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View Full Version : Spinoff: Olympics, Canada, and cost of qualifying



Dorienna
Jan. 10, 2008, 03:31 PM
Ok, so I read the Globe and Mail article in which Cindy Ishoy states she will not be trying to qualify for Beijing, namely because of the outrageously high costs and the conditions in Hong Kong. Here`s the link:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/freeheadlines/LAC/20080110/OLYDRESSAGE10/sports/Sports

SO! What do you guys think? Any comments on Canada`s Olympic selection process, vs the US, any truth to this article, or better ways to choose a team? Does this come back to the country`s geography, our lack of CDI`s, the lack of funding for athletes, or something else?

mxkextended
Jan. 10, 2008, 04:12 PM
I think the reservations about Hong Kong could be justified, but Ashley competes in Florida in the winter, doesn't she?

Cindy is just a short distance from Chicago, I believe.

Foxtrot's
Jan. 10, 2008, 06:04 PM
So, with some, and perhaps more to come, dropouts, that does not make a Gold medal so special when the competition is diluted.
To declare the qualifying standards so late is unfair to all and shows
disarray in the organizers.

snoopy
Jan. 10, 2008, 09:59 PM
Ok, so I read the Globe and Mail article in which Cindy Ishoy states she will not be trying to qualify for Beijing, namely because of the outrageously high costs and the conditions in Hong Kong. Here`s the link:
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servlet/ArticleNews/freeheadlines/LAC/20080110/OLYDRESSAGE10/sports/Sports

SO! What do you guys think? Any comments on Canada`s Olympic selection process, vs the US, any truth to this article, or better ways to choose a team? Does this come back to the country`s geography, our lack of CDI`s, the lack of funding for athletes, or something else?



There IS "truth" to this article....I will let someone else (hopefully a canadian)open this can of worms before I open my mouth with a little more "detail";)

Mozart
Jan. 11, 2008, 05:41 PM
There IS "truth" to this article....I will let someone else (hopefully a canadian)open this can of worms before I open my mouth with a little more "detail";)

I am Canadian. Consider this your can opener. Spill snoopman. :cool:

dressagejunky
Jan. 11, 2008, 05:49 PM
It is clear from the article that the riders are concerned about the conditions and stress on their horses in Hong Kong.

But I think what they are also saying is that they are also concerned about the stress that the Canadian criteria will put on their horses by requiring them to spend two months in Europe competing there just before the Olympic Games.

Besides the stress on the horses, Cindy says that she cannot afford to spend that amount of time away from her family and business. She also seems to be saying that the riders must pay for all of this themselves, including the return of the horses from Europe to Canada after the games. I understand that horses are returned to their point-of-origin, and the Canadian criteria require the horses to be in and leave from Europe.

If Dressage Canada is going to require them to spend so much time in Europe as part of the qualification criteria, should Dressage Canada fund the cost?

Also, shouldn’t Dressage Canada set criteria that ensure the selection of the most qualified team by making it easy for the best riders to compete? It sounds like they have done the opposite. Strange.

Fixerupper
Jan. 11, 2008, 08:03 PM
BachmanTurner Overdrive..Gimme Your Money Please lyrics:

And he said, Boy, you'd better move real slow
And gimme your money please.
He said, Gimme your money please.
Wasn't that strange
Wasn't that strange indeed.

;)

Dutch
Jan. 11, 2008, 11:24 PM
It is really unbelievably late Dressage Canada posted the qualifying criteria for the 2008 Olympics - November, 2007!

The real cruncher is, that even if the rider competes at the required number of CDI's and achieves the scores as set out by Dressage Canada, Dressage Canada has the option whether to send the riders or not at the "last minute".

"In addition, all Combinations will be evaluated on their performance at the major International events in Europe to reconfirm that each Combination demonstrates a sufficiently high standard of performance at an elite level of competition to be reasonably competitive at the 2008 OG (see section 2.1
d.).Any Combination(s) may be withdrawn from entry at the 2008 OG if the DSC is not
satisfied, in the exercise of their discretion, that the Combination(s) will be reasonably
competitive at the 2008 OG. In exercising this discretion the DSC will only consider
performance and results at the one or two major International events in Europe all
Combinations must participate in . . . The three (3) rider/horse Combinations participating in the 2008 OG will be confirmed no later than 10 days before definite entries, and/or, 10 days before final quarantine, whichever comes first."

Foxtrot's
Jan. 13, 2008, 02:30 PM
In other sports the COC will be announcing the athletes qualified to go and selected to go by end of May 2008.

Foxtrot's
Jan. 13, 2008, 02:31 PM
In other sports the COC will be announcing the athletes qualified to go and selected to go by end of May 2008. EC - I don't know.

Donella
Jan. 13, 2008, 07:20 PM
I don't understand the whole having to qualify in europe to make the team. This is outrageous. Canada won't have a team if that is the case..how many are actually going to be able to leave their buisness's/commitments and foot the bill to go to europe for a good number of months before hand?

Dutch
Jan. 13, 2008, 07:26 PM
I don't understand the whole having to qualify in europe to make the team. This is outrageous. Canada won't have a team if that is the case..how many are actually going to be able to leave their buisness's/commitments and foot the bill to go to europe for a good number of months before hand?

Exactly!!

snoopy
Jan. 13, 2008, 09:02 PM
I don't understand the whole having to qualify in europe to make the team. This is outrageous. Canada won't have a team if that is the case..how many are actually going to be able to leave their buisness's/commitments and foot the bill to go to europe for a good number of months before hand?


Yes and imagine if these two riders were STILL very determined to go but where making a stand by withdrawing there intent in order get the selection criteria changed. And imagine that these two riders or a least one of them was basically a shoe in for selection because of her outstanding results. Imagine fielding a team without one of these riders. Canada has two horse/rider combinations performing some very credible work...one is in europe, one is not. Cindy's horse is a solid team horse and an asset to the team. I cannot see a team without Ashley. That leaves Evi. JB's horse is not performing to standard. So if I were to hazzard a guess the team would be:

Ashley
Cindy
Evi

...and two of them have "withdrawn" from selection.
There could be others to make up a team...but it would not be a competitive team at GP level.

Elatu
Jan. 13, 2008, 11:00 PM
I see the "agenda" on this one. There are already 3 horses/riders in Europe. My guess:
Christy Boylen
Cheryl Meisener
Evi Strasser

Mozart
Jan. 14, 2008, 11:06 AM
I gather the rationale for qualifying in Europe is that competing in those venues more closely resembles competing in the Olympic venue? Still seems rather onerous and unrealistic given that riders do not simply ride their horse for a living. Two of the three that Elatu mentions now reside in Europe. How is Evi able to make this work? She has a Canadian based business, does she not?

Elatu
Jan. 14, 2008, 12:24 PM
But Evi has been competing in Europe this winter season, has she not?
I'm not trying to read into this selection process, but from the screws that the powers that be have put to the North American contenders, I don't see any other team member option available.

ringdancer
Jan. 14, 2008, 01:44 PM
I found the list of the Dressage Canada 2007 Board of Directors. Apparently they would be the ones who were responsible for setting the criteria.

Lisa Kostandoff
Judith Pineault
Elizabeth McMullen
Cara Whitham
Evi Strasser

hsheffield
Jan. 14, 2008, 02:38 PM
would appreciate it if someone would verify what I think is the US plan (which sounds similar to the Canadian one to me....)

1. if you qualify for the trials, your horse goes to southern California. (quite a distance for any Florida horses!)

2. if you win, you go to Europe for an extended period to compete

3. quarantine in Aachen

4. off to China (for 30 days ?? )

5. back to Aachen

6. back to the USA

btw....anyone know who pays for your horse to compete in Europe? I'm hoping it's our NF, but don't know for sure.

thanks.

Elatu
Jan. 14, 2008, 03:06 PM
It would have made a lot more sense to hire judges, and have the team trials in Canada; even go to the point of having the same judges in a venue in Germany to appease the Euro-Canadian contingent. Then the highest 3 scores determining the team.
A heck of a lot more feasible than expecting to show all over hells' half acre!.

snoopy
Jan. 14, 2008, 03:12 PM
It would have made a lot more sense to hire judges, and have the team trials in Canada; even go to the point of having the same judges in a venue in Germany to appease the Euro-Canadian contingent. Then the highest 3 scores determining the team.
A heck of a lot more feasible than expecting to show all over hells' half acre!.


You would think something on these lines would make more sense....but the CEF has made some rather odd choices from the get go.

I personally think it really boils down to money. The CEF does not have the money to send a team half way round the world only to receive a poor result. I know there is no medal chances but what they are doing now with this criteria is to make it impossible to even improve on their team rankings with horses that could have helped further the effort. What they will be left with are horses in europe who may scrape through the qualifications, go to HK and end up very close to the bottom of the heap....which in turn does nothing to increase funding from the COC.

Elatu
Jan. 14, 2008, 03:34 PM
And to prove my point about the agenda; here is the link:
http://www.eurodressage.com/reports/shows/2004/04og/06-21-boylen.html
So the whole "who-ever is in Europe gets on the team theory" fits.
I still think it stinks.

Foxtrot's
Jan. 14, 2008, 05:22 PM
So why go to the Olympics if you are going to end up at the bottom of the heap??? Because not everyone can win. That's a cry from the Olympic ideals. Canada would be shamed with an Eddie the Eagle, or a Jamaican bobsled team? With all the money being directed to being the top medal contender at the 2010 Olympics, other sports are missing out on funding. With funding not adequate to meet the needs of an expensive sport like Equestrian, then the travelling judges is a good idea - it has been done before. It is crazyness.

snoopy
Jan. 14, 2008, 05:22 PM
How is Evi able to make this work? She has a Canadian based business, does she not?


She brought a couple of horses with her to europe besides her GP horse. She sold one....and I am sure it was for quite a bit of money, so I am sure that this has helped in funding her stay. She realizes that she has to make these trips in order to compete against the best in europe and to get international judges familiar with her horses. As she still holds a german passport, she is allowed to live over there without restriction.

snoopy
Jan. 14, 2008, 05:30 PM
So why go to the Olympics if you are going to end up at the bottom of the heap??? Because not everyone can win. That's a cry from the Olympic ideals. Canada would be shamed with an Eddie the Eagle, or a Jamaican bobsled team? With all the money being directed to being the top medal contender at the 2010 Olympics, other sports are missing out on funding. With funding not adequate to meet the needs of an expensive sport like Equestrian, then the travelling judges is a good idea - it has been done before. It is crazyness.


I am not sure of the tone of your post. I do not think that the COC or CEF expects a medal but then again it would be foolish to send a team that was not going to be competitve....by which I mean solid scores of 68+. I should think that that money would be better spent by way of grants to send riders over to europe to compete/train on a regular basis. At the moment, and to my knowledge, if a rider wants to go to europe then it is funded by themselves.

dressagejunky
Jan. 14, 2008, 07:12 PM
Well said Elatu!

Here are the top seven Canadian riders according to the current FEI world rankings.

Rank Rider
25 Ashley Holzer
72 Christy Boylen
76 Jacqueline Brooks
94 Evi Strasser
122 Cindy Ishoy
164 Leonie Bramall
172 Cheryl Meisner

If the "spend two months in Europe at your own expense" criteria discourages those not already in Europe from contending, this would eliminate Canada's current #1, #3, and # 5 riders. Holzer and Ishoy have already said that they won't compete because of this. Has anyone heard anything from Brooks?

Snoopy is right. While based on these rankings there may be no hope of a medal, it is simply common sense to ensure that your best riders represent your country. You do this by setting criteria that encourage the best riders to compete for a place on the team. Dressage Canada has done the opposite!

CDNJumperGirl
Jan. 14, 2008, 09:40 PM
Jackie Brooks would make a great team member, her horses get better every time we see them but I don't know if she'd want to put her horse through all that- both her horses are relatively young and have a lot of career in front of them. I also don't know what her funding looks like or what her plans for the winter are.

Shame its all working out like this, even though Canada doesn't have a chance at a medal, we do have some decent riders who might have been able to produce decent results.

snoopy
Jan. 14, 2008, 09:50 PM
Shame its all working out like this, even though Canada doesn't have a chance at a medal, we do have some decent riders who might have been able to produce decent results.


Could not agree more!!!! There is some real talent in both horses and riders. It seem like the CEF is hell bent on screwing things up for the dressage riders. It is bad enough that in order to be competitive that canadian riders have to live/train south of the boarder, but to purposely shorten the list by asking even more of them is beyond me.

Mozart
Jan. 15, 2008, 11:04 AM
You would think there would be some way of coming up with criteria that gives your "most successful to date" riders an equal shot at the team....

Tiki
Jan. 15, 2008, 11:22 AM
And then there's this (http://eurodressage.com/reports/shows/2008/08sydney/pr_teamog.html) today from Eurodressage. Judges are going to Australia and New Zealand to judge their riders.

Elatu
Jan. 15, 2008, 12:04 PM
Tiki: Well, I guess my idea wasn't that far off base!.
We've seen enough cock-ups from Dressage and Equine Canada with the UNCART deal.
It's about time the powers that be started looking outside the box if we are going to have a creditable dressage representation, that every potential team member in North America and abroad can have a shot at.

ringdancer
Jan. 15, 2008, 12:37 PM
Ashley has made it very clear in an interview with Dressage Daily how she feels about the European criteria:

http://www.dressagedaily.com/2008/dd_200801/dd_20080114-holzer.html

Also, even more amazingly, apparently according to the Dressage Canada rules any qualifying CDI’s done in North America essentially don’t count!!!

The criteria specify that the Dressage Selection Committee make their final selection decision based ONLY on two European events. And the Committee doesn’t have to confirm the team makeup until just 10 days prior to the final quarantine.

What is with Dressage Canada’s obsession with Europe???

And isn’t it unfair to the riders not to make a final decision on the team until just 10 days before quarantine???

egontoast
Jan. 15, 2008, 02:02 PM
Any chance of the criteria changing, I wonder?




Holzer said that she would love to participate in the Olympic Games and would do so if able to skip Europe and go directly to Hong Kong, but the requirement of making a stop in Europe to compete this summer is just too hard. Some international riders have expressed concerns about the heat in Hong Kong, but that is not the issue with Holzer.

snoopy
Jan. 15, 2008, 02:08 PM
Any chance of the criteria changing, I wonder?


That is the reason she "withdrew" in order to force the issue. But she still wants to go. So really when it first came out that she and cindy were not going to attempt a place in HK...they were making a stand in order to get the criteria changed. Kind of like going on strike.

Leena
Jan. 15, 2008, 02:09 PM
The least to say is there is something wrong here with some major thinkers and I am not proud of them at all.

It is difficult enough to be at these levels and that should be taken into consideration.

Mozart
Jan. 15, 2008, 02:12 PM
Where do the showjumpers and eventers have to go to qualify? Anyone know?

dressagejunky
Jan. 15, 2008, 03:18 PM
The criteria specify that the Dressage Selection Committee make their final selection decision based ONLY on two European events.

If the criteria specifically require the Selection Committee to ONLY consider two European events in making the final team decision, wouldn't that tend to favor those riders who are already in Europe, since the European judges, as a result of having had more exposure to them, might tend to score them higher?

eqsiu
Jan. 15, 2008, 04:15 PM
Where do the showjumpers and eventers have to go to qualify? Anyone know?

Eventers are generally chosen by their performance at spring events. Rolex and Jersey Fresh were the two big ones for choosing the American WEG team this year. Because there is such a strong eventing community in the US we don't have to go overseas to choose our riders, though people do fly over for Badminton in May. I would assume that Canadian eventers also use Rolex and a CCI*** or two as the primary selection trials.

Browndog
Jan. 15, 2008, 08:10 PM
I found the list of the Dressage Canada 2007 Board of Directors. Apparently they would be the ones who were responsible for setting the criteria.

Lisa Kostandoff
Judith Pineault
Elizabeth McMullen
Cara Whitham
Evi Strasser


Also, even more amazingly, apparently according to the Dressage Canada rules any qualifying CDI’s done in North America essentially don’t count!!!

What is with Dressage Canada’s obsession with Europe???

Hmmmmm, only two posts and both slagging Dressage Canada and their board......axe to grind? Not too tough to figure out who the 'dancing' one is.........

egontoast
Jan. 15, 2008, 08:34 PM
Hmmmmm, only two posts and both slagging Dressage Canada and their board......axe to grind? Not too tough to figure out who the 'dancing' one is

Really? How can you figure that out? There are more than a few people unhappy with the criteria .

ringdancer
Jan. 15, 2008, 09:13 PM
Hmmmmm, only two posts and both slagging Dressage Canada and their board......axe to grind? Not too tough to figure out who the 'dancing' one is.........

Hi Browndog,

Perhaps you might be willing to explain why you feel that the Dressage Canada criteria are in the best interests of the sport, are fair to the competitors, and will ensure the fielding of the best possible Olympic team for Canada.

I can assure you that I am not one of the competitors affected by this, if that is what you are suggesting, but I am interested in and involved in the sport. I believe that the qualifying criteria are not in the best interests of the sport or fair to the competitors, and that’s why I posted.

cdndressagegirl
Jan. 15, 2008, 09:50 PM
I personally feel it is such a letdown that Canada's top riders are being practically forced out of the Olympics because of the criteria that was made by board members whom a lot of have never had the experience to even know how much pressure it is for a horse to travel such long distances. I also find it funny how Cindy or Ashley, can't remember which one mentioned in one of their quotes that they haven’t had a lot of say in the matter or something along those lines. Isn't the athlete rep who would be Evi strasser in this case suppose to contact all of the athletes and talk to them about what would be reasonable for them when it comes to travelling, qualifying shows etc? She is representing her team mates on the board after all. Of course this criteria is so convenient for those who live over in Europe already, and Evi has been living over there on and off for about a year now. I hope all these articles are a wakeup call to Dressage Canada Board that maybe they should think about changing their criteria fast and supporting their riders instead of turning them away from a lifelong dream. I also believe this year we have the greatest chance of doing our best because we have many top horse and rider combinations. Ashley Holzer and Pop art are an outstanding pair who haven’t received a bad mark yet. 76% in the Grand Prix last weekend as well as a 71%. Jacqueline Brooks has also been producing great results with her horse Gran Gesto and is currently ranked second in the North American League FEI world cup rankings. I believe she also received a 70 last weekend in the Grand Prix. Seriously Dressage Canada better step it up a notch if they want to send a strong team to Hong Kong!!

Elatu
Jan. 15, 2008, 10:00 PM
Yes, and I truly wonder if the Dressage Canada committee ever read this message board?, or anyone else's comments for that matter. Ashley and Cindy have made a very public and valid point to their disappointment on the selection process. I hope that it does not fall on deaf ears.
Shame on DC for making this selection a fiasco from the start.
Pressure on DC has already changed their membership policies more than once this year already, so the next thing to change in my opinion is this abomination of an Olympic team selection.
I wonder if there are any public minutes from their Dressage Canada meetings for the members of DC to see?
I'm not reading into your post Cdndressagegirl, but the travelling would not effect Strasser as she is in Europe, so I guess she and the other 2 contenders already in Germany/Holland would'nt have complained right?

canyonoak
Jan. 15, 2008, 10:09 PM
I'm confused.

Ashley Holzer is/ is not trying to go to Hong Kong?

hunterjumpernews.com has a report from Ken Braddick in which Holzer is doing a freestyle exhibition this weekend at the opening of WEF.

Braddick clearly states "She is seeking to qualify to ride for Canada at Hong Kong."

Of course, she is--at the moment--the highest placed North American in the World Cup standings, and if she can stay in Top Two, would get an invite to Amsterdam, meaning she would be in Europe anyway.

Fixerupper
Jan. 15, 2008, 11:51 PM
Ashley did not try for World Cup last year when it was in Las Vegas... if you look it up she does not travel much to show. She is in Wellington for the season and then pretty much stays in the north east (pretty impressive standing for someone who doesn't chase points.) As, I believe she said - she does have young children and a business to run.

egontoast
Jan. 16, 2008, 06:09 AM
canyonoak, according to the dressage daily article linked on this thread , Holzer definitely wants to go but only if criteria is changed.

Dressage Canada should be trying to facilitate the participation of the top riders, not making it more difficult by throwing up obstacles in their paths.

As far as medals go, if only the riders who were sure of medals participated, it would be a pretty small and boring exercise.

Looks like these rules have backfired if the intention was to send the best possible team.

The deadline has been extended to February 14.

fiona
Jan. 16, 2008, 03:04 PM
supporting their riders instead of turning them away from a lifelong dream.

That's really sad, how many people get anywhere close to chasing that dream? To have the goal posts moved out of reach seems way harsh.

ShannonLee
Jan. 16, 2008, 10:24 PM
Have you thought of the costs to horse and rider who are based in Europe to come back to Canada to compete at a head to head trial? That's crazy too. Both physically for horse, and financially for the rider.

I think the big problem is timing, and if the top 4 horses and riders were funded to compete in Europe at an earlier time of the year, it would be a great thing to do for all. The problem, as I see it, is that the selection criteria has the Canadians competing for a spot on the team at the last possible moment at either the Dutch or German Championships (Rotterdam or Aachen) both crazy politically for the Canadian scores..... They should be named earlier to the top 4, then funded to train and compete in Europe, and they should compete at a smaller CDI's where the judges will not be too nationalistic in their placings and scores..... All riders who want to do well need to be in Europe for a little bit to get in front of the judges, but it is crazy to do that at Rotterdam and Aachen!

I don't buy the athletes concerns of family as valid per se - These are the Olympics - it requires great sacrifice. That's part of it. If every mother could fit Olympic training and qualifying in to their schedule it would not be so special. Don't kill me for that statement - it doesn't mean I don't value the family - just that other Olympic athletes probably don't have perfect 9 -5 jobs with time off to see the kids in their debates and plays. It's all in your priorities, and if your priority is with your family,that's a great thing, maybe just not an Olympic thing.

dressagejunky
Jan. 16, 2008, 11:08 PM
Have you thought of the costs to horse and rider who are based in Europe to come back to Canada to compete at a head to head trial? That's crazy too. Both physically for horse, and financially for the rider.

Well, since we are talking about the Olympic Games, and the fundamental basis for the Games is that the athletes represent their home countries, I don’t think that being required to qualify in the country, or at least on the continent, that you hope to represent is a "crazy" idea.

Dutch
Jan. 16, 2008, 11:32 PM
If I remember correctly, in past years, if a Canadian dressage rider residing outside of Canada earned a score of 70% or more at a CDI, they automatically qualified for the Olympic games without having to compete at the trials at home. They only had to return to Canada for the trials if this score was not achieved. I really can't remember whether this meant only Europe, or U.S.A. as well. Maybe someone else does?

egontoast
Jan. 17, 2008, 06:57 AM
It's my understanding that those who are in Europe DO NOT have to come back to NA to compete (and I don't think they need 70s) Pretty sure unless someone can correct me on that.

This part is the killer for some . Even if you go to Europe they can say no. Pretty expensive trials and,again, favours those already there since it doesn't matter what you accomplished before. Everything will ride on those two shows.



Any Combination(s) may be withdrawn from entry at the 2008 OG if the DSC is not
satisfied, in the exercise of their discretion, that the Combination(s) will be reasonably
competitive at the 2008 OG. In exercising this discretion the DSC will only consider
performance and results at the one or two major International events in Europe all
Combinations must participate in . . .

ShannonLee
Jan. 17, 2008, 07:49 AM
Yes, in past years riders could automatically be on the team if they got two scores in CDI's that were over a certain percentage point - I believe it was 70%.

I was unclear on my previous post. I think the current criteria has some merit - no head to head trials in Canada - for the reason that the travel is too hard on horses based in Europe. Horses and riders based in Europe are an asset to the Canadians international reputation and should not be penalized for being there. Asking them to travel back to Canada, compete at two selection trials one week after the other, then travel back to Europe for Quarantine, then travel on to HK would be way too much for them, and you would lose all of those possible competitors.

We don't need head to head trials - we could definitely pick the best team from CDI scores that have been earned in the previous 9 months.

If the timing were better, the horses get to travel to HK in smaller segments - the trip to Europe breaks it up. The horses could rest while there, show at a smaller venue, rest again, and then make the trip to HK. I do, however, agree that with the current timing and the competition venues currently planned for the Canadians is not conducive to garnering their best performances at the Games.

Dutch
Jan. 17, 2008, 09:24 AM
It's my understanding that those who are in Europe DO NOT have to come back to NA to compete (and I don't think they need 70s) Pretty sure unless someone can correct me on that.

This part is the killer for some . Even if you go to Europe they can say no. Pretty expensive trials and,again, favours those already there since it doesn't matter what you accomplished before. Everything will ride on those two shows.

I was referring to past years, not the 2008 criteria. Sorry if I was unclear in my post.

egontoast
Jan. 17, 2008, 11:16 AM
Actually I was replying to Shannon Lee, I think..no maybe both arghh :)

fiona
Jan. 17, 2008, 03:56 PM
what does "reasonably competitive" mean?

egontoast
Jan. 17, 2008, 08:30 PM
exactly.

ringdancer
Jan. 17, 2008, 10:29 PM
what does "reasonably competitive" mean?

I suspect it means that "in the exercise of their discretion" the Selection Committee can ignore the months of hard work that the competitors will have put in to earn their qualifying scores, and select whomever they like.

Dutch
Jan. 17, 2008, 10:54 PM
or decide not to send a team at all.

Fixerupper
Jan. 17, 2008, 11:29 PM
Not sending a team is a poor option - not just for the riders. In ways that are too complicated to satisfactorily explain it affects national funding not just for dressage but for horse sport in Canada.

tarnia
Jan. 29, 2008, 05:28 PM
DC has modified some of their criteria: http://www.eurodressage.com/reports/shows/2008/08og/canada_newrules.html

Also Ashley Holzer is reportedly back in: http://www.dressagedaily.com/2008/dd_200801/dd_20080129.html

dressagejunky
Jan. 30, 2008, 11:04 PM
DC has modified some of their criteria: http://www.eurodressage.com/reports/shows/2008/08og/canada_newrules.html

Yes, but their press release -

http://www.dressagedaily.com/2008/dd_200801/08can1.pdf

says that "DC wants to make it clear that this aspect (Europe) of the original criteria was never a second stage of the “selection trial”, as it has been characterized by some."

They seem to have forgotten what their original criteria stated -


"Any Combination(s) may be withdrawn from entry at the 2008 OG if the DSC is not satisfied, in the exercise of their discretion, that the Combination(s) will be reasonably competitive at the 2008 OG. In exercising this discretion the DSC will only consider performance and results at the one or two major International events in Europe "

Despite this, good for them for at least acknowleging their mistakes by correcting the criteria!

Lexi
Jan. 30, 2008, 11:34 PM
uh, no. the information you quoted does not identify those events as "selection trials," which are just that, selection trials.

just as eventing has "mandatory outings," not at all the same thing as "selection trials."

if they were selection trials, they would be identified as such.

just because an event is used to subjectively influence decisions in some aspect of the selection process does not make it a "selection trial," which has quite a specific meaning.