Teaching a young horse to move forward

[Quiet Riot]

I have a 4 yr old who is very green. I'm having trouble teaching this guy to move forward from my leg, especially at the trot. He will trot, but it's slow with no energy. I feel like I'm carrying him around the ring, any suggestions??

[FlashGordon]

I'm an H/Jer and so this might not be wholly in tune w/ Dressage principles but I think its a basic lesson that all horses should learn.

Forward is so important and if they are truly forward and in front of your leg they cannot buck/rear/spook/get silly.

You need to sensitize him to your leg and he needs to learn that Go Means Go. Start on the ground with a dressage whip. Flick it where you'd typically use it behind your leg and give a big "Good Boy!" when he goes forward. Rinse and repeat.

When you hop on, do the same thing. Stay off his mouth and praise no matter HOW he goes forward.... even if he jumps, speeds up, changes gait, whatever. Add leg with the whip and eventually he will become very responsive to the lightest touch.

The important thing to remember is that forward does not mean fast. I used a lot of transitions between and within gaits, as well as figures, to keep my gelding's hind end active as he began to understand the "go" cue.

This all may seem kind of rudimentary and as if it won't translate into "energy" per say but it sounds to me like your guy is a green horse that doesn't truly understand the leg aid. It is a process, but it does work, as I've used it time and time again on sticky horses.

[Equibrit]

Trail/cross country/hunting/endurance riding. OUTSIDE the ring! Take him out with an older steady trustworthy horse.

[Forte]

Give him a light squeeze with the inside of your calves. If he does not move forward right away, tap him sharply behind your leg with the whip. If he still does not go, smack him hard with the whip. Be prepared that when you tap him, he may jump forward, so make sure you don't accidentally catch him in the mouth and punish him. When he does go forward, praise him. It's really that simple. Squeeze, tap, smack. Repeat. Don't kiss, cluck, nag, poke or plead. Just squeeze, then go to the whip if he doesn't listen. I would not go on the trails with a horse that does not have forward established. What happens when you reach a scary object or he doesn't feel like going anymore? He needs to know that leg means go. It's something that all horses should learn in the first few rides.

[Sabine]

It's really hard to know how much you know as a rider and horseman. With young horses- you'd want to start with a good healthy horse. Get a vet to check him and see if his blood count and overall health is good. Once you know there's nothing wrong- try and get to know the horse. Try and find out his personality- see what makes him tick. This requires experience for sure - but I can't explain in detail all the little markers I follow to know how to assess a horse. I just know after a while of handling and lunging and working him from the ground - what makes him tick.
Next when you ride a young horse- consider it to be like talking to a toddler. You don't talk in full sentences- you talk in words- in baby talk- same with the horse. You make yourself understood on those items that matter- very clearly - black and white- no dragging or negotiating the issue...go the wall - be fearless and move on. It has to be hot and cold in a second- no grudges held- just act and be done.

Going forward is your number one job to get across to the riding horse....I guess that tells you right there....good luck and ask more specific Qs....if you need.

[Quiet Riot]

It's really hard to know how much you know as a rider and horseman. With young horses- you'd want to start with a good healthy horse. Get a vet to check him and see if his blood count and overall health is good. Once you know there's nothing wrong- try and get to know the horse. Try and find out his personality- see what makes him tick. This requires experience for sure - but I can't explain in detail all the little markers I follow to know how to assess a horse. I just know after a while of handling and lunging and working him from the ground - what makes him tick.
Next when you ride a young horse- consider it to be like talking to a toddler. You don't talk in full sentences- you talk in words- in baby talk- same with the horse. You make yourself understood on those items that matter- very clearly - black and white- no dragging or negotiating the issue...go the wall - be fearless and move on. It has to be hot and cold in a second- no grudges held- just act and be done.

Going forward is your number one job to get across to the riding horse....I guess that tells you right there....good luck and ask more specific Qs....if you need.

Thank you Sabine, I'm an accomplished rider and have trained many a green bean. The horse has been turned inside out by a vet (recent PPE) and is sound. Mentally, he's very immature and his attention span is short.
He's very willing, once he understands what I'm asking him to do.
I have been reinforcing my leg with a tap from the whip and he will move forward, for about 3 strides. I just feel that I'm using the whip too often and I'm not being effective in teaching him to move forward.
The canter is less of a problem, I can sit deeper and move him forward using my seat and legs.
I'm thinking, I need to make more of an "impression' when I reinforce my leg with the whip. But since he's a baby, I'm afraid of coming down too hard on him.:)

[pintopiaffe]

How fit is he?

And has forward been established on the lunge?

I had one horse that I 'skipped' the lungeing part with because of the way I backed him... he had done roundpen/despooking work before I got him.

But never properly lunged.

Much to my chagrin, I had to go back and really establish forward and reaching for the bit on the lunge first. Insisting on reaching with the back end, not speed. Adding the rider back was easy. He was already going in the correct manner then, and was stronger, fitter, and more confident.

Not saying you can't ride *as well.* But since this lesson, I really believe that getting it right on the lunge is an essential part of the process, even if the horse is already backed. I will go 'back' to the lunge until we get forward right and consistently.

[Foxhound]

I agree with what Pintopiaffe says. You need to teach him what forward means from the ground before he can be forward under saddle. If you have an indoor or a large round pen, first free lunging him without tack in the indoor, teaching him to GO on his own. After that, put on tack (a saddle or surcingle, with side reins to the bit) and repeat the process. If you are using an indoor, which I recommend over a round pen, you will probably need another person to help you keep him going, so you don't have to run from one end to another.

[Quiet Riot]

How fit is he?

And has forward been established on the lunge?

I had one horse that I 'skipped' the lungeing part with because of the way I backed him... he had done roundpen/despooking work before I got him.

But never properly lunged.

Much to my chagrin, I had to go back and really establish forward and reaching for the bit on the lunge first. Insisting on reaching with the back end, not speed. Adding the rider back was easy. He was already going in the correct manner then, and was stronger, fitter, and more confident.

Not saying you can't ride *as well.* But since this lesson, I really believe that getting it right on the lunge is an essential part of the process, even if the horse is already backed. I will go 'back' to the lunge until we get forward right and consistently.


He's somewhat fit, but still has a way to go.
I began working him on the lunge and he has the same problem, if I'm not constantly on him, he'll stop and walk. The only time he'll move forward, is when he's full of energy and after 10 minutes on the lunge he's back to being lazy.
This is a new issue for me, he's a WB and I'm use to training OTTBs. I know eventually I will figure this out, but in the meantime I'm a bit frustrated. :cool:

[slc2]

It takes a whip and a sense of humor...

I don't feel trail riding or following another horse is a solution. It may help to show the rider it's possible...but obedience has to be established in the ring. The horse has to learn to go from the leg, or nothing else is possible, and that will be the problem you will be dealing with for the rest of the horse's life. It will be the underlying issue in every training problem from now til he stops wearing a saddle.

[Tnevent]

I had this problem with a non race trained TB. I took him out to a big field. Anytime he didn't want to go forward I'd smack him with a crop and gallop for a little ways. He got the idea. I stayed in the field for a few months to make sure it was ingrained. Also lots of hacking. I do the same with the babies I break (well not the galloping off parts!). As soon as they stop and steer I only hack them out. Best way to get them forward thinking is to get out of the ring! I wouldn't be in a rush to go around the same area over and over either!

[lddowler]

If the canter is forward and the trot is slow, it could simply be that he is unbalanced. Is he bum high? Did he just have a growth spurt? He might not be used to his "new" shape yet. An unbalanced canter is easy to maintain, an unbalanced trot is not. If he's not going forward on the lunge, I would NOT put sidereins on him. What I would be tempted to do is pony him off of a very calm and responsive horse. Go out on the trails and just trot. He's probably going to be keen to keep up with the other horse and you'll be in a pretty safe spot. Its a good way to get him moving and fit.

The round pen is also a good place to establish "go". My mare took some time to understand "go"- it took lots of praise and some treats too. She would run like stink then suddenly stop and submit. She was very stressed by the whole ordeal until she understood that I was asking her to move forward and not punishing her. Now that I've added side reins, she's back to the same reaction- she's just unsure. I repeat my command, enforce with a flick of the whip, and praise heavily.

Also, have his feet checked. Make sure his toes aren't too long- its hard to use a hind leg correctly with long toes! Horses with short toes and high heels also move short behind- be sure those feet are balanced.

[Leena]

How big he is and how the saddle fit ? This is an aspect very important in a greenie life.

If he is immature, he might just need to be re inforce in every stride. Some are slow in the ding ding !

My big young took a long time (3 months) to really move forward and I went inches by inches...Always a bit more and now he feels so confident !

[kip]

I third what pintopiaffe wrote. Teach them to be foward and over their back on the lunge first. Prior to riding my youngsters spend a few weeks on the lunge learning how to use themselves properly while keeping a good rhythm, listen to voice commands, and move foward when asked in all three gaits. I find that if these principles are all established on the lunge then they are typically all there even as early as the first ride.

[arbeegirl]

Get out of the ring!!! When my guy (also my 1st warmblood after years of riding TB's) was 4, he was the same way. I could kick and smack every step but still didn't help. Once I took him out in the open with nothing to stop him, he became more forward. He was a big unbalance guy and staying in the ring was too hard for him. He would get going down the long side then had to figure out how to maintain the gait through the short side of the ring. He was lazy at first out in the fields too. But after he learn he could just go straight and not have to turn, he moved more and more forward. Now I just have to give a little squeeze if we need more. I still continue riding out of the ring as much as the weather allows.

Make sure when he gets to forward you praise him...that helps too:)

[Quiet Riot]

If the canter is forward and the trot is slow, it could simply be that he is unbalanced. Is he bum high? Did he just have a growth spurt? He might not be used to his "new" shape yet. An unbalanced canter is easy to maintain, an unbalanced trot is not. If he's not going forward on the lunge, I would NOT put sidereins on him. What I would be tempted to do is pony him off of a very calm and responsive horse. Go out on the trails and just trot. He's probably going to be keen to keep up with the other horse and you'll be in a pretty safe spot. Its a good way to get him moving and fit.

The round pen is also a good place to establish "go". My mare took some time to understand "go"- it took lots of praise and some treats too. She would run like stink then suddenly stop and submit. She was very stressed by the whole ordeal until she understood that I was asking her to move forward and not punishing her. Now that I've added side reins, she's back to the same reaction- she's just unsure. I repeat my command, enforce with a flick of the whip, and praise heavily.

Also, have his feet checked. Make sure his toes aren't too long- its hard to use a hind leg correctly with long toes! Horses with short toes and high heels also move short behind- be sure those feet are balanced.

Yes, he's going through a growth spurt and his butt is high. Feet are fine, just had the farrier give him a trim.:D

[Quiet Riot]

How big he is and how the saddle fit ? This is an aspect very important in a greenie life.

If he is immature, he might just need to be re inforce in every stride. Some are slow in the ding ding !

My big young took a long time (3 months) to really move forward and I went inches by inches...Always a bit more and now he feels so confident !


He's 17h and the saddle has been checked.

I'm thankful for all the advice I've received!!!
I'm going to work more on the lunge and reinforcing my leg while riding.
I think I haven't been consistent/strong enough with this boy, he's a baby and I think I've been coddling him too much.:)

[horsechick]

Do you have another horse you can follow? Warmbloods tend to lack "motivation" and sometimes they can learn how to carry themselves better if they have a friend to encourage them to Move It! I second the getting outside advice as well...

[ThatIrishTemper]

Whenever I break a baby, I carry a crop (not a dressage whip, yet) by rule. I ask, if they don't immediately respond I ask again reinforced by crop behind my leg (and not a love tap, but not a "crack" either, a firm "GO NOW"). Crop not on the butt, on the barrel, directly behind my leg. If they throw a temper tantrum about, send them forward and straight, don't punish them for it. You're looking for a reaction, any reaction, just ride foward through it. Once they quiet down and are moving forward at a pace you like, praise them.

It works every time, and all my horses move forward nicely after the first couple rides. They "get it" very quickly that momma don't mess around. ;)

[Sabine]

He's 17h and the saddle has been checked.

I'm thankful for all the advice I've received!!!
I'm going to work more on the lunge and reinforcing my leg while riding.
I think I haven't been consistent/strong enough with this boy, he's a baby and I think I've been coddling him too much.:)

I have done the same with my baby- and I have quietly adjusted what I perceived to be lack luster and for about 2 weeks now- he has clicked...we went thru a horrible time of too fast- running- yet not listening to the leg. I have a lady that helps me once a week- and all she said is consistent patience..and she was right- he's come around and right now...(3 1/2) he is a total pleasure- but I don't believe it will last- that's the joy of a baby- nothing stays the same...:)!

[Leena]

Consistent is enough...We have to stay strong in our mind only !

Good luck !

[jej]

Rider discipline is key to training horses to go forward. Every time you close your leg and the horse doesn't go forward, you must reinforce the aid with a tap of the whip. Every time, without getting impatient or angry. Some young horses take a while to pick this up, but obedience to the leg is critical.

Don't overthink it at first. If the horse takes a few canter steps, fine - praise him. If he shoots forward with his head up in the air, fine. Don't get frustrated. Sometimes students say, "he should know this by now". Forget this thinking - you reinforce with the whip until he goes forward off the leg, even if it takes 1,000 corrections.

I think as riders, it is very easy to get into the mindset that closing the leg means "go forward" SOMETIMES. Even when the horse is having a walk break, closing the leg means go forward. Be careful the horse does not train YOU to give the aid multiple times before you tap with the whip. Hmm, horsie says, I don't have to respond to her aid because she will ask me again... and maybe again. This is where you have to be very disciplined with your aids, so the horse knows that forward means forward, every time.

[Valentina_32926]

Whip
Trail riding
Caveletti's - if he doesn't use his butt he'll fall on his face

Don't forget - "nagging" with whip and/or spurs can dull the horse to the aides :no: - so ask once (nicely) then give a good whack (and don't hold no matter if he gallops off - followed by good boy/girl.)

Then return to ask first nicely (LIGHTLY) - always. :winkgrin:

[BaroquePony]

Some lines of warmbloods can be very slow to develop, like age 6 for what would be more normal at age 4 for others... joints may not be fully developed. Know of some poeple who said they found this information out to late for their warmblood as they had already pushed too hard too young and created irrepairable damage to the joints which did not show up until later.

Tough call. Could just be lazy and ok, but big and unbalanced.