Check your Sundowner Trailer before use! [Archive]

Old Equine Lady

Feb. 16, 2008, 12:18 AM

Hampton Bay

Feb. 16, 2008, 12:26 AM

I would call the Sundowner HQ about them refusing to fit it until April. That is just wrong, and they need to know you are less than happy.

Thanks for the heads-up. I am in the market for a trailer sometime this year. I will be sure to keep this in mind when looking.

MaresNest

Feb. 16, 2008, 12:31 AM

XHalt

Feb. 16, 2008, 06:36 AM

This is a timely topic for me since I'm taking mine into the shop for repair this morning. From what I heard, Sundowner is now DENYING to fix some of these under warranty. The retailer I'm working with is being incredibly honest and upfront with me. Mine is a 2002 and there are rust spots all over the frame. They told me they need to document with pictures and a full report, submit it to Sundowner to see if they will cover the repairs. I know that it's very labor intensive to fix them and the repairs can run in the $3k range! This particular shop has been subcontracting the work out since there are so many of them that need to be repaired.

If you have a Sundowner, you should really get it checked.

J Swan

Feb. 16, 2008, 07:47 AM

If I were you - I'd be furious that the place that has inspected and serviced the trailer for the past 8 years did not do their job. Trailer servicing should be done at least annually and premature wear and the structure are supposed to be inspected and addressed.

The owner's manual should tell you what you are supposed to be doing to maintain the trailer. In many cases, owners do not maintain the trailer properly (don't deny it - we all know people that don't take care of their trailers!) and then complain when the things fall apart.

Even all steel trailers require maintenance; paint scraping, fixing rust, etc. Aluminum trailers, fiberglass - doesn't matter.

I'm not sure why you think having to wait until April is illegal. I had an old Jeep that was subject to a recall; and I had to wait a long time before I could get it fixed. Sometimes we just have to wait in line.

I hope everything works out for you.

I purchased a Sundowner trailer in March 2000. There is an 8 year warranty on structural defects. I found significant failure of the floor structure where the steel is placed against the aluminum. This caused the support for the floor to severely rusted out and become subjected to failure at any given time. When I took the trailer to a qualified dealer, they informed me they could only fix one a month and I would have to wait until April as there were several ahead of me. This should be illegal and is unacceptable as I need a method of hauling my horses. I currently care for several retired horses that require the best of care. This includes hauling the horses to the hospital or clinic if required. Failure to obtain timely medical services for any one of these horses may result in an untimely death. The design of the special powder coating on the trailer is very unsafe and should be recalled. At any time, one of these trailers floors can fall out with a horse on board and drag the horse down the highway, killing it. Sundowner claimed they solved the problem of steel against aluminum with a special powder coating, but the "powder coating" is failing and an accident is waiting to happen. They have made some changes to the newer trailers, but these also have the possibility of failure.
The inspection station I took my trailer to for inspection stated they have seen over 250 of these failing floor supports. That is just one station. Please, if you own a Sundowner, get a good look under your trailer before you put your horse on it!

josierider

Feb. 16, 2008, 08:38 AM

Where exactly do you look to see where the steel meets the aluminum? From the inside or the outside? Both?

XHalt

Feb. 16, 2008, 11:26 AM

Where exactly do you look to see where the steel meets the aluminum? From the inside or the outside? Both?

You can look for rust anywhere on the frame (the gray part).

And JSwan, this isn't a maintenance issue, it's a MAJOR design problem. Sundowner is well aware of the issue and not doing the right thing by notifying owners or standing by their warranty.

Hampton Bay

Feb. 16, 2008, 02:30 PM

Wow, it amazes me what some companies will do (or not do).

I would call and complain, and keep calling, until they fixed it. Squeaky wheel gets the grease idea.

clanter

Feb. 16, 2008, 02:47 PM

Sundowner Valuelite owners (or know people who are), and have any technical questions regarding your powder-coated frame rusting, call Anthony Holder, Sundowner's Warranty Manager.
His e-mail address is: anthonyh@sundownertrailers.com.

He can be reached at 1-800-654-3879.

ponygirl

Feb. 16, 2008, 04:36 PM

A friend of mine just had to replace her floor on one of these trailers. It was an ouch to the pocket book.

J Swan

Feb. 16, 2008, 05:21 PM

You can look for rust anywhere on the frame (the gray part).

And JSwan, this isn't a maintenance issue, it's a MAJOR design problem. Sundowner is well aware of the issue and not doing the right thing by notifying owners or standing by their warranty.

It's not a "major design" problem. Take a look under your car or truck and you'll see rust too. You're SUPPOSED to be maintaining your trailer; and that includes scraping and repainting the steel frame as indicated. When you take it in for service (another thing most people don't do like they're supposed to), the mechanic is supposed to be examining the trailer for signs of wear. The owner and their mechanic should examine the hinges ramp, doors, frame, wiring, checking for dry rot on tires, maintaining the axle, all kinds of things.

Not just for Sundowners; all trailers need vigilant maintenance. The mere fact that they get parked outside and develop condensation predisposes them to rust problems. An 8 year old trailer - sorry - that type of problem isn't unusual, and it doesn't happen suddenly. Doesn't matter what brand it is.

This summer I have to scrape and paint not only my horse trailer, but the flatbed and several farm implements. The flatbed and most of the implements are only a couple of years old - and even then - some of them only get used in the spring or fall.

I still can't figure out what is supposed to be "illegal" about having to wait to get the trailer serviced.

If the manufacturer is being difficult - that's too bad and I hope she gets that resolved. But rust? Rust happens.

But it's not supposed to happen between aluminum and steel.

Steel rusts, aluminum doesn't. If the OP's trailer has so much rust that the structure has been compromised - that is because she did not maintain the trailer. Rust isn't necessarily a structural problem unless the rust is eating through the metal. Usually it's just surface rust that you scrape and repaint.

If she's seeing corrosion, that is different than rust. And it is still not necessarily a structural problem unless it has been allowed to corrode to the point the metals are falling apart. And that, again, is evidence of failure to properly the maintenance schedule and can void the warranty.

It's akin to never getting an oil change and then trying to claim that the engine failed because of a "design flaw" and making a claim against the warranty. If the owner fails to properly maintain their trailer/vehicle, it can void the warranty.

MaresNest

Feb. 16, 2008, 08:00 PM

It's not a "major design" problem. Take a look under your car or truck and you'll see rust too.

If the OP's trailer has so much rust that the structure has been compromised - that is because she did not maintain the trailer. Rust isn't necessarily a structural problem unless the rust is eating through the metal. Usually it's just surface rust that you scrape and repaint.

JSwan, normally I would be inclined to agree with you, but I actually had a trailer repair shop warn me about these new Sundowners a year ago. Apparently the powder coating process that Sundowner uses for the frames is inadequate, and the frames are rusting at alarmingly fast rate. Much faster than you would see on most brands of trailers.

So, while I agree that rust happens and that we should all be diligent about trailer maintenance, in this particular instance, I think it IS a design flaw. I am particularly concerned that it's still going on a year after the repair shop warned me about it. I would have thought that there would have been a recall.

J Swan

Feb. 16, 2008, 08:53 PM

My trailer guy warned me about the same thing. (Not about Sundowners specifically)

He wags his finger and says - you know - you really have to watch for signs of paint bubbling on these frames. He goes on and on. I get lectured a lot, and then he tells me he's happy to work on the darn thing for me.

I'm too stingy so I do it myself.

I have, however, loosened my deathgrip on my change purse to get the bearings repacked. I'm just too old to sit on a tire and push grease into a bearing.

A design flaw, to me, is more about the structure itself, not so much materials. Paint, even on cars, fails.

Folks use the word "recall" a lot - but recalls, even on passenger vehicles, are not that common. What is more common is a technical bulletin. Chances are your tow vehicle (or any vehicle) has had many technical bulletins issued against it and you are never aware, and you drive the vehicle around until it breaks down - and then - your mechanic MAY tell you that a bulletin was issued warning about a defective part.

There are some pretty specific things that have to happen for a manufacturer to issue a recall. This really doesn't qualify. However, I'm writing from memory. I went through this a while back on a passenger vehicle.

However, I think what the OP is talking about is not rust, but corrosion. If it is that bad that the structure is unstable, the problem has been there a very long time and she has not taken the trailer in for service.

And that can void the warranty. Now - for a trailer that has been serviced and is taken care of and the owner starts to notice a little problem - THAT is the time to make a claim under the warranty.

That's kinda why I'm wondering why on earth the people who service her trailer let the problem go on so long as to damage the actual structure. An 8 year old horse trailer is goingg to have a lot of wear on it - even if it isn't used. Actually, if it isn't used much rust and corrosion are even more likely to be a problem. So, I'd be ticked at whoever I was paying to service the horse trailer. It's hard to exercise our rights under a warranty if, either by negligence or inaction, we void it!

clanter

Feb. 16, 2008, 11:25 PM

A design flaw, to me, is more about the structure itself, not so much materials. Paint, even on cars, fails.
!

Do not know as I have never taken one apart but Electrolytic Corrosion (Electrolysis) occurs when. dissimilar metals are in contact with each other ... aluminum sheets should not rest directly on steel ... exposure to salt water form de-icing roads in the northern states would accelerate the ion transfer

If they were just using a powder coating on the steel as the separation then it is a design fault

Evalee Hunter

Feb. 17, 2008, 04:36 AM

Do not know as I have never taken one apart but Electrolytic Corrosion (Electrolysis) occurs when. dissimilar metals are in contact with each other ... aluminum sheets should not rest directly on steel ... exposure to salt water form de-icing roads in the northern states would accelerate the ion transfer

If they were just using a powder coating on the steel as the separation then it is a design fault

Yes, to me, this is the point. You cannot just make a trailer of aluminum over a steel frame. You need to take special care to keep the metals separate from each other. If special care is NOT taken, then THAT is a flaw in the design. The corrosion may have shown up rather suddenly because the dissimilar metals actually came in contact with each other only recently & then the corrosion progresses suddenly & rapidly. Aluminum/steel contact (or, rather, avoiding contact) is a big design problem with aluminum/steel trailers.

However, regarding waiting for repair ... well, that happens. All of us potentially could NEED our trailers for a medical emergency with our horses. So, if we know we are going to be without the trailer for a while, we need to have a plan B ... buy a 2nd trailer (used, inexpensive), borrow a trailer, arrange to be have access to a friend's trailer 24/7, or whatever.

XHalt

Feb. 17, 2008, 06:19 AM

A couple of things, first Sundowner expected that the frames and powder coating would hold up for a minimum of 8 years. Otherwise they would have never sold them with an 8 year warranty on the frame. Something at the time, they were the only ones doing.

Secondly, the steel on these is comprised of thin sheets of cold rolled sheet metal. When moisture (only a drop) is getting into the frame, it's rotting them from the inside out by getting into the various layers. So you may not even see rust but yet your frame could be in bad shape.

Daydream Believer

Feb. 17, 2008, 09:15 AM

I was warned off of aluminum Sundowners and Exisses by a trailer repair shop about 6 years ago when I bought my older Trailet. They said that those two brands of trailers showed up most frequently with frame and structure related problems. From what I've heard on these forums and others since then, they sounded right on.

enjoytheride

Feb. 17, 2008, 09:29 AM

I believe not too long ago someone on this BB had major problems with their sundowner, I think the ramp just fell off? Sundowner refused to fix it even though the trailer was new and other people had the same problems. Owner had to go through some serious lengths to get the trailer fixed.

Evalee Hunter

Feb. 17, 2008, 10:56 AM

Jaegermonster

Feb. 17, 2008, 03:22 PM

I heard about this when I bought my C&C in 1999, which by the way is an all aluminum trailer :)
At that time, I looked at several brand new Sundowners that had never even had horses in them or been off the lot and saw quite a bit of rust in various places. And since then heard the stories about ramps falling off, and welds and so forth.
You could not give me a Sundowner.

USCavalry

Feb. 17, 2008, 03:30 PM

J Swan

Feb. 17, 2008, 06:19 PM

Anywhere steel comes in contact with aluminum is a potential hazard waiting to happen. The two together will cause corrosion, therefor you will have eventual failure. This is why I am cautious about trailers that are aluminum with a steel frame.

They might be better if they make sure to put some kind of washer that will stop the corrosion from happening, but I am sure even a washer would eventually have to be replaced.

These trailers have an insulator. It is not steel on aluminum, nor is it powder coated steel on aluminum. There are proper, and thick insulators all over the darn thing.

J Swan

Feb. 17, 2008, 06:25 PM

Dr. Doolittle (who posts here) is one who had a ramp fall off ... while she was transporting a horse which fell out the back & was dragged down the road. Others have had the ramp fall off when a horse stepped on it loading or unloading. Sundowner seems to be the one with that problem. (I personally know someone who had a Sundowner ramp fall off.) JSwan pretty regularly jumps into these discussions & lectures all of us about trailer maintenance. I agree with much or most of what JSwan posts but when it comes to her lectures on polishing boots, maintaining equipment, etc., well, she obviously has a whole lot more interest & concern regarding that stuff than I do (I'm trying to be tactful here).

And I appreciate you trying to be tactful. I'm actually about as interested in maintaining horse trailers as I am in getting a mammogram and Pap smear.

I don't like it, and I really don't care. But if I want to keep everything working properly, I have to pay attention and do preventative maintenance.

Sorry you don't like the way I polish my boots.

RunForIt

Feb. 17, 2008, 07:32 PM

I have a 2000 Sundowner 727, have it serviced and inspected yearly at the Sundowner dealership/service center here in Covington. I too heard about these issues last summer, went with list in hand when I had my trailer serviced; the head of the service dept. stayed late and showed me and my husband each part of the floor, the joints, everything...all was fine and dandy. I am always sure to clean the trailer after use and routinely remove the mats to let any moisture between the mats and the flooring dry completely. That and attending to servicing seems to be working in my trailer. I DON'T have a ramp for the very reasons that many of you mentioned as well as the slipping issues as horses back off the trailer. :cool: I'm very pleased with my Sundowner trailer and believe it will last as long as I need it! :)

Evalee Hunter

Feb. 17, 2008, 09:32 PM

. . . . Sorry you don't like the way I polish my boots.

Goodness me. I admire you for polishing your boots! I know you were in the military. My mother used to polish not only everyone's shoes but our SNEAKERS - our old, canvas Keds were polished with white shoe polish (after being washed regularly in bleach & hot water). I vowed never to embarrass my children with blindingly white sneakers nor with shoes polished to a high gloss. Yes, it embarrassed me to be so different from the rest. But, I have nothing against you polishing your boots to a high gloss as long as that is the way you want them!

Old Equine Lady

Feb. 17, 2008, 09:40 PM

It's not a "major design" problem. Take a look under your car or truck and you'll see rust too. You're SUPPOSED to be maintaining your trailer; and that includes scraping and repainting the steel frame as indicated. When you take it in for service (another thing most people don't do like they're supposed to), the mechanic is supposed to be examining the trailer for signs of wear. The owner and their mechanic should examine the hinges ramp, doors, frame, wiring, checking for dry rot on tires, maintaining the axle, all kinds of things.

Not just for Sundowners; all trailers need vigilant maintenance. The mere fact that they get parked outside and develop condensation predisposes them to rust problems. An 8 year old trailer - sorry - that type of problem isn't unusual, and it doesn't happen suddenly. Doesn't matter what brand it is.

This summer I have to scrape and paint not only my horse trailer, but the flatbed and several farm implements. The flatbed and most of the implements are only a couple of years old - and even then - some of them only get used in the spring or fall.

I still can't figure out what is supposed to be "illegal" about having to wait to get the trailer serviced.

If the manufacturer is being difficult - that's too bad and I hope she gets that resolved. But rust? Rust happens.

But it's not supposed to happen between aluminum and steel.

Steel rusts, aluminum doesn't. If the OP's trailer has so much rust that the structure has been compromised - that is because she did not maintain the trailer. Rust isn't necessarily a structural problem unless the rust is eating through the metal. Usually it's just surface rust that you scrape and repaint.

If she's seeing corrosion, that is different than rust. And it is still not necessarily a structural problem unless it has been allowed to corrode to the point the metals are falling apart. And that, again, is evidence of failure to properly the maintenance schedule and can void the warranty.

It's akin to never getting an oil change and then trying to claim that the engine failed because of a "design flaw" and making a claim against the warranty. If the owner fails to properly maintain their trailer/vehicle, it can void the warranty.

I was maintaining my trailer property, taking it in every year to be inspected and serviced. I live in a state which require yearly state inspections. The failure of the supports for the floor of the trailer were not evident until my trailer failed. I could see if the corrosion/rust happened gradually over time, but it seemed to happen in one year's time, from one inspection to the next. Sundowner is paying for the repair, but I was told shops are only allowed to make repairs to one Sundower a month. That is what I think should be illegal!

I have taken excellent care of my trailer, cleaning, removing mats, power washing, etc.

c_expresso

Feb. 17, 2008, 09:58 PM

Yikes...

I would never buy a Sundowner. My friend's trainer was driving her brand new Sundowner for the first time with her horse in it, when the ramp just fell off and her horse fell out onto the highway and was THANK GOD somehow okay.... that story turned me off Sundowners.

Ruth0552

Feb. 18, 2008, 07:01 AM

I was going to say that you should check other dealers to see if anyone else had time... but the fact that they can only fix 1 a month is ridiculous. No logic there at all.

Just a thought... you said you bought your trailer April 2000 and it has an 8 year warranty? I would make darn sure I got something in writing, by email or something from Sundowner saying they are going to pay for it since they apparently only allow 1 repair a month and are making you wait. It would be VERY uncool to have them turnaround and say, nope been 8 years, after you get it fixed.

J Swan

Feb. 18, 2008, 08:16 AM

I was told shops are only allowed to make repairs to one Sundower a month. That is what I think should be illegal!

It might be that your shop does not want to be swamped with warranty work. It doesn't pay well. If you're being told that they're only "allowed" to work one one brand of trailer per month - I'd challenge that. I'd want to see it in writing. (You could make up some reason like you want it in writing so you can call Sundowner and complain, because you need your trailer sooner... something like that). See if they suddenly move you up in line. ;)

I have to run interference for my mother all the time. Every time she gets her car worked on, or a tree cut down or something - someone tries to screw her. Telling her she needs the air in her tires changed, (I'm exaggerating), or screw her on price.....

Does anyone remember when Featherlite trailer doors fell off all the time? Or was that pre-Internet/BB?

I know US rider is collecting data about trailer accidents; but I've noticed no government agency collect data on trailer accidents/failures except in certain cases. (GVW of the tow vehicle seems to be the trigger). It's one of my pet peeves. (that and unpolished boots)

I'd love it if there was a central location for submission of data on trailer failure. Things like hinges, ramp welds, floor supports, etc. Because, at the risk of sounding like I'm lecturing, there does not appear to be a really good way for trailer owners to have their voice heard. We're too small a population. And though the warranties are often honored, no matter how you slice is a ramp or door falling off is completely unacceptable. Not even one time.

But I'd also like it if all trailer drivers had to pass a course and get a special license to tow, too. Too many nincompoops on the road.

I'm going to go sit in a corner and cry because y'all think I lecture. Oh crap - it's time to schedule a mammogram, too. It's going to be a bad week.

Boo hoo. :winkgrin:

Good luck getting your trailer fixed.

Evalee Hunter

Feb. 18, 2008, 08:26 AM

. . . . I know US rider is collecting data about trailer accidents; but I've noticed no government agency collect data on trailer accidents/failures except in certain cases. (GVW of the tow vehicle seems to be the trigger). It's one of my pet peeves. (that and unpolished boots)

I'd love it if there was a central location for submission of data on trailer failure. Things like hinges, ramp welds, floor supports, etc. Because, at the risk of sounding like I'm lecturing, there does not appear to be a really good way for trailer owners to have their voice heard. We're too small a population. And though the warranties are often honored, no matter how you slice is a ramp or door falling off is completely unacceptable. Not even one time. . . .

Yes, I agree with you. I don't think we will see really safe, well-made trailers until there is some place to report failures. Unfortunately, letting the industry police itself has not worked.

. . . . But I'd also like it if all trailer drivers had to pass a course and get a special license to tow, too. Too many nincompoops on the road. . . .

The nincompoops I see on the road are car drivers! I've come, over the last few months, when I've been making a 12 to 14 hour loaded-horse-trailer round trip every five weeks, to particularly abhor Volvo drivers who seem to me to be the worst on the road. What an attitude they have.

J Swan

Feb. 18, 2008, 08:44 AM

The nincompoops I see on the road are car drivers! I've come, over the last few months, when I've been making a 12 to 14 hour loaded-horse-trailer round trip every five weeks, to particularly abhor Volvo drivers who seem to me to be the worst on the road. What an attitude they have.

JSwan's nightly prayer

Our Father, who Art in Heaven,
please pour a little chlorine in the gene pool.

Amen.

lilypondlane

Feb. 18, 2008, 08:59 AM

Wow, very glad I read this thread. I have a 2005 Sundowner Sunlite and I am definitely going to take a close look at my trailer's underside today. I do recall that the maintenance video tells you that you MUST acid wash the floor frequently -- can't remember exactly how often -- or the warranty is void. I have not been completely happy with my Sundowner -- the escape doors sometimes appear to be closed but are not (driving down 81 and glancing in my side mirror seeing the passenger side escape door flapping open) -- I now pull on a corner of the door after I've closed it to make sure it isn't going to pop open. The vent cover in the roof of the dressing room ripped off while the trailer was parked. The sliding windows are difficult to slide. The divider that keeps the horses heads separated is easily popped out of the holder by a horse's nose, causing it to swing back into the second horse's face, and several of the rings for the built-in hay bags that come with the trailer were pulled out the first time I used it, so back to the rope hay bags. All in all, not too impressive.

CBudFrggy

Feb. 18, 2008, 01:12 PM

I bought my 2003 Sundowner Valuelite 2H BP trailer in 2005. It had only been used once by the previous owner, for the Florida Cracker Trail Ride. My husband and I crawled all over and under it, when we discovered that the steel floor supports were developing surface rust. I took it to the dealer, who sandblasted it and undercoated it per the warranty. I also had the dealer do the annual maintenance b/c I didn't know if/when it had been done before. My hubby and I also washed, polished and waxed the trailer inside and out to seal the aluminum and prevent/inhibit corrosion.

I, like JSwan, believe that if you want something to last, you had better take care of it. I unload the shavings, wash the floors and under the mats after every use and leave the floor mats folded over to allow the floor to dry. I also rinse the underside and between the wheels. Has anyone had a horse urinate on their trailer when parked? Guess where the urine goes if its not trapped in bedding. Right through the seams of the trailer. If you do not wash it out, it will ruse and corrode your trailer.

Everytime I see a rust bubble or streak, I clean it down to the metal and use a little drop of rustoleum paint. Wax is your friend--it seals paint and metal to protect against moisture. It also helps to prevent rust under trailers to park them on pavement. Trailer floors are exposed to more moisture when they are parked on grass rather than pavement.

I have checked my ramp over and over and have never found a problem with it. I grease the springs and hinges when needed, but have noticed no faulty or stressed metal. (You might wonder how I would know what to look for when looking for faulty metal. Well, my hubby has a plane--that's one thing you want to inspect before every flight for faulty metal!)

I guess I can't speak to the ramp issues, but since there are 2 reports on here of the ramps falling off of new trailers, then I'll have to take that at face value and always check mine.

All in all, I loff my trailer, but wish I would have bought a GN--I would love to put a mattress in the nose when I "sleep over" with my horse. I think its a well-made trailer and would buy another one.

As far as the dealer--my dealer is very busy in the winter months down here. After all, polo, Wellington and the show season is in full-swing. I have to forgive her if she can't get me in right away.

trubandloki

Feb. 18, 2008, 01:29 PM

Just a thought... you said you bought your trailer April 2000 and it has an 8 year warranty? I would make darn sure I got something in writing, by email or something from Sundowner saying they are going to pay for it since they apparently only allow 1 repair a month and are making you wait. It would be VERY uncool to have them turnaround and say, nope been 8 years, after you get it fixed.

I agree completely. April will put you one month past your eight years. Be sure to get something in writing before your time is up.

Guilherme

Feb. 18, 2008, 01:54 PM

SMF11

Feb. 18, 2008, 03:45 PM

I don't know much about trailers, and *thought* I did my homework when I bought my first one two years ago . . . and yes, it is a used Sundowner. I am a little freaked out by this thread! I can say that my ramp failed last spring -- it was all internal, so nothing maintenance could prevent. The bars in the ramp which attach to the outer frame detached from the frame. ($650 later . . .)

I dunno -- should I just sell this trailer and get a different one? I don't want to hijack this thread, but what's a good replacement?!

sirensong4

Feb. 18, 2008, 04:48 PM

I've only ever had a 1992 CM stock combo and a 2006 Circle J Outback. No complaints on either one.

Jaegermonster

Feb. 18, 2008, 04:53 PM

In the long, long ago the Navy was nice enough to send me to Corrosion Control School. I was the Aircraft Division Officer and was responsible for managing the airframe and engine components maintenance on 8 of the taxpayers' airplanes. Service aboard an aircraft carrier is VERY hard on metal components (particularly magnesium which will be eaten up by salt air in very short order). I learned a lot about the corrosion propensity of steel and aluminum and what happens when dissimilar metals come in contact in a damp environment. Leaned a lot about protection, too (paint, anodizing, etc.). Most of this stuff has been mentally filed for many years.

When I bought me current trailer in '03 I did a lot of shopping around. I dusted off some of that corrosion control knowledge. One of my tools was a flashlight. I must have looked like a TV CSI crawling around in the daylight shining my flashlight on parts of the trailer "where the Sun don't shine." But it was an educational experience. One thing I noted about Sundowner was that welds and various "detail" work was good where you would see it, but shoddy where you would not. I did not see any situations where dissimilar metals were mated without buffers, but I was not looking, either. I "wrote off" the brand based upon the quality of the welds.

I am not very obsessive about trailer maintenance. I clean it good three or four times a year. The rest of the time it gets a good "fresh water washdown" after about every second use (unless somebody pees in it, then it gets done pretty quick 'cause I don't like the smell). I do a full visual inspection (including the underside) about twice a year. So far this particular Featherlight has no issues of any kind with the structure.

Keeping it under cover when not in use probably contributes to it's excellent physical condition.

G.

I agree, I have a 99 C&C 2h straight load GN and one of the things I really inspected when I was trailer shopping was the welds. My trailer is all aluminum, frame and all. I have had it since it was brand spanking new, and thanks to good construction and careful maintenance, the other day someone asked me if I got a new trailer.
I had it acid washed once while I was out of town and when I came back through the inspection station into FL the officer asked me if I had the paperwork from the dealer since it was a new trailer coming into the state. He almost fell over when I told him the trailer was 5 years old at the time.

I have looked at a number of Sundowners over the years, both brand new on the lot and some belonging to friends and have never been impressed. The quality of my C&C is beyond compare, Sundowners...not so much. I would never buy one, and esp would not buy a used one.

Dinahmare

Feb. 18, 2008, 04:57 PM

Now I know why the maintenance guy at the trailer place was so insistent about me bringing this trailer in for an annual inspection and his mention of this being the last year of the 8 year warranty. I was grumbling about a 350 dollar maintenance call but I guess I better pony up the cash. Thanks everyone.

magnum

Feb. 18, 2008, 04:58 PM

You can look for rust anywhere on the frame (the gray part).

And JSwan, this isn't a maintenance issue, it's a MAJOR design problem. Sundowner is well aware of the issue and not doing the right thing by notifying owners or standing by their warranty.

Is the fact that Sundowner (ESPECIALLY at the HQ level) is unethical and not honoring warranties actually NEW NEWS to some of you?

MANY posters here have recounted ad nauseum about problems with Sundowner QUALITY, that is FURTHER not backed by its owners.

Personally, I have shared multiple times on this BB my first hand trouble with them. First, the trailer I bought, tho NEVER USED, sat for 3 mos. after Congress over winter ... when I went to get in to it for the FIRST TIME, the door almost came off in my hand. Turns out, it had ALL of the door hinges tearing away from the frame because the hinges were UNDERATED for the weighted capacity.

Secondly ... about my trainer's trailer ... the axles tearing off at 65 mph ((w/a listed Olympic team horse, a National Champion horse, and my regional champion horse on board) ... the axles and tires BOTH were no where NEAR the correct capacity for the rig. Sundowner is NOTORIOUS for this. Even on BP's, they put the cheapest avail. tires on. IMHO - I wouldn't trust them to haul a show dog, much less a horse!!

Magnum

VAcowboy

Feb. 18, 2008, 05:01 PM

I purchased a Sundowner trailer in March 2000. There is an 8 year warranty on structural defects. I found significant failure of the floor structure where the steel is placed against the aluminum. This caused the support for the floor to severely rusted out and become subjected to failure at any given time. When I took the trailer to a qualified dealer, they informed me they could only fix one a month and I would have to wait until April as there were several ahead of me. This should be illegal and is unacceptable as I need a method of hauling my horses. I currently care for several retired horhas come to my attention that there is a serious design flaw in the powder-coated steel frames on the "Valuelite" models of Sundowner Trailers causing these frames to rust at an accelerated rate. Further, I understand that the manufacturer has not alerted the owners of these trailers to the damage occuring and the danger of a major frame failure.

In 1999 Sundowner began building "Valuelite" trailers using power coated steel frames. There is an inherent design flaw in the engineering of this type of frame. Powder coating does not flex with the trailer, and what happens over time, as the trailer travels and vibrates, the powder coating over the steel frame splits apart at the frame joints. Moisture is then trapped between the frame and the powder coating, causing the steel to rust at an accelerated rate, as it has no way to dry out.

Sundowner is aware of the problem. However, to my knowledge, I have never heard of any type of factory recall nor even any type of notice of concern being sent from the manufacturer to all affected customers. It is reasonable to assume that almost every "Valuelite" trailer presently on the road has this problem, and that most owners are blissfully unaware of the problem.

The only solution I know of to "band-aid" the problem is to have the entire frame sanded with a power sander, then a "metal cleaner" should be applied, then a "metal ready" product applied, and finally at least 3 coats of "POR 15" should be applied to stop further deterioration. POR 15 will need to be applied every few years to insure full rust prevention.

If the trailer is still under warranty, Sundowner will do the work, although the trailer owner should make sure that all of the above procedures are done. It is interesting to note that this winter Sundowner announced that they have stopped making Valuelite trailers without any explanation as to why they were discontinuing the model.

I hope this information is helpful to any owners of Sundowner "Valuelite" trailers.

ses that require the best of care. This includes hauling the horses to the hospital or clinic if required. Failure to obtain timely medical services for any one of these horses may result in an untimely death. The design of the special powder coating on the trailer is very unsafe and should be recalled. At any time, one of these trailers floors can fall out with a horse on board and drag the horse down the highway, killing it. Sundowner claimed they solved the problem of steel against aluminum with a special powder coating, but the "powder coating" is failing and an accident is waiting to happen. They have made some changes to the newer trailers, but these also have the possibility of failure.
The inspection station I took my trailer to for inspection stated they have seen over 250 of these failing floor supports. That is just one station. Please, if you own a Sundowner, get a good look under your trailer before you put your horse on it!

iT has come to my attention that there is a serious design flaw in the powder-coated steel frames on the "Valuelite" models of Sundowner Trailers causing these frames to rust at an accelerated rate. Further, I understand that the manufacturer has not alerted the owners of these trailers to the damage occuring and the danger of a major frame failure.

In 1999 Sundowner began building "Valuelite" trailers using power coated steel frames. There is an inherent design flaw in the engineering of this type of frame. Powder coating does not flex with the trailer, and what happens over time, as the trailer travels and vibrates, the powder coating over the steel frame splits apart at the frame joints. Moisture is then trapped between the frame and the powder coating, causing the steel to rust at an accelerated rate, as it has no way to dry out.

Sundowner is aware of the problem. However, to my knowledge, I have never heard of any type of factory recall nor even any type of notice of concern being sent from the manufacturer to all affected customers. It is reasonable to assume that almost every "Valuelite" trailer presently on the road has this problem, and that most owners are blissfully unaware of the problem.

The only solution I know of to "band-aid" the problem is to have the entire frame sanded with a power sander, then a "metal cleaner" should be applied, then a "metal ready" product applied, and finally at least 3 coats of "POR 15" should be applied to stop further deterioration. POR 15 will need to be applied every few years to insure full rust prevention.

If the trailer is still under warranty, Sundowner will do the work, although the trailer owner should make sure that all of the above procedures are done. It is interesting to note that this winter Sundowner announced that they have stopped making Valuelite trailers without any explanation as to why they were discontinuing the model.

I hope this information is helpful to any owners of Sundowner "Valuelite" trailers.

J Swan

Feb. 18, 2008, 06:57 PM

Well, if you read the original post Sundowner is honoring the warranty. The OP is upset that it's going to have to take her own mechanic so long to get to it.

My trailer is over 8 years old and nothing has failed on it. The axles and tires are perfectly appropriate, the welds are good, the hinges are good (and the side door is still on even though one of my horses tried to tear it off).

It's got normal wear and tear - but so does my tow vehicle. Sorry some of you seem to have problems with your trailers. I remember the days of the Featherlite hysteria, and I can think of many trailers that have failed for various reasons. Usually because of failure to maintain it; or just age.

If any of y'all think having to scrape and sand is some sort of monumental disaster and worthy of a national recall, you've obviously never spent the winter under a boat in the boatyard. Farm vehicles and implements require a lot of maintenance. Just like boats and boat trailers. Neither is any fun, and both cost money. Unsaddle the drama llamas.

Is the fact that Sundowner (ESPECIALLY at the HQ level) is unethical and not honoring warranties actually NEW NEWS to some of you?

MANY posters here have recounted ad nauseum about problems with Sundowner QUALITY, that is FURTHER not backed by its owners.

Personally, I have shared multiple times on this BB my first hand trouble with them. First, the trailer I bought, tho NEVER USED, sat for 3 mos. after Congress over winter ... when I went to get in to it for the FIRST TIME, the door almost came off in my hand. Turns out, it had ALL of the door hinges tearing away from the frame because the hinges were UNDERATED for the weighted capacity.

Secondly ... about my trainer's trailer ... the axles tearing off at 65 mph ((w/a listed Olympic team horse, a National Champion horse, and my regional champion horse on board) ... the axles and tires BOTH were no where NEAR the correct capacity for the rig. Sundowner is NOTORIOUS for this. Even on BP's, they put the cheapest avail. tires on. IMHO - I wouldn't trust them to haul a show dog, much less a horse!!

Magnum

horsegirl520

Feb. 18, 2008, 09:42 PM

Yikes... mines an 2000 (I think a SunLite?)... now I'm nervous! I haven't had any problems with my trailer yet (and I LOVE it), but I have noticed some rust (I assumed it was just superficial... just where the paint flaked off). I need to take it in for some routine maintenance... I'll be sure to have them check it out to make sure it's still safe for my horsey to ride in.

magnum

Feb. 19, 2008, 03:47 PM

J Swan -- They refused to honor the warranty ... we met directly with the owners at their plant .... They refused to admit anything was wrong. It was hard to legally prove otherwise, since no government standards EXIST for such units from a STRUCTURAL standpoint (only regulations on tail lighting, reflective tapes, etc.)

Sadly, a lot of Mftr's these days refuse to admit any wrongdoing.

Do they think that admitting a wrong opens them up for a lawsuit?

Possibly. So, instead they will risk injured & mangled horses .... and they get unhappy, non returning customers, BBB complaints, and NHTSA complaints (I made one and encourage others to do so). Maybe it is due to similar complaints that some trailers are no longer made?

Hopefully, owners of ANY brand of trailer deemed unsafe as a PRODUCT of its engineering schemes or mft'g. practices will pursue complaints with the proper governing authorities.

If we do not, is it because we feel comfy loading our trusting equines on to trailers with NO consumer testing or government mandated structural requirements?

No wonder these horses don't want to load. They sense more than we do.

FYI - A friend had a lovely Hanoverian last summer who refused to load after a very successful show. Unusual for him .... we coerced him on anyway. Within 11 miles of the show grounds, his foot went thru the floor at 60 m.p.h on an interstate, resulting in a 3 week hospital stay and one year of rehab. His coronet band had been sliced all the way thru ... it had to grow out. Sadly, the hoof split after he threw a shoe almost a year to the day after the trailer floor gave way. Infection set in instantly .... and he had to be euthanized. No one saw that coming, includ. the surgical staff and equine professional working on his case.

Investigations revealed that the trailer floor had been put together with all aluminum - a respectable thickness - until they ran out in one section. For that section, they stuck in PLYWOOD and COVERED IT WITH a very thin aluminum skin. This location was right where the horse's front feet rested in transit. Over time, the metal had leaked water on the plywood and the plywood had rotted. This was truly something NO ONE (except the factory) could have ever seen coming or ever known about. We had inspected the floor and never saw anything. It was all hidden by aluminum as intended by the factory - which has since sold and no longer produces a horse trailer product, BTW.

Since then, I have inspected several of such factories and it is not unusual to find cases of alcholic beverages in the fridges in the employee break rooms .... (nice touch, huh?). Their metal working / fabrication shops are some of the highest violators of employee safety standards in the nation .... and have been on OSHA's "initiative" program for more than 3 years now.

I have personally lost all faith in trailer mftr's.

When I custom designed and ordered my CURRENT trailer, I actually had them hold production on it in the structural phase until I could get to the factory to inspect it myself. I took photos (with film, as digital is not admissable in court) from every angle. I told them the story about previous experiences .... I then politely let them know if anything went wrong or if any aspect of the trailer was stucturally compromised resulting in harm to me, my horse or other travelers on the road, that I'd pursue legal action against them.

Only after it passed my own inspection did I give them the green light to continue finishing my trailer ... (talk about a PITA customer!). They were actually GREAT about it and they wecolmed all of my input, including design revisions for future similar models.

FWIW - Unless there's been a recent change, there are NO government issued minimal safety structural standards for livestock rigs. Some trailer Mftr's. have formed their own group to "self police." To see what standards they have set for themselves, you can reference their website. I think it is : National Trailer Manufacturer's Association.

Magnum

J Swan

Feb. 19, 2008, 05:53 PM

You don't have to defend yourself; I wasn't attacking you. I have no doubt that you had problems with your trailer.

And I'm right with you on the quality issues. It's one reason I think they are all deathtraps.

You're right - there is little to no oversight. From what I've read; the trigger for reporting an accident to the feds is the GVW of the tow vehicle. Most of the tow vehicles horse owners tow with are under that GVW. So any manufacturer can point to a flawless safety record. Doesn't matter what type of trailer - Brenderups, Exiss, Sundowner, Featherlite...... etc.

It makes me tear my hair out - but that is the subject of another thread.

In all honestly - the rusting on the frame is going to happen. There are terrific products out there to fix it. Horse trailers (and trailers in general) require a great deal more maintenance than the manufacturers tell us. I suppose the exception could be the all aluminum - but aluminum is difficult to weld, corrodes.... you know - no trailer design is perfect. Eventually they all fail.

I don't have any vested interest in defending Sundowner, or my personal choice of horse trailer. I've just not had one single problem with it. However, I do maintain it more than the average horse owner. So - I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not.

talloaks

Feb. 19, 2008, 07:21 PM

Since 1980 I have only had KINGSTON trailers and if I bought a new one today it would be a KINGSTON. :yes:

promlightshine

Feb. 19, 2008, 07:57 PM

I also wonder about trailers made in one part of the country being shipped to other parts. I live in MA and use my trailer year round. I hose the undercarriage everytime I take it out in the winter and try to avoid going out on snowy/salt ridden roads.

That said- I do get my trailer serviced annually and will ask them about my frame and how it's looking. I've had the trailer for 4 years. There were little things in the warranty that were covered. I have a step down so the bumpers were pulled out as the horses stepped on them at times .

I did have an axle bend. It wasn't covered. We did get another and I'm pretty sure it was my fault.

I do have a sundowner. I love my trailer. I will be sure to keep on top of these concerns. Frankly , for those of us with these trailers we are stuck. I know my 4 year old gooseneck trailer isn't going to be the first thing someone looks at when considering a used trailer. Up in NE I'm seeing more 2 h bp's behind smaller and smaller towing vehicles than I could have imagined. That's another post and J Swan's prayer will apply there also :)

JSwan--You made me smile. You are a hunting, riding, perfectionist with perfect tack and a wealth of knowledge. I can always count on you to keep it interesting!!! :)

flypony74

Feb. 19, 2008, 11:24 PM

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/thread-view.asp?threadid=8760&start=1

I don't have an iron in the fire, but saw this....

promlightshine

Feb. 20, 2008, 10:38 PM

Interesting thread. It does look as if they are trying a couple of different options. I too have the lovely rhino coated frame. I remember when we bought the trailer the salesman at a place we didnt' buy a sundowner did tell us about the oxydation effect. However, he said they had done things to minimize the risk. Hmmm... maybe my 2003 is going to be ok?

I know I bring my trailer for work with the mats pulled out so they can see the floor etc. I really appreciate this thread. The trailer is only 4 years old so I can hopefully try to be proactive.

Good luck to all and here's hoping for no more serious accidents due to this problem.

Touchstone Farm

Feb. 20, 2008, 10:50 PM

Evalee, perhaps you are referring to a different Dr. Doolittle, but the one I know had a Kieffer trailer that had the doors fail (no ramp on this trailer, so no ramp to fall off), and had her horse dragged down the road. Keiffer maintained the trailer was fine, but I do get a sick kick out of their current advertising which states "better doors."

Because there are no federal regulations on trailers, some companies will build to the minimum...

Of course, we should all do maintenance, but I find it inconceivable to me that a floor should fail after only 8 years of use. My car is 14 years old and has 209,000 miles on it. It has had good engine maintenance, but I certainly don't maintain the interior much nor do I wash it very often and yet I don't think I'm going to fall through the floor as I drive down the highway. (Of course, I don't normally pee in it either! ) But until there are federal regulations that trailer companies must meet, it is up to them as to what standard they build to.

Evalee Hunter

Feb. 20, 2008, 11:26 PM

magnum

Feb. 21, 2008, 01:08 PM

No problem, J Swan. I took no offense, but rather wanted to clarify.

I will have to do some digging around about GVW's ... I had not before heard of this, but good info. and thanks.

BTW -- forgot to mention above, the horse who lost his life to the trailer in question was age 5 and it was after his first show at Training level, where he got 70%! He was 6 when the hoof structure failed and he had to be euthanized.
A totally avoidable tragedy.

Magnum

page3girl

Feb. 21, 2008, 09:07 PM

I have a 2007 777 without a dressing room that I'm about to trade in for one with. I've been very happy with it, until I saw this thread! Asked my Sundowner dealer about it.

Apparently the problem began in 1999 and was resolved in 2003. Now, they use a rhino lining kind of material that flexes (the powder coat cracked as a consequence of flexing, and water got into the cracks and was trapped, which caused the corrosion).

XHalt

Feb. 21, 2008, 09:13 PM

It's my understanding that Sundowner NEVER fixed the problem. They have continued manufacturing these trailers with the powder coating knowing full well the problems consumers would face. They have only recently announced that they are stopping production on them to go with an all aluminum model.

promlightshine

Feb. 22, 2008, 12:46 AM

I have a 2004 that I bring in annually for service. Usually in the fall but this year next week :). I didn't trailer through the winter this year like I have in the past so delayed the service until the use would pick up.

I bought my trailer at the EA and have since then gone to Orchard for service. They have been great. I called today and the service guy told me that he isn't the one to talk to me about this. He sent me to a VM and I left a message. I always pull the mats when it's serviced to be sure they can get a look at everything.

My floor and frame are rhinocoated. The coating is just starting to crack off in spots. I asked the service guy if he'll check for it , I usually give a list anyway so I'll put it on.

I'm interested to see what they have to say. I told them I'm just looking for guidelines as to what to watch for. Maybe he'll call back tomorrow.

FYI-for those in my area 10% off if you get your trailer serviced by the end of Feb. What the heck? If the weather is lousy I'll forego the 10% and book it in March.

pasodqueen

Feb. 22, 2008, 06:26 AM

Okay..this thread got me paranoid so I had my 2003 Sundowner bumper pull brought in for inspection with a request to look at the ramp, the welds, tires etc. And guess what, they found some issues where the powder coat meets the frame. One spot but the mechanic said it needed to be taken care of sooner than later. I bought it in New Jersey so now what do I do? Call the dealer or Sundowner themselves to see if they will address the problem? Any thoughts or will they not cover this?

J Swan

Feb. 22, 2008, 07:49 AM

No problem, J Swan. I took no offense, but rather wanted to clarify.

I will have to do some digging around about GVW's ... I had not before heard of this, but good info. and thanks.

Magnum

I'll see if I can find that information for you. I seem to recall that it came from..... DOT? It was the last time we had a "trailer" thread, and several people mentioned the dearth of data on trailer accidents. So I did some poking around.

For the poster who mentioned trailers not meeting the same standard as autos.... I think if they did they'd be a heck of a lot more expensive than they are now. Not a justification for shoddy work, of course. But I think a 12K horse trailer would easily go for 30K or higher if they had to meet the same highway standards as automobiles.

And even then..... autos/trucks fail all the time too.

pasodqueen - if your trailer is still under warranty, and you find something wrong, obviously you should make a claim under the warranty. It's not a big deal.

XHalt

Feb. 22, 2008, 11:06 AM

promlightshine - I have been dealing with Orchard trailers too. They are nothing but a class act!! Talk about making the best of a really bad situation (they have close to 2,000 Sundowners on the road). Peter the service manager spent almost half an hour with me on the phone and was completely honest and upfront about the situation. I personally didn't feel like going through the whole warranty claim and waiting to see if they would reimburse me for the repairs so decided to trade my trailer in. Orchard trailers took it in trade for a very good price and will have the repairs done under their name before reselling it.

And I had to laugh when you mentioned the 10% off...that's what started this whole thing for me. I thought I'd save 10% on my annual service, instead I ended up with a new trailer. LOL! :)

talloaks

Feb. 22, 2008, 01:36 PM

XHalt, what brand of trailer did you buy?

XHalt

Feb. 22, 2008, 01:37 PM

XHalt, what brand of trailer did you buy?

An Elite...all aluminum so hopefully it will last a long time.

talloaks

Feb. 22, 2008, 01:50 PM

An Elite...all aluminum so hopefully it will last a long time.

I assume it is not one of the Sundowner models, right??

promlightshine

Feb. 22, 2008, 09:16 PM

xhalt

I really don't plan or want to start over so. I have a 2 H slant GN . It's one of the "black " models. I just love it . It's not a perfect trailer but it's been good for me. I also have a son heading off to college so I can't devest (no horse related item in my life has been an investment :) in something right now. Budgets are set.

Just as an FYI to the poster who bought her trailer elsewhere...

I purchased my trailer from a dealer in southern Ct . Orchard is almost 2 hours closer. I have had them service it from day l. I am pleased and do promote their service department.

I would expect any dealer or authorized service agency for sundowner to provide you service. Fortunately I've had no problems with the warranty stuff so far.

promlightshine

Feb. 29, 2008, 07:35 PM

Ok, I too spent a good deal of time with the service department on the phone. What I will tell you all who have the 700 series trailers is to be sure you have them monitored and checked on a regular basis. There are some theories going around including the coating issues but it's likely much deeper than that. If it falls within the warranty they will cover. It's just timing. If you are past your 8 years and it's structural or if it's just surface and you are past your 3 years be prepared to write the checks.

I'm waiting to hear what the actual costs and damages will be.

I live in NE. I clean my trailer out after every use. I hose it down. I routinely pull the mats . I don't use bedding but use straw to avoid debris getting trapped. Guys this is a concern. Be very careful, especially if you haven't been getting them checked or live in areas where temps can vary quite a bit.

At this point I would still get a sundowner as I loved everything about my trailer . There were "extras" that weren't in some of the others. However, I'm very concerned and have advised people to be sure they are getting routine maintenance on their rigs. But that should be happening regardless of the brand or any "internet" concerns.

eventer_mi

Mar. 1, 2008, 10:05 AM

I think that I am one of those who posted about the ramp/door falling off my Sundowner trailer, and I had a b*tch of a time getting the dealer to honor the warranty. I only had the trailer for about four months when this happened. They tried to blame me, saying that I didn't sweep all the manure from the hinges - huh? This is a HORSE TRAILER. If I didn't get every last microscopic piece of manure, the ramp shouldn't fall off the d@mn thing! I was lucky in that it just popped off after I loaded my horse up in the trailer, not while I was moving, but that was a waking nightmare for me for weeks after.

It was a Sundowner Valuelite, btw. I'll never buy another Sundowner again - you wouldn't believe the phone calls that I had to make to get the thing serviced, and the whole time I was praying that I wouldn't need my trailer for an emergency while I was duking it out with them.

Lisa Cook

Mar. 1, 2008, 10:42 AM

Add me to the list of people with a Sundowner problem. I brought my trailer in to the dealer a week or so ago for its annual servicing. Last year, I paid to have all the superficial surface rust stripped off the frame and have the whole thing done with a new undercoating & paint etc. So, imagine my surprise when the dealer called to say that my frame was shot...completely rotted out. The rotting started on the inside of the frame and worked its way out, so there was no way to know it was there until the rotting worked its way all through the frame. As I understand it, it has to do with the fact that the steel Sundowner used is actually compressed layers of steel. Once moisture finds its way into the middle of the layers, it rusts and just works its way through the steel, from the inside out.

The service manager told me that my trailer was one of the worst Sundowners they have seen. But they are happy to have it because I have it serviced annually there, and they have full documentation on all the maintainence that was done every since I bought it (it is a 2000). Apparently Sundowner claims that the structure failure is due to owners not maintaining their trailers properly and the dealer can prove that is not the case with my trailer.

I loved my Sundowner (is is a 2000 Valuelite, 2 horse bumper pull with dressing room). I cleaned it religiously, totally pulling the mats out, scrubbing the trailer clean regularly, inside & out. It looked fabulous, I must say, on the outside. Everytime I read something about ramps falling off or structures failing, I was all like: "Oh, not my trailer! I love my Sundowner!".

As of yesterday, I now own a Jamco.

promlightshine

Mar. 1, 2008, 12:45 PM

Lisa; that is exactly what the concern is. That is the compressed steel is creating a structural problem NOT the coatings. If you repair the surface you don't get to the core. It covers the problem.

Re: the hinges-Sorry Mr. Dealer, but 3 years bumper to bumper is what it is. I know I never had a problem with repairs like that and believe that is a unethical dealer vs national issue. I do know that any dealer that is not responding needs to know the name of your lawyer, several hundred internet friends etc. Now I'm into the remaining portion so I have to have a structural problem. It's all in the matter of interpretation. I can't and won't put my animals at risk.

Check your frames carefully. If you service yourself-keep all your records. Take annual photos.
Check for recalls and more.

Husband and I talked about getting another brand of trailer but again, the timing is poor. I purchased a brand new trailer so as to have one for years especially once it was time for son to go to college. The same with our vehicles. Besides I do love my trailer -I just want to know that my precious cargo is safe, which of course is why we chose this trailer in the first place.

TouchstoneAcres

Mar. 1, 2008, 01:14 PM

promlightshine

Mar. 9, 2008, 01:08 PM

Enjoy your trailet. The good news is if there are any concerns, you will find them out here :)

At the time I purchased my sundowner we were traveling all around to go to hunts and hunter paces here in NE. My riding partner and I even planned to go further north and catch some of the hunts there but it never worked out as she became ill. The goose offered flexibility for housing/staying overnight places. I love the GN I have. It's likely not practical with the price of fuel rising . Many of my friends have gone smaller and plan to stay that way. I'm debating about that but again, the costs of starting over are something I wish to avoid.

I have to trust that a company with a lot of positive press on the internet will come through. I am fortunate that the service agent is thorough and keeps great records. I have been reading and researching and since I too have cared for my trailer like Lisa -I have to believe there will be a solution that is safe . But if there isn't I'll not be silent!!

Lisa-thanks so much for the PM. You helped answer some questions I did have. Infact, I think your trailer was the one he used for an example when talking to me. No names of course :)

Invested1

Mar. 10, 2008, 09:57 AM

Gindarkh

Mar. 10, 2008, 11:12 AM

When I custom designed and ordered my CURRENT trailer, I actually had them hold production on it in the structural phase until I could get to the factory to inspect it myself. I took photos (with film, as digital is not admissable in court) from every angle. I told them the story about previous experiences .... I then politely let them know if anything went wrong or if any aspect of the trailer was stucturally compromised resulting in harm to me, my horse or other travelers on the road, that I'd pursue legal action against them.

Only after it passed my own inspection did I give them the green light to continue finishing my trailer ... (talk about a PITA customer!). They were actually GREAT about it and they wecolmed all of my input, including design revisions for future similar models.

Magnum

Magnum,

Out of curiosity, what brand is this new trailer whose customer service was so great ?

witherbee

Mar. 10, 2008, 11:31 AM

Damn, I need to get my trailer in for inpection too. I love mine - it's a 777 BP with DR, but it's not used all that frequently. We bought it in MA, and I think it's a 2003 or 2004 - have to look it up. Now we're in FL, so the weather is very different. Not sure how thorough the maintenance has been on it... How much $$ are we talking here for a good inspection?

promlightshine

Mar. 10, 2008, 09:45 PM

I don't know what the going rates are but typically I have them check the brakes, wiring, repack the bearings and of course they do little things like replace lights, etc. The brakes were done a year or so ago-but in general it's a couple hundred dollars some of which was covered by warranty. I've also purchased an extra rim just in case I need a 2nd spare tire. You just never know-so that did increase my bill a bit last year :).

Others can jump in but have them look carefully at your frame. If there is any sign of rot explain that it may be coming from the inside out. Look for rust coming up on the inside wall and the floor.

If you have a sundowner dealer/service agent down there , they should know about this . However, one of the things that happens here that may not happen in FLA is the extreme temp changes we get. The expansion and contraction of the metal may be more severe up North.

Equibrit

Mar. 10, 2008, 10:23 PM

I would suggest you swat up on the reaction between dissimilar metals when placed together; http://www.legendmfginc.com/Promotions/Steel_Alum.htm

This is most certainly a flaw caused by faulty design. Buy ALL steel or ALL aluminum - never mix the two.

092556

Mar. 10, 2008, 10:31 PM

Is the problem the steel frame rusting out or the aluminum floor or both ? I don't own a Sundowner, a 1988 Four Star, 4 horse gooseneck aluminum stock trailer but it does have a steel frame and an aluminum floor. I crawled under it, the frame had no rust, no bubbling paint and I couldn't see any damage or discoloring of the aluminum. I'm I missing something? I live in Florida so salt and extreme temperatures are not an issue. Is the problem mainly up north and only Sundowner Trailers ?

Touchstone Farm

Mar. 10, 2008, 10:42 PM

Well, J Swan, I'd be happy to pay more to make sure the trailer I'd buy met safety standards and would more likely keep my horses from falling through the floors or flying out the back and into the traffic following behind!! (Which in fact, if my friend pulling a Kieffer trailer at about 15 mph in a residential neighborhood, probably would have seen her horse fly out of the back at 55 mph, with a high probability of causing a serious traffic accident/injuries/possible deaths of her husband and children following behind in her mini van.) So yes, I'd be willing to pay more.

The only possible solution is to write legislators and demand that stock trailers meet safety standards as well.

J Swan

Mar. 11, 2008, 07:49 AM

The only possible solution is to write legislators and demand that stock trailers meet safety standards as well.

If I remember correctly (and I may not so double check) there seems to be a bit of a gap or loophole or something in the fed DOT regs.

I'm just talking about accident reporting - the type of reporting that the feds would use to determine if a problem exists with a certain mode of transportation.

The threshold for reporting is based not on the trailer - but on the GVW of the tow vehicle. The figure I recall reading was 10,000. So if I was in an accident with my horse trailer - that accident would meet the threshold for reporting. So you do see a couple of horse trailer accidents being reported - and that would include trailer failure.

But since the threshold is the GVW of the tow VEHICLE - the vast majority of horse trailers may fail, result in an accident or injury to human or live cargo - and it's simply never reported except to the police dept as a regular old traffic accident.

I guess that's why we read or hear a lot of anecdotal evidence - but not a lot of facts.

I did see in some PE journals that metallurgical failure analysis was used in some lawsuits - but again - that information would be scattered among court documents, maybe profiled in a journal somewhere - but there it stays. On the other hand - google isn't exactly the best way to search for scientific information.

When we read about semi's full of livestock being involved in accidents - other than the fact they are high profile - another reason those can get national attention is the involvement of the feds. Interstate transport, combined with the GVW of the tow vehicle.

Anyway - I don't think I have any point to make except that it's possible for any trailer manufacturer to point to the lack of accident data as proof that their trailer is well built and safe. However, that really isn't the case - lack of data does not mean anything but that data has not been collected or stored in an easily accessible location. And there appears to be no duty on the manufacturer to disclose that data even if it did exist.

I'm less concerned about the Sundowner stories than I am with the design of all trailers. Any component can fail on any piece of equipment - so a failure here or there may not be significant.

Any manufacturer can make any claim they want and point to the lack of data to support their claim. And a consumer really has no choice except to rely on the dealer/manufacturer.

But I'd also like to point out that mechanics aren't saints, either. Some of the information about the steel used in the frame of this trailer is wrong. Mechanics are pretty good about scaring customers into unneeded repairs - and when I learn of that crap it makes me furious.

All aluminum trailers have their own dangers. All steel trailers have their own dangers. No design is the best or safest. But I really would like for accident data involving any livestock trailer - no matter what size or GVW of the tow vehicle - be reportable. At least that way - if legislation or regulatory change is needed - there is verifiable, objective data to support it.

Equibrit

Mar. 11, 2008, 02:39 PM

Fact;

Galvanic or Two-Metal Corrosion

A potential difference usually exists between two dissimilar metals when they are immersed in a corrosive or conductive solution. If these metals are placed in contact (or otherwise electrically connected), this potential difference produces electron flow between them. Corrosion of the less corrosion-resistant metal is usually increased and attack of the more resistant material is decreased, as compared with the behavior of these metals when they are not in contact. The less resistant metal becomes anodic and the more resistant metal cathodic. Usually the- cathode or cathodic metal corrodes very little or not at all in this type of couple. Because of the electric currents and dissimilar metals involved, this form of corrosion is called galvanic, or two-metal, corrosion. It is electrochemical corrosion, but we shall restrict the term galvanic to dissimilar-metal effects for purposes of clarity.

J Swan

Mar. 11, 2008, 07:27 PM

Well yeah, everyone knows that. Which is why if you use dissimilar metals you place an insulator between them. Or you should.

On the other hand - even all aluminum trailers use steel bolts - without insulators. You don't hold them together with aluminum. Maybe corrosion minded trailer owners are best advised to go with all steel trailers?

Dunno.

Equibrit

Mar. 11, 2008, 08:06 PM

Well .............It really should be corrosion minded trailer builders that design better trailers to avoid the corrosion problems!

Spectrum

Mar. 12, 2008, 02:09 PM

I'm feeling pretty good about my new Trail-et delivered last week. Please don't burst my bubble yet! I looked at Sundowners too but preferred the wood floor that I could rep-lace myself if need be. Also this 4 horse H2H was much more affordable than the Sundowner.
http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s133/TouchstoneAcres/Trail-et/

Rest easy, Touchstone! I can think of dozens of people I know who have various models of Trail-et trailers in our area, many of them 10-20 years old ath this point and still looking practically new. I've used many different models of varying ages myself as well, and have always been impressed with the quality and general safety of these trailers.

I don't know of a single person who has owned a Trail-et in my area who has had a trailer accident or major problem with one that wasn't maintenance-related (ie. broken wire or needing new tires/brakes, etc).

Because of that they are absolutely my first choice in horse trailers. I have also heard (but can't confirm) that Hawk trailers are nearly identical to Trail-ets. I haven't seen any first-hand, however.

Spectrum.

MaresNest

Mar. 12, 2008, 05:14 PM

I have also heard (but can't confirm) that Hawk trailers are nearly identical to Trail-ets. I haven't seen any first-hand, however.

I have heard that, too, but that Hawks are slightly better...

http://www.blueridgetrailer.com/pages/iframeMain.html?./horse/horse_main.html

J Swan

Mar. 12, 2008, 07:44 PM

Well .............It really should be corrosion minded trailer builders that design better trailers to avoid the corrosion problems!

Amen!

Invested1

Mar. 13, 2008, 08:49 AM

I have also heard (but can't confirm) that Hawk trailers are nearly identical to Trail-ets.

I heard that too (though also can't confirm)--that the two owners split up--one went on to build Hawks and the other, Trail-ets....

sporthorsefilly

Mar. 14, 2008, 11:20 AM

Any thoughts on Equi Spirit?

Frwndoh

Mar. 14, 2008, 12:51 PM

I've had my EquiSpirit for nearly 9 years and have always used it pretty heavily (atleast once a week spring to fall). It has held up VERY well. I maintain it well, always cleaning it out after every trip, but pulled the mats out and went over it really thoroughly yesterday. No wear and tear on the structure, floor boards, etc.
To think I was debating between the Sundowner and the EquiSpirit back in 1999 - from reading this post, I think I made the right decision!

promlightshine

Mar. 19, 2008, 09:46 PM

Well the word is in. My trailer is fine for now. They did a thorough evaluation of the frame and for now I'm ok to enjoy it. I have been advised to never miss an annual servicing and to periodically inspect my frame and floor. No worries.

I am going to pick it up later this week and can't wait to have it back. Funny but you feel so dependent without one. That's for sure!!

karenstandefer

Mar. 22, 2008, 10:08 PM

I've had 3 Sundowner ValueLite trailers. They've all been great. All have had to have some sort of warranty work or the other and the HQ have treated me like a queen with every incident. I don't have a dealer close to me (purchased this last one from a dealer in New Mexico even though I lived in Washington), so I regulary call the headquarters in OK when I need something and they'll tell me if I can get a local "other brand" trailer dealer to handle it or whether it really needs to be transported to the nearest Sundowner dealer 100 miles away.

Last week I did my annual acid washing. Removed the mats and hauled the trailer to a truck wash. Everything cleaned up nicely, but when I got back home and was walking on the horse compartment flooring, it felt funny and on closer inspection it seemed that the bedliner had delaminated from the aluminum flooring. I found one "slit" and sort of pulled it up and it didn't look good. So, I called my dealer in New Mexico to ask them about it. He told me that it is covered by the 3 yr warranty and not the structural warranty. He also said that they don't use the bedliner anymore, but didn't say why when I asked.

So, after talking to him I decided to investigate under the liner further and started pulling it up. I ended up ripping it all out. About 70% of it was delaminated. Underneath I found rusted bolts and quite a bit of electrolysis. So, I called the Headquarters office and the warranty office said it was covered by my 8 year structural warranty, take it to the closest Sundowner dealer and make sure they fixed it to my satisfaction.

I have always had the same pleasant experience with the headquarters office with whatever question or problem I have thrown at them. I've delt with them for 12 years now. No trailer brand is without problems that crop up. But I'm extremely satisfied with the service I've received from Sundowner. For the first two years I owned my latest trailer, the sales person would call me about every 5-6 months to make sure everything was going well.

Karen

Old Equine Lady

Mar. 23, 2008, 09:45 PM

So, after talking to him I decided to investigate under the liner further and started pulling it up. I ended up ripping it all out. About 70% of it was delaminated. Underneath I found rusted bolts and quite a bit of electrolysis. So, I called the Headquarters office and the warranty office said it was covered by my 8 year structural warranty, take it to the closest Sundowner dealer and make sure they fixed it to my satisfaction.

I have always had the same pleasant experience with the headquarters office with whatever question or problem I have thrown at them. I've delt with them for 12 years now. No trailer brand is without problems that crop up. But I'm extremely satisfied with the service I've received from Sundowner. For the first two years I owned my latest trailer, the sales person would call me about every 5-6 months to make sure everything was going well.

Karen

I am glad to hear that you have had good service from Sundowner and they will fix your trailer right away. As I said in my first post, they will not began repairs until April and this started in January. The location I bought my trailer from is no longer a Sundowner dealer, so I have to wait months for a place that is 60 miles away to repair. Not that it is that far and I guess because I am not a regular customer, I don't get the same type of service?

karenstandefer

Mar. 24, 2008, 06:35 PM

.... and I guess because I am not a regular customer, I don't get the same type of service?

I think the difference may be because I didn't deal with the dealership. I called the Headquarters Warranty manager from the beginning. I've always delt with them first, before the dealer, because my dealer is 2000 miles away from me and I don't have a Sundowner warranty location anywhere close to me (100 miles away). So, I'm always hopeful that they'll let me take it to the RV place instead of hauling 100 miles up the road.

Sorry you've had so much trouble. As another person suggest, I'd definitely call the Sundowner Headquarters Warranty Mgr and make a complaint against the dealer.

Karen

Lookout

Mar. 24, 2008, 06:55 PM

It's not a "major design" problem. Take a look under your car or truck and you'll see rust too. You're SUPPOSED to be maintaining your trailer; .
It is a major design flaw. It's called galvanic action and is the order in which metals should touch, or not touch depending on their propensity to rust when in contact. It's the first lesson they teach in materials class. It's akin to putting your gasoline storage right in the hay storage area.

J Swan

Mar. 24, 2008, 07:03 PM

Lookout

Mar. 24, 2008, 08:18 PM

Yes, Lookout - we've all hashed that out long ago. Please take my posts in context - and read the ones that come before and after.

It's not akin to storing gasoline next to hay. Even an all steel trailer, painted and maintained, is going to get some rust on it over time. Even the most expensive, beautifully engineered sports car will get rust on the frame. Even painted surfaces can rust underneath if something (like a rock) chips the paint. And what happens when dissimilar metals touch isn't rust - by the way.

That's why you have to maintain your vehicles, trailers and farm equipment. That's why they make paint for farm implements. For trailers. For cars. blah blah blah.

Because wear and tear happens.

Actually yes, you're right, it's not rust, it's corrode. And when you have metals in the wrong order according to the galvanic chart, touching, no maintenance is going to help you. It's bad design. And yes I did go thru the posts and the point was not made. It's like gasoline next to hay in that two 'incompatible' materials which should not be in close proximity, are put there in error.

J Swan

Mar. 24, 2008, 08:53 PM

Unless there is an insulator.

Raven08

Aug. 7, 2008, 01:44 PM

I would like to bring to the attention of anyone who currently owns a Sundowner Trailer and/or is aware of the ongoing problems trailer owners are experiencing with the disintegration of the under structure due to faulty undercoating of all trailers manufactured between 1998-2008. If you did not know this already, please educate yourself, it could mean the safety of transporting your horse.

Sundowner has not publicly recognized the problem; however, if called directly they allow as how they are well aware of the problem and that the individual dealers are taking care of the repairs. Unfortunately the company is encouraging a sand and paint job to cover up the problem what is really becoming a structural issue. The dealers hands are tied. There are no recalls as of yet and it is getting more and more difficult to get results that satisfies the safety issues of the trailers. It‘s just a matter of time before there is a tragedy of a horse falling through the flooring of a Sundowner Trailer. These trailers are rusting from the inside out. Take a good look at the underside of your trailer with a flashlight and specifically check the seams and corners. Peel back the covering that is under the mats. The company is clearly trying to put a band aid on the issue until such time comes as the warranty is void. The question is why we are waiting for someone else to suffer a tragedy before we make a bold move. We, as concerned horse owners need to act collectively and present an argument that the company cannot refute. By contacting the Consumer Protection Agency we can bombard them with personal experience and letters of dissatisfaction. With enough names and testimonies we can make a difference. Go to www.oag.ok.gov and create your file with the agency. Make sure to reference Sundowner Trailer.

For information on the company has reduced their work from approximately 600 to 200 over the past two years. The Elkhart Office is closing. They are downsizing and cutting corners. If we do not act now we may very well be stuck with an expensive investment that is dangerous to use.

Aug. 7, 2008, 02:20 PM

I recently bought a used Sundowner SUNLITE and did extensive research before I bought it, and had it inspected. It passed with flying colors. No issues, AT ALL.

In my research what I found out is that the issues with Sundowners are with the VALULITE line.

Still, proceed with caution as you would in any large purchase or maint program, but be aware that all Sundowners were not created equal.

Castlegate

Aug. 7, 2008, 02:38 PM

I also had a ramp fall off my Sundowner....trailer was fairly new when it happened. Horse was loading when it fell..was determined to be a "defect" in the welding on the trailer. Won't own one again...and Sundowner was less than concerned that my trailer may have other "defects" in welds in other places....

I know someone else who had the door fall off theirs while transporting horses...you expect some problems with trailers when they age...and of course if you dont maintain them...but my issue was just sloppy work...and it took attorneys to get it fixed.

justathought

Apr. 8, 2009, 10:24 PM

Any recent updates on this issue?

justathought

Apr. 9, 2009, 07:16 AM

bump

cssutton

Apr. 9, 2009, 09:31 AM

I have a Sundowner 727 4 horse that I estimate I have pulled over 200,000 miles over the past 14 years.

I get it inspected and acid washed at least once and usually twice a year.

I have never had any of the problems mentioned here.

I am mystified as to how the ramp falling off lets the horse fall out.

All Sundowners I am familiar with have double swinging doors, latched with the same style latches used on over the road trailers with the ramp outside of the doors, so if the ramp were to fall off, the doors are unaffected.

May be the Sundowner is not the best today, but I certainly have no reason to complain.

CSSJR

Jumpin_Horses

Apr. 9, 2009, 09:47 AM

I just called Sundowner about concerns with my trailer. I spoke with a warranty dude, and he was very helpful. he explained everything, and that my trailer is under structural warranty, and they will "replace" any damage. he even said that they would approve my tractor mechanic to fix my trailer if something is wrong, because there isnt a sundowner dealer near me anymore.

Im going to have my mechanic check out my trailer. if he doesnt see anything, I will just be very diligent about spraying underneath my trailer to keep salts under control.

IMO he was very helpful

just give Sundowner a call if you have any concerns - (800) 438-4294 - Customer Service - click 4 to talk to a warranty dude.

he also said that they started using "under coating" in 2002

you know, just like any vehicle on the road, it is subject to corrosion. unfortunately, UNLIKE most vehicles on the road, one of the MOST important parts of a horse trailer is in the floor/frame.. hence the huge concerns.

Im sorry about all the trouble you all have had with Sundowners. and I took all your stories very seriously because I have a Sundowner, so it hit home.

you know, I had to ride in the back of my trailer one time, with a sick horse, on a 45 minute trip to an emergency hospital, and I gotta tell ya, riding back there was smoother than riding in my truck which was VERY helpful at that moment trying to hang onto IVs and such. I LOVE my Sundowner, so all your stories really upset me.

Just call them and try to work out any of your troubles with them.

Grandma used to say: "you get more flies with honey, than you do with vinegar"...... so, be nice - it will take you far......

RackOn

Apr. 11, 2009, 09:36 AM

So many comments on here about having your mechanic/dealer, etc. look at the frame.

Get a screwdriver and crawl under the trailer and LOOK AT THE FRAME YOURSELF. It isn't rocket science; rust and corrosion are easy to spot. If the coating is peeling or you see potential soft spots, stick the screwdriver into the metal to see how much is corroded. If the coating is cracked, peel it off and look at what is underneath. Pay close attention to the joints.

Alternatively, when your mechanic has it lifted, get under there and look and poke around. Then you can see for yourself.

I bought my used Sundowner from a MAJOR Sundowner dealer which included a "full inspection". I just happen to stumble onto this frame issue on horsetrailerworld.com about a week after I bought it and sure enough the frame had to be repaired. The dealer was useless with the repair.

Having said that, Sundowner paid for the repair which was made by an RV repair shop close to my home. I worked with Sundowner directly and am very happy with the outcome.

It took some effort as I took pictures of the frame, emailed them to Sundowner, found a repair shop, etc. but in the end it was worth it.

I do love my trailer. 2H gooseneck straight load. I would buy another Sundowner.

You can read horror stories about every brand of trailer but in the end you must use your own common sense and take the initiative to ensure your trailer is safe.

And taking the initiative in my case meant NOT relying on information from the dealer.

PS do not neglect to pack your wheel bearings.

spotmenow

Apr. 12, 2009, 08:56 AM

I LOVE my Sundowner, so all your stories really upset me.

Just call them and try to work out any of your troubles with them.

Grandma used to say: "you get more flies with honey, than you do with vinegar"...... so, be nice - it will take you far......

Agreed. I have a 2003 Sunlite Stampede SL. It is all aluminum, including the floor, and has the "Suncoat" on the floor/walls. Never had an issue, but bringing it in to be inspected tomorrow as a result of this thread.

I have to say, I had a problem when I first bought the trailer in 2004 with the dealer (Action Trailer Sales :mad:); they cut the plexi-glass wrong for the sides and then refused to make good on it. Sundowner made good on it instead. That is the ONLY issue I've ever had with it and look forward to years of continued use. However, I will be sure to never miss an annual inspection from now on.

AKB

Apr. 12, 2009, 09:03 AM

I love our Sundowner trailers (2001 and 2003). We had the floors inspected last summer, and there was corrosion. I could feel a soft spot in the back of the floor of the one trailer where the manure lands. Sundowner replaced the floors in both trailers without any questions and without any charges. I called the dealer, they asked for the measurements of the floors and asked who had inspected them. Then, they called back when the new floors were ready to be installed.

spotmenow

Apr. 15, 2009, 03:31 PM

Just got my trailer back from being inspected. The guy said that the undercoating on the bottom is flaking off like nobody's business and that the steel frame underneath is only 1/8" thick; he couldn't believe a company would manufacture a trailer that big (its a 3-horse) with such thin steel. He said that even if I have Sundowner sand blast and re-coat it (under warranty), it can only be done once since its such thin steel. After that-it will be useless.

His advice is to dump it now. And, it has NOTHING to do with maintenance...the actual (aluminum) floor is pristine. Too bad the frame holding it up is a piece of crap. Very disappointed-off to try and trade it in for something else.

AKB

Apr. 15, 2009, 03:33 PM

Spotmenow-I would call your nearest Sundowner dealer and bring it in. My experiences with Sundowner were very positive. I know lots of other people who had their Sundowners fixed for free.

spotmenow

Apr. 15, 2009, 03:49 PM

Problem is, once they fix it, it will happen again over time and the next time it does, there will be no fixing it due to the thinness of the steel. It will be useless.

cssutton

Apr. 15, 2009, 05:17 PM

You are assuming that you know how they are going to fix it.

They might, if you work it right, put a new frame under it with a different steel.

It would be foolish to trade until you know.

CSSJR

If we do not wish to lose our freedom, we must learn to tolerate our
neighbor's right to freedom even though he might express that freedom
in a manner we consider to be eccentric.

spotmenow

Apr. 15, 2009, 05:34 PM

Replacing the frame is akin to rebuilding the trailer...hey, if they're willing to do that, great. However, it would cost them several thousand dollars in materials and labor. Hardly think its going to happen.

Still, I put a call in to the dealer we bought it from and am waiting for a return phone call from the head of the service department there.

promlightshine

Apr. 17, 2009, 12:04 AM

The coating on my floor chipped and now it lifts . I called the company in ok several times with no answers. No one picks up the phone. I didn't ask about the frame just the coating AND if I needed to have my trailer serviced by a dealer to keep the warranty as the company who does my repair no longer sells new sundowners. They of course refurbish and sell the trade-ins for those customers who opted to buy new vs do the floors.

It seems those who did well did well working with a dealer -correct?

spotmenow

Apr. 17, 2009, 06:14 AM

We are not having any luck with our dealer (Action Trailer Sales); they are not returning our calls.

My husband called Sundowner directly yesterday...no answer.

I can tell you this; if they do not honor the warranty, I will be the one to start the lawsuit. We have a lawyer friend who is also a horse owner/lover and he would be more than willing to take the case.

You know, this is the kind of issue that could put a company under, especially in these economic times. All I know is, one of my boarders has a cheap steel trailer that is three years older than mine and it was parked on the grass for years. The frame looks a million times better...this would NOT be a hard case to prove.

promlightshine

Apr. 20, 2009, 11:43 PM

Action may not be returning calls as they are getting overwhelmed with this mess too. I bought my trailer from them at the EA but have always had it serviced at Orchard in Western,ma. Orchard is no longer selling them so you are left with action and Tourbillion in RI.

I think they (action) are afraid. I was told to call the manufacturer directly to start reporting problems and they are not returning my calls.

Next week is a registered letter
The week after that is a complaint to the AG in Ok

If someone on this site has a better idea I'm happy to listen.

Karen

JSwan

Apr. 21, 2009, 09:44 AM

I can tell you this; if they do not honor the warranty, I will be the one to start the lawsuit. .

If they don't honor the warranty - you should. That would send me over the edge.

If Sundowner is giving you guys problems there is no excuse for that and I hope y'all nail 'em. I've never had a problem with Sundowner or the dealer I bought the trailer from.

What I am very happy about is that the guy that services my trailer does a real honest to goodness inspection and points out areas of concern long before it becomes a problem. But for years my trailer was not inspected properly and it really ticked me off. They'd check the lights and that was it. :mad: The guy would not even check the battery or the cable unless I prodded him! In my state they're supposed to conduct a full inspection - including flooring and structure.

But that's not true of all jurisdictions - and in those states it's even more important for the owner to conduct their own periodic inspections. And a good inspection includes lifting mats, scraping, sanding repainting, closely inspecting the frame and supports, checking for frayed wiring or corroded leads, checking welds and U bolts, , bolts and hinges/latches for signs of premature wear, checking the tires for signs of uneven wear, repacking bearings and lubing the chassis, greasing the ball, hinges and latches, (NOT using Pam cooking spray), tightening the hitch, checking the torque on the lugs, etc.

It doesn't take a lot of time - but it will pay off in spades as the trailer ages, especially if there is a warranty claim.

I wonder how financially sound that company is these days....... or any trailer manufacturer....

Dr. Doolittle

Apr. 21, 2009, 09:57 AM

Dr. Doolittle (who posts here) is one who had a ramp fall off ... while she was transporting a horse which fell out the back & was dragged down the road. Others have had the ramp fall off when a horse stepped on it loading or unloading. Sundowner seems to be the one with that problem. (I personally know someone who had a Sundowner ramp fall off.) JSwan pretty regularly jumps into these discussions & lectures all of us about trailer maintenance. I agree with much or most of what JSwan posts but when it comes to her lectures on polishing boots, maintaining equipment, etc., well, she obviously has a whole lot more interest & concern regarding that stuff than I do (I'm trying to be tactful here).

WHAT THE HELL?!?!?!? :confused:

Where on earth did you hear this??

This NEVER happened to me, and I would appreciate it if you would edit your post, IMMEDIATELY!!!!!!

slp2

Apr. 21, 2009, 11:01 PM

Oy! I was about to go look at some Sundowner's this weekend. :eek: Of course--I have always heard that Sundowners were a very high quality trailer. Is that reputation completed unwarranted? The dealer I talked to today said that they are now all aluminum. However, he did mention that he sells another brand (can't remember it) and that company is in a better "financial state" (which I interpreted as him hinting that Sundowner was NOT as stable right now).

Anyway--I have a Merhow now--have had some minor issues over the years but nothing outlandish for the amount of use it has had. Also, a friend of mine has a Hawk--seems to be a nice trailer too. And lastly, I have heard about the 4-star trailers as being very good. OK--so I"m about to buy one of those 4 brands. I already saw that someone said the Hawks seem to be good. What about a new Merhows or 4-Stars? Or should I go with a Hawk?

spotmenow

Apr. 22, 2009, 06:43 AM

Not surprised that Sundowner is having financial issues...they are having to eat the cost of repairing hundreds, maybe thousands of trailers. Ditching mine, I can tell you that.

Out of the four brands you mentioned, 4-Star is the best.

promlightshine

Apr. 28, 2009, 12:25 AM

slp; I love my trailer. Like JSwan I got my sundowner for the quality and it looks pretty sharp. They are not returning my calls. I'm going to take my trailer this fall to the active sundowner dealership and bring along all my paperwork. That will be a 6 month check as my trailer is a 2004. If I had only waited a couple of years I'd have the trailer I wanted without all the worry.

I would choose a sundowner again if I knew they'd stand by their product. So we'll see.

My friends got an all aluminum that can covert to a 2 or 3 horse slant. Has a ramp . It's really neat. They race stbs and this is a "stb " model. When I was foxhunting more regularly I liked having the "real" dressing room. I'd love the flexibility to have three or two horses . Sometimes the extra space comes in handy.

anyway... if you look at new sundowners-get an idea what's up with the company. If you look at used if the floors/frames have been replaced you are good to go for many years to come.

spotmenow

Apr. 28, 2009, 06:51 AM

Well, they don't want to replace our frame, just sand/recoat it. My mechanic told me that since so much of the frame has rusted away, sanding/recoating will only get me a few more years. Just long enough for the warranty to completely run out. :mad:

Spoke to one dealer who told me that he dropped Sundowner right before we bought one because Sundowner was advising dealers to tell customers that their trailers were all aluminum (even though the frame isn't). This particular dealer refused to do so and dropped them.

So, my husband will be contacting Sundowner directly today and telling them that we want a new frame or we will be contacting a lawyer. I would have been better off buying an all-steel trailer for 1/2 the price-would have lasted twice as long. I have nothing good to say about Sundowner.

justathought

May. 22, 2009, 05:13 PM

Ok - so I am about to do the work on the trailer that everyone here has discussed.... except, I am asking fro rumbar instead of simply replacing the aluminum and replacing the frame - which is still adiscussion item with Sundowner.

Does anyone know the suggested placement of the steel support beams (on center) for a rumbar floor? I am also emailed the rumbar company with this question.

grinanride

May. 23, 2009, 07:46 AM

12" OC with a bottom frame deep enough so the Rumber does not stick up over the frame / unless you are adding mats / then the bottom frame should be deep enough for both
Risa
HappyTrailsTrailers

cloudyandcallie

May. 23, 2009, 08:25 AM

If Sundowner does not repair your trailers (if it can be done, sounds like a lot of things would have to be replaced and the trailers taken apart and rebuilt with proper materials) or replace the trailers or give you your money back, you should:

exchange names and phone #s
hire a competent, that's competent law firm that is EXPERIENCED in handling class action lawsuits. This means someone like the firm that sued Ford over the Explorer rollovers, or the tyres, forget the brand that was on the Explorers. Why? because most lawyers cannot handle a class action lawsuit and don't have the resources to do so.
You will have some initial outlay of money with a good class action lawfirm, but the firm will have the resources to carry the lawsuit. Yes the firm will get a lot of money in any settlement, but that will come out of the money won, not out of your pockets, as it would if you hire some local firm which doesn't have the money to help you.
Class action lawsuits are necessary when a company refuses to acknowledge and recall. It's not unjust enrichment of the plaintiffs, it is reimbursing you for being sold a defective product.
Get together and do it now before someone's horses are dragged down a highway because of the defects in these trailers. Don't let people flame you for this, it's like buying a toaster that when you plug in, has a defect that electrocutes you, it's not a "maintenance" issue, it's a dangerous product. (I PMed one OP on one of these threads a while back, telling him/her to get the class action suit going. You need to do so before sundowner moves all its assets somewhere where you cannot reach them.)
Decide now if you are going to file a class action lawsuit, or delay and let someone end up with a tragedy, if it has not already happened to someone not on this board.

The MAG Man

Jun. 2, 2009, 05:00 PM

:mad: I want to add to this thread and bring it back up to the top as this is a big problem for many. Sundowner Trailer owners have much to be concerned about.

I have a 2 horse straight load w/dressing room that was manufactured in 1999 and I bought new in 2000. I am an antique car restorer (hobbyist) and spend a lot of time under antique vehicles and am no stranger to a welder, rust and restoration issues. I offer this to give some credence to my analysis of this Sundowner Trailer frame rust problem.

My original dealer, Orchard Trailers in Hatfield, MA, no longer carry Sundowner trailers. They have "piles" of Sundowner frames behind their shop and are replacing frames on Sundowner trailers every month. The cost ranges from $7-$10,000.00 depending on the size and type of trailer. A basic 2 horse bumper pull with no dressing room is $7k to replace the frame and it goes up from there.

The problem details:

Sundowner makes aluminum skin and floor trailers with steel frames. The steel within the trailer was all powder coated by Sundowner at time of original construction. Powder coating is an excellent coating system (in my view) when it is properly applied. The emphasis here is "properly applied".

My trailer has corrosion of the steel frame, complete failure of the powder coating, and is generally a total disaster on a trailer with less than 7,000 miles on it.

The powder coating failed and as a result, the coating separated from the steel base exposing uncoated steel to the weather. In painting terms, you'd say it looks like was never put in primer, but in powder coating terms I'd say that they had a combination of very low grade steel components, and a very low grade powder coating backed up by lack of preparation. Those to elements combine in an exponentially damaging way to have the failed powder coating now trap water, salt brine (winter driving), and dirt under the powder coating and against the raw steel setting up corrosion and failure of the frame at what I can only describe as monumental levels!

Here's a photo of the 1" steel tube that houses my brake controller wires before I cut out this failed piece and replaced it all: http://www.englishes.com/photos/BrakeWiresConduit1.jpg
Yes the only thing holding it together is force of habit and the wires which control the brakes of my trailer. Lovely - if the wires chaffe through, I lose the brakes in addition to the floor and horse!

That photo tells you a lot and you can see the level of corrosion is extensive. Sundowner of course wants to hear or know nothing of this and while they are trying to offer a "warranty" repair of these failures on any trailers which are within the warranty period, in my opinion the method of repair actually worsens and INCREASES the problem so caveat emptor there.

Sundowner is proposing to take these failed powder coated steel frames and put the trailer up on a lift and wire brush all of the corroded steel areas, then shoot rattle can undercoating goob over the affected area. The problem with this approach is that the powder coating failure is on all sides of the steel frame, however only the bottom portion of the frame rails, cross members, long sills, and conduit are exposed and accessible from the bottom. The top of those rails in contact with the floor and trailer are not reachable and cannot be brushed cleaned and undercoated without removing the trailer body which would be a very extensive repair and costs, so they just are covering up the portion of the problem you can see so as to put off the problem until the trailer is out of warranty. Why do I know this? Because this trailer WAS repaired in exactly this way 5 years ago by Sundowner.

So by covering the affected areas with undercoating from the bottom, they are now trapping water and salt brines which enter by gravity through the failed top of the frame rail. With no way to drain out, that brine sits under the coatings and goes to work overtime to dissolve the steel. The fact is that I have seen substantially less failure of the frame on antique trucks that are 60-80 years old than I see on this Sundowner trailer. Yes, I'm NOT happy about this at all and Sundowner's obstinance about the problem, and lack of professional resolution, lack of backing up their problem as the manufacturer is very disheartening to say the least.

Bottom line, before buying any Sundowner trailer, make sure you get a creeper and look more closely at the frame and chassis than you do anything else.

Here's another undercarriage shot that should be burned into your mind on this topic. This is looking up at the front face of the trailer and this is the frame that is holding up the dressing room floor. Does this look like something you'd be comfortable putting your prized show horses in to ride down the interstate? If it does, then I have a killer dealer on a trailer for you!
http://www.englishes.com/photos/Trailer_1inchSquareTubeFailure.jpg

Remember that this trailer has less than 7,000 miles on it!
:mad:

glaze

Jun. 2, 2009, 05:50 PM

I could not read this whole dang thing...so im not sure if anyone has said what the problem is ...I have heard powder coat was not put on correct...I read where one was going off about it was not a design fault because rust is a maintenance issue..

IMHO this is what I think is happening.....

Anytime you have metal touching alum it can set up electrolysis when this happens the steel will break down at a rapid rate. This is a major design flaw IMO powder coating will wear down. Everyone knows the whole trailer will flex and such thus causing rub marks on the powder coat therefore leaving steel to touch alum...

I would think if you have a trailer they would fix it at a reasonable amount of time. Let one of these 300,000.00 shoe pony fall threw the floor and get the insurance companys involved my guess would be if they proved it was electrolysis the trailer co would loose....anybody got a cap in your mouth bit down on tin foul ..

After going back and reading I see wear sundowner fix most with no cost to the owner im just wondering if any one who got it fixed noticed if they put a bond breaker between the alum and steel ....and for all the ones who let people other than the dealers fix....its out of sundowners hands now ever stop to think why they where so willing to take someones word over the phone and say yea get it fixed...now all they have to say is take it back to who fixed it. It is now your problem from now on..

The MAG Man

Jun. 2, 2009, 07:06 PM

I could not read this whole dang thing...IMHO this is what I think is happening.....After going back and reading I see wear sundowner fix most with no cost to the owner im just wondering if any one who got it fixed noticed if they put a bond breaker between the alum and steel ....and for all the ones who let people other than the dealers fix....its out of sundowners hands now ever stop to think why they where so willing to take someones word over the phone and say yea get it fixed...now all they have to say is take it back to who fixed it. It is now your problem from now on..
It's not electrolytic/galvanic corrosion. It's all explained thoroughly including Sundowner's "fix" of my problem 5 years ago, then the subsequent failure of their "repair-fix", and how the way they went about fixing the problem actually worsened it.

My trailer is 9 years old. In 2003 they offered an 8 year warranty on the frame. They didn't replace any frame and used a $10 rattle can of rubberized undercoating to simply cover and hide the problem from view until the corrosion was so extensive that it caused the undercoating to fall off exposing the paper thin remaining steel.

glaze

Jun. 2, 2009, 07:16 PM

well please explain what the problem is...And why are they using a rubber bond breaker if no electrolysis....you think to hide the problem right..

glaze

Jun. 2, 2009, 07:28 PM

Chemistry 101. Iron is 0.44 volts below hydrogen and aluminum is 1.7 volts under hydrogen, so galvanic dissolution begins in the presence of an electrolyte. .................................................. .................................................. ..............but you seem to have it all figured out..Get a lawyer and let the stupid thread die I am tired of hearing about it...what good do you think it will do...by they way do you wanna guess who sold the most trailers in2003, 2005, 2007, 2008,

spotmenow

Jun. 2, 2009, 08:03 PM

Glaze, no one is making you read this thread.:no:

Okay, Sundowner agreed to let Congelosi replace the frame on our 2003 Sunlite Stampede. Should I be concerned still if the frame is replaced?

glaze

Jun. 2, 2009, 08:31 PM

spot ...yes mam ya should worry if it does not have a bond break between the steel and alum...and just powder coat by its self will not cut the muster....has anyone stopped to think why sundowner is so apt to just replace not much questions let me tell ya it cost big money to replace what they have done but I am incline to believe that the root of the problem from the trailers is deeper than thin steel or bad paint. I would like to see todays design compared to when they where at the height of the problem...and you are correct I don’t have to read this tread but I had seen where no one suggested the problem could be from steel touching alum ...I was just trying to give a heads up I don’t own a Sundowner so it don’t matter to me one way or the other but I hate to see people spend the money that they worked for only to feel duped

contesstant

Jun. 4, 2009, 08:04 AM

My Dad is a Metallurgist, or Material's Engineer in more "modern" terms, and has been since 1962. I sent him an email and the pictures that were posted above. Here is what he said:

Putting steel and aluminum in contact in a moist environment creates galvanic corrosion. With the materials involved in this case the aluminum is more active than the steel and would corrode more rapidly than the steel. The reason for powder coating the steel is to make it more compatible with the aluminum thus preventing galvanic corrosion.

I do agree that the basic cause of the problem is inadequate powder coating. There is no way the steel could corrode to the extent is has if the coating was properly applied.

I don't like the idea of undercoating to correct the problem either. Undercoating is OK if done during the original manufacture but applying it on parts that are already corroded is poor practice.

Keep in mind that this gent lives in MA where the roads may be salted which compounds the problem.

If only he lived closer to me and could inspect my trailer himself. It is a 2005 Sunlight 727.

JSwan

Jun. 4, 2009, 08:38 AM

If only he lived closer to me and could inspect my trailer himself. It is a 2005 Sunlight 727.

If you contact RAyers on this BB he was testing samples of the powder coat. Lots of us sent samples to him. Your trailer is still under warranty so if you do have a problem - there is no reason it should not be repaired.

Since we live in the same state, I'll tell you that this state requires testing of the structure and floor of trailers as part of your annual inspection. However, most inspectors do NOT conduct their inspection properly. Few even bother to test the battery.

You'd be well advised to ensure your inspector is conducting a proper inspection. If you don't know what is required, you can call the local barracks (VA state trooper) and ask to speak with the trooper responsible for overseeing the work of state inspectors.

Many people seem to have the same complaint but I must admit I was shocked at the photos a recent poster provided. My trailer looks NOTHING like that - it never did. The frame doesn't even look similar to mine and we have the same model and year. It leads me to wonder if Sundowner changed materials/supplier at some point? Or changed a design within model years? And my trailer has insulators between the frame, floor and structure in addition to the powder coating (which is long gone - my trailer is old and I scraped sanded and repainted many years ago - leaving just the GN area with the original coating).

Problem with horse trailers is that besides all being death traps, there is little to no regulation about their manufacture except lighting/conspicuity tape.

They're not built to automotive standards which may come as a surprise to some people; but they're not required to be. Manufacturers pretty much use the same stuff they make landscape trailers out of. Just a little heftier and with a horsey motif. Color me jaded and cynical.

Anyway - just know that a very thorough inspection is required in Virginia but few inspectors bother to do a proper job. I don't know who you're taking it to now but if you need a referral, I can give you one. He'll go over your trailer with a fine toothed comb.

ETA - here is a link to the VA state police website - safety section. There is contact information as well as a link to part of the inspection manual (the part which is codified). You can obtain or view the manual by contacting the trooper. http://www.vsp.state.va.us/Safety.shtm#InspectionProgram

contesstant

Jun. 4, 2009, 09:45 AM

JSwan, thank you for the info! My trailer is not reg'd in VA however, because we are a military family. I am not at all surprised that the inspections are not very thorough. They don't exactly do much for the annual auto inspections here.

I'll contact the poster you mentioned about testing my powder coating. I do have the trailer being serviced right now by a private individual who I understand has also contacted Sundowner and am not sure of the result yet. I'll see him this weekend and ask. We are aware that my trailer is still under the 8-year warranty, and luckily it is not used to haul any horses at this time, but that will change next winter when we make our next military move, so I'm hoping to get it fixed or make sure it is NOT going to have issues, now.

JSwan

Jun. 4, 2009, 10:26 AM

glaze

Jun. 4, 2009, 11:13 AM

JSwan
My trailer looks NOTHING like that - it never did. The frame doesn't even look similar to mine and we have the same model and year. It leads me to wonder if Sundowner changed materials/supplier at some point? Or changed a design within model years? And my trailer has insulators between the frame, floor and structure in addition to the powder coating (which is long gone - my trailer is old and I scraped sanded and repainted many years ago - leaving just the GN area with the original coating).

jswan thanks for clearing that up................................................ .......

From what I have seen in the pics ...it’s the best example of electrolysis I have seen in a while. If the people will notice how the steel is layered in that it appears to look like thin sheets of paper. When normal or salt corrosion takes place it has the appearance of pits and they usually start in corners or ends and any place that ties back. Electrolysis appears to look like layers. Im not just making a blind guess I had to spend about two years one time studying the cause and effects of that type of corrosion. On mid to high rise building they use aluminum window wall that is supported by steel for wind load and dead loads. We have always known steel and aluminum must be isolated from each other but over the two years we had a better understanding of just how important and necessary this was to the cause and effects of this aspect. As the young lady mentioned that her dad was metallurgist and felt it was a powder coat problem...well he is just plan wrong the bottom line is if the trailer had isolators between the to metals the powder coat would not break down as it did. As soon as someone tries to lay blame on the company that produced the powder coat they will find that company has extreme programs to insure a bad product does not make it out the door. If Sundowner can convince people it’s a bad application of powder coat then all they have to do if re shoot the frame. On the other hand if they have to isolate the two metals then the whole trailer must come apart. The cost to pull apart a trailer is much greater than just add some paint. All Sundowner is trying to do is make the consumer happy until the warranty runs out. As we all know when a trailer is purchased we like the 8 years warranty but do expect the product to last much longer and I feel that it should. As it stands now your trailers that is having this issue will not make it very long....

Case in point as referenced above the young lady JSWAN thats not having any problems with her Sundowner has one key factor that you guys don’t as she stated her trailer has isolators between the two metals.

contesstant

Jun. 4, 2009, 01:22 PM

You'll need to check inspection requirements with your state of residency, since you are active duty military. Each state addresses what active duty personnel must do to comply with inspection requirements when they are stationed outside the registering state. And those requirements don't conflict with the Soldiers and Sailors Civil Relief Act.

Glad you have a good person working on your trailer. I swear some of the rigs I see I wouldn't load firewood in. Spongy floors, bald tires, improperly loaded and hitched, absolutely NO maintenance done - just plain scary!

No worries, we are on top of all inspections for our vehicles. Got some more good advice from my Dad today. Since glaze wants to discredit what he is saying, anyone interested can PM me on an easy test to determine if the powder coating has been applied or processed incorrectly. It's simple, dirt cheap, and used to determine some powder coating issues on bombs. Yes, he's an expert and knows what the hell he is talking about. He's 67 years old.

The powder coating issue IS a problem if it is done incorrectly, as is the lack of a barrier between the aluminum and steel.

Is anyone aware of any class-action lawsuits regarding this?

JSwan

Jun. 4, 2009, 01:53 PM

Case in point as referenced above the young lady JSWAN thats not having any problems with her Sundowner has one key factor that you guys don’t as she stated her trailer has isolators between the two metals. [/SIZE]

Holy Moly I'm saving this post for posterity. It's been a long time since anyone called me a young lady.

I wouldn't say I have not had problems with my Sundowner. I HATE all horse trailers and think they are all death traps. I just think my trailer is a piece of equipment and I maintain it and that's that. I maintain my farm implements too - because I don't want the bush hog to fail and cut someone's head off.

My complaint is that people don't seem to be maintaining their trailers. Just the other day someone posted that they check their tire pressure once a YEAR. Before that someone said they lubricated the hitch with PAM cooking spray. Another boasted that they never clean out their trailer and then they act all surprised when the floor rots.

Look folks, these things are not made to automotive standards. There is little to no accident reporting - because reporting requirements are triggering by the GVWR and/or type of license of the driver or dollar amount of damage.

People who do have problems do not file complaints with the appropriate federal agency so that there is a record of failures/problems. So any manufacturer can point to the absence of data to "prove" their product is superior. That may or may not be true - the consumer has no way of knowing.

My beef with Sundowner is that if they had any doubt, ten years ago, that their powder coating was misapplied, the company can no longer claim ignorance. They should stand behind their warranty. Trailers beyond the warranty period - well - that's when you need some proof (which people have obtained thanks to RAyers)

My beef with horse owners is that there is no excuse for any of our trailers to look like that recent photo. While a coating may have been misapplied - letting many years go by without maintaining the trailer is not the manufacturers fault. It's the horse owners.

So yes, I do think the owner has some responsibility to inspect and maintain their equipment. Contrary to popular belief, letting a trailer sit unused does not necessarily extend its useful life. Even a properly applied powder coating will not last forever. Tires dry rot. Wiring is chewed through. Corrosion or rust happens. Eventually it will to ALL trailers. It's still incumbent upon the owner to maintain the trailer.

Tthere is little to no regulation or oversight as to how these things are constructed. They just have to meet federal standards for use on highways. Doesn't mean they're well constructed. None of them.

But it would not be true to say I've not had "problems" with my trailer. It's ten years old and has been very heavily used. It shows. But it does have insulators all over it - though other people insist theirs does not.

It is true that the frame does not in any way resemble the recent photos displayed - doesn't even look like similar materials were used.

And I find that very curious. Makes me wonder how many of these trailers are really the same model underneath the pretty exterior. That may explain such wildly different experiences......

contesstant

Jun. 4, 2009, 02:35 PM

I am pretty anal about keeping up on maintenance. Just haven't used my trailer since 2006 when I took my horse to a trainer. So, getting it all checked out now in anticipation of using it again. I went over it last summer pretty well and gave it a good cleaning, have kept the tires inflated, etc. But haven't had the underside checked at all. I will let you all know what is found by the shop. They do the servicing as a side business so it might be awhile.

I 100% agree that it is ultimately the owner's responsibility to at least be on the lookout for issues. I am grateful to have found this thread as I would never have thought to crawl under it and go over the frame with a magnifying glass. Here's hoping my trailer is in good shape. I paid cash for it brand new and really am in no mood to sink a ton of money into it or another one.

glaze

Jun. 4, 2009, 04:27 PM

contesstant
Did not mean do discredit your dad im sure he is a fine man. Everyone has chose their own path. The path you have chosen is to just repaint the frame and it sounds like a good plan to me I hope it works for ya.......

For any others that are having the problem I would really encourage you to isolate the steel frame from the aluminum. This should not be that hard for any well ran shop....but here is what makes me think that other options should be explored.
A. For every single trailer to get a bad powder coat just seems kinda odd
B. If the application is wrong its gonna be human error and I find it odd that one person painted all those trailers.
C. I don’t think a powder coating booth would be set up incorrect in that kind of facility and take notice of the other items on the trailer that are powder coated the frame is not the only thing. Why aren’t those things rusting away at a rapid rate.
D. Really explore what powder coating is and how its applied. I think some may have a misconception that its like paint.
E. There are some fine trailers of this type if you know someone who has one and its not having a problem I encourage you to see what is different in the two. It don’t matter if its longer, shorter, or otherwise... they should all be basic in design.
F. If you should take the precautions for this theory what could it hurt. If it was me I would do both powder coat and isolators.
G. I have looked into this issue and I have my theory and that is just what it is...theory or a hypothesis....but hey what do I know...sorry if you felt I was discrediting your dad...... :rolleyes:

contesstant

Jun. 5, 2009, 07:15 AM

Glaze, where did you get the impression I was repainting the frame? I haven't even determined whether mine has any damage yet. It's in the shop right now being serviced and they are going to inspect the frame and test the powder coating. I am very hopeful that mine is one of those that is NOT at all affected.

Pippigirl

Jun. 5, 2009, 07:07 PM

contesstant

Jun. 7, 2009, 07:23 PM

Pippi, I had that same initial reaction myself.

The good news is that it appears that my trailer is in fantastic condition, inside and out. :winkgrin:

Pippigirl

Jun. 14, 2009, 11:21 PM

Pippi, I had that same initial reaction myself.

The good news is that it appears that my trailer is in fantastic condition, inside and out. :winkgrin:

That's a relief! My b/o has a 2007 Sunlite 737 goose neck slant load. I'm not sure if the weld spots are a problem...but the underneath is all rusty. This trailer does not leave the property in the winter or early spring so it hasn't been on salted roads... Should it be rusty already???

nowoncourse

Jan. 26, 2010, 09:36 AM

Rockfish

Jan. 26, 2010, 09:45 AM

I've never liked Sundowners, just something about them was off-putting.I've had a few friends who bought them, and they thought they were just average, not the best trailer they could have gotten for their money.

However, I've had good experiences hauling my friends' Jamcos.....and I've called up the HQ in Ontario a few times, and they've been extremely helpful with any questions I had.

Guilherme

Jan. 26, 2010, 10:45 AM

I work for an equestrian magazine and one of our readers just brought this issue with Sundowner to our attention. The more I research, the more I find out that this has been a problem for a very long time.

If any of you on this post would like to formally speak out, or even anonymously share your stories, please private message me and we can set up an interview time.

Thanks in advanced!

If you do an archive search I think you'll find multiple threads on this issue. A couple of the posters in those threads have significant engineering/scientific backgrounds and have made very relevant comments.

Personally, I wrote off Sundowner as a brand in 2002. I was looking for a new trailer and was shopping with a flaslight. It was very useful in looking in places "where the Sun doesn't shine." ;) I found quality in the dark places to be very poor (especially the welding; it looked like it was done by first termers from the local community college without much supervision). I don't know if quality has improved or not. They spend an awful lot on paid endorsements so how much can be left for manufacturing improvements??? :(

Again, check the archive here and spend some time with Google and you'll find some relevant information. Of course what happens to it if your magazine gets bid ad dollars from Sundowner? :eek:

G.