently kids are more involved in cheaper sports such as soccer, internet (oops that's what I'm doing) and other. And less kids are getting involved with horses. When we ostracize one group within our own group, we divide ourselves. We need to stay together as what we are...HORSE PEOPLE and welcome newbies, no matter what discipline they want to ride.

www.horselife.com (http://www.horselife.com) is trying to get an advertising campaign started similiar to the "Got Milk", RV and boating ads to generate new people in to the horse industry. So let's forget the snobbery and welcome all horse people of all kinds.

Sorry I guess I ranted...:eek:

pandorasboxx
Apr. 8, 2008, 04:58 PM
Outside the ring, we had the Fair (of course going on), pig races right near the rail, HELICOPTER rides within 200 feet of the ring, plus an assortment of carnival rides.
:winkgrin:

Yep. That would do it. Racing swine. :eek: We'd have been teleported into the next county before the porkers reached the finish line.

The mare does have her limits yanno and heaving, grunting porcine racers darting past would be it.

The helicopters swooping in would be the coup de grace.

Huntertwo
Apr. 8, 2008, 10:17 PM
Yep. That would do it. Racing swine. :eek: We'd have been teleported into the next county before the porkers reached the finish line.

The mare does have her limits yanno and heaving, grunting porcine racers darting past would be it.

The helicopters swooping in would be the coup de grace.

LOL... But, what was the funny part is that the horses weren't bothered by it..:confused: This is a real big busy fair - tractor pulls, tons of spectators, Helicopters, rides. - You name it, the horses had some sort of contact with it and no one seemed bothered. Strange.

Chief2
Apr. 8, 2008, 11:40 PM
This sounds like either the Berlin Fair or the Hebron fair. At Hebron, they even had a high school marching band circle the horse ring, playing whatever it was they played, while all of the rest was going on. Drums, tubas, marching uniforms with plumes, flags and the works. If he horses weren't bombproof before they got there, their nerves are shot by the time their owners were ready to leave.

The pig races start with the call to the post. When they are right next to the horse ring, it's a real trip! At one of the other local fairs (same set up, etc), we had an OTTB mare not long off the track whose owner wanted to try her in a hunt course. The poor woman got one foot into the stirrup, the call to the post went off, and the mare took off like a bat out of h*ll. Took the entire course counterclockwise, flying over whatever jumps were in her way, and screeched to a halt at the in gate. The rider survived by sheer guts and the element of surprise, hanging on half astride over the horse, her left foot in the stirrup and the right leg somewhere over the saddle, jumps and all. The mare (a lovely TB in all seriousness), was retired from hunt courses shortly thereafter.

As for being a snob, I am way beyond that, all penguin jokes aside. I was a concert flutist and am intimately aware of the the sheer amount of obsessive self-focus and tunnel vision needed to climb the levels and perform (show) well, and the size of the ego needed to sustain the climb to the top levels. Now that I am in another place and have given that part of it up, I now look back and realize the sheer amount of selfishness necessary, and lack of consideration to much else that was beyond me at the time of my climb. Music judgement is totally subjective, and so is showing. And the exact same qualities good musicians must have to achieve their goals apply to all show people in spades as well. There's a lot of 'me, me, me' involved in showing. I look at a lot of these folks, and wonder if the day will come for some of them when they will mature beyond the whole thing, and look back at their behavior with and honest eye. Once you see it in hindsight, the whole behavior is pretty disgusting.

So, it is far kinder to joke about penguins going around in circles and be perceived by the naive as a snob, than to vent one's spleen about how completely nauseatingly disgusting the whole showing enterprise can really be.

So, without any snobbishness at all, I reiterate:
What is the motivator for getting dressed up like a penguin, only to ride in endless circles for a subjective judgement and maybe a ribbon or a score? I just don't get it. (Only, really, I do.)

Auventera Two
Apr. 9, 2008, 10:13 AM
Great, insightful post Chief, thanks. :)

Huntertwo
Apr. 9, 2008, 02:29 PM
Chief2,
Of all the fairs in Ct. how did you know I was talking about the Berlin Fair? :lol::lol::lol:

We haven't shown there in a few years, but sadly, the parking lot for trailers is getting smaller and smaller as it is getting taken over by rides etc.

Not sure if you ever lived in the area, but it used to be a nice rural fair and now it is turning into a carnival atmosphere. Less and less animals every year... Cows, sheep etc. :no:

matryoshka
Apr. 9, 2008, 07:50 PM
I was thinking that the hunter person might have had a concern about us trail riders disturbing the show horses. I guess people can get pretty far removed from reality keeping to a little ring (at least, that is how I would feel circling in a little ring). I would hate to be the cause of a spook that unhorsed a rider in the show ring! It's easy for us trail riders to forget the level of focus in horse and rider required to perform well. You might not be able to stop ladies with strollers scaring the bejeezus out of our horses, but keeping unpredictable trail riders at a distance seems like a valid request. And I mean that trail horses are unpredictable from a show horse's point of view--not the riders.

I would think a nice row of trees would solve the problem nicely. Of course, that wouldn't keep out the sound of my rhythm beads, but it'll keep my bright blue tack from showing through!!

Hey, this reminds me of the time my horse and I unknowingly ventured close to a bomb-proofing clinic going on in a nearby show ring. We were in the woods and could hear the loud speaker. Next thing I know, there is gunfire! Rather than bolting, my horse got perfectly still and then behaved as though his life depended on my sanity. That was his best behavior the entire ride! Then when we approached the arena from the other side and he saw all the horses (and no blood), he went back to being his old self that gets excited around other horses.

Chief2
Apr. 9, 2008, 10:42 PM
HunterTwo, I half-own a Lusitano who was fascinated with the helicopter. It was going up and down near his trailer. The pig race placement could use some adjustment, but the apple pie in the big red house is still the best.

Berlin is trying to close down the horse venues as well. Ma Martins Round Up was held to a far less time allotment, strictly enforced, so they could have more room later in the afternoon for the performance groups, and no was working for the fair was very nice in their delivery of it either. The BOD no longer includes horse people, so they are moved to the more homogenized fair that is now typical throughout the state. Less horses, less liability, more room for junk. Hebron has stopped the horses shows all together for the same reason.

However, that said, the Durham fair reopened the horse showing venue this year when the Hills family did all the legwork to put on a team penning. It was a great success. However, they are now tied up in legal manuvering to keep the town of Middletown from declaring them a commercial enterprise, requiring permits for team pennings and shows, which the town can then deny and shut them down as well. It is going to court for appeal. It holds huge implications for towns throughout the state, and the developers are salivating. Whoever would have thought that the day would come when horses would no longer be welcome in the beautiful state of Connecticut?

Aventura Two, I don't know how insightful the post was. Just feelings long contained in this humble trail rider. I still think the positioning of the ring in the horse park really does warrant thought so that everyone can coexist happily and the park has a good chance of being a great success. It would be a shame if the whole thing fell apart before it ever got off the ground because of infighting and lack of real middle ground.

billiebob
Apr. 9, 2008, 10:55 PM
"I kid you not but I got a response from a hunter rider asking that we make sure that the trail riders are not seen from the show rings. Meaning that we're a bunch of rag-tag horse people."


Wow....are you sure the trail riders want to see those rag-tag hunter riders?:lol:

SonnysMom
Apr. 10, 2008, 08:36 AM
A few of you are saying maybe the hunter show riders should train their horses better before they come out into public to show. Most of the replies also seem to be from an adult point of view. Don't forget that the hunter shows will have a large number of classes for children. Likely there will be a green hunter and green pony classes.
We also all know that just because horse/pony is solid at home or even at the friend's ring down the street you add the extra excitement of a show atmophere and suddenly you have a different horse.
I personally couldn't care less what a bunch of trail riders look like but I could also see where having trails close to a ring in such a manner that a horse could "appear" and "disappear" could be distracting to the horses/riders in the ring- especially to young horses.
Regretfully there are also trail riders that are rude to other riders- sometimes intentionally so. I have trail ridden with people that would have thought it great fun to intentially gallop right by a ring during a show just to try to get a reaction from the riders in the ring. I am not saying all trail riders are rude but regretfully in any population there will be rude people- including in the hunter ranks.
I wouldn't take her comments to mean she didn't want to see the rag tag trail riders.
When the horse spooked at the stop sign it probably didn't cost you anything. When you have just paid $12-$20 for a class to have a hard spook in the middle of a jumping course will likely keep you from pinning as well. A hard enough spook in the middle of a jumping line may cause a stop or run-out and depending on the size of the class will keep you out of the ribbons. When you have worked hard to be able to put in 8 quiet fences and a paying your hard earned money for your classes and your trainer and maybe a braider it is frustrating to have a good trip ruined by something stupid.

Auventera Two
Apr. 10, 2008, 09:35 AM
If the speed as posted as WALK ONLY, I cannot see how horses in the ring would be spooked by trail horses. :confused: They will be encountering horses walking all over the show grounds, warm up ring, show ring, etc. If a show horse can't handle another horse walking past 100 yards away (or whatever) then maybe a child shouldn't be mounted on them and maybe they shouldn't be out in public.

Sure, if trail riders went screaming by in gallop from out of nowhere, a horse could spook, but honestly, why not just post a WALK ONLY sign?

Horses spook. Period. If you don't like that, then um, maybe don't ride horses?? When I enter an LD ride, I pay somewhere around $80 in gas to trailer there and another $50-65 for my entry fee. And $25 for a park pass and $15 to camp overnight. And guess what? The only 2 rides I did last year, I met a group of hikers on the trail, and an ATV race - ON THE SAME TRAIL. I had to slow down considerably because my horse was green. I didn't even come near placing at the top. I was in the dead bottom. And I didn't care. It was for the fun and experience of it all. That stuff just HAPPENS. TRail riders and endurance riders deal with it, and so can show people.

And honestly, that's just my opinion. If yours is different, then fine. No problem here. Just expresing my own :)

matryoshka
Apr. 10, 2008, 11:58 PM
I think JSwan is right in that the design is going to be important. Why not cater to the needs of the show people? They pay lots of money to show. Whereas we trail people might just pay for a yearly pass plus parking. Seriously, whether we think trail riders should or should not pose a problem, they could. Why not design with this thought in mind and do one's best to keep the trail riders separated from the show grounds as much as possible? I think the show people will appreciate this, regardless of their reasons, and that will reflect in feedback and the success of the fair grounds.

And I had totally forgotten about the green horse thing! It's easy to think of show grounds being inhabited by seasoned competetors. They aren't. And accidents with horses when there are that many people and horses crammed together can be serious. Why not just design with that in mind? It hurts nobody so long as it can be done practically.

katarine
Apr. 11, 2008, 11:03 AM
ding ding ding...that's exactly what I was trying to say: keep everyone's interests in mind and design to best suit everyone's needs, within reason. Trail riders don't want posted speed limits, LOL and show riders (on potentially green or anxious horses) don't necessarily HAVE to be set up for trial by fire. I wouldn't buy a farm right next to a firing range or drag racing strip just to 'make' my horses deal with it, LOL

Auventera Two
Apr. 11, 2008, 01:32 PM
ding ding ding...that's exactly what I was trying to say: keep everyone's interests in mind and design to best suit everyone's needs, within reason. Trail riders don't want posted speed limits, LOL and show riders (on potentially green or anxious horses) don't necessarily HAVE to be set up for trial by fire. I wouldn't buy a farm right next to a firing range or drag racing strip just to 'make' my horses deal with it, LOL

I live 1 mile from the airport. Does that count? Not commercial, but we still have planes taking off and landing and flying so low you can see the pilot's face, right over our farm at least once an hour every day. :lol:

It was always funny how a new horse would duck and dive and run for cover but after a few buzzes they don't even notice anymore. But no I wouldn't want to live next to a drag strip either because that would be a lot louder and more annoying (to me!) than the private airport.

questisthebest
Apr. 12, 2008, 04:21 AM
I may be able to understand her concern if there is a show going on, but with 50 acres, you want to take advantage of each little space to the best the property has to offer, nothing wrong with setting trails near an arena. In fact, some people may see a trail leading to an arena would be a great warmup and cool down oppurtunity. You could however put signs up around the area to be respectful of other riders in both arena or trail if it became a problem, which I don't think it would. Horses in the arena (show horse or not) and on the trail need to consider that the purpose of this park is to provide a recreational center for all equestrians to enjoy, that means just dealing with eachother. On the other hand, I don't think the horse on the trail is going to be anymore of a distraction than the other horses riding in the arena and I feel a comment like that comment was rude and unneccesary.

Cosmonster- I had the opposite experience as you, I found the atmosphere so much more relaxing and friendly than in the show ring. I found people involved with endurance riding to be very helpful to a new comer no matter the discipline, heck, my first ride was in a jumping saddle;) and everytime it appeared as though I was having a problem, somebody offered a lending hand. Many people I know who do endurance ridng also do dressage as well, or atleast some type of arena work. I once helped volunteer at a USDF sanctioned show and although there were a few snobs, majority of the people were real friendly. Western pleasure however was a different story. Hunters were similar to WP in those terms. I don't think trail riders/endurance riders would have the attitude of show riders if they respected their choice of discipline in the first place.

matryoshka
Apr. 12, 2008, 08:15 PM
I've got to add a plug for endurance people, too. The one and only LD I tried with Butch, I had a big fat ribbon on his tail because he bucks and is likely to send a hoof flying at another horse during a buck. We were heading down a path through the woods, and Butch refused to get off the trail so some 50 mile riders could pass. He was hopping down the trail sideways, and the other riders told me just to relax and wait until we got to the bottom of the hill. I had expected people to be frustrated with me and my horse, but instead they were supportive and said they'd all been there at one time or another.

When I finally got him off the trail, as they trotted past the last rider in the group laughingly shouted back "This is why we don't carry firearms on a ride!" I laughed, because honest to goodness, if I'd had a gun, I'd have been tempted to shoot Butch between the ears!

I found the same sort of support and comaraderie at CTR's.

However, I will say that I try to stay out of the way of serious competetors, because I doubt they'd have as much patience with my horse's antics.

JackSprats Mom
Apr. 22, 2008, 10:12 PM
What is the motivator for getting dressed up like a penguin, only to ride in endless circles for a subjective judgement and maybe a ribbon or a score? I just don't get it

Ahh young grasshopper there are many ways to achieve the same harmony on horseback. Some prefer to do it in a manner that shows lightness, responsiveness and two units working as one--wait that describes both dressage and endurance....my point:winkgrin:

I love the harmony of riding dressage with my horse as much as I love riding the trails with him. Both work towards an inner connection and peace. Today I was fortunate enough to do both, some wonderful arena work followed by some beautiful trail in the sun.

AV2- just an idea of how much showing costs compared to endurance. I showed twice so far this year, running me over $500 each show. My endurance rides cost me a lot less (no stall fee, no drug fee, no office fee, no hotel fee, just to name a few) The major difference being on an endurance ride being spooked by a boulder or ATV won't lose me anything, in the dressage arena it may lose me everything. No horse is bombproof. Its nice, if you've put the preparation in to be able to show without any weird and wonderful distractions, normal ones are fine.

Honestly, depending on how you read the H/J comments it could be taken as anything but snobby, she may just be asking for safety...which I think we would all support:yes:

Can't we all just get along:winkgrin:

Ohh and both sides can be just as nasty trust me, seen some mean ass stuff on endurance rides as well as at shows, thankfully its the minority and the majority are there to make us feel welcomed

matryoshka
Apr. 23, 2008, 06:58 PM
AV2- just an idea of how much showing costs compared to endurance. I showed twice so far this year, running me over $500 each show. My endurance rides cost me a lot less (no stall fee, no drug fee, no office fee, no hotel fee, just to name a few) The major difference being on an endurance ride being spooked by a boulder or ATV won't lose me anything, in the dressage arena it may lose me everything. No horse is bombproof. Its nice, if you've put the preparation in to be able to show without any weird and wonderful distractions, normal ones are fine. I think this has become the concensus here. It took me a while to see it, but once I really thought about it, the concern seemed really valid. Unexpected obstacles are part of the challenge of endurance/CTR/trail riding. They aren't generally a part of showing, though they do happen, as the lady mentioned about the baby carriage.

I marked some trail for the Foxcatcher ride today. You should have seen Butch with bunches of trail ribbons attached to the saddle--they looked like cheerleader pom-poms. He looked quite festive and wasn't bothered at all. The lady who taught me the portion of the trail had warned me to get Butch used to the stuff before taking him out to mark trail, but I simply didn't have time. He's such a trooper!

Standing still for hooking high branches and attaching the ribbons were much more challenging for him. The good news is that he learned to back up today, and he doesn't really mind me standing in the stirrups or leaning way out to catch branches. However, DO NOT ask him to walk anywhere near sticker bushes, or he gets upset. He did take some of his frustration out on me when we could trot through the fields--buck buck buck buck buck. And I only had one hand for the reins since I used a carrot stick with a hoof pick duct taped to the end to hook high branches! It was snapped to my belt, but I had to keep a hand on it if I didn't want to risk it bumping his legs. Not bad for an OTTB!! :winkgrin: