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View Full Version : Is Storm Cat really a PA-bred??



Texarkana
Dec. 3, 2007, 01:29 PM
This makes no sense to me.

I was watching the cute little Bloodhorse/HRTV bit on Terlingua (http://www.bloodhorse.com/#), and it got me thinking about her other offspring.

So I'm looking at Pedigree Query, and they have Storm Cat (http://www.pedigreequery.com/storm+cat) listed as a PA-bred.

Is that right? I'm thinking that surely has to be an error someone entered on the site. He was bred by Overbrook in KY, which as far as I know, never had any PA divisions. Nor can I figure any reason they'd send their mares to PA to foal.

Anyone got the whole story on this one?

mambo9
Dec. 3, 2007, 02:25 PM
Storm Cat is a PA Bred. He was bred by W. T. Young, and was foaled and raised at Derry Meeting Farm owned by Marshall W. Jenney. He ran for Young, was Grade 1 winner of $570,610, and was trained by Jonathan Sheppard.

Another great stallion- Danzig- is also a PA bred and Marshall W. Jenney was also a co-breeder on him!

Glimmerglass
Dec. 3, 2007, 02:34 PM
Nor can I figure any reason they'd send their mares to PA to foal.

With all the slots revenue doesn't PA have a very generous breeding reward program for those who foal in the Keystone state?

miss_critic
Dec. 3, 2007, 02:54 PM
Where did you see that Overbrook actuallly bred him?

jengersnap
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:02 PM
With all the slots revenue doesn't PA have a very generous breeding reward program for those who foal in the Keystone state?

Yup. My husband (as owner-breeder) use to make up to 30% more on a PA bred's winnings. They pay owner and breeder. They are also preferred starters in PA and there are PA only and PA added races and bonuses.

http://www.pabred.com/faq/faq.php

jengersnap
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:07 PM
Where did you see that Overbrook actuallly bred him?

Probably from the info on Pedigree Query:

Owner: Overbrook Farm
Breeder: Overbrook Farm
State Bred: PA
Winnings: 8 Starts: 4 - 3 - 0, $570,610

Texarkana
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:10 PM
With all the slots revenue doesn't PA have a very generous breeding reward program for those who foal in the Keystone state?

Yes, but they didn't in 1983!

Thanks for the explanation, Mambo9. I spend much of my early horse years working coming and going from Derry Meeting (although by then it was the owned by George Strawbridge) and never knew he was foaled there. Pretty neat.

Anyone know why Young had Terlingua foal at Derry Meeting instead of at his Overbrook Farm in KY? Her previous foal was born in KY, as were the rest of them. It just seems odd they'd ship her to PA for one foal...

azbloodstock
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:18 PM
Overbrook did not exist back then, WT Young was just really getting started in the business. Below is from the Jockey Club.


https://www.equineline.com/RegistryIncludes/images/subforms/clear_pixel.gifSearch Results https://www.equineline.com/RegistryIncludes/images/subforms/clear_pixel.gifRegistered Thoroughbred Name: Storm CatDam: TerlinguaFoaling Year: 1983Sex: HorseBreeder: W. T. Young Storage Inc. DNA Sample:Posted

dr j
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:32 PM
I believe Danzig was a PA bred also. Correct me if I am wrong.

Don't have time to check that fact right now but it pops into my head.

J

mambo9
Dec. 3, 2007, 03:35 PM
Here is a link from the Thoroughbred Times back in 2000.... It informs of Storm Cat, Danzing and other famous PA breds that Marshall Jenny had touched in his life!

This should help clarify things a little!

http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2000/November/27/Leading-breeder-Marshall-Jenney-dead.aspx

ejm
Dec. 3, 2007, 04:19 PM
Terlingua's 1984 foal was Chapel of Dreams, a stakes-winning filly by Northern Dancer, who stood at E. P. Taylor's Windfields Farm near Chesapeake City, Maryland - roughly an hour's drive from Derry Meeting Farm.

At a guess, Terlingua was shipped to Derry Meeting to avoid stressing a very young foal with a long van ride. Derry Meeting has always had a lot of very good clients with high-quality breeding stock, and did quite a bit of seasonal and year-round boarding for mares being bred to the Windfields stallions.

Texarkana
Dec. 3, 2007, 04:45 PM
Terlingua's 1984 foal was Chapel of Dreams, a stakes-winning filly by Northern Dancer, who stood at E. P. Taylor's Windfields Farm near Chesapeake City, Maryland - roughly an hour's drive from Derry Meeting Farm.

At a guess, Terlingua was shipped to Derry Meeting to avoid stressing a very young foal with a long van ride. Derry Meeting has always had a lot of very good clients with high-quality breeding stock, and did quite a bit of seasonal and year-round boarding for mares being bred to the Windfields stallions.

Good sleuth work, emj! I didn't even notice that when I was looking at her produce. That completely makes sense to foal her out on the east coast when you'll be breeding back to an east coast stallion.

Linny
Dec. 5, 2007, 08:56 AM
One of Danzig's best sons, Hard Spun is also a PA bred.

Sing Mia Song
Dec. 5, 2007, 11:38 AM
Bred by Mike Moran, whose mother Elizabeth also bred Creme Fraiche and High Yield. The Morans routinely have what I would consider to be the nicest-bred stock in PA, if not the whole Mid-Atlantic. I believe that she also has at least one share in Storm cat.

sm
Dec. 5, 2007, 04:57 PM
the top PA-Breds, note Smarty Jones. They'll need to update to include Hard Spun:

Alphabet Soup
Breeders Cup Classic winner.

Ambassador of Luck
Undefeated Eclipse Award-winning older mare.

Danzig
Undefeated, leading international sire,
sire of seven champions.

Devil’s Honor
Pennsylvania Derby winner.

Flatterer
Four-time Eclipse Award-winning jumper.

Go For Wand
Twice an Eclipse Award winner.

Iroquois
First American-foaled winner
of the English Derby at Epsom.

Lil E. Tee
Kentucky Derby winner.

Lyphard
Three-time leading sire
and twice leading broodmare sire.

Mrs. Penny
Twice a European champion,
North American graded stakes winner.

Russian Rhythm
European champion, multiple Group One winner.

Selkirk
European champion miler, leading international sire.

Smarty Jones
Champion, Kentucky Derby and Preakness Stakes winner.

Storm Cat
Grade One winner, world’s leading sire of the 1990s.

Tikkanen
European champion, Breeders Cup Turf winner.


Owners' bonuses in detail on page 4 http://www.pabred.com/Brochure/p4.html
Top horses as I've listed, page 6 http://www.pabred.com/Brochure/p6.html
General info: http://www.pabred.com

miss_critic
Dec. 5, 2007, 05:27 PM
WOW, I had no idea about some of those!

Texarkana
Dec. 5, 2007, 05:27 PM
Interesting list... I was familiar with most of them as PA-breds. Although being born and raised in PA and now living in TN, I feel like a total idiot. I now live about 2 minutes from the Belle Meade Plantation, which advertises itself as the birthplace of Iroquois. Complete with statue of Iroquois as a foal. Heck, I live in the Iroquois Apartment complex for christs sake! Now I realize that he only stood stud there.

I feel like the native Pennsylvanian in me needs to go around and correct everyone! LOL! So what farm was Iroquois foaled at in PA?

sm
Dec. 5, 2007, 06:00 PM
I feel like a total idiot. I now live about 2 minutes from the Belle Meade Plantation, which advertises itself as the birthplace of Iroquois. Complete with statue of Iroquois as a foal. Heck, I live in the Iroquois Apartment complex for christs sake! Now I realize that he only stood stud there.

I feel like the native Pennsylvanian in me needs to go around and correct everyone! LOL! So what farm was Iroquois foaled at in PA?

It's not you, he's documented that way all over. Including State Facts info #3 http://www.50states.com/facts/tenn.htm

I found two references:

1) " This equestrian event was named for Iroquois, the first American-bred horse to win the English Derby in 1881. The famous racehorse was born in 1878, in Chestnut, Pa., and was named for the Indian tribe. Iroquois was brought to Nashville's Belle Meade plantation where he died in 1899. The thoroughbred was buried on the plantation grounds, but the grave is in an unknown location. Iroquois was purchased as a yearling by George Lorillard, an American tobacco millionaire. Lorillard shipped several horses, including Iroquois, to his stables in England to be trained. The horses were accompanied by Lorillard's trainer, Jacob Pincus. As a two-year-old, Iroquois won four of 11 starts and seven of nine races at age three. The brown horse stood 16 hands high and his greatest victory came at the English Derby. Iroquois' successful races established him as the second favorite with 11 to 2 odds. The 1881 Derby was the 102nd renewal of the mile-and-a-half course event. The famous jockey, Fred Archer, was so impressed by Iroquois' past performances that his request to ride the stallion was anxiously granted. Archer rode Iroquois to an upset victory over Peregrine, winning by a neck to become the first American-bred horse to win the most famous horse race in the world. It would not be until 1954 that another American-bred horse, Never Say Die, would win the English Derby....

" Later that racing season, Iroquois also won the St. Leger and the Prince of Wales Stakes. He was the only horse to win those three races in the 102 years they were run. After Iroquois' triumphs on the English turf, Lorillard brought his prized race horse to his stables in Jobstown, N. J. to stud. In October 1886, Lorillard closed his stables and held an auction to sell all his thoroughbreds, including Iroquois. William H. Jackson, who was the proprietor of the Belle Meade Plantation, heard about the auction, attended it and purchased Iroquois for $20,000. " http://host1.bondware.com/~citypaper/news.php?viewStory=3656

2) June 1, 1881, Iroquois, who was later purchased by Belle Meade Plantation, had the honor of being the first American horse to win the English Derby. http://www.mc.vanderbilt.edu/reporter/index.html?ID=2067

EDITED TO ADD:
If you follow the dam, Maggie BB, she was never owned by Belle Meade. She was bred by James B. Clay, Jr., a grandson of the renowned Kentucky politician Henry Clay; owned by several of the Clays; M.A. Littell; Captain T.G. Moore; then sold to breeder Aristides Welch and sent to his Erdenheim Stud at Chestnut Hill, Pennsylvania, near Philadelphia. In 1877 Maggie B.B. came up barren, but the next year foaled a dark brown son of Leamington destined for fame as IROQUOIS. Iroquois was sold to Pierre Lorillard, and was shipped to England as a yearling in 1879. Iroquois was turned over to Jacob Pincus to be trained. http://www.tbheritage.com/Portraits/MaggieBB.html

Texarkana
Dec. 5, 2007, 08:35 PM
I assume that's the same Erdenheim Farm (http://www.whitemarshfoundation.org/farm.aspx) later of Eugene Dixon's family.

This is all quite interested to me, seeing as how Tennessee state history is lying to everyone, LOL. Seriously, ask anyone around here why Iroquois is significant, and they'll say he was born at Belle Meade.