3 yr old Materiale

[Fantastic]

Opinions, please.

Materiale classes are W,T, C both directions - round and round. For 3 yr old classes, horse must be at least 36 months (exactly 3 yrs) at time of competition.

Results in USDF Connection show the top 3 year old colt with 79.7000% and top filly has 79.100%. The top 8 for colts and top 8 for fillies are shown on the USDF site. How many were participating nationally?

[Texarkana]

I don't know if these classes are more popular regionally, but I have never been to a show that had more than a handful of 3 y/os competing in the materiale classes. Most shows that I've been to only have one or two horses entered.

I think it depends on your horse. If you have an athletic 3 year old who's mentally mature enough to show under saddle, the more power to you. I don't think having a 3 y/o going w/t/c under saddle is unreasonable at all if you do it smartly. The materiale classes aren't really asking a whole lot out of the horses in my opinion. And the judging I've seen has been forgiving towards expected green-ness and young horse antics.

Now, if the 3 year old materiale classes become as popular and competitive as the futurities in other disciplines, I imagine we might start seeing more problems. I wouldn't be very happy if it became the norm for competitors to start their yearlings under saddle to be ready for the materiale classes, or if you started seeing people longing their 3 y/os all through the night to exhaust them before their class. But so far, that has not been my experience at the DSHB shows.

[Oldenburg Mom]

Mr. Joey Starbuck did the three year old last year, and he was in the top 10 for the USDF. We are very proud of him.

Whoops, just saw the poll.

And the judging I've seen has been forgiving towards expected green-ness and young horse antics.

This is true; Joey didn't pick up the correct canter lead and at one show the judge waited until he had!!! They are very forgiving.

[Walnut Farm]

I am sorry, not sure I understand your question/poll?

and most horses are started lightly as 3 year old and do w/t/c and not break down at 9 in my experience.

With that said, I had a 3 year old last year who was not ready physically, and another that did super, so depends on the horse and the trainer I think

[Fantastic]

The yearbook standings got me thinking and wondering. My question poll was to get a consensus of how people feel about 3yo classes.

These horses are started somewhere between late in their 2yo year or into their 3yo year, and I know how strongly some people feel about waiting to start until they are 4yo. My yes, I've always wanted a 3yo in full training breaking down at 9 was an attempt to be sarcastic.:no: It wouldn't really be funny to have a 3yo in hardcore full training 5 days a week.

Mr. Joey Starbuck did the three year old last year, and he was in the top 10 for the USDF. We are very proud of him.

(how do you make a quote like the one Oldenburg Mom wrote?) Do you remember how many horses he competed against?

[bellaalexander]

I have a filly that did the Material last year. She is in training now as a four year old preparing for the YJC five year old classes. She was started late in her three year old year, competed at two shows and then given the winter off. She is now jumped once a week and flatted 5 days a week. She is only ridden on the best footing and is fed a quality feed and she is with a great trainer.
What I am trying to say is that there is more involved in the "breaking" down of a horse than starting them as three year olds. If you keep a close eye on your youngsters, you should not have a problem. Some horses are ready to start and show sooner than others. If you put too much pressure a horse that is not physically or MENTALLY ready, that is when you get into problems. JMHO!!!

[Fantastic]

The yes, I would buy, no I wouldnt buy comments are geared towards the opinion of people who are shopping 3yos who might read this poll.

[eqsiu]

I had to choose the fourth option. I couldn't resist. That said, I think 3 is a fine age to start horses. However, I doubt any horse I started lightly at three could do well at a show, even a backyard schooling show. They just wouldn't be that far along.

[crtrak]

Like others have said - it depends on the horse. If they're coordinated enough and mentally ready, why not. I've had 2 so far that have done well (although admittedly there wasn't too much competition - I think the most was in an east coast show and there were 5 or 6 in the class) and one's now competing 3rd as a coming 7-yo. But he loves the applause and the crowds and he loves to go "play" at dressage...

We start them very lightly - very little lungeing - teach them W/T/C, and ride them for 15-20 minutes 3 or 4 times a week. And if they're ready they go show. Of course - most of them have been out showing in-hand already and aren't much bothered by the "show ring".

There's some evidence out there that says that the exercise (as long as their knees are closed and you start them lightly) is actually good for building bone and ensuring long-term soundness...

[Oldenburg Mom]

Ok maybe this will help. I am a BIG supporter of the "What's the hurry?" theory of training. I agree with ALL of those who said "depends upon the horse" and trainer. Completely true.

Joey had only been ridden about 45 times when he went into his class at Devon. That includes his first time being backed.

His trainer, however, was a no-pressure kind of trainer. That doesn't mean she didn't have days where he was pushed, but it wasn't every day. I would also comment that he *was* in full training ... but it was age appropriate. It would be waaaaay too light for a four or five year old. Plus, Joey has had the winter off.

Now, take a different horse, with a different trainer and a different mind set, ... it may take 200 rides before he's ready to go into the ring. Just like all people are different, all horses are different. JMHO.

[lovethoroughbreds]

This is a really great thread. I am a very, very particular person about starting a horse "too early." I had planned to start mine under saddle at four but recently started one of my two babies at 3 years 6 months because my competition horse (who was started at 7!) had a very, very slight lameness that keeps him out of competitive training.

My baby horse has been under saddle for just a couple of weeks and is the most sane, kindest, easiest thing in the world to deal with. Since I'm taking him to one in hand class in a few weeks, I thought we might ride him in the Materiale class as well. It will be for his benefit to have him get that experience but that is it. I'm not worried about being on the bit, I'm not worried about impresssing anyone (I can't, since my babies are out 24 x 7 and do not look like your typical fancy in hand horses).

It's ironic that I was very, very against starting a baby this early, but in this one case (for me) it's worked out really well. Of course, I'll report back in case I make a fool of myself in the ring, which is always a possiblity. But, I've been shocked about how well he's done. You can even get him to pick up the correct lead pretty consistenly if you set him up correctly (nothing fancy here, he's just easy to feel where his shoulder is and ask at the right time.).

So, I've changed my mind on this one. I think a lot of it depends on what you are looking for. I'm not looking for a "win" or advanced level moves, but am going for his experience (and my own). This will be our only USDF in hand and 3 year old Materiale class (ever!) but I think we'll have a lot of fun. He'll also just be a trail horse for the next year and after that will start cavaletti work when he's four and then "real training" when he's five. So, even though he's started young, he'll have a long time to grow up before really "showing" in the true sense of the word.

[Daydream Believer]

IMO it's way too young to push to show one under saddle. Mine are maybe being backed at three for the first time late in that summer. We do WTC and trail ride a bit and then they are left alone until the next year. I also find letting them mature mentally until four really helps them accept training more quietly not to mention that additional physical maturity.

[Fairview Horse Center]

It depends on the 3 year old, but probably most are fine. We began to lunge my 3 year old once a week, around the first of May. He has taken a really long time to be confident, but the trainer was able to sit on him Saturday. Sunday, he was w/t, and he just came right on the contact, softly reaching. My other we have lunged 3 times, but she couldn't care less, se we are already on her, and her 2nd ride, she w/t/c for 5 minutes. Both will continue to be ridden once or twice a week for 15 minutes. I would expect they would be totally ready by Devon, end of September without pushing at all, but I doubt I will send them. 3 year old classes are not asking for polish, and if they are bred to do this, they come right on the bit, without asking. They also usually offer up some big trot by the 5th or 6th ride, when they are comfortable with the balance. It is kind of funny, as you are just asking them to step into the canter, and they respond with a lengthening, and the rider is going "WOO, HOO!!."

That is ALL they need to do 3 year old classes. They do it naturally - big, free, loose gaits.

[Eyemadonkee]

I don't see the point... why not wait until the horse is 4?

[pintopiaffe]

None of mine would ever be ready, I don't think.

But I've known a few that I started in the summer of their 3yo--started ground driving etc., who could have managed a round-and-round show by fall, without much effort.

At age Five the judges all thought my stallion was 3. :sigh: His kids all seem to be similarly late bloomers. My Big Bay Broodmare Extraordinaire gained a HAND between five and seven, and about 250lbs between six and eight. No way. She was all legs and looked like a 2yo at FOUR.

My now Five year old was an October baby, so that throws it all off anyway. The spring after he turned four I backed him lightly, but he was SO haunch high (almost a hand) for most of that summer, that it just wasn't worth it to try riding him. He was left out to grow.

I don't know if it's my lines, or my breeds (Arab crosses) or my climate... I just don't know how they do it. I know my RPSI/Trakehner colt will NOT be able to go through the RPSI stallion process--no way he will be able to do that work at 4 and 5. :(

[Fairview Horse Center]

I don't see the point... why not wait until the horse is 4?

Why not if the horse is doing well? As a 3 1/2 year old, he will be going around the arena w/t/c for 15 minutes at home, so why not at a show?

[Hillside H Ranch]

I don't see a problem with it, if the horse is ready. I have a 3 year old gelding (was 3 in March) that went to the trainer in May. Groundwork for about a month(in addition to what had been done here at home) and was backed the first part of June. He is very level headed, which helps, but he is solid WTC. IMO, what is even better is that he has gone out on trails with another horse, crossed water, etc. If he continues to enjoy his work, then we are aiming for a materiale class in late August. Then he will come home with me and have the winter off and be started up again in the spring of his 4 year old year. FWIW he is hopefully headed to the jumper ring, so this show is completely for the experience only.

[Rhyadawn]

I don't see a problem starting a 3 yearold, but having them "ready" to show at just 3, it seems early to me, but if they are doing well, why not. That being said I have seen people take a 3 (or 2) year old to a show, have their horse completly freak out and cause injury, all in the name of getting their baby out there for the world to see.

[lorik]

I saw this thread and it got me thinking about how many horses really do show in the three year old Materiale classes. In most of the shows I do, I usually only see two or three fillies or colts in the three year old classes. I wondered if it had to do with the time of year of the shows. I looked at some of the back shows and here's what I came up with.

In 2007 in May at the KDA shows there was only one 3 year old colt in a materiale class. In 2008 at the same show there were 3 colts.

In 2007 in August at the Fair Hill show there were 3 fillies and 2 colts.

In 2007 in September at Dressage at Devon there were 11 three year olds in the three year old suitable to become a dressage horse class (open to fillies and colts). There were 5 fillies in the Materiale, and 11 colts (and OMOM's Joey placed third).

Maybe the time of year has something to do with it. There would certainly be more eligible horses in September than there are in May, but maybe it's just the profile of the show.

[Oldenburg Mom]

(and OMOM's Joey placed third).
...AND tied, score-wise, with second place! :) :) :) Not that I'm bragging or anything!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

All kidding aside, I think it really depends upon the horse's mind ...

Joey had not been pushed, but, let's face it: he was bred for dressage. He had the gaits, and he was ridden no more than, 2/3 times a week. I am not a fan of longeing, so he was longed very little. Then, after Devon, he was given the entire winter off, and has been started back in work since April? May?

This year he will be shown at Devon in the 4-year old Materiale, however, which is an entirely different kettle of fish.

[Home Again Farm]

The breed shows in my area tend to be in the summer and fall. I have shown a three year old in Materiale in the fall of her 3 year old year. Mine are started in the spring of the 3 year old year by a trainer who does very little longeing. She rides them very lightly and keeps them very happy and forward. They start real work at four, but can easily do a 3 year old Materiale class by fall.

[lorik]

In 2005 there were 6 in the 3 year old suitability, 7 fillies in the 3 year old matieriale and 5 colts.

In 2006, there were 10 in the suitability, 5 fillies in the 3 year old materiale and 9 colts.

[Hillside H Ranch]

Lori, do you recall how many were in the 2005 3 yr old class? It seems to me like there were a lot more than there were for 2007, but I could be wrong.

I think you're correct about it being the time of year that brings higher numbers to DAD. :yes:

Personally, I can't imagine starting a horse (i.e. backing) before age three, so I'm not sure I would ever enter a horse in a three yr old class. I agree that each horse is different, but just based on my understanding of the bone plate development, I couldn't do it.:no:

But I think most people here who have said they are showing in the 3 year old materiale AREN'T starting there horses prior to 3. My gelding will only have been under saddle for about 3 1/2 months before his materiale class this August. He was a March baby and was started in May. The materiale classes are WTC, they aren't asked for collection or anything of that type. At the shows I attend it is very common to have very green horses in the materiale and not at all uncommon to see some "baby" moments.