Ambassadors for Driving :)

[Ashemont]

I'm sure you're all a bit tired of my bragging on Maggie Mae - but you never let it show (thank you) :) so I'd like to share something that happened as a result that was totally unexpected.

Now those of you who really know me know that I'm not quite the inspirational type, however that's just what has happened! Because of my enthusiastic posts on other horse forums about my adventures with Maggie I have had FOUR mature ladies contact me and enquire about driving! One already has a pony but was hesitant to start something new - and she's younger than me!

Three of them are former riders who due to age or health can no longer ride or can no longer ride as much yet they still want to continue to enjoy horse adventures. The fourth is a woman who always wanted to ride and while she now has the time since she's retired, she is fearful of climbing up on a big horse. :uhoh:

I have done my best to point them all to driving resources and to encourage them as you have all encouraged me. I've invited them to this forum and I know you will treat them kindly should they become brave enough to post. :yes:

This made me realize that we should all be ambassadors for our sport. Encouraging and supporting YOUNG drivers is imperative for our sport to continue, but there is a whole world of prospective drivers out there we can bring into the fold now to strengthen our numbers and keep driving alive. So today I encourage all of YOU to share your happy driving stories with your riding horse friends. Especially those who are mature or unable to ride anymore. The love of horses is still there and by guiding them into the driving world we'll only make it better for all of us :winkgrin:

[Thomas_1]

Now personally speaking I think driving is much too much fun to wait till you're old and can't ride and neither do I think its a substitute, alternative, compromise or 2nd cousin to riding. I've ridden and driven all my life as have a lot of folks I know and indeed most the best drivers are also very proficient riders and they continue to do both.

I always encourage and stimulate and challenge riders - of all ages and abilities - to think about carriage driving to develop and improve and enhance their equine knowledge, rein handling and ground training skills. So not as a substitute for or a poor relation to riding, BUT to compliment and enhance and improve.

I frequently put riders on to a reining machine (with riding rein length) to show them how heavy handed and incorrect they are with their ridden technique and I often show them how they wouldn't have a snowball in h ells chance with driving reins by giving them reins of that length. A lot are absolutely gutted and horrified by the effect they're having on their horse's mouth when they see it in action and a few are inspired to take up driving to enhance their rein handling technique and to improve their ability to use the natural aids of hands and voice to guide a really well-trained horse.

Having said that there's no doubt that driving has the additional advantage of being more accessible and particularly for those who may have special requirements, limited mobility etc etc.

I've got open days on 21st & 22nd June and specifically to look at the topic of "Accessibility".

Now its actually being co-ordinated through 4 organisations who provide services for people with disability and other special needs and the open day(s) here is part of a series of events to titilate and stimulate ideas about what is accessible to people.

I already work with clients from those organisations and have customers from their who I teach to ride as well as carriage drive. It started off as being just one day on 22nd but because of the huge number of folks showing interest, I'm doing 2 days now.

On the open day, I'll be doing:

- a display of all the vehicles
- a demonstration of long reining + a silly 'show off' bit where I "forget to attach the reins" and work the horse from voice only.
- a demonstration of cross country obstacle driving
some stunt driving/show off tricks..... DON'T TRY THESE AT HOME: "log jumping with a carriage", driving up and down a see-saw, through an obstacle course on fire!
- tasters on the reining machines
- tasters using a carriage built for wheelchair users and for those who are semi-ambulent
- a drive out with the coach and 4 for those who are more profoundly disabled

[Drive NJ]

Good for you Ashemont and Thomas I bow to your truely walking the walk and providing opportunities to so many people to learn about driving.

One point though Ashmont... though we have a big current focus on youth driving again, which deserves support, we should also offer the same opportunities to our core market which has always seemed to be the mid-20s to mid-30s (and above) when people start getting married and having kids and wanting a sport where the family can all enjoy the same horse together.

I'm happy to see the idea of driving weekends growing out of the original ADS Weekend of Driving of many years ago through the Mid A ADS weekends which have been running for many, many years (right gothedistance - who I believe ran one of the first ones) and now on to the National Drive and ADS weekends in the NorthEast and Pacific Northwest. The idea of "driving camps" for adults and minors is growing in popularity and rightly so.

[Ashemont]

The idea of "driving camps" for adults and minors is growing in popularity and rightly so.

Wow... where do you find out about these? Sounds like something that would be of interest :)

And Thomas I appreciate that driving can be a 'first love' but my point was that there might be a HUGE market out there as yet untapped. To me more drivers equals more events, more opportunities and more FUN! :D

[Thomas_1]

but my point was that there might be a HUGE market out there as yet untapped. To me more drivers equals more events, more opportunities and more FUN! :yes::yes::yes: But you don't have to wait for them to get ancient and infirm and injured and unable to ride :winkgrin:

[KellyS]

Agreed on all the points above. :yes:

Driving is such a wonderful sport for some many reasons. For us (Aaron and I), it gives us an opportunity to enjoy a sport together, much more so when we are competing individual horses at event (even though we groom for each other).

Riding and driving complement each other so well, and go hand in hand. We love teaching our friends--both horsey and nonhorsey--about it and many of them are realizing that it is not just about having a "cute" pony and "cart," but that it encompasses abilities and training that are just as difficult as any sport out there, equestrian or nonequestrian. Of course, having a "cute" pony goes a long way towards attracting people to ask us about driving. :D

Drive NJ is very correct in that there needs to be a focus not only on "young" drivers but on all new drivers getting into and participating in the sport. The true base of the sport is the adult amateur that works full time to support their "hobby" and typically enjoys driving with fellow family members (whether it's a spouse or kids).

In addition, "young" drivers don't just encompass individuals under the age of 18, but also those of us in our 20's who are coming into the sport with a lot of passion and enthusiasm--we are here for the long haul and look forward to many, many years of driving participation.

However, many of us in our 20's and 30's are dealing with similar issues: One, we don't have the financial base of many older competitors (or young drivers that are supported by mom & dad) and two, there are very few programs/incentives for adult drivers compared to what's available for "young" drivers. Now that I'm feeling better after having successful surgery in May, I'd like to become more involved in developing affordable clinics geared to all drivers and I think activities like the driving weekends (eg, Mid Atlantic driving weekend) provide low key, noncompetitive activities that are relatively inexpensive and fun. :yes:

For those of us coming into this sport after college (and just getting careers starting as working adults), the initial investment in horse/pony, carriage, and equipment can be intimidating, but can be done. There are just a handful of us in this age bracket in our area competing at CDEs, and we all credit fellow drivers/friends for helping us get started and supporting our involvement. This is a great age to get involved because as you get older and more financially secure, the expenses associated with carriage driving seem less insurmountable (at least that's what we keep hoping). :)

For Aaron and I, our introduction to driving came through a driving program at the college we attended. This led to summer internships with a judge/technical delegate and we were able to groom (and Aaron began competing) at shows such as Devon, the Canadian Classic, and Walnut Hill. We were very blessed to be able to learn from "the top" and the experiece we gained (and contacts we made in the driving world) allowed us to easily move into combined driving.

There is a big learning curve when you become involved in driving--if we can focus on presenting learning opportunities to all levels and ages of interested parties, then people can get a knowledge base that allows them to safely enjoy the sport. But as Ashemont says, it begins at the grass roots level--if we each act as an ambassador, we can bring the joy of driving to many, many people.

[War Admiral]

And Thomas I appreciate that driving can be a 'first love' but my point was that there might be a HUGE market out there as yet untapped. To me more drivers equals more events, more opportunities and more FUN! :D

There are also a boatload of people out there who actually drive right now, BUT they do it as a sideline to some other equestrian sport. Organizers, a good way to rope those people in is to make sure you organize your driving events at a time when none of the other breeds/disciplines has anything much going on in your area. And then publicize. A LOT. Which doesn't mean sticking it in your carriage assn. newsletter and hoping for the best.... :cool:

[RidesAHaflinger]

Wow... where do you find out about these? Sounds like something that would be of interest :)

Doesn't Muffy Seaton put on an adult driving camp? She's up in your neck of the woods, Pat. Might be worth checking out.

Karen

[Drive NJ]

I was speaking of the Mid-A, NE and National Drives for one when referring to "camps", but it is also true that Muffy is doing some "camp" sessions. Thinking in terms of long weekend or more where you can just go and drive, or go and take lessons or whatever. The more the merrier as far as I'm concerned. Maybe when I have more time.............

[HackneyHorseDriver]

Yes one should always give back to ones sport. I made a promise myself to help anyone that asked as I still remember how hard it was to find information and trainers. Currently we have a 10 year old boy and 15 year old girl that are each apprentices to the sport of carriage driving. They are taught safety from the ground up, skills, all while having fun they never knew could be with horses.

Next weekend we are hosting a annual charity carriage show that is open to the public. We post flyers, put ads in our local papers, and have an email flyer. The proceeds benifit a large carriage driving show held in July. The event over the years has brought alot of non horse people to the world of driving along with riders looking for something new. We provide a large table with driving info such as: ADS, CAA, CMA, state driving clubs, our training center, photos, carriages on display with history and fully appointed.

In the fall we run a Carriage Driving 101 clinic and have been pleased with and average of 20 participants each year. Most are new to the sport or lost looking for more information.

Volunteering for any type of driving event is also a great help and keeps are driving venues alive and well. It's never to late to lend a hand or take someone for a drive. :)
Denise

[Drive NJ]

Got that right HackneyHorseDriver but I'm taking a bit of time off for good behavior right now (which means that me and my sister nj2 are cutting back to volunteering only 1 day a weekend, 2 weekends a month for now:D).

Been volunteering, organizing, doing clinics, etc since the mid 1970s and we have new horses we are bringing along - just for fun... so I'll respectfully leave it to you guys for a few years while we turn these horses into our "perfect picnic 'ponies'".

Except for the carriage house/driving talk at a local museum this weekend, the monthly 1/2 day clinics we are trying to set up, and our Autumn Leaves Ride/Drive Fun Day this fall (in its 25th or so anniversary run this year);)

[pricestory]

Carolina Carriage Club had worked very hard to keep our name and passion in front of the public, from doing demos anywhere and everywhere, to sharing the FENCE facility this past weekend with Carolina Region Pony Club. I think the more folks see us, the more they want to be involved.

I have folks tell me from time to time that they are going to drive when they get old. I say, great, but think about carrying harness, moving vehicles, etc and how much easier it would be now. Plus, why wait to have this much fun. Although many of us drive because we can't ride anymore, it isn't a sport for the old and weak. And I'm sure that learning the cones courses and hazards will ward off senility.

[kearleydk]

I won't swear to it but I think there is going to be some sort of driving clinic at the Pony Club Nationals this summer. Driving is not currently one of the Pony Club events but if it is added it will be a HUGE boost to the young drivers.
Dick

[horseyfolks]

I think your right Dick. I also think there will be a lot more interest than folks would expect from the Pony Club kids.

Last year at the Carolina Carriage Club HDT at Tryon the venue was shared with a Pony Club Regional show. When we got there it seemed there were kids on horses EVERYWHERE jumping over anything they could find. Jumps, fences, picnic tables, little brothers..... OK, so maybe I'm exaggerating just a wee bit but you get the picture. Anyway, Price had asked Sam to do a little talk to the PC kids about her driving and why she liked it. Sam took her 'gator with her, set up her marathon carriage, and tried to think of enough stuff to say to use up 20 - 30 minutes.

I was really impressed! There were a lot of kids that showed up for the talk. They seemed genuinely interested, asked for real serious questions, and the whole thing ended up lasting almost an hour.

I think there are a lot of potential drivers in Pony Club.....

Don

[Thomas_1]

In the UK we frequently use those from the Pony Club to act as marathon course score collectors. Gets them involved and also gets their pony used to the horrific sight of a horse drawn carriage in safe environs.

[goodhors]

The driving might be a direct result of the problems a few years ago at KHP when the Pony Club Nationals and the CAA Driving Weekend were held on the same weekend. Some Pony Club kids did not show their best faces to some Driving ladies who also happened to be HUGE Pony Club supporters. I understand it got rather individually ugly with certain kids. I was there working at the Rare Breeds Show, but went over to visit and view the carriages. I know lots of the CAA folks, got a real earful about the PC kids, though the driving ladies had tried to be courteous and careful around ALL the other horses. Roads in the Park are open to all, drivers stopped to allow PC kids clearance, were very rudely treated.

Hope this clinic will open some eyes, expose kids to other venues to use horses for. So many PC members are ring-only riders, have a hard time dealing with new things and spooky horses.

My PC experiences were interesting and only for our Great Lakes Area. Of course each group of kids, leaders, will vary, so what is pursued will be what interests those folks. Games were just starting to be fun then, no interest in Polo Crosse or the Tetrathalon. Couldn't even make up a Team. Locally, everyone boarded a horse except us. Had to have stall cleaning lessons, how to feed and curry horses!! Son liked the jumping part, nothing like it for kids anywhere else here except big Circut shows.

[annikak]

I think you must be speaking of the Midsouth rally which hold an USEA event at the same time, and not Nationals, as when nationals take up the KHP, they take up the entire darn thing!

That being said, I remember being there when the show shared the weekend- the park was packed, every one of the driving people were great, and made a great impression on me. My horse was scared to DEATH of them. :lol: He is a bit of a dink about things like that. I am told by someone that knows a lot about driving (;)) that my TB's would not cut it!

I would think those being rude might have been the scared adults...just speculating, but I can assure you that if anyone had seen a kid being rude, esp. at Nationals, that kid should have been told right then and there that that was NOT acceptable. (I personally have a huge issue with rude kids) But since it was listed as a USPC rally AND event, there might have been some confusion. I know the kids I was with were in awe of the carriages- esp the 4 in hands. Thats impressive!

In the last PC mag, there was an article about the driving that happened at the Carolina region camp/rally- don't have it handy, but know it was at FENCE. Those kids faces were beaming. And again, I was wishing that I could drive.

KellyS- what you guys do sounds perfect. Would love to Drive with Mr AK, but sure wish I could get something that we have here already trained to drive.

GH, Ask Mr GH if he thinks Chief could do it???:winkgrin:

[Thomas_1]

Here pony club is nearly all outside activity. And the afternoon before the driving event when the competitors are all arriving and setting up, we invite the PC to bring any new ponies down too and get them familiarised and ordinarily have a BBQ for everyone so folks can intermingle if they want to.

[pricestory]

Once again, Pony Club and CCC HDT shared the FENCE facility. And it went beautifully. I wrote the article last year for the Whip, in response to the gossip I had heard about the incident at the Ky horse park. The picture in the Whip was of one of our pony clubbers ground driving Buster, one of my mini donks. I am the president of CCC and a USPC Chief Horse Management Judge so I assure you, both driving and pony club are dear to my heart.

NATIONALY - The incident happened during a Mid South Regional Rally, not Nationals as when PC comes for Nationals we do indeed take up the entire facility. Pony Club stresses riding in the open and to move up through the ratings, pony clubbers must ride in the open as part of the ratings test. Not D1's of course, but by D2. I know when I drive at Biltmore, the only negative remarks I have ever gotten have been from adults, not kids. I can't imagine a kid being rude at pony club, at least more than once.

LOCALLY - CCC put on Horses Meets Wheels Clinic several times a year. We share trails with trail riders and often one of them (yes, them, not us, by the rider's reaction to the carriage) scares their horse to bits about the carriages. So our clinic used all kinds of wheelie things from strollers to bicycles to carriages and allows the horses mounted and dismounted to look, follow, play leap frog, etc.
And I teach harness parts, harnessing, ground driving, long lining, driving (what you can do it a little time), at every Carolina Region Pony Club Camp. When we share the facility as we have for the past 3 yrs, we also teach walking a hazards, have someone like Sami talk, etc.

I am Chief Horse Management Judge for Tet this year at P C Nationals at Ky horse park and I haven't heard anything about a driving demo but can't be on top of everything. Our region does offer every pony club discipline but there are only a handful in the US that offers everything from dressage to polocross. It is a volunteer organization and you have to have the volunteers and the kids who want to do all the different stuff to support it in a region.

[kearleydk]

I miss understood my 11 yr old D3 Pony Clubber. We are taking her to National's this year and she wanted to go to a Driving Clinic and was hoping they were having one.

I researched after I spoke. I am sorry. Spoke too quick. There is not a driving clinic at Pony Club National's this year.

[Ashemont]

There is not a driving clinic at Pony Club National's this year.

Isn't that a shame! Driving's loss as I'm sure more than a few PCers would come over to 'our' side ;) And maybe even some of the parents! :yes:

Our club had it's annual picnic last night and I was very pleased to hear of all of the fun stuff planned for our next year. Low-level organized stuff like a Poker Drive, three mini-CDE's, etc. I'm so glad they are trying to make driving accessible to more people :D

[Drive NJ]

Have to say Thomas... we used to use the local Pony Club as score collectors back in the 80s but found it didn't work so well. First hour we spent picking up the kids who fell off when ponies spooked at carriages, then they quickly got hot-cold-tired-bored. Had much better luck with local trail riders, but in today's world of instant results, people decided ATVs would be better :no:.

Personally, I thought the ridden horses were great - they could step into the woods easily if a carriage was coming down the trail, accessible to the crowds (and we used to have crowds back then) looking for information, and provided nose petting opportunities to child spectators.

[pricestory]

I'll be in the Tet barn and would love to meet you. :D They don't let me out of the barns much :yes: but usually the barns are open to everyone in the afternoon for an hour or so. Maybe you can drop by or if you come early, I will be there from Sun to Fri am. Whew, a long time.:eek:

[horseyfolks]

Where and when are the PC Nationals?

Don

[pricestory]

Ky Horse Park, July 23-27.
Are you ready to hit the road again?

[kearleydk]

Actually it seems like a lifetime ago but it was only last year that Sami and I along with Bob Giles did a little demo for Pony Club camp. It was very well recieved and almost all the campers got to drive a little bit. They were very enthusiastic.

The only horse that spooked at the carriages was the one my dear wife subsequently bought. It was only a little spook.

Around here our experience is that both Pony Club kids and Pony Club horses are very well behaved. Games is pretty popular and that sure exposes horses to all sorts of objects being picked up, waved around, and extended toward them by other riders. Can't imagine a Pony Clubber being actively rude. Maybe uncommunicative to a stranger but not more than that.

Dick

[KellyS]

Hey Price--

You might have met Aaron before--he was a Horse Management Judge at PC Nationals in 2005 (at the time he was serving as the Vice Regional Supervisor for New Jersey Region Pony Clubs). :) Apparently he was involved in the hostage taking of the pink flamingo. But I know nothing else! :winkgrin:

With Pony Club starting to become more focused on individual disciplines (ie, you can choose different "tracks" to follow), I think providing learning opportunities about driving would definitely bring new members into the sport. I know Pennsylvania 4-H already includes driving classes in the state championship horse show.

I did a side saddle clinic for a local Pony Club a few years ago and it was very well received. Allowed the kids to see a totally different aspect of riding and learn quite a bit about it.

[pricestory]

I can't remember when I have missed a Nationals but unless we were in the same discipline, I could have never met him or seen him, well, maybe at lunch. I end up in Jr games or Tet usually. For some reason, they don't let me do NORMAL :winkgrin:stuff (eventing, dressage, showjumping) and I haven't figured out polocross yet.:confused:

I do think, in general, kids are sponges and will soak up anything horsey, given a chance. We might not get them won over right now, but they will tuck the driving info away and perhaps come back to it. We just need to present it as fun, not an old lady thing (sorry guys).

[horseyfolks]

Price and Dick..... what I was thinking was if something driving related was being offered to the PCers and Sam could help out I would haul her there with AJ. As it stands we have to be at Ironhorse August 1. It would be pretty easy to leave early for the PC Championships at Lexington and then continue right from there up to Ironhorse in Illinois. I am flying our 'gator into Ironhorse so its not like she will be riding with us..... If its not to late and y'all want to ask about doing something driving related there count us in. Maybe a dressage and cones demo with Sam's new spider and then a hazard demo in full marathon duds......

Don

[goodhors]

[QUOTE=
Around here our experience is that both Pony Club kids and Pony Club horses are very well behaved. Can't imagine a Pony Clubber being actively rude. Maybe uncommunicative to a stranger but not more than that.

Dick[/QUOTE]

Well that was my opinion as well, until SEVERAL ladies reported problems with kids at the Rally. I was rather shocked myself. These are nice ladies, not silly or nasty, good horse handlers, all of them work with kids, have kids. I told them if they had any more problems, to make note of the kid's numbers, report them to the PC officials. Such behaviour needed to be corrected, not the PC ideal. Kids have to be wearing numbers at all times, should be easy to ID. Don't know if they did.

Nice to hear of Aaron and Price working for the Pony Club as officials. Good officals really make things at a Rally go well, kids come away with more knowledge and goals of improvement. I am doing my kid time at 4-H this season. May be back to Pony Club if daughter gets the jumping bug after lessons. I did a lot of odd, offical jobs when son was doing PC Rallies, lower levels.

I would think the PC kids should love seeing Sami and AJ do a demo on Driving. As mentioned, kids may not be drivers now, but who know about the future! The Agenda may be full, those national Rally's are crammed full of things to do, all planned far in advance to be smooth.

[MySparrow]

Nothing so big as Pony Club, but I've been having my Because Horses Matter clinic here this week. It's an introductory clinic for littles, ages 8 through 11, and I've got an exceptionally good batch this year. So yesterday we spent some time talking about driving while I harnessed Prince and then put him to the pipe cart so I could let each one try driving around a simple cone course. Obviously I stayed in the cart as well! All the kids loved it, and I think we may have a couple of future whips among them. One of the strongest-willed among them announced that she MIGHT just like driving better than riding!

It definitely helped their reinsmanship. I saw a real improvement today when they were astride again.

[Thomas_1]

Sparrow - I do hope that you're showing them the fundamentals of handling driving reins when you're letting them "have a go" and that you're not doing the "hold the reins in each hand" thing????

[annikak]

I think that driving should indeed be a part of USPC- at least be something that should be offered- and all PC kids should be exposed to more Horse Activities....

Price- I will come by to meet you in the barns!!!!

Annika

[pricestory]

Don, it may be too late but you could contact activities@ponyclub.org
After Championships, which is usually really stuffed full for the kids, is Festival. That is a time of clinics, seminars etc for kids and adults. That may be the time to try to do something.
Annika, I'll look forward to seeing you.

[kearleydk]

Price, I'm looking forward to meeting you at Festival too. I shook the bushes a little and have the E-mails for the powers that be for festival and have recently met 2 of them. Also a couple of the PC powers that be have interest in driving.

Sooooooo............. Before I stir any more trouble, Don are you and Sami really up for this?

Again, Festival is July 24 through July 31. I'm going to be be there without horses and would help any way I could. The schedule is chock full of stuff for the Pony Clubbers but maybe something could be fit in.

Dick

[horseyfolks]

Dick.... you know me, I don't stutter. Give it your best shot. I think something like this is a great opportunity to get Sam used to giving back at a young age..... Not only that but the Chocolate Chip Cookie girl at the Hampton is a cutey pie :eek:;):D!

Don

[pricestory]

Dick, I hope to be headed home before Festival gets going, probably Friday morning since Tet finishes Thurs afternoon. If you are there by then, come see me.

[kearleydk]

Price, We will be there before you leave so will be looking for you.
Dick

[annikak]

The powers that be think so too! And Guess what? He wants to drive, too! ;) I bet if one told him...Hey...I'll show you, you'd have a good thing goin'!

I will also place a bug in LM's ear- got a discussion going on here right now. It was very well recieved before and how great would it be?

I am coming with horses, that sadly, don't drive, but will help with what I can. We are there the ENTIRE time! I am tired already!

[horseyfolks]

If Sam has a choice we would prefer something towards the end of the week.... less nights in a motel I have to pay :D:yes:...

If not we will work with whatever y'all need to make it work.....

Don

[annikak]

it is being talked about.... so, let me know if anyone hears anything... I am riding in the ICP, as well as helping with SJ, but I know I will have time here and there.
We are getting there Sunday and leaving TEEEEENNNNNN days later....:eek:

[Thomas_1]

Well the open day went very well and I've posted a little about it here:

http://www.chronicleforums.com/Forum/showthread.php?p=2519487#post2519487

[kearleydk]

This is your roving ambassador on the scene in Ocala. Did a little harnessing, hitching and driving demo for Senior Pony Club camp in the rain this PM. It was nasty but the young lady Pony Clubbers did not want to quit so we pressed on. Talked our way through harnessing showing how everything fits and what each piece does.

Then I ground drove Onyx a little (yes I used the green horse because his harness was right on the rack and I was running late) He obliged with a mild version of his airs above the ground so the Pony Clubbers saw it was not just a stroll in the park.

We then hitched Onyx and Arman and gave all the Pony Clubbers a ride on the navigator's step. The only boy in the group said, as we trotted off, "this is a lot faster than it looks from the ground."

Several were amazed at how quickly and tightly the carriage could turn.

Dick

[Ashemont]

Good for you, Dick! I'm sure those kids really appreciated your efforts. And taking a greenie was probably far more interesting... and educational ;)

I think the speed is surprising to all who haven't driven. Even my 29 year old son who is a real athlete and likes to do everything FAST had a ball on the back step. So much so that he wants to do it again and has volunteered his services if dad ever gets around to doing a CDE!!!! He loved the difference he could make cutting corners and such, and actually said he'd PREFER to navigate! Too bad he lives too far away to go out with us regularly but it's wonderful to have him interested in participating :)

We really do need to capture the youngsters and I'm glad to see things such as the Young Drivers Clinic which is currently going on here in Southern Pines. But I also would love to see more things for adult amateurs. I'm sure there are many like us who have done horses and want to continue doing so, who would find driving preferable to riding - and that's the group that has the $$$$ :winkgrin: