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ltw
Jan. 1, 2008, 05:14 PM
How many of you long line or double lunge with long lines? I have been doing this for a few years and think it is a great way to get a horse fit again going in straight lines and staying off a small lunge circle, especially if rehabbing an out of shape horse. I have also used with young green horses.

I like it for teaching them good self carriage, learning to use their hind end and half halts. Does anyone else use it as a training technique?

Mallard
Jan. 1, 2008, 05:51 PM
I have done it with all my youngsters just as a 'fun' thing to do!
It's way better than longing for babies and it teaches them to start, stop & steer as well as really focusing on the handler.

I had so much fun with the first horse I ever long-lined, that he ended up pulling our cutter around in his 2 and 3 yr old winters. FUN!

Just yesterday I long-lined my ConnemaraX.
We are very out of practice...it's been a couple of years for him.
However, he is a clever little guy and we managed to do some nice direction changes at the trot.
It is a nice change from going in circles and longing and it keeps the handler fit!

ideayoda
Jan. 1, 2008, 06:11 PM
I use it (almost) every day as a warm up, and certainly as a progressive way of training a youngster/re-training. The schooling progresses from lungeing (as youngsters) with side reins (to the caveson/then the bit). Then they learn to drive/halt/turn/change gaits. Then they are ridden. Later on in their training they work on lateral work/piaffe/etc on long lines as well. Ideally they always have a good surcingle (with a crupper and standing rings as well as many levels of D's). However, it takes years of work to develop skills for ease of work and knowing the if/thens which can happen.

Hampton Bay
Jan. 1, 2008, 06:59 PM
I use it with my mare instead of lunging as she does better with the outside contact. But with her, I generally do not need to lunge or long line her prior to riding, so I do it as a workout on days I don't plan to ride. I like being able to switch directions more frequently, as well as the ability to go straight, steer over a small fence (with no standards)...

I just use a halter and two lines though. The outside line I run behind her butt, the inside goes directly to my hand. Her mouth is very sensitive, so using a bit is a disaster with her. I like being able to have an opening inside rein as well because it is more clear to her, and less forceful.

Trixie's mom
Jan. 1, 2008, 07:37 PM
once or twice a week...all horses should do this IMO...wonderful way to work a horse.

ride-n-tx
Jan. 1, 2008, 07:42 PM
I do it, and love it, but i am not very good at it :). i can do the basics, but not much else. There will be a long lining clinic in my area this year (Finally!!!), so hopefully i will learn a thing or two.

darrin
Jan. 1, 2008, 11:21 PM
ride-n-tx, can you give some info on this clinic? i'm in austin, and this is something i'm interested in learning more about. thanks!

DJ
Jan. 1, 2008, 11:45 PM
I am near Austin, I would like to hear about it too, if it is nearby. :cool:

J-Lu
Jan. 1, 2008, 11:54 PM
Ida Anderson is doing a Long Lining clinic at Canaan Ranch in Fulshear, TX (outside of Houston), Jan 26-7.

See the Houston Dressage Society webiste or www.canaanranch.net (http://www.canaanranch.net) for more information.

J.

goeslikestink
Jan. 2, 2008, 04:37 AM
its the best way to start babies off - getting them to understand basicc commands going forwards and straight and balanced in time also gives them a nice outline which all falls over into ridden work -so half your battle is won

ride-n-tx
Jan. 2, 2008, 08:09 AM
Ida Anderson is doing a Long Lining clinic at Canaan Ranch in Fulshear, TX (outside of Houston), Jan 26-7.

See the Houston Dressage Society webiste or www.canaanranch.net (http://www.canaanranch.net) for more information.

J.

Thanks J-Lu, that is the one i was referring to. Let me know if any of you are going!

J-Lu
Jan. 2, 2008, 03:43 PM
Thanks J-Lu, that is the one i was referring to. Let me know if any of you are going!

I'll be out of town, (it figures), but my horse will be there observing...

cyndi
Jan. 2, 2008, 04:33 PM
I'm going to the longlining clinic in Houston. At least I think I am - I sent a check and so far it hasn't been cashed - but no one has told me it's full, either!

I signed up both of my coming three year olds. It may be _interesting_ to say the least! :lol:

They both have been longlined, but only in the round pen. I have longlined most of my youngsters, but am totally self-taught and mainly have done it to get the 'steering' and 'brakes' down before starting under saddle.

Hopefully we will learn a lot!

DressageGeek "Ribbon Ho"
Jan. 2, 2008, 04:55 PM
I am learning to - just barely starting to try/understand lateral work this way. It is a terrific tool for me to feel through my back and core (as well as a good workout). I try and do it once a week, then hop on bareback and "feel" as if I were long lining.

We use a surcingle and bridle and I use my muck boots. I will use the arena and do circles, serpentines, change of bend, halts (we can only do walk and trot, a few times canter), or go up and down small hills.

It's a nice change for him, as well as for me. I am very happy to be gaining this training tool for my "arsenal."

magnum
Jan. 2, 2008, 05:38 PM
My trainer and I use this on ALL young horses well before they are ridden.

It is a tool I could not live without! It is always a great refresher to let the horse work thru things on his own, and teach new things, as well.

Magnum

ASB Stars
Jan. 2, 2008, 07:01 PM
Long lining- and double longeing- are two of the best tools you will ever learn to use.

All of my young, and remedial, horses start off this way, and I continue- well, forever. There is almost nothing you can't teach- or fix- in long lines.

In addition, being able to SHOW a student "THIS is what YOUR hands are doing" seperate from them sitting upon the beasts back, is a fabulous gift. In the years that I taught (when dinosaurs roamed the Earth) I had more students with light bulb moments as they lined a horse than I can possbly remember doing almost anything else.

If you don't know how already, find someone who can teach you! :yes:

Ridge Runner
Jan. 2, 2008, 07:49 PM
I start all my youngsters in long lines and double lunge also. I think it is essential in their education. I'll take them for walks around the farm and down trails also.

ltw
Jan. 2, 2008, 09:25 PM
I was at a stallion show in Germany back around 2000. I watched Cord Meiners long line Don Gregory (Donnerhall son) through the entire Grand Prix test. Perfect one tempis, perfect P&P, perfect canter Pir. It was incredible. Cord cued Don Gregory for the one tempis by pressing on his butt on the side he wanted him to change. He was up close and personal to the stallion's haunches during this part. Talk about total trust! It was incredible!

Reiter
Jan. 3, 2008, 11:04 AM
I was at a stallion show in Germany back around 2000. I watched Cord Meiners long line Don Gregory (Donnerhall son) through the entire Grand Prix test. Perfect one tempis, perfect P&P, perfect canter Pir. It was incredible. Cord cued Don Gregory for the one tempis by pressing on his butt on the side he wanted him to change. He was up close and personal to the stallion's haunches during this part. Talk about total trust! It was incredible!

Wow! I would have loved to see that! I got goosebumps just imagining! ;)

cyndi
Jan. 3, 2008, 11:40 AM
I saw the Lippizan stallions (the _real_ ones ;)) when they came a few years ago and one of the riders longlined one of the guys through one tempi changes, half pass - probably much like what ltw saw with Don Gregory. It was simply amazing! The thing that struck me is that the guy was _walking_ but the horse was cantering!

DressageGeek "Ribbon Ho"
Jan. 3, 2008, 02:33 PM
I saw the Lippizan stallions (the _real_ ones ;)) when they came a few years ago and one of the riders longlined one of the guys through one tempi changes, half pass - probably much like what ltw saw with Don Gregory. It was simply amazing! The thing that struck me is that the guy was _walking_ but the horse was cantering!

ditto. I am far from that ability, but it just goes to show you how much you can accomplish.

ltw
Mar. 10, 2008, 11:35 PM
I have a 4 yr old young mare that had injured a collateral ligament in her hind ankle in a pasture injury. After 5 months of rest, I started hand walking her for the last 3 weeks. The vet said I could start walking her under tack.

She is fine in the brain and would have tolerated riding but I felt after total rest it was not fair to her for me to get un her back, and felt that it would be better to get her fit before adding rider weight.

Yesterday I longlined her at the walk. It is a great tool as you can go in straight lines and have so much more control than lunging.

To my amazement she remembered all of the verbal cues. She was wonderful for her first time out and totally obedient. I was so thrilled. She remembered stop, go, turn, straight lines, half halt.

I think that longlining is anther tool for us when we need to rehab a horse from an injury. It gets them use to the verbal and physical cues again but allows me as a rider to observe so much from the ground about their way of going and how they are using themselves.

I could see after 20 minutes she was getting tired on her hurt hind leg and was starting to twist on it as I was right behind her and could see exactly how she was using that hind leg and if she was dropping that hip on that side so I stopped.

Today I just hand walked for 15 minutes on firmer footing (driveway- versus firm ring footing). Boy, what a long hard road the rehab work is, been there, done that .... but I think the long lining is a great tool.

My next step is to check out the walking swimming pool treadmill my vet just purchased for rehabbing horses. Maybe this would also be a good tool for her progress.

eyesontheground
Mar. 11, 2008, 12:32 PM
So...I have alot of questions that I have always been afraid to ask for fear of looking stupid...

I really like the IDEA of long lining because you seem to have more control than lounging, can work on stuff without the weight of a rider and bc I am not a big fan of youngsters being on small circles. But...my big confession...I have no idea what to do or how to start or even what to buy.

The dumb question of the day...what is the difference between long lining, double lunging, and ground driving? Are they all the same thing? Is there some subtle difference that I am missing? Dumb question of the day number two...am I gonna get kicked when I ask a horse to actually do this?

Thanks for indulging my ignorance!

veezee
Mar. 11, 2008, 12:44 PM
Long lining and ground driving are the same thing. Just depends on the age group of people and where they are from to what terminology is used.;) I love to use long lining/ground driving with my horses. It's a great way to warm up, use for training, and almost as fun as riding. You can learn how to do it by taking lessons with a trainer that does it and attend clinics. If you haven't done it with your horse I do recommend having someone work with you to show you how. :)

lilypondlane
Mar. 11, 2008, 12:53 PM
My former dressage instructor learned this skill from her French instructor and became very proficient. She long-lined my 3-year old mare for about five months before I sent her to be started -- the guy who started her said she was the easiest horse he ever started. She used it on my daughter's gelding who wanted to buck after each jump -- cured that problem in just a couple of months. She used it on two of my young mares who had been out of work for a while. It's easier on the horse, for sure, they all seem to love it, and it's awfully good exercise for the human. :) I feel that I am not coordinated enough to be good at it, or perhaps just not knowledgeable enough, but it's a wonderful training tool and my horses all loved it.

ltw
Mar. 11, 2008, 08:34 PM
Try to find someone to train you how to longline. The first person that taught me actually drove horses for a living. He ground drove but he also professionally drove carriages. and he also started young horses under saddle. In my area of Virginia this was James Houston.

He helped me bring a mare back to work that had had a few foals and was unfit. I watched him for a few times, and then he handed the reins to me and ran behind me coaching me the whole time. I got to the point where I could ground drive this mare all over my neighborhood.

I also had two professional trainers help me with green horses after the first guy got me started.

You definetely need a professional to teach you the tricks, otherwise, you can get tangled up in the lines, the horse gets loose and freaks out and can hurt himself or you.

If you are learning for the first time, get a professional to teach your horse first. Some horses freak out and the next thing you know you are water skiing across your ring. YOu have to be strong and skilled enough to get a half halt and respect from the horse. YOu also have to be able to run and keep up with the horse. YOu don't want the horse running loose with two lungelines flapping. There are also tricks to hooking up the lines properly.

Once your horse learns, then have the Professional help you longline the horse. This person can stand behind you and guide you while you do it. You have to be coordinated with the lines or you will get tangled.

Timex
Mar. 12, 2008, 05:17 PM
we LOVE long lining! all of ours do at least a little bit - even the race horses! a great workout, and while my son was small, making it tough to ride much, it was the ONLY work my nicer horses got. and they were better for it in the long run! there was a great article on long lining in Practical Horseman a couple of months ago, incidently.

magnum
Mar. 13, 2008, 12:42 PM
My trainer is fabulous. She taught her Hanoverian stallion great PIAFFE/ PASSAGE transitions on the long lines. It is truly amazing to watch her work. I personally have gotten to the point where I can teach changes of direction, collection and extensions. It is also a great way to introduce lateral work and work thru any stiffness in the horse's jaw.

I do well at basics. But, when I see my trainer doing piaffe, half passes, QUICKER changes of directions (than I can do with any degree of competence) .... I tend to think I'd end up with lines wrapped around my ankles (and that wouldn't be my first time, either!) :lol: .

This is a tool that we especially like for horses who have been "ruined' with hand riding who have not learned to use their back very well. It frees them up from the expectations of having a rider on their back. They learn to come lower and THRU, then when the rider gets up, the horse makes a comeback that much more quickly.

One tip -- on windy days, you MUST watch your extra line .... they will blow up and tangle around your feet!

Magnum

poltroon
Mar. 13, 2008, 01:14 PM
I am using this to work with my daughter's 11.1 hand pony. I can almost get away with riding him myself, but I feel bad for him and then don't really insist. ;)

He was driven before we bought him, so he has endured my attempts with patience and finally figured out what the heck I was trying to do. :D This is great for my education, because he is small enough that we can't get in too much trouble.

I don't have anyone to teach me this skill, and I definitely have a lot to learn. I would especially like to know more about teaching a horse lateral work with the long lines, something that would definitely benefit the pony. Can anyone point me to some good references I can use to keep my thinking straight, if not my pony, reins, and whip? :D

vanheimrhorses
Mar. 14, 2008, 01:19 AM
I have used them and like it, i was really impressed watching Arabian trainers use them, they are so good at double lines, it really does wonders for the horse and keeps him straighter and calmer on the circle without drifting or bulging but can be tricky on young wiggly fast out of balance horses, I find it works well in a smaller area such as a round pen where the horse is more controlled
they also keep the horses hocks up under himself more, it would be interesting if there was some kind of device to teach people how to hold the lines and use them

MagicRoseFarm
Mar. 14, 2008, 01:53 AM
James Houston also helped me with some youngsters on the ground, after I had knee surgery and was unable to work my own. He was VERY good with the ground driving and helped me to be more proficient just by watching his techniques.

My trainer Michael Keirkegaard is very proficient in long reining and uses it as another tool in his regular training regime and in development of his FEI horses.

NoDQhere
Mar. 14, 2008, 09:48 AM
Our youngsters are all taught to longline and spend many hours doing it before they are ever expected to carry a rider. There is nothing that prepares a horse for riding better than longlining. We also use double lounging and "regular" lounging, but the long lining is by far the best. Plus it is a great "tool" to use throughout a horse's career. The book by Philippe Karl, Long Lining, The Saumur Method, is a very good book.